| makofoto | 01-22-2004 06:53 PM |
'03 Nationals, No SM WRX's ?
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Am I looking at the correct results:
[url]http://www.scca.org/amateur/solo2/nationals/2003/results/groups/sm.html[/url]
No WRX's in SM at the Solo II Nationals last year ... ?
Why not?
Is the WRX just not a good SM car?
[url]http://www.scca.org/amateur/solo2/nationals/2003/results/groups/sm.html[/url]
No WRX's in SM at the Solo II Nationals last year ... ?
Why not?
Is the WRX just not a good SM car?
| afpdl | 01-22-2004 07:18 PM |
The only one I know of that was going to compete was conebasher and it was broken so it couldnt make it.
| MNbiker | 01-22-2004 09:53 PM |
I'd wager you'll see some STi's there this year.;)
| dwx | 01-22-2004 10:39 PM |
I would expect to see a few this year. If you notice most of the cars that compete in SM aren't newer cars. Not many people want to turn their daily driver WRX into a race car. Unless they are doing rally that is. If you look at the results from nationals last year the newest car is a 98 Civic.
| Silver Bullet 02 | 01-23-2004 01:27 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by dwx [/i]
[B]I would expect to see a few this year. If you notice most of the cars that compete in SM aren't newer cars. Not many people want to turn their daily driver WRX into a race car. Unless they are doing rally that is. If you look at the results from nationals last year the newest car is a 98 Civic. [/B][/QUOTE]
I agree. It takes soooooo much to make a nationally competitive SM car that most wouldn't be good daily drivers. You would be very hard pressed to make a nationally competitive SM WRX that you enjoyed driving to work every day. Just having the Tein RA suspension takes my car out of the enjoyable daily driver category in my opinion. Adding a 400+whp engine and a non-synchro tranny and you are definately out of the comfortable daily driver category.
I doubt there are many people who would want to hack up a 20k+ car to make it a dedicated racer but I'm sure there are some. I'm half way in between.... a regionally competitive SM setup that is fun to drive to work every once in a while :-)
[B]I would expect to see a few this year. If you notice most of the cars that compete in SM aren't newer cars. Not many people want to turn their daily driver WRX into a race car. Unless they are doing rally that is. If you look at the results from nationals last year the newest car is a 98 Civic. [/B][/QUOTE]
I agree. It takes soooooo much to make a nationally competitive SM car that most wouldn't be good daily drivers. You would be very hard pressed to make a nationally competitive SM WRX that you enjoyed driving to work every day. Just having the Tein RA suspension takes my car out of the enjoyable daily driver category in my opinion. Adding a 400+whp engine and a non-synchro tranny and you are definately out of the comfortable daily driver category.
I doubt there are many people who would want to hack up a 20k+ car to make it a dedicated racer but I'm sure there are some. I'm half way in between.... a regionally competitive SM setup that is fun to drive to work every once in a while :-)
| Davenow | 01-23-2004 01:46 PM |
Silver Bullet 02
what is your setup?
what is your setup?
| makofoto | 01-23-2004 01:46 PM |
That's why I'm hoping that these ProDrive Active dampners will "help."
[url]http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=482343&perpage=25&pagenumber=1[/url]
[url]http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=482343&perpage=25&pagenumber=1[/url]
| Silver Bullet 02 | 01-23-2004 01:57 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Davenow [/i]
[B]Silver Bullet 02
what is your setup? [/B][/QUOTE]
02 WRX
-Two Evolution driving schools
-APS Club Spec kit (around 285chp)
-Tein RA suspension (not good for daily driving, especially in the winter. Awesome for competition though)
-STi RA V6 gearset with Quaife front diff
-Upgraded swaybars front and rear and rear endlinks
-Poly bushings
-Misc other go fast stuff but I listed the major items
[B]Silver Bullet 02
what is your setup? [/B][/QUOTE]
02 WRX
-Two Evolution driving schools
-APS Club Spec kit (around 285chp)
-Tein RA suspension (not good for daily driving, especially in the winter. Awesome for competition though)
-STi RA V6 gearset with Quaife front diff
-Upgraded swaybars front and rear and rear endlinks
-Poly bushings
-Misc other go fast stuff but I listed the major items
| Silver Bullet 02 | 01-23-2004 01:59 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by makofoto [/i]
[B]That's why I'm hoping that these ProDrive Active dampners will "help."
[url]http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=482343&perpage=25&pagenumber=1[/url] [/B][/QUOTE]
The Praxis (sp?) system seems like a great system too. Gives you the ability to change spring rates and ride heights on the fly. I don't know how good of a competition suspension it is though. We should know by the end of the summer. It may not be legal for SM... I'm not sure.
[B]That's why I'm hoping that these ProDrive Active dampners will "help."
[url]http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=482343&perpage=25&pagenumber=1[/url] [/B][/QUOTE]
The Praxis (sp?) system seems like a great system too. Gives you the ability to change spring rates and ride heights on the fly. I don't know how good of a competition suspension it is though. We should know by the end of the summer. It may not be legal for SM... I'm not sure.
| makofoto | 01-23-2004 03:09 PM |
Silver Bullet ... do you have the original STI gear ratios ... if so ... does 1st gear seem a bit to high/long?
What does that front diff do for you ...
If you want to email me directly or start a new thread ... that's fine ... but I think the subject matter is O.K. for this thread ... and anyway I started the thread ... so I think I can Hijack it! :cool:
What does that front diff do for you ...
If you want to email me directly or start a new thread ... that's fine ... but I think the subject matter is O.K. for this thread ... and anyway I started the thread ... so I think I can Hijack it! :cool:
| Silver Bullet 02 | 01-23-2004 03:14 PM |
I do have the RA ratios. The first gear is better in my opinion. For the occasional course where you have to drop down to first gear you don't go too low and it gives you more time (power down) in first gear before having to shift to second gear. It also allows you to stay in the power band without waiting until close to 7000 rpm to shift since 2nd gear is lower than stock. You can avoid bogging at the line by slipping the clutch just a tad more than stock.
Having 1st closer to 2nd in ratio allows you to downshift without grinding that most stock 5sp WRX's have.
The Quaife front diff allows you to power out of corners much sooner since it sends torque to the wheel with the most traction instead of spinning the inside front tire like the open stock front diff does. This also gets more torque to the rear which decreases understeer when powering out of a turn.
These are pretty major improvements for a WRX autocross car.
Having 1st closer to 2nd in ratio allows you to downshift without grinding that most stock 5sp WRX's have.
The Quaife front diff allows you to power out of corners much sooner since it sends torque to the wheel with the most traction instead of spinning the inside front tire like the open stock front diff does. This also gets more torque to the rear which decreases understeer when powering out of a turn.
These are pretty major improvements for a WRX autocross car.
| makofoto | 01-23-2004 03:22 PM |
Can one add a LS to a regular WRX w/o adding your gear box ... is the quaife the way to go ... and where do you buy it from ...
| KC | 01-23-2004 03:26 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Silver Bullet 02[/i]
[B] The Praxis (sp?) system seems like a great system too. Gives you the ability to change spring rates and ride heights on the fly. I don't know how good of a competition suspension it is though. We should know by the end of the summer. It may not be legal for SM... I'm not sure. [/B][/QUOTE]
Praxis is not legal for S, ST, SP. You're changing the 'type' of uspension from 'coil-over-strut' to 'air-bag'.
Edit: SM it's legal 'as long as it attaches to stock mounting points.
--kC
[B] The Praxis (sp?) system seems like a great system too. Gives you the ability to change spring rates and ride heights on the fly. I don't know how good of a competition suspension it is though. We should know by the end of the summer. It may not be legal for SM... I'm not sure. [/B][/QUOTE]
Praxis is not legal for S, ST, SP. You're changing the 'type' of uspension from 'coil-over-strut' to 'air-bag'.
Edit: SM it's legal 'as long as it attaches to stock mounting points.
--kC
| Silver Bullet 02 | 01-23-2004 03:30 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by makofoto [/i]
[B]Can one add a LS to a regular WRX w/o adding your gear box ... is the quaife the way to go ... and where do you buy it from ... [/B][/QUOTE]
You can add the Quaife to the stock gearset. It just bolts on where your open front diff is now. You have to take the tranny out and open it up to do it.
I bought mine directly from Quaife. We were talking back and forth about a sponsership deal and they ended up just sellling me the diff for a discounted price. Go to [url]www.quaifeusa.com[/url] and I think they have a list of distributors there.
I believe the Quaife is the best front diff for autocross. I'm pretty sure it works in the same way as the Surtrac front diff on the STi. They are Torsen type diffs which means they send some multiple of the torque of the slipping wheel to the gripping wheel. I haven't noticed any negative effects from the Quaife and I have noticed a significant improvement in corner exit capability. Much faster.
I've read that the Whiteline Anti-lift kit will help decrease the inside front wheelspin problem too but I don't know first hand. Increasing rear spring rate relative to the front would probaly help also. I'm not sure the Quaife front diff is the best bang for the buck in terms of upgrades. I installed it because my tranny was already apart for the gear upgrade after I exploded my first gear.
[B]Can one add a LS to a regular WRX w/o adding your gear box ... is the quaife the way to go ... and where do you buy it from ... [/B][/QUOTE]
You can add the Quaife to the stock gearset. It just bolts on where your open front diff is now. You have to take the tranny out and open it up to do it.
I bought mine directly from Quaife. We were talking back and forth about a sponsership deal and they ended up just sellling me the diff for a discounted price. Go to [url]www.quaifeusa.com[/url] and I think they have a list of distributors there.
I believe the Quaife is the best front diff for autocross. I'm pretty sure it works in the same way as the Surtrac front diff on the STi. They are Torsen type diffs which means they send some multiple of the torque of the slipping wheel to the gripping wheel. I haven't noticed any negative effects from the Quaife and I have noticed a significant improvement in corner exit capability. Much faster.
I've read that the Whiteline Anti-lift kit will help decrease the inside front wheelspin problem too but I don't know first hand. Increasing rear spring rate relative to the front would probaly help also. I'm not sure the Quaife front diff is the best bang for the buck in terms of upgrades. I installed it because my tranny was already apart for the gear upgrade after I exploded my first gear.
| Silver Bullet 02 | 01-23-2004 03:32 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by KC [/i]
[B]Praxis is not legal for S, SM, ST, SP, P. You're changing the 'type' of suspension from 'coil-over-strut' to 'air-bag'.
--kC [/B][/QUOTE]
I figured that was the case. I know that the Tein EDFC is illegal also because its configurable on the fly.
I believe the intention of that rule was to prevent people from using active suspension that compensate as you drive. Although they are illegal, I don't think the EDFC or the Praxis systems should be illegal IMHO.
[B]Praxis is not legal for S, SM, ST, SP, P. You're changing the 'type' of suspension from 'coil-over-strut' to 'air-bag'.
--kC [/B][/QUOTE]
I figured that was the case. I know that the Tein EDFC is illegal also because its configurable on the fly.
I believe the intention of that rule was to prevent people from using active suspension that compensate as you drive. Although they are illegal, I don't think the EDFC or the Praxis systems should be illegal IMHO.
| makofoto | 01-23-2004 03:33 PM |
KC - does it look like the design of the Prodrive Active Shock would be legal for SM ...
| KC | 01-23-2004 03:51 PM |
See my edit. SM it is legal as long as it attaches to the regualr attaching point. Nothing in SM rules stipulate that you can't use different type suspensions. :)
| Silver Bullet 02 | 01-23-2004 03:55 PM |
18.1.E (SM)
Suspension components are unrestricted as long as they use the original attachment points. Brakes are unrestricted.
Sometimes I get my STX and SM rules overlapped since I just started SM last season.
Suspension components are unrestricted as long as they use the original attachment points. Brakes are unrestricted.
Sometimes I get my STX and SM rules overlapped since I just started SM last season.
| AWMIII | 01-23-2004 04:21 PM |
I would have gone, but my wife was due to give birth any day at that time.
| exhacker | 01-25-2004 06:15 AM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Silver Bullet 02 [/i]
[B]I've read that the Whiteline Anti-lift kit will help decrease the inside front wheelspin problem too but I don't know first hand. Increasing rear spring rate relative to the front would probaly help also. I'm not sure the Quaife front diff is the best bang for the buck in terms of upgrades. I installed it because my tranny was already apart for the gear upgrade after I exploded my first gear. [/B][/QUOTE]
ALK is not legal for autocross Street classes, from what i've heard. sticks you either into P or M, becuase you're technically changing the suspension mounting points.
[B]I've read that the Whiteline Anti-lift kit will help decrease the inside front wheelspin problem too but I don't know first hand. Increasing rear spring rate relative to the front would probaly help also. I'm not sure the Quaife front diff is the best bang for the buck in terms of upgrades. I installed it because my tranny was already apart for the gear upgrade after I exploded my first gear. [/B][/QUOTE]
ALK is not legal for autocross Street classes, from what i've heard. sticks you either into P or M, becuase you're technically changing the suspension mounting points.
| exhacker | 01-25-2004 06:18 AM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by makofoto [/i]
[B]That's why I'm hoping that these ProDrive Active dampners will "help."
[url]http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=482343&perpage=25&pagenumber=1[/url] [/B][/QUOTE]
Oh, and I'm pretty sure that your suspension cannot be adjustable while the vehicle is in motion for autocross. Please quote a rule for a particular class if you can prove me wrong. :cool:
[B]That's why I'm hoping that these ProDrive Active dampners will "help."
[url]http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=482343&perpage=25&pagenumber=1[/url] [/B][/QUOTE]
Oh, and I'm pretty sure that your suspension cannot be adjustable while the vehicle is in motion for autocross. Please quote a rule for a particular class if you can prove me wrong. :cool:
| makofoto | 01-25-2004 11:40 AM |
If Active Suspensions are out lawed across the board ... that would be WRONG. There should be a class where one can use the latest technology. I for one can't afford an AutoX only car ... and I couldn't live with super stiff coil overs.
| KC | 01-25-2004 11:44 AM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by exhacker[/i]
[B] ALK is not legal for autocross Street classes, from what i've heard. sticks you either into P or M, becuase you're technically changing the suspension mounting points. [/B][/QUOTE]
That is correct. There is an offset bushing (Whiteline partnumber above) that is like an ALK, that is legal in STS/STX/SM. I also beleive that the ALK is legal for SM.
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by makofoto[/i]
[B] If Active Suspensions are out lawed across the board ... that would be WRONG. There should be a class where one can use the latest technology. I for one can't afford an AutoX only car ... and I couldn't live with super stiff coil overs. [/B][/QUOTE]
As long as you cannot adjust it while the vehicle is in motion, it would be legal. Ie: Put it out of reach of the driver for the run.
--kC
[B] ALK is not legal for autocross Street classes, from what i've heard. sticks you either into P or M, becuase you're technically changing the suspension mounting points. [/B][/QUOTE]
That is correct. There is an offset bushing (Whiteline partnumber above) that is like an ALK, that is legal in STS/STX/SM. I also beleive that the ALK is legal for SM.
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by makofoto[/i]
[B] If Active Suspensions are out lawed across the board ... that would be WRONG. There should be a class where one can use the latest technology. I for one can't afford an AutoX only car ... and I couldn't live with super stiff coil overs. [/B][/QUOTE]
As long as you cannot adjust it while the vehicle is in motion, it would be legal. Ie: Put it out of reach of the driver for the run.
--kC
| makofoto | 01-25-2004 11:52 AM |
But even if you don't have access to the remote control that allows one to switch from comfort to competition mode ... the ProDrive active shocks still "automatically" adjusts its valving "1,000 times/second."
[url]http://www.prodrive-usa.com/product_detail.asp?yid=219&cid=10&pid=76&s=[/url]
[url]http://www.prodrive-usa.com/product_detail.asp?yid=219&cid=10&pid=76&s=[/url]
| SUV-ETR | 01-26-2004 11:15 PM |
Suspension is "unrestricted" in Street Modified. (see quote from rulebook above). Thus, active suspension is 100% legal, assuming the attachment points are retained, etc.
It would even be legal for it to be driver-adjustable in SM, but I'd be real interested in seeing someone actually try to change suspension settings in the middle of an autocross run! :lol:
Same thing for engine/drivetrain. As long as the block says "Subaru" and you don't have to modify the chassis to fit it, you can do basically whatever you want. Electronic traction control, hydraulic paddle shifters, you name it. Have fun!
Neal <--- fits above description about being too poor to mod his Subaru for SM...so drives an old VW instead...and is still too poor to do everything possible...
It would even be legal for it to be driver-adjustable in SM, but I'd be real interested in seeing someone actually try to change suspension settings in the middle of an autocross run! :lol:
Same thing for engine/drivetrain. As long as the block says "Subaru" and you don't have to modify the chassis to fit it, you can do basically whatever you want. Electronic traction control, hydraulic paddle shifters, you name it. Have fun!
Neal <--- fits above description about being too poor to mod his Subaru for SM...so drives an old VW instead...and is still too poor to do everything possible...
| makofoto | 01-26-2004 11:32 PM |
So under car braces should be O.K. in SM also ... ?
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