| Lachlan | 03-02-2004 10:47 PM |
rally school
�
�
I've always wanted to learn to race so I could put some rally tires on my daily driver and have a good time in the dirt and get to some amateur rally events. I've heard of one rally school in florida, but I think its pretty expensive. Are there other rally schools anywhere in the country?
| AlanO | 03-02-2004 10:58 PM |
[url]http://www.team-oneil.com[/url]
| Lachlan | 03-02-2004 11:02 PM |
huh. I enter there and nothing happens. Blank screen. :(
| sirfrankwilliams | 03-02-2004 11:14 PM |
blank from here too.
| AlanO | 03-02-2004 11:25 PM |
Works for me. The site must have been redesigned recently, it uses Flash now. If you don't have Flash installed, that might be why you don't see anything.
| scarywoody | 03-02-2004 11:26 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by AlanO[/i]
[B] [url]http://www.team-oneil.com[/url] [/B][/QUOTE]
have any idea what they cost? I kinda looked but didn't see anything.
[B] [url]http://www.team-oneil.com[/url] [/B][/QUOTE]
have any idea what they cost? I kinda looked but didn't see anything.
| Lachlan | 03-02-2004 11:40 PM |
I dunno. Usually I don't have problems with flash sites.
| CageChicane | 03-03-2004 01:40 AM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by scarywoody[/i]
[B] have any idea what they cost? I kinda looked but didn't see anything. [/B][/QUOTE]
from what i have seen it will be over $1K. they range in lenth from 3 days to a week. eventually costing near $2,500. i personally have access to a National Forest which is illegal, but free. otherwise i would be all over a rally school. i think i would rather spend that large amount of money on my car than on myself.
[B] have any idea what they cost? I kinda looked but didn't see anything. [/B][/QUOTE]
from what i have seen it will be over $1K. they range in lenth from 3 days to a week. eventually costing near $2,500. i personally have access to a National Forest which is illegal, but free. otherwise i would be all over a rally school. i think i would rather spend that large amount of money on my car than on myself.
| Chaste Automotive | 03-03-2004 03:47 AM |
If you want to go to rally school go to one in Europe nothing against tim oneil but you will get more for your money in Europe. Vigin airways flight to london is 400-500 round trip from Los Angeles. You then have a lot of choices I would tell you to go to the higgin's school (forest rally experience) it is cheap and a good place to start. Bill gwynne is good as well. Then you can go to some of the top schools after a little experience John Hauglands school is very very good as is the Jakke's school but that is for drivers and co-drivers to go together. Remember you get what you pay for.
| Morison | 03-03-2004 04:01 AM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by CageChicane[/i]
[B] I think i would rather spend that large amount of money on my car than on myself. [/B][/QUOTE]
Building a fast rally car and NOT taking any form of rally school is a good way to ensure you'll spend a large amount of money on the car.
:huh:
[B] I think i would rather spend that large amount of money on my car than on myself. [/B][/QUOTE]
Building a fast rally car and NOT taking any form of rally school is a good way to ensure you'll spend a large amount of money on the car.
:huh:
| Mopho | 03-03-2004 08:21 AM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Morison [/i]
[B]Building a fast rally car and NOT taking any form of rally school is a good way to ensure you'll spend a large amount of money on the car.
:huh: [/B][/QUOTE]
:lol: :lol:
Good one Morrison-san!
[B]Building a fast rally car and NOT taking any form of rally school is a good way to ensure you'll spend a large amount of money on the car.
:huh: [/B][/QUOTE]
:lol: :lol:
Good one Morrison-san!
| ITWRX4ME | 03-03-2004 02:14 PM |
Here's another one but I can't vouch for it. I emailed them for info and never got a response. You probably have to call them.
[url]http://www.virclub.com/vir_euro_rally/index.html[/url]
[url]http://www.virclub.com/vir_euro_rally/index.html[/url]
| RB5 Clone | 03-03-2004 05:15 PM |
Why don't ppl Get It about rally school??
�
�
" i think i would rather spend that large amount of money on my car than on myself."
This kind of thinking (or lack of it) amazes me. Nobody imagines that airline pilots could learn by trial and error, nobody imagines that helicopter pilots can learn by trial and error....why does anyone think they can learn rally driving the same way?
The capabilities of a modern rally car and the techniques needed to extract that performance safely and sanely are so far beyond the understanding of an untrained driver it would be laughable if it weren't so pathetic and dangerous.
Hate to break it to ya, guys, but driving a powerful turbo AWD car sideways is NOT an innate skill. It takes many counter-intuitive techniques to keep the car shiny-side-up and out of the trees (and keep its crew out of the freakin hospital!)
I am dumbfounded by ppl's willingness to spend cubic dollars on the latest carbon-fiber bolt-on ricey widgets and hot ECU's and superheated turbo kits...and then don't understand the value of the "control software" behind the wheel (ie the DRIVER, duuh!) in the whole equation.
Hurtling down some squiggly forest road, dodging rocks and trees and dropoffs, a trained driver in a clapped-out old VW Golf can totally spank and totally embarrass the typical street driver (even a good one) pedaling a rally-prepped STi. All the STi does is ensure that the untrained driver will be going a whole lot faster when they leave the road and the inevitable Bad Things start happening really really fast.
Trust me, crashing a rally car is not cool, it is not fun, it hurts a lot and costs way way more than any rally school. Let's just say I learned this the hard way--about 3 stage miles into my first event. We wrecked a brand-new beautifully prepped car by backing into the woods at 70 mph, rolling 4 times and landing on the roof at the bottom of a 20-foot embankment. The car was toast. We were lucky to get out alive.
After my initial bad experience, I smartened up and have since done several courses at O'Neil's. My team partner has done several courses there too. Now we finish way more rallies than we DNF. We go faster and safer than we ever imagined possible. Heck, we're even racking up some points now! We can flatly state that the expenditure at Tim's school (not cheap, no question!) has been the most cost-effective go-fast money we have spent on rallying, bar none.
If you want to drive fast in the forest, you owe it to yourself and your friends and your Mom to log some miles at rally school.
Dave G
Last Ditch Racing
This kind of thinking (or lack of it) amazes me. Nobody imagines that airline pilots could learn by trial and error, nobody imagines that helicopter pilots can learn by trial and error....why does anyone think they can learn rally driving the same way?
The capabilities of a modern rally car and the techniques needed to extract that performance safely and sanely are so far beyond the understanding of an untrained driver it would be laughable if it weren't so pathetic and dangerous.
Hate to break it to ya, guys, but driving a powerful turbo AWD car sideways is NOT an innate skill. It takes many counter-intuitive techniques to keep the car shiny-side-up and out of the trees (and keep its crew out of the freakin hospital!)
I am dumbfounded by ppl's willingness to spend cubic dollars on the latest carbon-fiber bolt-on ricey widgets and hot ECU's and superheated turbo kits...and then don't understand the value of the "control software" behind the wheel (ie the DRIVER, duuh!) in the whole equation.
Hurtling down some squiggly forest road, dodging rocks and trees and dropoffs, a trained driver in a clapped-out old VW Golf can totally spank and totally embarrass the typical street driver (even a good one) pedaling a rally-prepped STi. All the STi does is ensure that the untrained driver will be going a whole lot faster when they leave the road and the inevitable Bad Things start happening really really fast.
Trust me, crashing a rally car is not cool, it is not fun, it hurts a lot and costs way way more than any rally school. Let's just say I learned this the hard way--about 3 stage miles into my first event. We wrecked a brand-new beautifully prepped car by backing into the woods at 70 mph, rolling 4 times and landing on the roof at the bottom of a 20-foot embankment. The car was toast. We were lucky to get out alive.
After my initial bad experience, I smartened up and have since done several courses at O'Neil's. My team partner has done several courses there too. Now we finish way more rallies than we DNF. We go faster and safer than we ever imagined possible. Heck, we're even racking up some points now! We can flatly state that the expenditure at Tim's school (not cheap, no question!) has been the most cost-effective go-fast money we have spent on rallying, bar none.
If you want to drive fast in the forest, you owe it to yourself and your friends and your Mom to log some miles at rally school.
Dave G
Last Ditch Racing
| Lachlan | 03-03-2004 05:19 PM |
so is there another site for oneil? One that works on my computer?
| RB5 Clone | 03-03-2004 05:24 PM |
sometimes the O'Neil site does not work for me either, I just switch from Explorer to Netscape and it works fine.
| Mopho | 03-03-2004 05:24 PM |
Well said, Dave. You should note that you were not driving in that accident, so you were only stupid for riding with the guy:D
Did you try [url]www.teamoneil.com[/url] (no hyphen)?
Did you try [url]www.teamoneil.com[/url] (no hyphen)?
| Lachlan | 03-03-2004 05:37 PM |
well I tried netscape and it still doesn't show. I guess it's not meant to be :(
| Mopho | 03-03-2004 05:43 PM |
Works for me in IE try this [url]http://www.teamoneil.com/index2.htm[/url]
| Lachlan | 03-03-2004 05:46 PM |
Nothing. It keeps saying there are errors on all his pages.
| Mopho | 03-03-2004 06:00 PM |
Hmm, must be something wrong with you puter or browser, I've never had a problem with that site, MAC or PC.
Good luck
Good luck
| Rovah | 03-03-2004 08:41 PM |
[url]http://www.teamoneil.com/[/url]
Works for me. Always has.
I second and underline Dave's entire post! :-)
Cheers! John
Works for me. Always has.
I second and underline Dave's entire post! :-)
Cheers! John
| Lachlan | 03-03-2004 09:42 PM |
ok, well, does anyone know of any other schools?
| defduane | 03-03-2004 10:49 PM |
the one in florida: [url]http://www.gorally.com[/url]
| USMARINE24M | 03-04-2004 12:16 AM |
i went to the ridgecrest one here in cali last weekend, very informitive, and not expensive at all :D
| wrrrx | 03-04-2004 09:21 AM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by USMARINE24M [/i]
[B]i went to the ridgecrest one here in cali last weekend, very informitive, and not expensive at all :D [/B][/QUOTE]
Dang, I wish I'd known about this. No publicity outside of Cali? I wish more SCCA regions would have their own rally schools. (Ours, ORG, was supposed to have one this month, but it's been postponed. :( )
$80 is waaaay easier than $1000+ !
Russ R
[B]i went to the ridgecrest one here in cali last weekend, very informitive, and not expensive at all :D [/B][/QUOTE]
Dang, I wish I'd known about this. No publicity outside of Cali? I wish more SCCA regions would have their own rally schools. (Ours, ORG, was supposed to have one this month, but it's been postponed. :( )
$80 is waaaay easier than $1000+ !
Russ R
| RB5 Clone | 03-04-2004 09:44 AM |
Team O'Neil phone #
�
�
Lachlan--
Here's a "quaint idea"
So go call O'Neil's on the phone. they will mail you catalogs, brochures, and a free STi rally car. (or most of that stuff!)
603-444-4488
One big part of the cost at O'Neil's---you drive the school's cars on a large network of private closed gravel roads in a very safe environment. this is worth a lot...saves beating on your street ride. you will definitely live longer this way.
one other point about the cost of rally school--it's only one expensive part of a VERY expensive pasttime. Basic rules of rally:
--Open car's hood, pour in money.
--cage car, pour in money
--finish prepping car, pour in money
--buy a nomex suit and helmet and all that stuff, pour in money
--Buy a big haul truck, pour in money
--buy a trailer, pour in money
--chew up expensive gravel tires ($400-600 per set), pour in money
--crash the car (inevitable, even after the school!), pour in more money
etc etc, you get the idea!
start with local TSD rallies, cheap. run with street car and minimal mods
RallyX racing comes next, fairly cheap, run with street car and a few more mods. Entry fee: $50 per race, a few hundered $$ for mods, maybe a couple thousand for mods once you find you have some talent and some potential and get really hooked
ClubRally comes next, get ready to spend serious $$$ with a dedicated race car ($5-10k at least) and service crew and haul truck, etc. entry fee: $500
ProRally: $25k minimum to run a season, and that's on top of all of the above!
ppl who think they can drive their street car to a rally and race are dreamin!
Cheers, have fun, be safe, learn the easy way!
Dave G
Serial Scooby Thrasher
Last Ditch Racing
Here's a "quaint idea"
So go call O'Neil's on the phone. they will mail you catalogs, brochures, and a free STi rally car. (or most of that stuff!)
603-444-4488
One big part of the cost at O'Neil's---you drive the school's cars on a large network of private closed gravel roads in a very safe environment. this is worth a lot...saves beating on your street ride. you will definitely live longer this way.
one other point about the cost of rally school--it's only one expensive part of a VERY expensive pasttime. Basic rules of rally:
--Open car's hood, pour in money.
--cage car, pour in money
--finish prepping car, pour in money
--buy a nomex suit and helmet and all that stuff, pour in money
--Buy a big haul truck, pour in money
--buy a trailer, pour in money
--chew up expensive gravel tires ($400-600 per set), pour in money
--crash the car (inevitable, even after the school!), pour in more money
etc etc, you get the idea!
start with local TSD rallies, cheap. run with street car and minimal mods
RallyX racing comes next, fairly cheap, run with street car and a few more mods. Entry fee: $50 per race, a few hundered $$ for mods, maybe a couple thousand for mods once you find you have some talent and some potential and get really hooked
ClubRally comes next, get ready to spend serious $$$ with a dedicated race car ($5-10k at least) and service crew and haul truck, etc. entry fee: $500
ProRally: $25k minimum to run a season, and that's on top of all of the above!
ppl who think they can drive their street car to a rally and race are dreamin!
Cheers, have fun, be safe, learn the easy way!
Dave G
Serial Scooby Thrasher
Last Ditch Racing
| Mopho | 03-04-2004 09:50 AM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by USMARINE24M [/i]
[B]i went to the ridgecrest one here in cali last weekend, very informitive, and not expensive at all :D [/B][/QUOTE]
What did they teach you?
[B]i went to the ridgecrest one here in cali last weekend, very informitive, and not expensive at all :D [/B][/QUOTE]
What did they teach you?
| Lachlan | 03-04-2004 10:53 AM |
Wow, yeah, well, I don't have ideas of being an all out rally driver right now. I just wanted to get dirty on a TSD course and see where it leads me :) Still, I thought it would be a good idea to know how to drive. Plus rally school looks fun!
Someday when I'm a rich major and send all my children to do forced labor I can get my viper and dedicate my soob to racing. Until then I'll have to settle for whatever kind of racing my street car can do :lol:
Someday when I'm a rich major and send all my children to do forced labor I can get my viper and dedicate my soob to racing. Until then I'll have to settle for whatever kind of racing my street car can do :lol:
| cowapult | 03-04-2004 06:43 PM |
Rallycross is what you need -> $40
You can even get someone with experience to ride along - then it would be perfect for you.
Or, if you really want a school, Beaverun is close to you, and it is much cheaper and much more introductory. It's more like a "rallyCROSS school" than a "CLUB rally school" but I've done it and it's fun and they provide the cars. From what you just said, it sounds like it is more up your alley anyway.
Beaverun rallycross school -> $200
[url]http://www.beaverun.com[/url]
You can even get someone with experience to ride along - then it would be perfect for you.
Or, if you really want a school, Beaverun is close to you, and it is much cheaper and much more introductory. It's more like a "rallyCROSS school" than a "CLUB rally school" but I've done it and it's fun and they provide the cars. From what you just said, it sounds like it is more up your alley anyway.
Beaverun rallycross school -> $200
[url]http://www.beaverun.com[/url]
| USMARINE24M | 03-04-2004 07:07 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Mopho [/i]
[B]What did they teach you? [/B][/QUOTE]
They taught pretty much everything about the sport.. Rules and regulations and techniques... After alot of classes durning the morning and afternoon, in the evening we had instructors go with us in our cars applying certain techniques (left foot braking, late apex, etc..)
[B]What did they teach you? [/B][/QUOTE]
They taught pretty much everything about the sport.. Rules and regulations and techniques... After alot of classes durning the morning and afternoon, in the evening we had instructors go with us in our cars applying certain techniques (left foot braking, late apex, etc..)
| CageChicane | 03-05-2004 03:51 AM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Morison[/i]
[B] Building a fast rally car and NOT taking any form of rally school is a good way to ensure you'll spend a large amount of money on the car.
:huh: [/B][/QUOTE]
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by RB5 Clone[/i]
[B] " i think i would rather spend that large amount of money on my car than on myself."
This kind of thinking (or lack of it) amazes me. Nobody imagines that airline pilots could learn by trial and error, nobody imagines that helicopter pilots can learn by trial and error....why does anyone think they can learn rally driving the same way?
The capabilities of a modern rally car and the techniques needed to extract that performance safely and sanely are so far beyond the understanding of an untrained driver it would be laughable if it weren't so pathetic and dangerous.
Hate to break it to ya, guys, but driving a powerful turbo AWD car sideways is NOT an innate skill. It takes many counter-intuitive techniques to keep the car shiny-side-up and out of the trees (and keep its crew out of the freakin hospital!)
I am dumbfounded by ppl's willingness to spend cubic dollars on the latest carbon-fiber bolt-on ricey widgets and hot ECU's and superheated turbo kits...and then don't understand the value of the "control software" behind the wheel (ie the DRIVER, duuh!) in the whole equation.
Hurtling down some squiggly forest road, dodging rocks and trees and dropoffs, a trained driver in a clapped-out old VW Golf can totally spank and totally embarrass the typical street driver (even a good one) pedaling a rally-prepped STi. All the STi does is ensure that the untrained driver will be going a whole lot faster when they leave the road and the inevitable Bad Things start happening really really fast.
Trust me, crashing a rally car is not cool, it is not fun, it hurts a lot and costs way way more than any rally school. Let's just say I learned this the hard way--about 3 stage miles into my first event. We wrecked a brand-new beautifully prepped car by backing into the woods at 70 mph, rolling 4 times and landing on the roof at the bottom of a 20-foot embankment. The car was toast. We were lucky to get out alive.
After my initial bad experience, I smartened up and have since done several courses at O'Neil's. My team partner has done several courses there too. Now we finish way more rallies than we DNF. We go faster and safer than we ever imagined possible. Heck, we're even racking up some points now! We can flatly state that the expenditure at Tim's school (not cheap, no question!) has been the most cost-effective go-fast money we have spent on rallying, bar none.
If you want to drive fast in the forest, you owe it to yourself and your friends and your Mom to log some miles at rally school.
Dave G
Last Ditch Racing [/B][/QUOTE]
hey guys, thanks for biting my head off without having any idea who i am! i happpen to be pretty good at driving through forest track. i think i said this already, but i live next to a National Forest similar to Sand Hills. i get plenty of practice, i go there every day for hours after class. i happen to be trying to get into Rally and my money would be better spent on things like safety equipment, tires, wheels, etc.
i made one little comment and i get a full lenth novel about how much of a dumbass i am. next time dont make assumptions....you know what they do.
[B] Building a fast rally car and NOT taking any form of rally school is a good way to ensure you'll spend a large amount of money on the car.
:huh: [/B][/QUOTE]
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by RB5 Clone[/i]
[B] " i think i would rather spend that large amount of money on my car than on myself."
This kind of thinking (or lack of it) amazes me. Nobody imagines that airline pilots could learn by trial and error, nobody imagines that helicopter pilots can learn by trial and error....why does anyone think they can learn rally driving the same way?
The capabilities of a modern rally car and the techniques needed to extract that performance safely and sanely are so far beyond the understanding of an untrained driver it would be laughable if it weren't so pathetic and dangerous.
Hate to break it to ya, guys, but driving a powerful turbo AWD car sideways is NOT an innate skill. It takes many counter-intuitive techniques to keep the car shiny-side-up and out of the trees (and keep its crew out of the freakin hospital!)
I am dumbfounded by ppl's willingness to spend cubic dollars on the latest carbon-fiber bolt-on ricey widgets and hot ECU's and superheated turbo kits...and then don't understand the value of the "control software" behind the wheel (ie the DRIVER, duuh!) in the whole equation.
Hurtling down some squiggly forest road, dodging rocks and trees and dropoffs, a trained driver in a clapped-out old VW Golf can totally spank and totally embarrass the typical street driver (even a good one) pedaling a rally-prepped STi. All the STi does is ensure that the untrained driver will be going a whole lot faster when they leave the road and the inevitable Bad Things start happening really really fast.
Trust me, crashing a rally car is not cool, it is not fun, it hurts a lot and costs way way more than any rally school. Let's just say I learned this the hard way--about 3 stage miles into my first event. We wrecked a brand-new beautifully prepped car by backing into the woods at 70 mph, rolling 4 times and landing on the roof at the bottom of a 20-foot embankment. The car was toast. We were lucky to get out alive.
After my initial bad experience, I smartened up and have since done several courses at O'Neil's. My team partner has done several courses there too. Now we finish way more rallies than we DNF. We go faster and safer than we ever imagined possible. Heck, we're even racking up some points now! We can flatly state that the expenditure at Tim's school (not cheap, no question!) has been the most cost-effective go-fast money we have spent on rallying, bar none.
If you want to drive fast in the forest, you owe it to yourself and your friends and your Mom to log some miles at rally school.
Dave G
Last Ditch Racing [/B][/QUOTE]
hey guys, thanks for biting my head off without having any idea who i am! i happpen to be pretty good at driving through forest track. i think i said this already, but i live next to a National Forest similar to Sand Hills. i get plenty of practice, i go there every day for hours after class. i happen to be trying to get into Rally and my money would be better spent on things like safety equipment, tires, wheels, etc.
i made one little comment and i get a full lenth novel about how much of a dumbass i am. next time dont make assumptions....you know what they do.
| Mopho | 03-05-2004 10:20 AM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by CageChicane [/i]
[B]hey guys, thanks for biting my head off without having any idea who i am! i happpen to be pretty good at driving through forest track. i think i said this already, but i live next to a National Forest similar to Sand Hills. i get plenty of practice, i go there every day for hours after class. i happen to be trying to get into Rally and my money would be better spent on things like safety equipment, tires, wheels, etc.
i made one little comment and i get a full lenth novel about how much of a dumbass i am. next time dont make assumptions....you know what they do. [/B][/QUOTE]
Perhaps it is because you made a dumbass statement and you were setting a bad example for people who are not as "expert" as a 20 year old who drives his car illegally through the woods everyday:rolleyes:
The advice was meant for anyone interested in getting into rally, not just you
So I take it you have been able to teach yourself the art of Left Foot Braking to transfer weight around on the car. Or how to use the throttle to transfer weight Have you learned how not to over correct? What about where to look? Have you taught yourself how to do a Scandinavian Flick? Have you learned obsticle avoidance? Have you learned the proper way to read corners? What about the proper way to drive over a jump? Or what to do in a crash? Or how to judge your equipment and tires? Etc.Etc.
Rally School is safety equipment
And BTW I hope you bought or are buying a complete used rally car as opposed to building one
[B]hey guys, thanks for biting my head off without having any idea who i am! i happpen to be pretty good at driving through forest track. i think i said this already, but i live next to a National Forest similar to Sand Hills. i get plenty of practice, i go there every day for hours after class. i happen to be trying to get into Rally and my money would be better spent on things like safety equipment, tires, wheels, etc.
i made one little comment and i get a full lenth novel about how much of a dumbass i am. next time dont make assumptions....you know what they do. [/B][/QUOTE]
Perhaps it is because you made a dumbass statement and you were setting a bad example for people who are not as "expert" as a 20 year old who drives his car illegally through the woods everyday:rolleyes:
The advice was meant for anyone interested in getting into rally, not just you
So I take it you have been able to teach yourself the art of Left Foot Braking to transfer weight around on the car. Or how to use the throttle to transfer weight Have you learned how not to over correct? What about where to look? Have you taught yourself how to do a Scandinavian Flick? Have you learned obsticle avoidance? Have you learned the proper way to read corners? What about the proper way to drive over a jump? Or what to do in a crash? Or how to judge your equipment and tires? Etc.Etc.
Rally School is safety equipment
And BTW I hope you bought or are buying a complete used rally car as opposed to building one
| RB5 Clone | 03-05-2004 11:19 AM |
apologies to target
�
�
Sorry for the rant (well, not really). Wasn't trying to bite off anybody's head. I just got kinda carried away, admittedly at your expense. For that, I do apologize. My point is that people who want to rally need to concentrate on driving skills BEFORE focusing so much on hardware. More importantly, they need to be keenly aware of how rally driving and rally drivers are perceived by the general public.
There have been a number of incidents recently here in New England where guys spend big bucks on a WRX or STi or Evo, mod the bejezzis out of them, then designate themselves as Rallye Drivahs...and who then promptly crash those cars in stupid but unfortunately high-profile circumstances on public roads.
One recent case involved an Evo that was playing McRae en route to a rallyX and ran wide on a blind corner and smacked into the brand-new pickup of a neighbor to the guy who was hosting the race. Cute, huh? Fortunately, there were no injuries (except to the Evo and its driver's ego) but you can imagine how much this helped local public relations for further rallies in the area.
This PR issue is one of the biggest hurdles blocking the growth of rally in the US. If the rally community (including those who want to become part of it) doesn't get a grip the public perception of who we are and how we drive, we may well be reduced to running "rallies" at indoor stadiums like motorcycle Supercross or offroad truck racing.
Too many rally wannabes have proven that their primary driving talent is taking out themselves and their passengers and the luckless civilians they hit. A couple of bad examples get public attention, and soon every Subie with big lights and a wing on the back becomes a giant bullseye for zealous cops with a bad attude. Often this attitude has been earned by picking up mangled pieces of what used to be human beings. Alienating the cops like this is a real missed opportunity, because many of them are enthusiastic car guys who love racing...and genuinely respect driving talent when they see it expressed in the right place.
If you have a private secret place to practice, that's great...but remember that even in a National Forest, the roads are NOT closed and if you come over a blind crest sideways and some poor trout fisherman is coming the other way in his F150, the fallout will be Not Pretty to say the least.
At rally school, they teach the techniques of managing a car in low-grip situations, and do it in carefully controlled conditions. This is worth a lot of $$$. Rally school does NOT NOT NOT teach judgement. That is totally up to each participant. Learning radical driving in controlled conditions is a major step in honing the sound judgement that will make a big difference in how far you can actually go in rallying.
That's all, stepping off the soapbox for now...gotta go wrench on the RS to get prepped for TSD/rallyX next weekend.
Dave G
LDR "Rally Dad"
There have been a number of incidents recently here in New England where guys spend big bucks on a WRX or STi or Evo, mod the bejezzis out of them, then designate themselves as Rallye Drivahs...and who then promptly crash those cars in stupid but unfortunately high-profile circumstances on public roads.
One recent case involved an Evo that was playing McRae en route to a rallyX and ran wide on a blind corner and smacked into the brand-new pickup of a neighbor to the guy who was hosting the race. Cute, huh? Fortunately, there were no injuries (except to the Evo and its driver's ego) but you can imagine how much this helped local public relations for further rallies in the area.
This PR issue is one of the biggest hurdles blocking the growth of rally in the US. If the rally community (including those who want to become part of it) doesn't get a grip the public perception of who we are and how we drive, we may well be reduced to running "rallies" at indoor stadiums like motorcycle Supercross or offroad truck racing.
Too many rally wannabes have proven that their primary driving talent is taking out themselves and their passengers and the luckless civilians they hit. A couple of bad examples get public attention, and soon every Subie with big lights and a wing on the back becomes a giant bullseye for zealous cops with a bad attude. Often this attitude has been earned by picking up mangled pieces of what used to be human beings. Alienating the cops like this is a real missed opportunity, because many of them are enthusiastic car guys who love racing...and genuinely respect driving talent when they see it expressed in the right place.
If you have a private secret place to practice, that's great...but remember that even in a National Forest, the roads are NOT closed and if you come over a blind crest sideways and some poor trout fisherman is coming the other way in his F150, the fallout will be Not Pretty to say the least.
At rally school, they teach the techniques of managing a car in low-grip situations, and do it in carefully controlled conditions. This is worth a lot of $$$. Rally school does NOT NOT NOT teach judgement. That is totally up to each participant. Learning radical driving in controlled conditions is a major step in honing the sound judgement that will make a big difference in how far you can actually go in rallying.
That's all, stepping off the soapbox for now...gotta go wrench on the RS to get prepped for TSD/rallyX next weekend.
Dave G
LDR "Rally Dad"
| Lachlan | 03-05-2004 12:00 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Mopho [/i]
So I take it you have been able to teach yourself the art of Left Foot Braking to transfer weight around on the car. Or how to use the throttle to transfer weight Have you learned how not to over correct? What about where to look? Have you taught yourself how to do a Scandinavian Flick? Have you learned obsticle avoidance? Have you learned the proper way to read corners? What about the proper way to drive over a jump? Or what to do in a crash? Or how to judge your equipment and tires? Etc.Etc.
[/B][/QUOTE]
All that sounds COOL! I want to learn all that stuff!
So I take it you have been able to teach yourself the art of Left Foot Braking to transfer weight around on the car. Or how to use the throttle to transfer weight Have you learned how not to over correct? What about where to look? Have you taught yourself how to do a Scandinavian Flick? Have you learned obsticle avoidance? Have you learned the proper way to read corners? What about the proper way to drive over a jump? Or what to do in a crash? Or how to judge your equipment and tires? Etc.Etc.
[/B][/QUOTE]
All that sounds COOL! I want to learn all that stuff!
| CageChicane | 03-05-2004 01:18 PM |
Mopho/RB5Clone,
yeah, i have taught myself all those things. i have watched tons of videos on how to do them, then i went out and practiced. i admittedly have gotten in some pretty dumb situations (on coming traffic) which has led to me and my friends to buying walky-talkies and affectively blocking off the roads. plus, i always do a little recce to scare off the deer.
i consider myself unbelievebly lucky to have a 500 mile dirt road playground right next door. that is my favorite feature about Alabama, they cant afford to pave their roads. anyone else i would say go to a Rally school. as for your rant, i kinna left the door open for it. i didnt really have any explaination around my original comment. i would really really really like to do a Rally School, but for my special case i think my funds would be better spent getting my car ready.
now that that is all behind us, Mopho--you said something about buying a car that is already rally preped. why? too late for that in my case, i already have a (very slow) '93 eclipse that i have installed a cage and seats/harnesses in. i just want to now your opinion on that. (the car cost $700, hard offer to pass up).
edit: pm me if you want to here examples of my early stupidity in rally practice. i dont really want them out on a public forum.
yeah, i have taught myself all those things. i have watched tons of videos on how to do them, then i went out and practiced. i admittedly have gotten in some pretty dumb situations (on coming traffic) which has led to me and my friends to buying walky-talkies and affectively blocking off the roads. plus, i always do a little recce to scare off the deer.
i consider myself unbelievebly lucky to have a 500 mile dirt road playground right next door. that is my favorite feature about Alabama, they cant afford to pave their roads. anyone else i would say go to a Rally school. as for your rant, i kinna left the door open for it. i didnt really have any explaination around my original comment. i would really really really like to do a Rally School, but for my special case i think my funds would be better spent getting my car ready.
now that that is all behind us, Mopho--you said something about buying a car that is already rally preped. why? too late for that in my case, i already have a (very slow) '93 eclipse that i have installed a cage and seats/harnesses in. i just want to now your opinion on that. (the car cost $700, hard offer to pass up).
edit: pm me if you want to here examples of my early stupidity in rally practice. i dont really want them out on a public forum.
| datageek | 03-05-2004 01:54 PM |
Just to echo USMARINE24M, I also did the Ridgecrest school last weekend. Lots of information and hands-on, in-car private instruction -- all for $80. It's hard to beat. Throw in another $15 and stick around for the rallycross the next day to put what you learned into practice in a controlled and (mostly) safe environment. Check it out: [url]http://www.californiarallyseries.com/[/url]
| Mopho | 03-05-2004 01:57 PM |
Well I am glad you are playing it safe.
Since most people get over excited about going rally, they tend to over do it on the car and buy something fast and or nice and then convert it to a rally car, which could take years and a lot of money. Most experienced Rally people suggest buying a cheap used car already prepared for a first car as it is cheaper, most of the bugs are worked out, and you get right into seat time instead of spending time working on it. You can find cars ready to go rallying for as little as $3-6k, it generally costs way more than that to prepare a car. Although in your case it may be different as you got a car really cheap ( I hope it is solid).
Since most people get over excited about going rally, they tend to over do it on the car and buy something fast and or nice and then convert it to a rally car, which could take years and a lot of money. Most experienced Rally people suggest buying a cheap used car already prepared for a first car as it is cheaper, most of the bugs are worked out, and you get right into seat time instead of spending time working on it. You can find cars ready to go rallying for as little as $3-6k, it generally costs way more than that to prepare a car. Although in your case it may be different as you got a car really cheap ( I hope it is solid).
| RB5 Clone | 03-05-2004 02:52 PM |
sounds betta now
�
�
Hi Cage--
Glad to hear you are practicing safer "stage" etiquette by working with radios to head off traffic problems and cut down on scaring civilians silly or worse.
We are also very fortunate here in Maine to have a huge network of logging roads to practice on. Even with reasonable precautions, it's still pretty risky out there on uncontrolled roads. I much prefer the practice gained while actually running rallies, cause it's way safer and more fun. If you crash on a rally, at least you can't blame somebody else...
As Mopho said, it's almost always cheaper to buy a built rally car than to build your own. If you don't believe this, spend $10k to finish your $700 Eclipse and then see how much you can sell it for!
If you're determined to go the hard route and build your own car, at least have some experienced rally guys check out your shell to see where you need to go next from your current level of prep. The Eclipse platform is well supported with rally-spec parts, you may be able to buy used DSM spares off other teams upgrading from older Talons and stuff.
Check out scca.org or nasarallysport.com for rules detailing class specs and prep guidelines. You can run in SCCA or NASA production classes with minimal mods--cage, race seats & belts, skid plates, beefed up suspension and upgraded lighting. You'll need a rally computer and intercom, and a bunch of spare struts, control arms, driveshafts, etc 'cause you WILL bend the car sooner or later.
Upgrade your cage to add as much support to the shell as you possibly can. While you've got the car torn up, seam-weld the thing everywhere you can reach. The car will drive better and last a LOT longer this way, not to mention being much safer when you roll it!
For your first car, being low-powered is actually an advantage--you will learn to DRIVE the roads and stay smooth and clean and maintain speed, as opposed to hanging on for dear life behind a big fat turbo and doing lots of "emergency braking practice" and having your co-driver yell at you to slow the ))(*&*&$!! down all the time. Spend $$$ on good gravel tires, they are your most cost-effective equipment purchase bar none. My race team partner and I got some great advice early on: "stick with your low-powered car until you can drive an entire stage and NEVER lift." This took a couple years, and we were both far better off for the experience.
ASAP, get your hiney to some rallies (NASA is running a bunch of events in the Southeast this year) and stick yer head into some rally cars. The absolute cheapest way to get started is to become a co-driver. Co-drivers are always in demand, and often have expenses paid or at least defrayed by team owners and/or drivers.
You'll learn a lot about the game and strategy of rallying from the right seat, minus the heinous cost issues and distracting team-building worries of a driver/car owner. Time spent co-driving pays big dividends when you eventually start driving your own car on stage, not to mention making it a WHOLE lot less stressful breaking in your own newbie co-driver!
You will get your best guidance from other rally guys who have learned the hard way.
Have fun, and remember...it's OK to be scared out there on stage--makes you keep your brain in gear, as opposed to thinking with other parts of your anatomy.
Dave G
Glad to hear you are practicing safer "stage" etiquette by working with radios to head off traffic problems and cut down on scaring civilians silly or worse.
We are also very fortunate here in Maine to have a huge network of logging roads to practice on. Even with reasonable precautions, it's still pretty risky out there on uncontrolled roads. I much prefer the practice gained while actually running rallies, cause it's way safer and more fun. If you crash on a rally, at least you can't blame somebody else...
As Mopho said, it's almost always cheaper to buy a built rally car than to build your own. If you don't believe this, spend $10k to finish your $700 Eclipse and then see how much you can sell it for!
If you're determined to go the hard route and build your own car, at least have some experienced rally guys check out your shell to see where you need to go next from your current level of prep. The Eclipse platform is well supported with rally-spec parts, you may be able to buy used DSM spares off other teams upgrading from older Talons and stuff.
Check out scca.org or nasarallysport.com for rules detailing class specs and prep guidelines. You can run in SCCA or NASA production classes with minimal mods--cage, race seats & belts, skid plates, beefed up suspension and upgraded lighting. You'll need a rally computer and intercom, and a bunch of spare struts, control arms, driveshafts, etc 'cause you WILL bend the car sooner or later.
Upgrade your cage to add as much support to the shell as you possibly can. While you've got the car torn up, seam-weld the thing everywhere you can reach. The car will drive better and last a LOT longer this way, not to mention being much safer when you roll it!
For your first car, being low-powered is actually an advantage--you will learn to DRIVE the roads and stay smooth and clean and maintain speed, as opposed to hanging on for dear life behind a big fat turbo and doing lots of "emergency braking practice" and having your co-driver yell at you to slow the ))(*&*&$!! down all the time. Spend $$$ on good gravel tires, they are your most cost-effective equipment purchase bar none. My race team partner and I got some great advice early on: "stick with your low-powered car until you can drive an entire stage and NEVER lift." This took a couple years, and we were both far better off for the experience.
ASAP, get your hiney to some rallies (NASA is running a bunch of events in the Southeast this year) and stick yer head into some rally cars. The absolute cheapest way to get started is to become a co-driver. Co-drivers are always in demand, and often have expenses paid or at least defrayed by team owners and/or drivers.
You'll learn a lot about the game and strategy of rallying from the right seat, minus the heinous cost issues and distracting team-building worries of a driver/car owner. Time spent co-driving pays big dividends when you eventually start driving your own car on stage, not to mention making it a WHOLE lot less stressful breaking in your own newbie co-driver!
You will get your best guidance from other rally guys who have learned the hard way.
Have fun, and remember...it's OK to be scared out there on stage--makes you keep your brain in gear, as opposed to thinking with other parts of your anatomy.
Dave G
| datageek | 03-05-2004 03:07 PM |
Sorry to keep beating on this CageChicane. But you did pipe up, so you kind of volunteered to make yourself an example for why your advice isn't really the best. The moral of the story here is next time you are doing something illegal and easily interpreted as blantently stupid don't pipe up, just keep it your happy little secret. :)
There are a lot of things that going to a rally school can get you that just practicing on your own in a relatively safe environment can't.
First off, only a fool pooh-poohs getting training from experts in a field they want to go into. While it's possible that someone who has been doing something longer than you won't be able to tell you anything new and useful, it's not terribly likely. Now, it may not be very much more than you didn't already know -- but in racing, every possible advantage counts.
Secondly, when you're racing along you are concentrating hard. Most of that is focused on what you are doing, and not how you are doing it or how you can improve. Having someone trained and skilled dedicated to just sitting, observing, and looking for areas to try doing differently is immensely valuable in and and of itself. If nothing else, having another person giving you a different persepctive can point out things that you didn't see yourself.
The bottom line is take advantage of other peoples' experience.
On putting money into the car vs. going to driving school... The way I look at it, that makes sense IF what you want to do is sell yourself as someone who mods and preps cars. If you want to sell yourself as a driver, doesn't it make more sense to make yourself the best driver possible rather than making yourself some driver with the best car possible?
There are a lot of things that going to a rally school can get you that just practicing on your own in a relatively safe environment can't.
First off, only a fool pooh-poohs getting training from experts in a field they want to go into. While it's possible that someone who has been doing something longer than you won't be able to tell you anything new and useful, it's not terribly likely. Now, it may not be very much more than you didn't already know -- but in racing, every possible advantage counts.
Secondly, when you're racing along you are concentrating hard. Most of that is focused on what you are doing, and not how you are doing it or how you can improve. Having someone trained and skilled dedicated to just sitting, observing, and looking for areas to try doing differently is immensely valuable in and and of itself. If nothing else, having another person giving you a different persepctive can point out things that you didn't see yourself.
The bottom line is take advantage of other peoples' experience.
On putting money into the car vs. going to driving school... The way I look at it, that makes sense IF what you want to do is sell yourself as someone who mods and preps cars. If you want to sell yourself as a driver, doesn't it make more sense to make yourself the best driver possible rather than making yourself some driver with the best car possible?
| CageChicane | 03-05-2004 04:01 PM |
datageek, i was thinking in class today that i would have been better off just keeping to myself. i absolutely agree that it is good to have instruction, and like i said i really want to do it. i did some novice AutoX school and learned a half dosen things i wasnt doing right, so i am a believer. my original quote wasnt advice to anyone, just personal preference.
that $80 RallyX school someone mentioned is something i would 100% do if it wasnt 3000 miles away.
RB5Clone, you gave some really good advice in your last post, funny part is is that i have already followed it before you told me. i went to the Sandblast and got some of the rules explained to me that i was unclear on. i am currently trying to co-drive or crew for some guy that goes to my college. so i agree with everything you said especially the 'start with a slow car first'. i was originally going to use my WRX until someone talked me out of it.
conclusion; ignore me and just go to a Rally School if you can afford it. do what i say, not what i do.
that $80 RallyX school someone mentioned is something i would 100% do if it wasnt 3000 miles away.
RB5Clone, you gave some really good advice in your last post, funny part is is that i have already followed it before you told me. i went to the Sandblast and got some of the rules explained to me that i was unclear on. i am currently trying to co-drive or crew for some guy that goes to my college. so i agree with everything you said especially the 'start with a slow car first'. i was originally going to use my WRX until someone talked me out of it.
conclusion; ignore me and just go to a Rally School if you can afford it. do what i say, not what i do.
| wrrrx | 03-05-2004 04:57 PM |
$40 or $50 for RallyX?!? :eek:
Man, we have it too good- $20 for members/$25 non-mbrs.
Actually... mebbe we should raise it- more people would drop out and the rest of us would get lots more runs!! :lol:
Russ R
Man, we have it too good- $20 for members/$25 non-mbrs.
Actually... mebbe we should raise it- more people would drop out and the rest of us would get lots more runs!! :lol:
Russ R
| CageChicane | 03-05-2004 05:44 PM |
since this thread has gotten a lot of attention from some experienced rally guys i have decided to use it.
can someone go to this link:
[url]http://www.discoveryparts.com/cgi-bin/store/commerce.cgi?product=firesys[/url]
and tell me which fire systems are work with the NASA rally rules and then which one you suggest.
can someone go to this link:
[url]http://www.discoveryparts.com/cgi-bin/store/commerce.cgi?product=firesys[/url]
and tell me which fire systems are work with the NASA rally rules and then which one you suggest.
| Chaste Automotive | 03-06-2004 11:18 AM |
Before you buy anything for your car spend the money on yourself. You are the perfect example of a know it all that will not listen to people that know a little more than you. IF you can't or won't then build your car (buy your car if you are smart) and go to a rally and enter and compete. Personally I find RallyX to be a bit worthless but hey to each their own. Just do me a favor and don't go run throught the woods! It is hard enough for us to get roads to run on without people running around illegally in the National Forest. We are constantly being blocked by enviromentalists and such about using roads, one of their arguements is that if we run the roads it will encourage other people to try and run them themselves. Do us all a favor please,you say you like rally? Then do not make it more difficult for us to rally.
| CageChicane | 03-06-2004 02:16 PM |
i thought we kinna ended that argument; i dont consider myself a know-it-all. i just drove 12 hours to get to Sand Hills to ask questions and learn about rally. i dont know why you think i wont listen to more experienced drivers. instead of spending thousands of dollars on a rally school i d-loaded GBs of videos showing heal/toe, pendilum, Scand flick, etc. i freaking studied the videos for hours before i went out and tried it. i think Marcus Gronholm is a pretty good instructor.
just about everything RB5Clone and some of the other guys said i agree with. you must have just read one post. anyway, help on the fire extinguisher?
if you really want i will delete some posts to destroy the evidence :cool:
just about everything RB5Clone and some of the other guys said i agree with. you must have just read one post. anyway, help on the fire extinguisher?
if you really want i will delete some posts to destroy the evidence :cool:
| Geek Guy | 03-06-2004 03:05 PM |
If you want help on car building, go to specialstage.com
| Drav | 04-13-2004 11:47 AM |
Just bumping this thread because I found it doing a search, and it's chock-full of good advice.
| Chaste Automotive | 04-13-2004 01:06 PM |
Cagechicane dowloading videos is not the same as instruction. I could care less if you wrap yourself around a tree but my concern is that you are using roads without permision. Thank you for making it harder on rally organizers! For those that want a list of rally schools feel free to email me I would be happy to put you in touch with people that can instruct you on how to drive safe and fast.
One of the biggest problems is that you are watching Marcus Gronholm driving a Peugot which has active differentials, active roll bars, and a sequential transmission which requires a significantly different technique then driving your viscous coupled car. How do I kow this? Because I have recently switched to an active diff car and everything changes completely. This isthe reason I have a problem with people copying cages they see pictures of on the internet. There are a lot of factors that you cannot figure out by watching videos or by looking at pictures. Good luck I hope yo uget some sense.
One of the biggest problems is that you are watching Marcus Gronholm driving a Peugot which has active differentials, active roll bars, and a sequential transmission which requires a significantly different technique then driving your viscous coupled car. How do I kow this? Because I have recently switched to an active diff car and everything changes completely. This isthe reason I have a problem with people copying cages they see pictures of on the internet. There are a lot of factors that you cannot figure out by watching videos or by looking at pictures. Good luck I hope yo uget some sense.
| ITWRX4ME | 04-13-2004 02:34 PM |
Chaste, lay off! Damn, dude. You act as if Cage's first post was his last. Enough already. He has explained himself silly.
| ITWRX4ME | 04-13-2004 02:39 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by CageChicane[/i]
[B]if you really want i will delete some posts to destroy the evidence :cool: [/B][/QUOTE]
Don't do that (you can't delete them anyway, but you can edit and remove the text). It just fuxors up the thread and makes in incromprehensible.
Besides, you manned up about it. The discussion is valuable. Just don't make any more comments about practicing on public roads.
[B]if you really want i will delete some posts to destroy the evidence :cool: [/B][/QUOTE]
Don't do that (you can't delete them anyway, but you can edit and remove the text). It just fuxors up the thread and makes in incromprehensible.
Besides, you manned up about it. The discussion is valuable. Just don't make any more comments about practicing on public roads.
| RacingBlue | 04-13-2004 02:49 PM |
You just can't beat the CRS school for $80.00 for a newby. Best bang for the buck ever.
[url]www.californiarallyseries.com[/url]
Then run some Rally xs with a beater and then maybe codrive in club events.
Then go and spend a ton on a big school and buy a big buck car.
[url]www.californiarallyseries.com[/url]
Then run some Rally xs with a beater and then maybe codrive in club events.
Then go and spend a ton on a big school and buy a big buck car.
| fasteddie | 04-13-2004 03:20 PM |
My 2 cents:
!) Rally-x. Cheap! As others mentioned. No complicated prerequisites. Try this to get your feet wet.
2) Course work or spectate a Club or ProRally. Get involved. Meet people. Ask a lot of questions like: did you go to rally school and if so where,, how can I get paying drive in a top car and finally can I take your evo for beat run? ;-) Take note of who seems to be doing it right and wrong from your perspective.
3) And if you still have the fever and the budget, go to O'Neil's school. By then, you will have a pretty good idea of what you want.
Remember it is supposed to be FUN!
Ted
!) Rally-x. Cheap! As others mentioned. No complicated prerequisites. Try this to get your feet wet.
2) Course work or spectate a Club or ProRally. Get involved. Meet people. Ask a lot of questions like: did you go to rally school and if so where,, how can I get paying drive in a top car and finally can I take your evo for beat run? ;-) Take note of who seems to be doing it right and wrong from your perspective.
3) And if you still have the fever and the budget, go to O'Neil's school. By then, you will have a pretty good idea of what you want.
Remember it is supposed to be FUN!
Ted
| rallyho | 04-13-2004 04:10 PM |
Hey FastEddie. Don't you have a bunch of clapped out rally cars and a bunch of dirt roads around your place? Let's start a rally school over there! I know your neighbors would be into it.
Oh, and can I take your wifes car for a beat run?
Oh, and can I take your wifes car for a beat run?
| Morison | 04-13-2004 04:27 PM |
Cage ...
I wasn't trying to jump on you - I have just seen this way of thinking too many times.
First off - I doubt you need a 'fire system' in the car and using fire extinguishers is often a better choice. Check the rules for the sanctioning body to find out what they require. One of teh things about Rallying is that you may need to use your extinguisher on someone else's car ...one of the reasons our region requires cars to carry TWO extinguishers.
Also - after 20 years of 'enthusiastic' gravel driving, and KNOWING that I was good on loose surface ... I took a two day school here in Calgary and learned how much I DIDN'T know.
I think that anyone who goes playing on 'potentially closed' roads is in for a bit of surprise when they hit their first stage ... a proper school with a proper road section and good instructors will almost ALWAYS save you money by keeping you on the road.
I won't touch your using rods without permissions ... needless to say that is a BAD thing.
I wasn't trying to jump on you - I have just seen this way of thinking too many times.
First off - I doubt you need a 'fire system' in the car and using fire extinguishers is often a better choice. Check the rules for the sanctioning body to find out what they require. One of teh things about Rallying is that you may need to use your extinguisher on someone else's car ...one of the reasons our region requires cars to carry TWO extinguishers.
Also - after 20 years of 'enthusiastic' gravel driving, and KNOWING that I was good on loose surface ... I took a two day school here in Calgary and learned how much I DIDN'T know.
I think that anyone who goes playing on 'potentially closed' roads is in for a bit of surprise when they hit their first stage ... a proper school with a proper road section and good instructors will almost ALWAYS save you money by keeping you on the road.
I won't touch your using rods without permissions ... needless to say that is a BAD thing.
| ProdriveRex | 04-13-2004 04:44 PM |
i want to rally
| M. Hurst | 04-14-2004 10:28 AM |
Rally Schools
�
�
While it's true that many of today's successful drivers never attended a school, we started in an era when cars were much slower.
We started out with Datsun 510s, Colts, and Volvo 142s and most had less than 100hp. We ran on cooper bias-ply snow tires.
We had no grip and no power.
I started my rally career by working at a well established driver's shop (Guy Light), Guy's property had it's own rally stage, so I really thought I had things figured out by the time I started rallying. Boy was I wrong! Had I been driving an awd turbo car at that time in my career, I'd probably be dead.
It's my opinion that the newer, heavier cars lose less speed when they leave the road, combine the higher speeds and increased weight and you have way more inertia to deal with. The crashes involve more energy. Awd cars are also capable of leaving the road at weird tangents from losing, then suddenly regaining grip.
Very high speed / loose surface car control skills can't be learned on a rallycross or from a video.
It's amzing to see the difference in a new driver's attitude after they've run that first stage, and seen how spooky and difficult rallying can be.
Whatever path you take, please take it easy, think of that human life sitting next to you in that car, think of that phone call to your parents in the middle of the night.
Crashing sucks.
Mike Hurst
2001,02,03 Club Rally G5 National Champion
SCCA Club Rally Series Manager
We started out with Datsun 510s, Colts, and Volvo 142s and most had less than 100hp. We ran on cooper bias-ply snow tires.
We had no grip and no power.
I started my rally career by working at a well established driver's shop (Guy Light), Guy's property had it's own rally stage, so I really thought I had things figured out by the time I started rallying. Boy was I wrong! Had I been driving an awd turbo car at that time in my career, I'd probably be dead.
It's my opinion that the newer, heavier cars lose less speed when they leave the road, combine the higher speeds and increased weight and you have way more inertia to deal with. The crashes involve more energy. Awd cars are also capable of leaving the road at weird tangents from losing, then suddenly regaining grip.
Very high speed / loose surface car control skills can't be learned on a rallycross or from a video.
It's amzing to see the difference in a new driver's attitude after they've run that first stage, and seen how spooky and difficult rallying can be.
Whatever path you take, please take it easy, think of that human life sitting next to you in that car, think of that phone call to your parents in the middle of the night.
Crashing sucks.
Mike Hurst
2001,02,03 Club Rally G5 National Champion
SCCA Club Rally Series Manager
| Ozymandias | 04-16-2004 04:30 AM |
are there such things as scholarships for rally schools?
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