| Choose | 11-07-2005 05:07 PM |
Rally New York aiming for WRC status!
�
�
Got this off rally-live.com....not sure if this wtlw or not but I'm calculating how many hours of driving it would be! :)
The Sullivan County Visitors Association and Rally New York, Ltd. have reached an agreement to pursue a bid for a future round of the World Rally Championship.
Rally New York is seeking approval to submit a bid to the Federation Internationale de l'Automobile (FIA) to host a World Rally Championship here in the Sullivan County Catskills. The FIA is interested in expanding the World Rally series especially with a location in the United States. The observation year would be slated for early 2007 with the actual event held from 2008 on an annual basis.
Rally New York has already received approval from the Town Supervisors of the towns where the championship would be held and legislative approval from Sullivan County.
�We are very interested in bringing an automobile race of this importance to Sullivan County and fully support the efforts of this experienced promoter,� stated Chris Cunningham, the Sullivan County Legislative Chairman. The Sullivan County Visitors Association is working hand in hand with Rally New York seeking public and private partnerships to sponsor the event.
�A World Championship event of this caliber will give Sullivan County world recognition and a substantial boost to the economy of Sullivan County, the region and the entire State of New York,� said Roberta Byron-Lockwood, President & CEO of the Sullivan County Visitors Association.
Ivan Orisek, President of Rally New York, Ltd. stated that the process is a two year venture with the first year being an observation event in which observers from the FIA would evaluate the rally to see if it meets specifications to be included into the World Rally Championship. The next year would be the actual event seen on TV by hundreds of millions of rally fans around the world. The economic effects of an event of this magnitude are millions of dollars during the event and residual millions due to the extreme exposure of the race.
Ed Jackson, Deputy Clerk of the Course added: �This is a culmination of our five-year effort to bring rallying in the United States out of distant wilderness inaccessible to spectators and to the vicinity of New York City.� Sullivan County Catskills is a resort area located only 90 miles northwest of New York City with excellent highway access.
Rally New York, Ltd. is already the promoter of Rally New York USA and International Rally New York, two of the eight events being held in the 2006 United States Rally Championship. Rally New York will seek support of ACCUS, the United States Affiliate of FIA, the United States Auto Club (USAC) and National Auto Sport Association (NASA) for the bid to the FIA.
Press release
SCVA
The Sullivan County Visitors Association and Rally New York, Ltd. have reached an agreement to pursue a bid for a future round of the World Rally Championship.
Rally New York is seeking approval to submit a bid to the Federation Internationale de l'Automobile (FIA) to host a World Rally Championship here in the Sullivan County Catskills. The FIA is interested in expanding the World Rally series especially with a location in the United States. The observation year would be slated for early 2007 with the actual event held from 2008 on an annual basis.
Rally New York has already received approval from the Town Supervisors of the towns where the championship would be held and legislative approval from Sullivan County.
�We are very interested in bringing an automobile race of this importance to Sullivan County and fully support the efforts of this experienced promoter,� stated Chris Cunningham, the Sullivan County Legislative Chairman. The Sullivan County Visitors Association is working hand in hand with Rally New York seeking public and private partnerships to sponsor the event.
�A World Championship event of this caliber will give Sullivan County world recognition and a substantial boost to the economy of Sullivan County, the region and the entire State of New York,� said Roberta Byron-Lockwood, President & CEO of the Sullivan County Visitors Association.
Ivan Orisek, President of Rally New York, Ltd. stated that the process is a two year venture with the first year being an observation event in which observers from the FIA would evaluate the rally to see if it meets specifications to be included into the World Rally Championship. The next year would be the actual event seen on TV by hundreds of millions of rally fans around the world. The economic effects of an event of this magnitude are millions of dollars during the event and residual millions due to the extreme exposure of the race.
Ed Jackson, Deputy Clerk of the Course added: �This is a culmination of our five-year effort to bring rallying in the United States out of distant wilderness inaccessible to spectators and to the vicinity of New York City.� Sullivan County Catskills is a resort area located only 90 miles northwest of New York City with excellent highway access.
Rally New York, Ltd. is already the promoter of Rally New York USA and International Rally New York, two of the eight events being held in the 2006 United States Rally Championship. Rally New York will seek support of ACCUS, the United States Affiliate of FIA, the United States Auto Club (USAC) and National Auto Sport Association (NASA) for the bid to the FIA.
Press release
SCVA
| WagonMonster | 11-07-2005 05:15 PM |
That would certainly kick ass.
Although Rally Mexico is still closer to me :p
Although Rally Mexico is still closer to me :p
| slowscooby | 11-07-2005 05:16 PM |
That would be awesome... A rally here we can actually go watch....keep us posted
| XenoWolf | 11-07-2005 05:17 PM |
:eek:
Too... beautiful.... should have brought... poet...
Too... beautiful.... should have brought... poet...
| tcs007 | 11-07-2005 05:38 PM |
I cannot imagine how much it's going to cost in insurance premiums. :eek:
| Yotsuya | 11-07-2005 05:40 PM |
Could be good; New York is close enough to get Europeans to come over for it. Heck, it may be worth a drive from Chciago for me.
| bemani | 11-07-2005 05:41 PM |
good luck with all that.
| Thumper23 | 11-07-2005 05:44 PM |
wow, that would be awesome
| kevinsUBARU | 11-07-2005 05:58 PM |
I just read the news!!!!! SOOOOOOO excited :) Oh yeah, 45 minutes from my house ftw...I hope it works
| dakwrx | 11-07-2005 06:21 PM |
Oh God (FIA), let this happen!
I would take a week off of work for sure!!
:banana:
I would take a week off of work for sure!!
:banana:
| dakwrx | 11-07-2005 06:55 PM |
with any luck Subaru might even still be in the WRC in 2008!
| rex n effect | 11-07-2005 08:25 PM |
How can we petition the FIA to let this happen?
Hopefully the Rally New York is very serious about this and they do a great job with their "trial rally" in the first year.
Hopefully the Rally New York is very serious about this and they do a great job with their "trial rally" in the first year.
| Rallycarperson | 11-07-2005 08:33 PM |
A WRC event a 100 miles away from my house?? :eek:
Although I have heard rumors of a WRC event being held in the US, but nothing really being done...
~Mark
Although I have heard rumors of a WRC event being held in the US, but nothing really being done...
~Mark
| Kitsune | 11-07-2005 09:59 PM |
Sounds good and all, but, I am not sure if the FIA is going to look at Monticello and think it is exactly the place to be.
From what I have seen of the roads, the stages could be world class but where is everyone going to stay? And is this just going to exponentially increase the cost of running the event?
From what I have seen of the roads, the stages could be world class but where is everyone going to stay? And is this just going to exponentially increase the cost of running the event?
| mattyg41383 | 11-07-2005 10:14 PM |
I'd be there with a couple car loads of people to watch.
| Homemade WRX | 11-07-2005 10:51 PM |
WRC in new york, now that I could afford to go to on a college kid budget...Mexico is too much...:(
| Mopho | 11-07-2005 11:09 PM |
:lol:
Well, unless they found an investor to pump about $20mil into it, I highly doubt this will happen.
Well, unless they found an investor to pump about $20mil into it, I highly doubt this will happen.
| Protege Menace | 11-07-2005 11:59 PM |
man, its not even part of the rally-america championship :( won't be there :(
but it would be cool to run 45 cars behind petter :D
but it would be cool to run 45 cars behind petter :D
| leaknoil | 11-08-2005 12:56 AM |
I can't see the FIA getting involved in anyway the divided mess that rally in the US is. No unified sanctioning body, no commercial support from car manufacturers, no real TV coverage, lack of public interest, and lack of any political will to spend tax dollars on supporting a rally.
Even the people with WRC events are struggling to keep them going. The FIA would love to break into the US. They have looked at events in the past. The US isn't up to the standards of hosting a run of the mill BRC event yet alone a WRC one.
The closest event we have right now is probably Rim of the World, or maybe Pikes Peak, as it has international appeal. Of course the people running Pikes Peak aren't going to let anyone near their event. But, man I can dream about Loeb and Petter screaming up that mountain.
Even the people with WRC events are struggling to keep them going. The FIA would love to break into the US. They have looked at events in the past. The US isn't up to the standards of hosting a run of the mill BRC event yet alone a WRC one.
The closest event we have right now is probably Rim of the World, or maybe Pikes Peak, as it has international appeal. Of course the people running Pikes Peak aren't going to let anyone near their event. But, man I can dream about Loeb and Petter screaming up that mountain.
| Mopho | 11-08-2005 12:57 AM |
Pikes Peak is not a rally!
| leaknoil | 11-08-2005 01:00 AM |
[QUOTE=Mopho]Pikes Peak is not a rally![/QUOTE]
I watched a rally there. You must have missed it
:lol:
I watched a rally there. You must have missed it
:lol:
| Mopho | 11-08-2005 01:03 AM |
[QUOTE=leaknoil]I watched a rally there. You must have missed it
:lol:[/QUOTE]
Did not miss it, I was there. It's not a real rally, that is why it has been dropped for next year
:lol:[/QUOTE]
Did not miss it, I was there. It's not a real rally, that is why it has been dropped for next year
| leaknoil | 11-08-2005 01:08 AM |
Too bad. I thought it was a great idea. Only thing I've seen offered lately to expose people to rally that aren't already driving in them.
| Thumper23 | 11-08-2005 01:10 AM |
[QUOTE=leaknoil]I watched a rally there. You must have missed it
:lol:[/QUOTE]
its technically a hill climb
which I would suggest is a subcategory of rally :lol:
:lol:[/QUOTE]
its technically a hill climb
which I would suggest is a subcategory of rally :lol:
| leaknoil | 11-08-2005 01:16 AM |
Its such a long hill climb I'd call it more a vertically accending rally stage. ;)
| silver04rs | 11-08-2005 01:29 AM |
[QUOTE=Thumper23]its technically a hill climb
which I would suggest is a subcategory of rally :lol:[/QUOTE]
Actually the PPIHC is a rally... thursday and friday they run stages around the base of the mountian I believe and then run the hill climb on Sat or Sun
And as far as a US based WRC event this would be amazing. I have read in the past thatWRC would like to come to the US but needs to have it in a place that is well known. From what I have heard the were looking at RAMADA EXPRESS because of the fact that the stages run through the Grand Canyon. New York would also work because it is well known. I would prefer to see Laughlin (Ramada Express) for the sheer fact of a possible snow rally on the first dau followed by wide open gravel stages and a great SSS on sunday
Travis- The Gravel Crew
[url]www.gcralyx.com[/url]
which I would suggest is a subcategory of rally :lol:[/QUOTE]
Actually the PPIHC is a rally... thursday and friday they run stages around the base of the mountian I believe and then run the hill climb on Sat or Sun
And as far as a US based WRC event this would be amazing. I have read in the past thatWRC would like to come to the US but needs to have it in a place that is well known. From what I have heard the were looking at RAMADA EXPRESS because of the fact that the stages run through the Grand Canyon. New York would also work because it is well known. I would prefer to see Laughlin (Ramada Express) for the sheer fact of a possible snow rally on the first dau followed by wide open gravel stages and a great SSS on sunday
Travis- The Gravel Crew
[url]www.gcralyx.com[/url]
| Mopho | 11-08-2005 02:06 AM |
[QUOTE=silver04rs]Actually the PPIHC is a rally... thursday and friday they run stages around the base of the mountian I believe and then run the hill climb on Sat or Sun
][/QUOTE]
No, they timed what are basically just practice runs on the hill and called it a rally stage. They did add one more "stage" that was run on the same road, but below where the hillclimb starts. It was all on the PP toll road. If you want to call that a rally, then go ahead, but it was a farce and it did not mesh well with the organization of the PPHIC
][/QUOTE]
No, they timed what are basically just practice runs on the hill and called it a rally stage. They did add one more "stage" that was run on the same road, but below where the hillclimb starts. It was all on the PP toll road. If you want to call that a rally, then go ahead, but it was a farce and it did not mesh well with the organization of the PPHIC
| davis10 | 11-08-2005 02:33 AM |
I would be there in a second (from Vermont), but they need to do it in the summer so im not at college in montana. :)
| leaknoil | 11-08-2005 03:10 AM |
[QUOTE=Mopho]No, they timed what are basically just practice runs on the hill and called it a rally stage. They did add one more "stage" that was run on the same road, but below where the hillclimb starts. It was all on the PP toll road. If you want to call that a rally, then go ahead, but it was a farce and it did not mesh well with the organization of the PPHIC[/QUOTE]
Ya it didn't go all that well but, it was a good idea. Too bad they just gave up on it rather then try and make it work. Rally needs the publicity.
Ya it didn't go all that well but, it was a good idea. Too bad they just gave up on it rather then try and make it work. Rally needs the publicity.
| datageek | 11-08-2005 05:06 AM |
Rim and Ramada both have the same problem: poor spectator access. Ramada has the added disadvantage that the stages are really far from the service park.
| RB5 Clone | 11-08-2005 08:13 AM |
spectator spectacle
�
�
[QUOTE=leaknoil]I can't see the FIA getting involved in anyway the divided mess that rally in the US is. No unified sanctioning body, no commercial support from car manufacturers, no real TV coverage, lack of public interest, and lack of any political will to spend tax dollars on supporting a rally.
.[/QUOTE]
One key difference with Rally NY group is that they DO have public interest and therefore the political will to support a bid. Nothing light enlightened self-interest from a region's economic community to get a bid like this launched...
One other thing that makes Rally NY stand out is how the stages are a combo of privately owned gravel roads and awesome public tarmac roads. Just like in Europe, the stage roads bring rally right to people's front yards. Just like in Europe, the stage roads are lined with spectators in their front yards. Just like in Europe, organizers have the opportunity to control access to certain stages (and thus charge admission to speccies and maybe actually MAKE SOME MONEY), and on certain stges they have huge public access for free. Either way, they have public support. There's a huge horse track/casino complex where they can stage speccie- and TV-friendly super specials.
When we ran International Rally NY, there were a number of teams that brought cars over from the UK just for the event--where else in the US do you see genuine RHD fire-breathing Evos driven by steely-eyed Irish leadfoots let loose on public roads?
The tarmac stages were packed with spectators, people hanging out in their front yards with lawn chairs and bonfires and really enjoying the spectacle. Where else in the US do you see this, or perhaps more importantly, where else in US do spectators have this kind of spectacle?
More power to organizer Ivan Orisek and his crews. They have a big job ahead of them, but they're obviously not afraid to try.
Dave G
[url]www.lastditchracing.net[/url]
.[/QUOTE]
One key difference with Rally NY group is that they DO have public interest and therefore the political will to support a bid. Nothing light enlightened self-interest from a region's economic community to get a bid like this launched...
One other thing that makes Rally NY stand out is how the stages are a combo of privately owned gravel roads and awesome public tarmac roads. Just like in Europe, the stage roads bring rally right to people's front yards. Just like in Europe, the stage roads are lined with spectators in their front yards. Just like in Europe, organizers have the opportunity to control access to certain stages (and thus charge admission to speccies and maybe actually MAKE SOME MONEY), and on certain stges they have huge public access for free. Either way, they have public support. There's a huge horse track/casino complex where they can stage speccie- and TV-friendly super specials.
When we ran International Rally NY, there were a number of teams that brought cars over from the UK just for the event--where else in the US do you see genuine RHD fire-breathing Evos driven by steely-eyed Irish leadfoots let loose on public roads?
The tarmac stages were packed with spectators, people hanging out in their front yards with lawn chairs and bonfires and really enjoying the spectacle. Where else in the US do you see this, or perhaps more importantly, where else in US do spectators have this kind of spectacle?
More power to organizer Ivan Orisek and his crews. They have a big job ahead of them, but they're obviously not afraid to try.
Dave G
[url]www.lastditchracing.net[/url]
| Weasel 555 | 11-08-2005 08:27 AM |
i hope Ivan/Rally NY/Sullivan County get it :D
| iwanbo | 11-08-2005 08:42 AM |
Oh God if that happened, I would so be there.
| akuhner | 11-08-2005 09:01 AM |
I very much appreciate what Ivan does for rally in our area, and Rally NY is a great event. But it will fail the observation. The level of organization is not even remotely close to the standard they will be looking for. Unless he is banking on building a bigger team, delegating resposibility, bringing in more even sponsors, and keeping everything on time and safe in the year or so before they come to observe. Ever notice Ivan does almost everything himself? If RNY were really organized Ivan would sit at HQ listening to the radio and directing people around.
If you really want to see WRC come to Rally NY start helping now. Sign up to work the spring event, or better yet talk to Ivan about helping to organize it - he starts putting it together months before the events. At the very least, treat it like it already is WRC and come watch it - he'll need thousands of spectators to show that the event can handle the tens of thousands of spectators who will show for a WRC event.
Alex
If you really want to see WRC come to Rally NY start helping now. Sign up to work the spring event, or better yet talk to Ivan about helping to organize it - he starts putting it together months before the events. At the very least, treat it like it already is WRC and come watch it - he'll need thousands of spectators to show that the event can handle the tens of thousands of spectators who will show for a WRC event.
Alex
| leaknoil | 11-08-2005 01:13 PM |
[QUOTE=datageek]Rim and Ramada both have the same problem: poor spectator access. Ramada has the added disadvantage that the stages are really far from the service park.[/QUOTE]
And a general lack of spectators as at all US rally events. Rally in the US just isn't popular enough to support an event big enough to even make a blip on the FIA radar.
That's what I thought was great about the Pikes Peak "Attempt at a Rally(tm)'. It tricked people into watching a rally. I actually had to explain what they were doing to some of the marshalls and spectators up there while I was shooting. They seemed pretty interested once they knew what was going on. A little more publicity and organization and the event might actually have generated some new rally fans.
And a general lack of spectators as at all US rally events. Rally in the US just isn't popular enough to support an event big enough to even make a blip on the FIA radar.
That's what I thought was great about the Pikes Peak "Attempt at a Rally(tm)'. It tricked people into watching a rally. I actually had to explain what they were doing to some of the marshalls and spectators up there while I was shooting. They seemed pretty interested once they knew what was going on. A little more publicity and organization and the event might actually have generated some new rally fans.
| WagonMonster | 11-08-2005 01:18 PM |
[QUOTE=datageek]Rim and Ramada both have the same problem: poor spectator access. Ramada has the added disadvantage that the stages are really far from the service park.[/QUOTE]
Not to mention that both Rim & Ramada are both run by the same organizers who really have no interest in expanding the sport beyond their own, little, private group.
:p
Not to mention that both Rim & Ramada are both run by the same organizers who really have no interest in expanding the sport beyond their own, little, private group.
:p
| hyp36rmax | 11-08-2005 01:19 PM |
ahhhh please FIA PLEASEE!!!!! i have heard a lot about Rim of the World as it is listed in the FIA calender, at least it was when i last saw it.
| AdvanSTI | 11-08-2005 01:21 PM |
that would be sick. Rally Mexico and Rally NY.... 2 rallies i would can attend! I hope this happens
| Kitsune | 11-08-2005 01:22 PM |
Actually, is'nt Int. Rally NY going all tarmac next year? That may be a particular selling point for the FIA, though...whatever the FIA thinks these days...who knows.
| WRXMaster | 11-08-2005 01:25 PM |
[QUOTE=leaknoil]And a general lack of spectators as at all US rally events. Rally in the US just isn't popular enough to support an event big enough to even make a blip on the FIA radar.
That's what I thought was great about the Pikes Peak "Attempt at a Rally(tm)'. It tricked people into watching a rally. I actually had to explain what they were doing to some of the marshalls and spectators up there while I was shooting. They seemed pretty interested once they knew what was going on. A little more publicity and organization and the event might actually have generated some new rally fans.[/QUOTE]
WRC is popular enough in the US to have a event.... Its US rally thats not popular lol ... There is a big difference
That's what I thought was great about the Pikes Peak "Attempt at a Rally(tm)'. It tricked people into watching a rally. I actually had to explain what they were doing to some of the marshalls and spectators up there while I was shooting. They seemed pretty interested once they knew what was going on. A little more publicity and organization and the event might actually have generated some new rally fans.[/QUOTE]
WRC is popular enough in the US to have a event.... Its US rally thats not popular lol ... There is a big difference
| leaknoil | 11-08-2005 02:11 PM |
[QUOTE=WRXMaster]WRC is popular enough in the US to have a event.... Its US rally thats not popular lol ... There is a big difference[/QUOTE]
It's a bit like the chicken and the egg. Yes, WRC would be popular here but, until you have a really popular well funded US rally event WRC isn't coming.
In the current climate of infighting (see Wagonmonster above ;) ) there isn't one team that can step up to the plate and work the media and sponsership deals needed. The US needs one unified championship and leadership team or its doomed to sucking. IRL and CHAMP are having a hell of a time making it work with all the millions and race deals they have. How US rally can survive two seperate championships with no money is going to be interesting. Or maybe it will survive but, just wont be interesting ;)
It's a bit like the chicken and the egg. Yes, WRC would be popular here but, until you have a really popular well funded US rally event WRC isn't coming.
In the current climate of infighting (see Wagonmonster above ;) ) there isn't one team that can step up to the plate and work the media and sponsership deals needed. The US needs one unified championship and leadership team or its doomed to sucking. IRL and CHAMP are having a hell of a time making it work with all the millions and race deals they have. How US rally can survive two seperate championships with no money is going to be interesting. Or maybe it will survive but, just wont be interesting ;)
| RB5 Clone | 11-08-2005 02:14 PM |
[QUOTE=leaknoil]And a general lack of spectators as at all US rally events. Rally in the US just isn't popular enough to support an event big enough to even make a blip on the FIA radar.
[/QUOTE]
Crikey, what a bunch of well-informed doomsayers...where is the rally community's enthusiasm for this idea?
Hmmm, let's see..spectator numbers. Having conducted (admittedly unscientific) first-hand, in-car, high-speed surveys of rally spectators at 30-some events in the US and Canada over the past few years, I'd agree with you on too many instances. In general, rally organizers in the US seem to be universal in their disinterest--and almost outright disregard for--spectators.
Things are not so bleak north of the border. Canadian events can draw crowds of 10,000-plus. Organizers promote VIP packages with guided bus tours to the best speccie spots. Sometimes the spectator throngs get a little unruly and press in on the edges of the road and things get a little hairy. But it's remarkable how a rally car coming down the road sideways at 80mph tends to send people scmpering for the safety of the other side of the ditches. Spectator control up there has improved a lot recently, however, seemingly without damping spectator turnout or enthusiasim.
But back to the thread topic. Rally NY has consistently outdrawn the crowds seen at other US events I've run, based on sheer number of spectator areas, the throngs of people out in their yards watching the rally go past, and by the general "flashbulb quotient" during night stages.
FIA surely must be aware that rally in the US is not likely to be a spectacle on the scale of Rally Deutschland (250k paying speccies) especially at first. They also know that the US is an automotive society of the highest order, and that their already proven brand of Loeb-Solberg-Gronholm entertainment will sell well here, especially with more mainstream TV coverage.
WRc has wanted IN to the US for years. The FIA just hasn't found the right group to make it happen. Credit the Rally NY crew for at least having the gonads to try.
Dave G
[url]www.lastditchracing.net[/url]
[/QUOTE]
Crikey, what a bunch of well-informed doomsayers...where is the rally community's enthusiasm for this idea?
Hmmm, let's see..spectator numbers. Having conducted (admittedly unscientific) first-hand, in-car, high-speed surveys of rally spectators at 30-some events in the US and Canada over the past few years, I'd agree with you on too many instances. In general, rally organizers in the US seem to be universal in their disinterest--and almost outright disregard for--spectators.
Things are not so bleak north of the border. Canadian events can draw crowds of 10,000-plus. Organizers promote VIP packages with guided bus tours to the best speccie spots. Sometimes the spectator throngs get a little unruly and press in on the edges of the road and things get a little hairy. But it's remarkable how a rally car coming down the road sideways at 80mph tends to send people scmpering for the safety of the other side of the ditches. Spectator control up there has improved a lot recently, however, seemingly without damping spectator turnout or enthusiasim.
But back to the thread topic. Rally NY has consistently outdrawn the crowds seen at other US events I've run, based on sheer number of spectator areas, the throngs of people out in their yards watching the rally go past, and by the general "flashbulb quotient" during night stages.
FIA surely must be aware that rally in the US is not likely to be a spectacle on the scale of Rally Deutschland (250k paying speccies) especially at first. They also know that the US is an automotive society of the highest order, and that their already proven brand of Loeb-Solberg-Gronholm entertainment will sell well here, especially with more mainstream TV coverage.
WRc has wanted IN to the US for years. The FIA just hasn't found the right group to make it happen. Credit the Rally NY crew for at least having the gonads to try.
Dave G
[url]www.lastditchracing.net[/url]
| WagonMonster | 11-08-2005 02:19 PM |
[QUOTE=leaknoil]It's a bit like the chicken and the egg. Yes, WRC would be popular here but, until you have a really popular well funded US rally event WRC isn't coming.
In the current climate of infighting (see Wagonmonster above ;) ) there isn't one team that can step up to the plate and work the media and sponsership deals needed. The US needs one unified championship and leadership team or its doomed to sucking. IRL and CHAMP are having a hell of a time making it work with all the millions and race deals they have. How US rally can survive two seperate championships with no money is going to be interesting. Or maybe it will survive but, just wont be interesting ;)[/QUOTE]
You know I'm right :p
And, as for USRC and RA getting along?
*snort* :lol: :lol: :lol:
In the current climate of infighting (see Wagonmonster above ;) ) there isn't one team that can step up to the plate and work the media and sponsership deals needed. The US needs one unified championship and leadership team or its doomed to sucking. IRL and CHAMP are having a hell of a time making it work with all the millions and race deals they have. How US rally can survive two seperate championships with no money is going to be interesting. Or maybe it will survive but, just wont be interesting ;)[/QUOTE]
You know I'm right :p
And, as for USRC and RA getting along?
*snort* :lol: :lol: :lol:
| leaknoil | 11-08-2005 02:28 PM |
Wasn't there some rumor floating around about the people at NASCAR looking into the WRC or such ? I'd love to see Roush Racing fielding a WRC car at Rally Daytona.
| Tensen | 11-08-2005 02:39 PM |
I really really hope it comes off, but i have my doubts, and in line with alex k's here....
I wonder how gronholm would react to the Liberty locals running out onto the stage with beer and firearms like this year.....I see the Pugs radiator getting...clogged....
I wonder how gronholm would react to the Liberty locals running out onto the stage with beer and firearms like this year.....I see the Pugs radiator getting...clogged....
| WagonMonster | 11-08-2005 02:40 PM |
[QUOTE=Tensen]I really really hope it comes off, but i have my doubts, and in line with alex k's here....
I wonder how gronholm would react to the Liberty locals running out onto the stage with beer and firearms like this year.....I see the Pugs radiator getting...clogged....[/QUOTE]
Gronholm will be driving a Ford, so no problem there.
"Damn Cletus, that there Ford sure doesn't look like a NASCAR!"
I wonder how gronholm would react to the Liberty locals running out onto the stage with beer and firearms like this year.....I see the Pugs radiator getting...clogged....[/QUOTE]
Gronholm will be driving a Ford, so no problem there.
"Damn Cletus, that there Ford sure doesn't look like a NASCAR!"
| psyber_0ptix | 11-08-2005 02:52 PM |
ROUCH SPONCORS GRONHOLM. GRONHOLM STILL NOT HAPPY WIHT CAR, SEEKS SPONCORSHIP FROM OTHER MANUFACTURER
:lol:
i'd hit a WRC: rally ny, i'd hit it hard
:lol:
i'd hit a WRC: rally ny, i'd hit it hard
| WRXedUSA | 11-08-2005 04:43 PM |
I don't think there is a question of organization. I'm sure the FiA would gladly provide an oversight crew to aid in design/logistics/structure.
No matter how far fetched WRC sounds, it really is a grassroots effort overseas. Oragnization is often coordinated by local car clubs by delegation. Insurance is the big issue here along with getting the local community to cooperate with WRC sized crowds.
As much as everyone hates it, the spectacle of PPIHC in conjunction with a multi-stage rally in the Colorado Springs area (non PP toll road) would probably be the best bet.
Hm. I doubt any of this will happen, but the size and scope isnt that far off folks.
No matter how far fetched WRC sounds, it really is a grassroots effort overseas. Oragnization is often coordinated by local car clubs by delegation. Insurance is the big issue here along with getting the local community to cooperate with WRC sized crowds.
As much as everyone hates it, the spectacle of PPIHC in conjunction with a multi-stage rally in the Colorado Springs area (non PP toll road) would probably be the best bet.
Hm. I doubt any of this will happen, but the size and scope isnt that far off folks.
| 8Complex | 11-08-2005 04:55 PM |
Might be interesting if it happens, but I don't know what the terrian is like around that area. I would watch it on TV, but not go there... I've always felt going to a rally is like watching a skyscraper go up with only a view of 1/4 of the bottom floor. You see things happen, but you don't often see [i]interesting[/i] things happen.
Also, if it happens, money says there is at least 1 death (crowd most likely).
Also, if it happens, money says there is at least 1 death (crowd most likely).
| bjorn240 | 11-08-2005 05:09 PM |
[QUOTE=WRXedUSA]I don't think there is a question of organization. I'm sure the FiA would gladly provide an oversight crew to aid in design/logistics/structure. [/QUOTE]
That's not really how it works. The FIA don't have a organizing group. Typically a candidate event will bring in the organizers of an existing WRC round to "help" them organize the candidate event. This was the path both Turkey and (to a slightly less extent) Mexico took. In its first two years, Turkey basically provided roads and bought an event, lock stock and barrel.
- Christian
That's not really how it works. The FIA don't have a organizing group. Typically a candidate event will bring in the organizers of an existing WRC round to "help" them organize the candidate event. This was the path both Turkey and (to a slightly less extent) Mexico took. In its first two years, Turkey basically provided roads and bought an event, lock stock and barrel.
- Christian
| WRXedUSA | 11-08-2005 05:31 PM |
[QUOTE=bjorn240]That's not really how it works. The FIA don't have a organizing group. Typically a candidate event will bring in the organizers of an existing WRC round to "help" them organize the candidate event. This was the path both Turkey and (to a slightly less extent) Mexico took. In its first two years, Turkey basically provided roads and bought an event, lock stock and barrel.
- Christian[/QUOTE]
I didnt say that the FiA organized the rally. The locals do, then, the event if certifed by the FiA stewards as meeting the FiA standards. (see the PDF docs from each rallies homepage) My gist of oversight was exactly as you interpreted it, an organizer from an existing round to consult.
- Christian[/QUOTE]
I didnt say that the FiA organized the rally. The locals do, then, the event if certifed by the FiA stewards as meeting the FiA standards. (see the PDF docs from each rallies homepage) My gist of oversight was exactly as you interpreted it, an organizer from an existing round to consult.
| bjorn240 | 11-08-2005 07:34 PM |
You said:
[QUOTE=WRXedUSA]I'm sure the FiA would gladly provide an oversight crew to aid in design/logistics/structure. [/QUOTE]
I say: the FIA stewards/observers do not aid in design/logistics/structure. They observe and determine whether the event meets the criteria for inclusion, and what needs to be improved.
The aid in design/logistics/structure comes from other organizers, the FIA doesn't have anything to do with it, and certainly does not provide it. You pay, they come.
- Christian
[QUOTE=WRXedUSA]I'm sure the FiA would gladly provide an oversight crew to aid in design/logistics/structure. [/QUOTE]
I say: the FIA stewards/observers do not aid in design/logistics/structure. They observe and determine whether the event meets the criteria for inclusion, and what needs to be improved.
The aid in design/logistics/structure comes from other organizers, the FIA doesn't have anything to do with it, and certainly does not provide it. You pay, they come.
- Christian
| Geek Guy | 11-08-2005 09:24 PM |
Eherm:
Rallye Charlevoix.
Went from observation on a 3-day event to dead the next year, and still has yet to return. Went bankrupt after blowing their budget bringing over FIA observers and targeting WRC status.
Rallye Quebec.
Rinse and repeat as above.
My prediction is that this will destroy Rally NY as we know it. If the Canadians can't get a WRC event (hello rabid Quebecquois fans! True snow rally!) then I seriously doubt that WRC will come to the US where we have a, let's be honest, "meh" attitude as a nation towards non-circle track racing on four wheels...
Rallye Charlevoix.
Went from observation on a 3-day event to dead the next year, and still has yet to return. Went bankrupt after blowing their budget bringing over FIA observers and targeting WRC status.
Rallye Quebec.
Rinse and repeat as above.
My prediction is that this will destroy Rally NY as we know it. If the Canadians can't get a WRC event (hello rabid Quebecquois fans! True snow rally!) then I seriously doubt that WRC will come to the US where we have a, let's be honest, "meh" attitude as a nation towards non-circle track racing on four wheels...
| Geek Guy | 11-08-2005 09:26 PM |
[QUOTE=silver04rs]Actually the PPIHC is a rally... thursday and friday they run stages around the base of the mountian I believe and then run the hill climb on Sat or Sun
And as far as a US based WRC event this would be amazing. I have read in the past thatWRC would like to come to the US but needs to have it in a place that is well known. From what I have heard the were looking at RAMADA EXPRESS because of the fact that the stages run through the Grand Canyon. New York would also work because it is well known. I would prefer to see Laughlin (Ramada Express) for the sheer fact of a possible snow rally on the first dau followed by wide open gravel stages and a great SSS on sunday
Travis- The Gravel Crew
[url]www.gcralyx.com[/url][/QUOTE]
Oh, and PP is no longer on the RA calendar as a rally. I can't remember the exact quote (it's on SS) but it was to the effect of:
"It's not a rally, it was never a rally, and it was silly of us to say that it will be a rally."
And as far as a US based WRC event this would be amazing. I have read in the past thatWRC would like to come to the US but needs to have it in a place that is well known. From what I have heard the were looking at RAMADA EXPRESS because of the fact that the stages run through the Grand Canyon. New York would also work because it is well known. I would prefer to see Laughlin (Ramada Express) for the sheer fact of a possible snow rally on the first dau followed by wide open gravel stages and a great SSS on sunday
Travis- The Gravel Crew
[url]www.gcralyx.com[/url][/QUOTE]
Oh, and PP is no longer on the RA calendar as a rally. I can't remember the exact quote (it's on SS) but it was to the effect of:
"It's not a rally, it was never a rally, and it was silly of us to say that it will be a rally."
| culturedetox | 11-08-2005 09:29 PM |
pleasepleasepleaseplease.. any WRC rally in the states would be a dream come true
| rallysquirrel | 11-08-2005 09:52 PM |
Speaking of PPIHC. It won't be considered a rally, because they can't find enought miles and stages for it to be considered a rally.
If Ivan can generate enought interest for FIA that would be a great step in the right direction. Also lets not forget Ivan's wife who works hard at all the events. Ivan wouldn't be there were it not for the support of his wife too.
If Ivan can generate enought interest for FIA that would be a great step in the right direction. Also lets not forget Ivan's wife who works hard at all the events. Ivan wouldn't be there were it not for the support of his wife too.
| leaknoil | 11-08-2005 10:27 PM |
It will never happen but, IF it was to actually happen I'd predict it as a huge financial failure. Your just not going to get Joe Nascar to come stand out in the cold watching a bunch of Europeans playing in the woods. Sure, you'll get some tourists from the rest of the world but, it would never pay for something this big.
I was talking with some of the people behind the scenes in Mexico and they claimed they got less then half the expected attendance and it didn't go well for them financially. They went on to say everyone was saying it was the promoters fault for not advertising enough. There seemed to be some feeling the event might be in trouble if next year didn't go better.
It's just not a great time for the WRC. Teams want out or they want costs cut. TV viewership is down and event attendance may be losing ground as well. Manufacturers are pulling out of regional sponsership where they've been for years (Australia this year and the US and Canada before).
I just couldnt think of a worse time to go spending my life savings (or my limited promotional budget of my company) on bringing a WRC event to NY.
I was talking with some of the people behind the scenes in Mexico and they claimed they got less then half the expected attendance and it didn't go well for them financially. They went on to say everyone was saying it was the promoters fault for not advertising enough. There seemed to be some feeling the event might be in trouble if next year didn't go better.
It's just not a great time for the WRC. Teams want out or they want costs cut. TV viewership is down and event attendance may be losing ground as well. Manufacturers are pulling out of regional sponsership where they've been for years (Australia this year and the US and Canada before).
I just couldnt think of a worse time to go spending my life savings (or my limited promotional budget of my company) on bringing a WRC event to NY.
| WRXMaster | 11-09-2005 12:12 AM |
[QUOTE=leaknoil]It will never happen but, IF it was to actually happen I'd predict it as a huge financial failure. Your just not going to get Joe Nascar to come stand out in the cold watching a bunch of Europeans playing in the woods. Sure, you'll get some tourists from the rest of the world but, it would never pay for something this big.
I was talking with some of the people behind the scenes in Mexico and they claimed they got less then half the expected attendance and it didn't go well for them financially. They went on to say everyone was saying it was the promoters fault for not advertising enough. There seemed to be some feeling the event might be in trouble if next year didn't go better.
It's just not a great time for the WRC. Teams want out or they want costs cut. TV viewership is down and event attendance may be losing ground as well. Manufacturers are pulling out of regional sponsership where they've been for years (Australia this year and the US and Canada before).
I just couldnt think of a worse time to go spending my life savings (or my limited promotional budget of my company) on bringing a WRC event to NY.[/QUOTE]
I dont know where your getting your information from ... Total opposite of what I was told by the head organisers at the after party in mexico..... Attendance doubled from last years wrc mexico ... The city of Leon is making a fortune off of wrc mexico - tourism/hotels/restraunts/Ticket sales ect... WRC is now the highest rated motorsport show in mexico "beating F1 and Cart!" I have alot of research from ISC about wrc ratings ect ... Your wrong TV Ratings are up for WRC worldwide ..not down ... Only teams backing out are PSA because they have won so much ... but Citroen cant find a better motorsport for the $$$ so they are coming back into the wrc... Think about how many people owns subarus in the US .. They would flood to a WRC event
I was talking with some of the people behind the scenes in Mexico and they claimed they got less then half the expected attendance and it didn't go well for them financially. They went on to say everyone was saying it was the promoters fault for not advertising enough. There seemed to be some feeling the event might be in trouble if next year didn't go better.
It's just not a great time for the WRC. Teams want out or they want costs cut. TV viewership is down and event attendance may be losing ground as well. Manufacturers are pulling out of regional sponsership where they've been for years (Australia this year and the US and Canada before).
I just couldnt think of a worse time to go spending my life savings (or my limited promotional budget of my company) on bringing a WRC event to NY.[/QUOTE]
I dont know where your getting your information from ... Total opposite of what I was told by the head organisers at the after party in mexico..... Attendance doubled from last years wrc mexico ... The city of Leon is making a fortune off of wrc mexico - tourism/hotels/restraunts/Ticket sales ect... WRC is now the highest rated motorsport show in mexico "beating F1 and Cart!" I have alot of research from ISC about wrc ratings ect ... Your wrong TV Ratings are up for WRC worldwide ..not down ... Only teams backing out are PSA because they have won so much ... but Citroen cant find a better motorsport for the $$$ so they are coming back into the wrc... Think about how many people owns subarus in the US .. They would flood to a WRC event
| leaknoil | 11-09-2005 01:34 AM |
[QUOTE=WRXMaster]I dont know where your getting your information from ... Total opposite of what I was told by the head organisers at the after party in mexico..... Attendance doubled from last years wrc mexico ... The city of Leon is making a fortune off of wrc mexico - tourism/hotels/restraunts/Ticket sales ect... WRC is now the highest rated motorsport show in mexico "beating F1 and Cart!" I have alot of research from ISC about wrc ratings ect ... Your wrong TV Ratings are up for WRC worldwide ..not down ... Only teams backing out are PSA because they have won so much ... but Citroen cant find a better motorsport for the $$$ so they are coming back into the wrc... Think about how many people owns subarus in the US .. They would flood to a WRC event[/QUOTE]
Well, I'm not going to argue about this but, I can't imagine the large majority of Subaru owners in the US care about WRC or rally. Nobody buying a Tribeca or that picked up a Brat for $500 is going to care at all. I'd guess that if you even went up to eveyone that bought even a Sti in the last 3 years and asked them who they thought is going to win the 2006 WRC season they might say , "Is that a wrestling league ?"
How many people in the US would pay $75+ to see a rally ? If a rally pass costs $75 in Mexico that should probably have it costing about $150 for Rally New York WRC at least. That shuts out alot of people. BTW, it might be hard for US backers to be ok with people just wondering out to the course and watching without paying. It really isn't the Amercian way.
You talked to people vested in the sucess of the event in Mexico. I talked to different people. I'm not going to say which is telling the truth. In fact, it probably somewhere in the middle. Like most of these things are. I'll just say some people involved were very disappointed.
US viewership declined last year according to the WRC fact book. Blame SpeedTV if you like but, its true. We haven't seen 2005 figures but, I'm guessing they'll be horrible in the US now that SpeedTV is all NASCAR all the time. What network is going too want to get involved with rating like that ? OLN has rally buried somewhere between a bull ride some guy gutting a fish.
PSA is out because worldwide car sales are down and they were unable to find any benifit that they could see from their involvment. It didnt sell more cars. What good is winning if it doesnt sell more cars ? Guy wants to be back and so he keeps saying they'll be back in 2007. We'll see if they actually come back to a full WRC schedule. I'd love it if they do. I'm not so sure they will. Pugoet is all about Le Mans now and I don't think they have any desire to come back anytime soon.
None of the manufacturers that were in the wings have stepped up. If they don't and PSA doesn't come back it's going to be ugly.
Well, I'm not going to argue about this but, I can't imagine the large majority of Subaru owners in the US care about WRC or rally. Nobody buying a Tribeca or that picked up a Brat for $500 is going to care at all. I'd guess that if you even went up to eveyone that bought even a Sti in the last 3 years and asked them who they thought is going to win the 2006 WRC season they might say , "Is that a wrestling league ?"
How many people in the US would pay $75+ to see a rally ? If a rally pass costs $75 in Mexico that should probably have it costing about $150 for Rally New York WRC at least. That shuts out alot of people. BTW, it might be hard for US backers to be ok with people just wondering out to the course and watching without paying. It really isn't the Amercian way.
You talked to people vested in the sucess of the event in Mexico. I talked to different people. I'm not going to say which is telling the truth. In fact, it probably somewhere in the middle. Like most of these things are. I'll just say some people involved were very disappointed.
US viewership declined last year according to the WRC fact book. Blame SpeedTV if you like but, its true. We haven't seen 2005 figures but, I'm guessing they'll be horrible in the US now that SpeedTV is all NASCAR all the time. What network is going too want to get involved with rating like that ? OLN has rally buried somewhere between a bull ride some guy gutting a fish.
PSA is out because worldwide car sales are down and they were unable to find any benifit that they could see from their involvment. It didnt sell more cars. What good is winning if it doesnt sell more cars ? Guy wants to be back and so he keeps saying they'll be back in 2007. We'll see if they actually come back to a full WRC schedule. I'd love it if they do. I'm not so sure they will. Pugoet is all about Le Mans now and I don't think they have any desire to come back anytime soon.
None of the manufacturers that were in the wings have stepped up. If they don't and PSA doesn't come back it's going to be ugly.
| datageek | 11-09-2005 07:31 AM |
[QUOTE=leaknoil]It will never happen but, IF it was to actually happen I'd predict it as a huge financial failure. Your just not going to get Joe Nascar to come stand out in the cold watching a bunch of Europeans playing in the woods. [/QUOTE]
I'm guessing that there are motorsports fans out there other than Joe Nascar who might be interested. Just my gut feeling, based off of the reactions I get whenever I wear my SWRT hat to my local autocross.
[QUOTE]I was talking with some of the people behind the scenes in Mexico and they claimed they got less then half the expected attendance and it didn't go well for them financially. [/QUOTE]
The officially released numbers say that Rally Mexico this year doubled attendance over last year. If I recall correctly, the first year Mexico was a WRC round they got more spectators than expected, so last year they prepared for way more. The reality didn't meet their increased expectations (which was for four times the number of speccies, if my memory serves), but did show a strong growth in attendance for the event.
[QUOTE]TV viewership is down and event attendance may be losing ground as well. [/QUOTE]
Curious... ISC's official figures say that world-wide TV viewership has been steadily increasing year on year. US viewership may not be increasing -- but the US market is not the primary one. Yes, I'm sure increasing US viewership is something that many folks involved with the WRC would love to see happen, starting with David Richards. (Who, by the way, has said repeatedly that there is strong interest in a WRC round in the US and that the only thing holding it back is a lack of a suitably organized event.) But at the end of the day the bread-and-butter on TV viewership is in Europe.
A US WRC bid has been inevitable for some time now. The question is, are you going to sit and list why it will never happen or do you want to get out there and try to make it happen. Pick which result sounds most appealing to you, and act accordingly.
I'm guessing that there are motorsports fans out there other than Joe Nascar who might be interested. Just my gut feeling, based off of the reactions I get whenever I wear my SWRT hat to my local autocross.
[QUOTE]I was talking with some of the people behind the scenes in Mexico and they claimed they got less then half the expected attendance and it didn't go well for them financially. [/QUOTE]
The officially released numbers say that Rally Mexico this year doubled attendance over last year. If I recall correctly, the first year Mexico was a WRC round they got more spectators than expected, so last year they prepared for way more. The reality didn't meet their increased expectations (which was for four times the number of speccies, if my memory serves), but did show a strong growth in attendance for the event.
[QUOTE]TV viewership is down and event attendance may be losing ground as well. [/QUOTE]
Curious... ISC's official figures say that world-wide TV viewership has been steadily increasing year on year. US viewership may not be increasing -- but the US market is not the primary one. Yes, I'm sure increasing US viewership is something that many folks involved with the WRC would love to see happen, starting with David Richards. (Who, by the way, has said repeatedly that there is strong interest in a WRC round in the US and that the only thing holding it back is a lack of a suitably organized event.) But at the end of the day the bread-and-butter on TV viewership is in Europe.
A US WRC bid has been inevitable for some time now. The question is, are you going to sit and list why it will never happen or do you want to get out there and try to make it happen. Pick which result sounds most appealing to you, and act accordingly.
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