| makofoto | 09-19-2005 05:10 PM |
STU's @ Nationals ...
�
�
Anybody know anything about the set-ups on the top placing STU STI's ...
Remember ... it's US against Them ... ;)
Coilovers ... spring rates ... sway bars ...
Assuming the top dogs were using 245/45/17 615's ... shaved ?
Remember ... it's US against Them ... ;)
Coilovers ... spring rates ... sway bars ...
Assuming the top dogs were using 245/45/17 615's ... shaved ?
| jmott | 09-19-2005 05:19 PM |
[QUOTE=makofoto]Anybody know anything about the set-ups on the top placing STU STI's ...
Remember ... it's US against Them ... ;)
Coilovers ... spring rates ... sway bars ...
Assuming the top dogs were using 245/45/17 615's ... shaved ?[/QUOTE]
yes...but I am them!
=)
I know the fastest BMW didn't even have the largest allowable tire size.
so..make your time!
Remember ... it's US against Them ... ;)
Coilovers ... spring rates ... sway bars ...
Assuming the top dogs were using 245/45/17 615's ... shaved ?[/QUOTE]
yes...but I am them!
=)
I know the fastest BMW didn't even have the largest allowable tire size.
so..make your time!
| afpdl | 09-19-2005 06:06 PM |
And they arent going to have the largest allowable size either as none of them are going to raise their car up that high.
RX8s on the other hand may get that silly awd tire limit dropped.
RX8s on the other hand may get that silly awd tire limit dropped.
| jmott | 09-19-2005 06:07 PM |
[QUOTE=afpdl]And they arent going to have the largest allowable size either as none of them are going to raise their car up that high.
RX8s on the other hand may get that silly awd tire limit dropped.[/QUOTE]
I would raise mine that high if I were in the class.
I would try it at least.
RX8s on the other hand may get that silly awd tire limit dropped.[/QUOTE]
I would raise mine that high if I were in the class.
I would try it at least.
| AtomicRacer | 09-19-2005 06:16 PM |
[QUOTE=jmott]
I know the fastest BMW didn't even have the largest allowable tire size.
[/QUOTE]
Well actually, according to the rules limiting mods to the fenders, they did have the largest tire they could run (or fit). I expect next year we will see some RX-8's with 275 wide tires though.
Just as long as the rally cars don't get shafted with smaller than 245 tires I will be happy.
As for my setup I was running the following:
-Cobb catted downpipe (stock cat back)
-Odyssey Battery PC680MJ
-STi "pink" springs
-Cobb front and rear sway bars
-group "N" rear tops
-Cusco front camber plates
-Pol-tec front end-links
-SSR Competition 17x8.5 -48 offset wheels
-Falken 615 full tread tires 245x45-17
-Goodrich SS brake lines
-Hawk HP+ brake pads
-Kartboys shortshifter and bushing
That's all I have done. Weighed the car there with 1/4 tank of gas and it was 3149 lbs.
For next year I will be making some additional changes.
-coilovers
-bigger bars (maybe)
-custom tune
-light weight pully (need to check if that is legal)
-cat back exhaust
-racing seats (very big maybe)
-steering rack bushings
-lower control arm bushings
-Paul
ps: I was 7th, car #66.
I know the fastest BMW didn't even have the largest allowable tire size.
[/QUOTE]
Well actually, according to the rules limiting mods to the fenders, they did have the largest tire they could run (or fit). I expect next year we will see some RX-8's with 275 wide tires though.
Just as long as the rally cars don't get shafted with smaller than 245 tires I will be happy.
As for my setup I was running the following:
-Cobb catted downpipe (stock cat back)
-Odyssey Battery PC680MJ
-STi "pink" springs
-Cobb front and rear sway bars
-group "N" rear tops
-Cusco front camber plates
-Pol-tec front end-links
-SSR Competition 17x8.5 -48 offset wheels
-Falken 615 full tread tires 245x45-17
-Goodrich SS brake lines
-Hawk HP+ brake pads
-Kartboys shortshifter and bushing
That's all I have done. Weighed the car there with 1/4 tank of gas and it was 3149 lbs.
For next year I will be making some additional changes.
-coilovers
-bigger bars (maybe)
-custom tune
-light weight pully (need to check if that is legal)
-cat back exhaust
-racing seats (very big maybe)
-steering rack bushings
-lower control arm bushings
-Paul
ps: I was 7th, car #66.
| jmott | 09-19-2005 06:17 PM |
What precisely do the rules say regarding fender modification?
[QUOTE=AtomicRacer]Well actually, according to the rules limiting mods to the fenders, they did have the largest tire they could run (or fit). I expect next year we will see some RX-8's with 275 wide tires though.
Just as long as the rally cars don't get shafted with smaller than 245 tires I will be happy.
As for my setup I was running the following:
-Cobb catted downpipe (stock cat back)
-Odyssey Battery PC680MJ
-STi "pink" springs
-Cobb front and rear sway bars
-group "N" rear tops
-Cusco front camber plates
-Pol-tec front bar ends
-SSR Competition 17x8.5 -48 offset wheels
-Falken 615 full tread tires 245x45-17
-Goodrich SS brake lines
-Hawk HP+ brake pads
-Kartboys shortshifter and bushing
That's all I have done. Weighed the car there with 1/4 tank of gas and it was 3149 lbs.
For next year I will be making some additional changes.
-coilovers
-bigger bars (maybe)
-custom tune
-light weight pully (need to check if that is legal)
-cat back exhaust
-racing seats (very big maybe)
-steering rack bushings
-lower control arm bushings
-Paul[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=AtomicRacer]Well actually, according to the rules limiting mods to the fenders, they did have the largest tire they could run (or fit). I expect next year we will see some RX-8's with 275 wide tires though.
Just as long as the rally cars don't get shafted with smaller than 245 tires I will be happy.
As for my setup I was running the following:
-Cobb catted downpipe (stock cat back)
-Odyssey Battery PC680MJ
-STi "pink" springs
-Cobb front and rear sway bars
-group "N" rear tops
-Cusco front camber plates
-Pol-tec front bar ends
-SSR Competition 17x8.5 -48 offset wheels
-Falken 615 full tread tires 245x45-17
-Goodrich SS brake lines
-Hawk HP+ brake pads
-Kartboys shortshifter and bushing
That's all I have done. Weighed the car there with 1/4 tank of gas and it was 3149 lbs.
For next year I will be making some additional changes.
-coilovers
-bigger bars (maybe)
-custom tune
-light weight pully (need to check if that is legal)
-cat back exhaust
-racing seats (very big maybe)
-steering rack bushings
-lower control arm bushings
-Paul[/QUOTE]
| PhilC | 09-19-2005 06:23 PM |
14.2.E. Fenders may not be cut or flared but the inside lip may be rolled to
gain additional tire clearance. Flares that are part of body kits may
be attached to the stock fenders. The intention is to permit fitting
the maximum allowable tire size. No other changes to the stock
fenders or wheel wells are permitted. Wear marks on inside surfaces
of the fender well from tire rub are permitted. However, wear
holes or slots completely through a fender well surface (which, in
effect, provide additional tire clearance) are not permitted.
You'd have to do an awfully creative roll on the fender to fit a 275 under an E36 IMO.
gain additional tire clearance. Flares that are part of body kits may
be attached to the stock fenders. The intention is to permit fitting
the maximum allowable tire size. No other changes to the stock
fenders or wheel wells are permitted. Wear marks on inside surfaces
of the fender well from tire rub are permitted. However, wear
holes or slots completely through a fender well surface (which, in
effect, provide additional tire clearance) are not permitted.
You'd have to do an awfully creative roll on the fender to fit a 275 under an E36 IMO.
| AtomicRacer | 09-19-2005 06:23 PM |
[QUOTE=jmott]What precisely do the rules say regarding fender modification?[/QUOTE]
You can roll the inner fender only. "Fenders may be not be cut or flared but the inside lip may be rolled..." Even if you use an aftermarket body kit, you still can't "cut" the fenders. As for the precise wording check page 70 of the rulebook. Chapter 14.2, section E.
-Paul
You can roll the inner fender only. "Fenders may be not be cut or flared but the inside lip may be rolled..." Even if you use an aftermarket body kit, you still can't "cut" the fenders. As for the precise wording check page 70 of the rulebook. Chapter 14.2, section E.
-Paul
| jmott | 09-19-2005 06:38 PM |
hmmm
you might make it fit up front with a cleverly sized coilover and a crapload of negative camber.
the rear would be tough.
[QUOTE=PhilC]14.2.E. Fenders may not be cut or flared but the inside lip may be rolled to
gain additional tire clearance. Flares that are part of body kits may
be attached to the stock fenders. The intention is to permit fitting
the maximum allowable tire size. No other changes to the stock
fenders or wheel wells are permitted. Wear marks on inside surfaces
of the fender well from tire rub are permitted. However, wear
holes or slots completely through a fender well surface (which, in
effect, provide additional tire clearance) are not permitted.
You'd have to do an awfully creative roll on the fender to fit a 275 under an E36 IMO.[/QUOTE]
you might make it fit up front with a cleverly sized coilover and a crapload of negative camber.
the rear would be tough.
[QUOTE=PhilC]14.2.E. Fenders may not be cut or flared but the inside lip may be rolled to
gain additional tire clearance. Flares that are part of body kits may
be attached to the stock fenders. The intention is to permit fitting
the maximum allowable tire size. No other changes to the stock
fenders or wheel wells are permitted. Wear marks on inside surfaces
of the fender well from tire rub are permitted. However, wear
holes or slots completely through a fender well surface (which, in
effect, provide additional tire clearance) are not permitted.
You'd have to do an awfully creative roll on the fender to fit a 275 under an E36 IMO.[/QUOTE]
| Scooby South | 09-19-2005 08:26 PM |
[QUOTE=AtomicRacer]Well actually, according to the rules limiting mods to the fenders, they did have the largest tire they could run (or fit). I expect next year we will see some RX-8's with 275 wide tires though.
Just as long as the rally cars don't get shafted with smaller than 245 tires I will be happy.
As for my setup I was running the following:
-Cobb catted downpipe (stock cat back)
-Odyssey Battery PC680MJ
-STi "pink" springs
-Cobb front and rear sway bars
-group "N" rear tops
-Cusco front camber plates
-Pol-tec front end-links
-SSR Competition 17x8.5 -48 offset wheels
-Falken 615 full tread tires 245x45-17
-Goodrich SS brake lines
-Hawk HP+ brake pads
-Kartboys shortshifter and bushing
That's all I have done. Weighed the car there with 1/4 tank of gas and it was 3149 lbs.
For next year I will be making some additional changes.
-coilovers
-bigger bars (maybe)
-custom tune
-light weight pully (need to check if that is legal)
-cat back exhaust
-racing seats (very big maybe)
-steering rack bushings
-lower control arm bushings
-Paul
ps: I was 7th, car #66.[/QUOTE]
No need for Steering Rack Bushings...as the 05 rack is SOLIDLY mounted to the frame...whereas the 04's wern't...
Pullys are allowed..
need to figure out spring rates...
Bigger bars are a good idea...even tho the stock bars are decent on the 05's
Congrats on your finish..
Bill
Just as long as the rally cars don't get shafted with smaller than 245 tires I will be happy.
As for my setup I was running the following:
-Cobb catted downpipe (stock cat back)
-Odyssey Battery PC680MJ
-STi "pink" springs
-Cobb front and rear sway bars
-group "N" rear tops
-Cusco front camber plates
-Pol-tec front end-links
-SSR Competition 17x8.5 -48 offset wheels
-Falken 615 full tread tires 245x45-17
-Goodrich SS brake lines
-Hawk HP+ brake pads
-Kartboys shortshifter and bushing
That's all I have done. Weighed the car there with 1/4 tank of gas and it was 3149 lbs.
For next year I will be making some additional changes.
-coilovers
-bigger bars (maybe)
-custom tune
-light weight pully (need to check if that is legal)
-cat back exhaust
-racing seats (very big maybe)
-steering rack bushings
-lower control arm bushings
-Paul
ps: I was 7th, car #66.[/QUOTE]
No need for Steering Rack Bushings...as the 05 rack is SOLIDLY mounted to the frame...whereas the 04's wern't...
Pullys are allowed..
need to figure out spring rates...
Bigger bars are a good idea...even tho the stock bars are decent on the 05's
Congrats on your finish..
Bill
| KC | 09-19-2005 08:56 PM |
[QUOTE=afpdl]RX8s on the other hand may get that silly awd tire limit dropped.[/QUOTE]
:angel: :D
:angel: :D
| itmcomputersdotcom | 09-20-2005 11:05 AM |
My setup was Tein Flex coilovers, Noltec Camber/Caster plates, Cusco 21mm FSB, Stock RSB, Piggy back, and Turbo back exhaust. Falken RT-615 tires, unshaved, a bit of black magic, a lot of witchcraft, and some luck in there too.
Branden
Branden
| makofoto | 09-20-2005 12:00 PM |
SCCA site is down at the moment ... what place did you come in ?
Which springs are you using ...
I Love my Flex's, others po-po them ... great for the price ... the new, current issue of Import Racer has a chart from Tein with set-up recommendations for single adjustable struts. They are doing a project with a Civic and Flex's ...next issue they take it to the track with a Tein engineer (Nakai-san?) to set-up the car specifically for that track.
[img]http://images12.fotki.com/v203/photos/4/43793/836092/TEINSuggestionsSML-vi.jpg[/img]
Which springs are you using ...
I Love my Flex's, others po-po them ... great for the price ... the new, current issue of Import Racer has a chart from Tein with set-up recommendations for single adjustable struts. They are doing a project with a Civic and Flex's ...next issue they take it to the track with a Tein engineer (Nakai-san?) to set-up the car specifically for that track.
[img]http://images12.fotki.com/v203/photos/4/43793/836092/TEINSuggestionsSML-vi.jpg[/img]
| makofoto | 09-20-2005 12:02 PM |
The chart could start with the japanese philosophy of stiffer springs in the front ... for better trail braking ... as opposed to stiffer in the rear ... "our" philosophy ... which they feel requires more straight line braking ...
| dwx | 09-20-2005 12:48 PM |
I know Dave Bruener's setup. He didn't do so hot the first day but I believe ran the 5th/6th fastest time on Wed. He is running stock struts, pink STI springs, Noltec plates. Larger whiteline front swaybar (26mm maybe) and an adjustable rear, probably 22-24mm. He has a single cat, but I can't remember if it's the stock last cat or not, I believe it is. He was running Chris Fenter's worn down Hankooks, 235/40/17. White 04 STI.
| itmcomputersdotcom | 09-20-2005 01:43 PM |
[QUOTE=makofoto]SCCA site is down at the moment ... what place did you come in ?
Which springs are you using ...
I Love ...QUOTE]
I came in first, but the springs I was using where the ones that came on he flex's. We are going to play with new spring rates and sway bar combos for next year, hopefully we find the setting that works the best.
Branden
#13 STU Rubasu STI
Which springs are you using ...
I Love ...QUOTE]
I came in first, but the springs I was using where the ones that came on he flex's. We are going to play with new spring rates and sway bar combos for next year, hopefully we find the setting that works the best.
Branden
#13 STU Rubasu STI
| DougM | 09-20-2005 03:20 PM |
tell us about the weather conditions STU was running in (both days)? the aggregate times seem a ways off from some of the other (similar) classes.
| jcroy66 | 09-20-2005 04:05 PM |
STU ran a different North Course than anyone else except BSP and SS, I believe.
| DougM | 09-20-2005 04:09 PM |
[QUOTE=jcroy66]STU ran a different North Course than anyone else except BSP and SS, I believe.[/QUOTE]
and the "revised" course was shorter, wasn't it?
and the "revised" course was shorter, wasn't it?
| makofoto | 09-20-2005 04:18 PM |
Branden ... so you didn't even switch the springs front to back ... which is what a lot of people do ... put the 550's in back and 450's up front ...
| jcroy66 | 09-20-2005 04:26 PM |
Doug, yes, I believe so. As I recall, the revised course added in a slalom that wasn't there originally, but cut off a longer section of course.
Mako, I thought only WRXs were doing that? I thought most of the STi folks were keeping the heavier springs up front?
Mako, I thought only WRXs were doing that? I thought most of the STi folks were keeping the heavier springs up front?
| makofoto | 09-20-2005 04:43 PM |
I'm still running AGAINST STI's ... so yes ... they need to be switched around. :devil: :lol:
| Got Pink? | 09-20-2005 06:06 PM |
I am trying to decide on spring rates for my KW V3's they come with 8kg/mm (~450s) front and progressive rear. I know I need linear rear springs and was thinking about 10kg/mm. Does anyone use more spring in the rear on a STU STi? I know Joel did in ESP but switched back to more in the front towards the end of the season.
| afpdl | 09-20-2005 06:11 PM |
Im currently running 7k front 9k rear but I dont know if I will leave it that way. There are some things I liked about the 9k/7k set up and some things I like about the 7k/9k.
| Jsortor | 09-20-2005 10:29 PM |
[QUOTE=makofoto]The chart could start with the japanese philosophy of stiffer springs in the front ... for better trail braking ... as opposed to stiffer in the rear ... "our" philosophy ... which they feel requires more straight line braking ...[/QUOTE]
They must drive like little girls :p I've got 8k(f)/12k(r) w/rear bar at max and stock front bar and trail brake all day long..... :lol:
They must drive like little girls :p I've got 8k(f)/12k(r) w/rear bar at max and stock front bar and trail brake all day long..... :lol:
| Snakebot | 09-20-2005 11:12 PM |
[QUOTE=DougM]and the "revised" course was shorter, wasn't it?[/QUOTE]
The North course was revised after the 2nd heat on Tuesday. The only classes that ran the original course was SS (1st heat), BSP, STU and FSPL (2nd) heat.
Because of the heavy rain and the high HP, high grip cars (SS and BSP) a section of the course literally started comming apart. The MTA tried patching the torn up sections but the cement would not properly set. So the event chair decided to redesign the course cutting out the broken up section. This shortened the course by 3-4 seconds.
Because of all the delays on the North course, Tuesday's 6th heat was postponed till Wednesday. By the time the 5th heat ran the sun was going down and it was past dusk when the heat went out for their final runs. The cars that had headlights were running with them on and some of the mod car drivers elected not to take their final runs because they couldn't see the cones. On top of this there were people in the grandstand taking FLASH pictures when the cars came into the Showcase turn. Imagine trying to pick out the cones in the limited arc of the headlights and having camera flashes going off in your face!
The chief of the North course did the right thing and threw out all of the final 5th heat runs and allowed the competors finish up the heat the next morning.
The North course was revised after the 2nd heat on Tuesday. The only classes that ran the original course was SS (1st heat), BSP, STU and FSPL (2nd) heat.
Because of the heavy rain and the high HP, high grip cars (SS and BSP) a section of the course literally started comming apart. The MTA tried patching the torn up sections but the cement would not properly set. So the event chair decided to redesign the course cutting out the broken up section. This shortened the course by 3-4 seconds.
Because of all the delays on the North course, Tuesday's 6th heat was postponed till Wednesday. By the time the 5th heat ran the sun was going down and it was past dusk when the heat went out for their final runs. The cars that had headlights were running with them on and some of the mod car drivers elected not to take their final runs because they couldn't see the cones. On top of this there were people in the grandstand taking FLASH pictures when the cars came into the Showcase turn. Imagine trying to pick out the cones in the limited arc of the headlights and having camera flashes going off in your face!
The chief of the North course did the right thing and threw out all of the final 5th heat runs and allowed the competors finish up the heat the next morning.
| Snakebot | 09-20-2005 11:24 PM |
My co-driver finished 4th and I sucked. I installed a new set of coil-overs the Thursday before Nationals and we ran the car without any testing/tuning...yeah, I know it was a stupid idea. Anyways here's the setup of the car.
Megan Racing Coilovers 8k-F, 6k-R
Cobb F/R bars - rears were set to soft (I should have set it to full stiff, the car was pushing a bit in steady state cornering)
APS 65mm intake
Stock exhaust
5Ziegen 17x8 w/ 245/45-17 RT615 (unshaved)
Considering on the lack of tuning with the new suspension I'm pretty happy with the car's performance.
Megan Racing Coilovers 8k-F, 6k-R
Cobb F/R bars - rears were set to soft (I should have set it to full stiff, the car was pushing a bit in steady state cornering)
APS 65mm intake
Stock exhaust
5Ziegen 17x8 w/ 245/45-17 RT615 (unshaved)
Considering on the lack of tuning with the new suspension I'm pretty happy with the car's performance.
| jmott | 09-20-2005 11:38 PM |
[QUOTE=Jsortor]They must drive like little girls :p I've got 8k(f)/12k(r) w/rear bar at max and stock front bar and trail brake all day long..... :lol:[/QUOTE]
got data logs?
its hard to *Really* trail brake all the way to teh apex.
btw I fixed that chart:
[IMG]http://www.slip-angle.com/hosted/mottsuggestion.jpg[/IMG]
got data logs?
its hard to *Really* trail brake all the way to teh apex.
btw I fixed that chart:
[IMG]http://www.slip-angle.com/hosted/mottsuggestion.jpg[/IMG]
| Jsortor | 09-21-2005 10:49 AM |
Quote=Jmott
got data logs?
its hard to *Really* trail brake all the way to teh apex.
I will see what I can come up with... You may ask if anyone has seen me run for proof too. My car still is not loose enough **while still utilizing the entire contact patch**
got data logs?
its hard to *Really* trail brake all the way to teh apex.
I will see what I can come up with... You may ask if anyone has seen me run for proof too. My car still is not loose enough **while still utilizing the entire contact patch**
| KC | 09-21-2005 11:10 AM |
I watched you run... you're too damn controlled. :D
You need to get like this:
[IMG]http://team***.org/gallery/albums/album175/dsd_1706.sized.jpg[/IMG]
:lol:
Damn.. owned by the filter... that's "w t f" in the URL
You need to get like this:
[IMG]http://team***.org/gallery/albums/album175/dsd_1706.sized.jpg[/IMG]
:lol:
Damn.. owned by the filter... that's "w t f" in the URL
| makofoto | 09-21-2005 11:21 AM |
Yeah ... SATO = little girl ! hahaha ... hysterically
I was working the course during our National Test 'n Tune while Josh was driving ... OMG! ... so on the edge, I mean over the edge ... ;-) "Step back ... here comes "Quick Hands" Josh again!"
On the other hand ... it was more amazing (and educational) to watch Motonishi ... he looked so slow (smooth, early braking, early gas) ... but his times were soooo fast!
I was working the course during our National Test 'n Tune while Josh was driving ... OMG! ... so on the edge, I mean over the edge ... ;-) "Step back ... here comes "Quick Hands" Josh again!"
On the other hand ... it was more amazing (and educational) to watch Motonishi ... he looked so slow (smooth, early braking, early gas) ... but his times were soooo fast!
| trhoppe | 09-21-2005 11:24 AM |
Sortor is a hack.
-Tom
-Tom
| makofoto | 09-21-2005 11:32 AM |
I guess ... the best type of Hack then ... :-)
| WRXIN | 09-21-2005 11:49 AM |
There's what appears to be a very nicely prepped 04 STi in the latest sport compact car magazine. Yeah, not the best mag in the world but its getting better. Anyhow, this STi has 670 springs in front and 780 in the rear if I remember correctly.
| KC | 09-21-2005 12:55 PM |
That's 12K/14K... if valved right, could be a great setup for asphalt.
--kC
--kC
| Got Pink? | 09-21-2005 01:12 PM |
do you think that 12k/14k springs are needed for a car that only has 245/45/17 street tires on it and a huge strano front bar? I was thinking that 8k/10k would be plenty spring for street tires.
Nate
Nate
| omahasubaru | 09-21-2005 01:16 PM |
I think those rates are reasonable for sure.
our 500/600 wasn't enough IMHO.
our 500/600 wasn't enough IMHO.
| KC | 09-21-2005 01:17 PM |
Needed? Nothing is really 'needed' in auto-x. It all depends on your driving style. I just said it could be a great setup on nice smooth asphalt. :)
--kC
--kC
| WRXIN | 09-21-2005 01:50 PM |
Meaning it would be awful on regular streets?
| Got Pink? | 09-21-2005 01:53 PM |
ohh the key word there was SMOOTH asphalt. Most places are not really that smooth and the one that is has a bump running the length of the lot that we have to go over twice and it really upsets some cars.
| jcroy66 | 09-21-2005 02:06 PM |
My guess is KC's implication is the nice smooth asphalt that was just laid down last week at Heartland Park. ;)
| KC | 09-21-2005 02:16 PM |
[QUOTE=jcroy66]My guess is KC's implication is the nice smooth asphalt that was just laid down last week at Heartland Park. ;)[/QUOTE]
Or Devens. :devil: But yeah...
I think that the Devens tour next year is going to see a big increase in participation since it's the best level asphalt in the North East. We suddenly go from 'meh' to 'almost nationals surface' in the span of a year... where most eveyone in the NE moaned the loss of the Rome NY site (concrete). Now... it just doesn't matter. :D
Many people have spent tons of dollars and many years development to handle the concrete in Topeka. With that being thrown out the window next year... things are going to change... PAX for '07 is going to be VERY interesting.
--kC
Or Devens. :devil: But yeah...
I think that the Devens tour next year is going to see a big increase in participation since it's the best level asphalt in the North East. We suddenly go from 'meh' to 'almost nationals surface' in the span of a year... where most eveyone in the NE moaned the loss of the Rome NY site (concrete). Now... it just doesn't matter. :D
Many people have spent tons of dollars and many years development to handle the concrete in Topeka. With that being thrown out the window next year... things are going to change... PAX for '07 is going to be VERY interesting.
--kC
| makofoto | 09-21-2005 02:26 PM |
Yeah Mark ... Barco, Scott, even Seb are taking about getting other cars for the street ... they just can't take driving their STX/SM cars on a regular basis.
| Got Pink? | 09-21-2005 02:27 PM |
I am really glad that nationals is moving to smooth asphalt as there are no concrete lots locally and I plan to use events like devens national tour and dc events are fedex to setup the car for smooth asphalt and with the new surface we should be able to beat those m3's and mythical rx8's KC thinks will win the class. But if an rx8 does win and gets the 245 limit for AWD cars removed it would be fine with me.
| KC | 09-21-2005 03:32 PM |
[QUOTE=Got Pink?]I am really glad that nationals is moving to smooth asphalt as there are no concrete lots locally and I plan to use events like devens national tour and dc events are fedex to setup the car for smooth asphalt and with the new surface we should be able to beat those m3's and mythical rx8's KC thinks will win the class. But if an rx8 does win and gets the 245 limit for AWD cars removed it would be fine with me.[/QUOTE]
It'll be close... really. I have RWD/low torque/low hp.. but wide tires.
Rally cars have less tire but awd with boost!
I mean it... it'll be close. :D
It'll be close... really. I have RWD/low torque/low hp.. but wide tires.
Rally cars have less tire but awd with boost!
I mean it... it'll be close. :D
| Jsortor | 09-21-2005 03:49 PM |
Kieth, before I went buying part for the RX-8, I would make sure it does not classify as "Sports car based" as I bet it could go either way. If it does go through, I would see it as a green light to go to SM as well, where it could make minimum wieght even with a turbo rx-7 motor or 3 rotor and have the prime time suspension configuration.......
[QUOTE=KC]It'll be close... really. I have RWD/low torque/low hp.. but wide tires.
Rally cars have less tire but awd with boost!
I mean it... it'll be close. :D[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=KC]It'll be close... really. I have RWD/low torque/low hp.. but wide tires.
Rally cars have less tire but awd with boost!
I mean it... it'll be close. :D[/QUOTE]
| Got Pink? | 09-21-2005 05:31 PM |
The RX8 must not be classed as sports car based since its on a the exclusion list for STX along with the Evo, STi and M3's. I agree that its on the line and really the whole thing is silly these days.
| Jsortor | 09-21-2005 05:58 PM |
[QUOTE=Got Pink?]The RX8 must not be classed as sports car based since its on a the exclusion list for STX along with the Evo, STi and M3's. I agree that its on the line and really the whole thing is silly these days.[/QUOTE]
Like you mention, the STI is on the exclusion list, even though it is already not even in the class because of displacement. I know KC will give us the skinny in a few days when he gets a return e-mail.... :)
Like you mention, the STI is on the exclusion list, even though it is already not even in the class because of displacement. I know KC will give us the skinny in a few days when he gets a return e-mail.... :)
| TheWRX | 09-21-2005 06:13 PM |
The RX8 is explicitly allowed in STU:
[url]http://www.scca.com/_FileLibrary/File/streettouringsupplementalclasses.pdf[/url]
[url]http://www.scca.com/_Filelibrary/File/streettouringcategoryclassificationsbymake.pdf[/url]
[url]http://www.scca.com/_FileLibrary/File/streettouringsupplementalclasses.pdf[/url]
[url]http://www.scca.com/_Filelibrary/File/streettouringcategoryclassificationsbymake.pdf[/url]
| Jsortor | 09-21-2005 06:35 PM |
[QUOTE=TheWRX]The RX8 is explicitly allowed in STU:
[url]http://www.scca.com/_FileLibrary/File/streettouringsupplementalclasses.pdf[/url]
[url]http://www.scca.com/_Filelibrary/File/streettouringcategoryclassificationsbymake.pdf[/url][/QUOTE]
According to the second pdf, it says that STU does not utilize the (not sportscar based) wording, effectively still possibly not allowing the car in SM. Bummer....
[url]http://www.scca.com/_FileLibrary/File/streettouringsupplementalclasses.pdf[/url]
[url]http://www.scca.com/_Filelibrary/File/streettouringcategoryclassificationsbymake.pdf[/url][/QUOTE]
According to the second pdf, it says that STU does not utilize the (not sportscar based) wording, effectively still possibly not allowing the car in SM. Bummer....
| KC | 09-21-2005 07:07 PM |
4 doors, 4 seats. Sportscar? ;)
| Draken | 09-21-2005 07:12 PM |
ok....So "Sports Car Based" is not a consideration in STU, as shown on the two above links. Further more the RX8 is specifically called out as STU legal. check.
And unless the vehicle is on the exclussion list (e46 M3, eXX M5) it is allowed.
So..Does that mean a Porsche 944 Turbo or 964 are elligible too? "Sportscar based" is not an issues, they are not on the exclusion list, and they have 4 seats. Likewise 911 variants?
Me thinks the exclusion list will be getting flushed out a bit more...
Chris H.
And unless the vehicle is on the exclussion list (e46 M3, eXX M5) it is allowed.
So..Does that mean a Porsche 944 Turbo or 964 are elligible too? "Sportscar based" is not an issues, they are not on the exclusion list, and they have 4 seats. Likewise 911 variants?
Me thinks the exclusion list will be getting flushed out a bit more...
Chris H.
| KC | 09-21-2005 07:16 PM |
Josh...
STU follows the ST rules/allowances and builds off them.
[QUOTE]Vehicles eligible for this category include all coupes/sedans with a
minimum of four seats, four seatbelts; that are non-sports car based
with maximum engine displacement of 3.1 liters, normally aspirated
and certain small displacement turbocharged sedans.[/QUOTE]
Since the RX8 is included in STU as eligible, then the SEB has agreed it is not considered a sports-car based vehicle... or it would not be on that list.
Ergo.. it would also be eligible for SM since ST uses the same wording of 'non-sportscar based'. The error in the 2nd PDF is an E&O item and that sheet is not part of the rules.
--kC
STU follows the ST rules/allowances and builds off them.
[QUOTE]Vehicles eligible for this category include all coupes/sedans with a
minimum of four seats, four seatbelts; that are non-sports car based
with maximum engine displacement of 3.1 liters, normally aspirated
and certain small displacement turbocharged sedans.[/QUOTE]
Since the RX8 is included in STU as eligible, then the SEB has agreed it is not considered a sports-car based vehicle... or it would not be on that list.
Ergo.. it would also be eligible for SM since ST uses the same wording of 'non-sportscar based'. The error in the 2nd PDF is an E&O item and that sheet is not part of the rules.
--kC
| Jsortor | 09-21-2005 09:14 PM |
[QUOTE=KC]Josh...
STU follows the ST rules/allowances and builds off them.
Since the RX8 is included in STU as eligible, then the SEB has agreed it is not considered a sports-car based vehicle... or it would not be on that list.
Ergo.. it would also be eligible for SM since ST uses the same wording of 'non-sportscar based'. The error in the 2nd PDF is an E&O item and that sheet is not part of the rules.
--kC[/QUOTE]
If this is so, then I [I]may[/I] know what I will be buying as a next car (after the Suby plays out...) ---Might still be too heavy though...Hmmm....
STU follows the ST rules/allowances and builds off them.
Since the RX8 is included in STU as eligible, then the SEB has agreed it is not considered a sports-car based vehicle... or it would not be on that list.
Ergo.. it would also be eligible for SM since ST uses the same wording of 'non-sportscar based'. The error in the 2nd PDF is an E&O item and that sheet is not part of the rules.
--kC[/QUOTE]
If this is so, then I [I]may[/I] know what I will be buying as a next car (after the Suby plays out...) ---Might still be too heavy though...Hmmm....
| MrDestructo | 09-21-2005 10:15 PM |
[QUOTE=Jsortor]If this is so, then I [i]may[/i] know what I will be buying as a next car (after the Suby plays out...) ---Might still be too heavy though...Hmmm....[/QUOTE]
Slightly off topic...:cool:
Josh, what are your plans for next year? Still going to try the 2.0L WRX ESP sleeper(if STEVOs move and boost is raised)??????
MF
Slightly off topic...:cool:
Josh, what are your plans for next year? Still going to try the 2.0L WRX ESP sleeper(if STEVOs move and boost is raised)??????
MF
| Jsortor | 09-21-2005 10:38 PM |
[QUOTE=MrDestructo]Slightly off topic...:cool:
Josh, what are your plans for next year? Still going to try the 2.0L WRX sleeper(if STEVOs move and boost is raised)??????
MF[/QUOTE]
That is still the plan, only I think I have to wait till '07 to be fully prepped. Just not enough budget yet. Probaby STX for pro's and maybe another class co-drive for tours....
Plus I have to give Yokohama some time to build me some cheater tires.. :p
Josh, what are your plans for next year? Still going to try the 2.0L WRX sleeper(if STEVOs move and boost is raised)??????
MF[/QUOTE]
That is still the plan, only I think I have to wait till '07 to be fully prepped. Just not enough budget yet. Probaby STX for pro's and maybe another class co-drive for tours....
Plus I have to give Yokohama some time to build me some cheater tires.. :p
| KC | 09-21-2005 10:51 PM |
I would think the 2.5L WRX would have the better shot in 'the other class of which shall not be named'. ;)
Better components from the get-go.
Better components from the get-go.
| Jsortor | 09-21-2005 11:07 PM |
[QUOTE=KC]I would think the 2.5L WRX would have the better shot in 'the other class of which shall not be named'. ;)
Better components from the get-go.[/QUOTE]
So what all is better on the new car other than the 2.5L motor? I might be able to sport for the bigger motor transplant, but if I could get the whole new car and prep it, then I sure wouldnt be complaining about budget issues now would I. :)
Better components from the get-go.[/QUOTE]
So what all is better on the new car other than the 2.5L motor? I might be able to sport for the bigger motor transplant, but if I could get the whole new car and prep it, then I sure wouldnt be complaining about budget issues now would I. :)
| KC | 09-22-2005 08:31 AM |
Biggest: Stronger gearbox for the Pros. (different case)
Steering Ratio improved (Can't touch steering in SP)
Greater torque that is available lower in the powerband (good starting point for tuning)
Base version (WRX TR) that is lighter than the rest of the '06s
Aluminum front suspension lower control arms and aluminum rear suspension lateral links
4 pots front/2 pots rear... with bigger rotors (Can't touch calipers/rotor size in SP)
Better semi-closed deck (I think.. not sure)
All that adds up to a better starting point. :)
Steering Ratio improved (Can't touch steering in SP)
Greater torque that is available lower in the powerband (good starting point for tuning)
Base version (WRX TR) that is lighter than the rest of the '06s
Aluminum front suspension lower control arms and aluminum rear suspension lateral links
4 pots front/2 pots rear... with bigger rotors (Can't touch calipers/rotor size in SP)
Better semi-closed deck (I think.. not sure)
All that adds up to a better starting point. :)
| Jsortor | 09-22-2005 09:13 AM |
[QUOTE=KC]Biggest: Stronger gearbox for the Pros. (different case)
Steering Ratio improved (Can't touch steering in SP)
Greater torque that is available lower in the powerband (good starting point for tuning)
Base version (WRX TR) that is lighter than the rest of the '06s
Aluminum front suspension lower control arms and aluminum rear suspension lateral links
4 pots front/2 pots rear... with bigger rotors (Can't touch calipers/rotor size in SP)
Better semi-closed deck (I think.. not sure)
All that adds up to a better starting point. :)[/QUOTE]
Gearbox can be changed with the motor in SP. I wonder if the ratio's are different.....
Meh, I will fight them off when someone brings one out......
Steering Ratio improved (Can't touch steering in SP)
Greater torque that is available lower in the powerband (good starting point for tuning)
Base version (WRX TR) that is lighter than the rest of the '06s
Aluminum front suspension lower control arms and aluminum rear suspension lateral links
4 pots front/2 pots rear... with bigger rotors (Can't touch calipers/rotor size in SP)
Better semi-closed deck (I think.. not sure)
All that adds up to a better starting point. :)[/QUOTE]
Gearbox can be changed with the motor in SP. I wonder if the ratio's are different.....
Meh, I will fight them off when someone brings one out......
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