| meebs | 06-15-2006 12:18 AM |
[QUOTE=StuBeck]Yep, that's what I'm fearing. An American in F1 hasn't seemed to help, hopefully having him for the USGP will create more interest.[/QUOTE]
The US is just SO different than Europe and part of it is size. Most countries, you can drive across in a day or less, as a result each one has a stronger identity. Our sense of nationalism is not the same and as a result F1 will never hit mainstream. Never say never? I did. Never.
And I don't know if I really care. :o There seems to be enough of a following that we get TV coverage and magazines on the news stands so I'm happy. :)
The US is just SO different than Europe and part of it is size. Most countries, you can drive across in a day or less, as a result each one has a stronger identity. Our sense of nationalism is not the same and as a result F1 will never hit mainstream. Never say never? I did. Never.
And I don't know if I really care. :o There seems to be enough of a following that we get TV coverage and magazines on the news stands so I'm happy. :)
| bitterWRX | 06-15-2006 12:42 AM |
[QUOTE=finnRex]I agree that he is a good plug for advertising, but I don't think that the American public will turn to watch F1 unless there's an American WINNING races, not just driving.
Mika[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=Ferg]I think you're spot on Mika.
I'll go you one further though...I think it will take an American actually taking the Driver's Championship before this country as a whole takes notice of F1..and then I'd only give it a 50/50 chance. :(
Then again, I'm in a really pessimistic mode today![/QUOTE]
To which I wonder:
Is Scott Speed good enough to win the WDC (in the future) and that he is not bringing results because he's piloting a Torro Russo? And would any bigger team, other than Redbull, be willing to pick up Speed?
Mika[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=Ferg]I think you're spot on Mika.
I'll go you one further though...I think it will take an American actually taking the Driver's Championship before this country as a whole takes notice of F1..and then I'd only give it a 50/50 chance. :(
Then again, I'm in a really pessimistic mode today![/QUOTE]
To which I wonder:
Is Scott Speed good enough to win the WDC (in the future) and that he is not bringing results because he's piloting a Torro Russo? And would any bigger team, other than Redbull, be willing to pick up Speed?
| JoD | 06-15-2006 08:11 AM |
Finally - some news about who's going where in the silly season....
From F1 Racing.net:
Renault extends Fisichella's contract
15 June 2006
The Renault F1 team today announced that it has come to an agreement with Giancarlo Fisichella to extend his contract for another season. Fisichella has won one race this season and is currently fourth in the championship.
Giancarlo Fisichella commented about the good news: "It was very important for me to know my future as soon as possible in the season. I am delighted to be staying at Renault next year, and to have the opportunity to see my hard work with the team over the past two seasons come to fruition.
"I want to thank the Renault F1 Team and the Renault Group for the trust they have placed in me. This clear vision for the future means I can focus 100% on the job at hand: retaining the constructors' championship with Renault in 2006 and finishing as high as possible in the drivers' standings."
Good for you, Fisi. :)
From F1 Racing.net:
Renault extends Fisichella's contract
15 June 2006
The Renault F1 team today announced that it has come to an agreement with Giancarlo Fisichella to extend his contract for another season. Fisichella has won one race this season and is currently fourth in the championship.
Giancarlo Fisichella commented about the good news: "It was very important for me to know my future as soon as possible in the season. I am delighted to be staying at Renault next year, and to have the opportunity to see my hard work with the team over the past two seasons come to fruition.
"I want to thank the Renault F1 Team and the Renault Group for the trust they have placed in me. This clear vision for the future means I can focus 100% on the job at hand: retaining the constructors' championship with Renault in 2006 and finishing as high as possible in the drivers' standings."
Good for you, Fisi. :)
| TimStevens | 06-15-2006 08:26 AM |
Yeah, that is good news for him. Now I hope he can make something of it!
| Ferg | 06-15-2006 08:29 AM |
[QUOTE=StuBeck]Confused about what?
STR won't be the senior team since they'll be running an 07 chassis. I doubt STR will be able to run the Red Bull chassis either, it was a wierdass loophole that let STR run the chassis this year. I think with the extra time they'll be able to make their own.[/QUOTE]
I was sort of making a joke, it's hard to keep track of the whole circus at times 'ya know! :D
I believe the loophole that allowed STR to run last years Red Bull this season still exists, and that STR plan on running this years RBR2, albeit a developed version next season, possibly with the Ferrari engine and all.
STR won't be the senior team since they'll be running an 07 chassis. I doubt STR will be able to run the Red Bull chassis either, it was a wierdass loophole that let STR run the chassis this year. I think with the extra time they'll be able to make their own.[/QUOTE]
I was sort of making a joke, it's hard to keep track of the whole circus at times 'ya know! :D
I believe the loophole that allowed STR to run last years Red Bull this season still exists, and that STR plan on running this years RBR2, albeit a developed version next season, possibly with the Ferrari engine and all.
| StuBeck | 06-15-2006 08:35 AM |
Red Bull is still having someone else make teh chassis? I think it makes sense for STR to make their own chassis now, the reason they ran the RBR1 was because the minardi chassis was so bad.
I'm surprised they're keeping Fisi another year, he's been pretty useless this year.
I'm surprised they're keeping Fisi another year, he's been pretty useless this year.
| Ferg | 06-15-2006 08:39 AM |
I think that's still the case with Red Bull..honestly now I'm not sure.
Here's the lastest bit I read about Red Bull's situation in regards to a possible Renault engine supply for next year.
[QUOTE]Red Bull Racing currently have a Ferrari customer engine contract for next year, while Red Bull's junior team Toro Rosso have a 2007 Cosworth contract.
Autosport understands, however, that the contracts are interchangeable between the two teams, potentially allowing next year's STR-02, which is likely to be a developed version of this year's RB2 car, to use the Ferrari engines around which the chassis was designed.
Under that scenario, Red Bull could be in the market for another engine if they did not wish to renew a partnership with Cosworth - the engine manufacturer they dumped in favour of Ferrari at the end of last season.[/QUOTE]
Here's the lastest bit I read about Red Bull's situation in regards to a possible Renault engine supply for next year.
[QUOTE]Red Bull Racing currently have a Ferrari customer engine contract for next year, while Red Bull's junior team Toro Rosso have a 2007 Cosworth contract.
Autosport understands, however, that the contracts are interchangeable between the two teams, potentially allowing next year's STR-02, which is likely to be a developed version of this year's RB2 car, to use the Ferrari engines around which the chassis was designed.
Under that scenario, Red Bull could be in the market for another engine if they did not wish to renew a partnership with Cosworth - the engine manufacturer they dumped in favour of Ferrari at the end of last season.[/QUOTE]
| Ferg | 06-15-2006 09:47 AM |
More on Fisi's good news.
[QUOTE]Fisichella: no preferences on teammate
By Jonathan Noble Thursday, June 15th 2006, 12:46 GMT
Giancarlo Fisichella has said he has no preference about who he wants as his teammate at Renault next year.
The Italian has had his contract with the team extended by another season, while it is still unknown who the French manufacturer will bring in to replace Fernando Alonso.
The two favourites for the drive are Renault tester Heikki Kovalainen and McLaren's Kimi Raikkonen - with speculation suggesting that Fisichella's deal makes it more likely that the team have got hold of Raikkonen.
But Fisichella has said that he has no idea yet who has won the fight to be Renault's second driver next year - although he suggested earlier this week that it would definitely be a Finn.
"I really don't know, it's too early to say," he told autosport.com. "The other day I was joking that it would be a Finnish driver and I do believe that Kovalainen, who has done a good job, has a good chance. I am sure he is one of the candidates.
"And the other Finn? Yes, he is a very good driver. I would relish the challenge of driving alongside him, but I do not care who it is really. Personally, if Kovalainen drives then I am happy with him because I know the guy and he is very good."
Although Fisichella has recently endured a difficult few races, having missed out on the podium in Monaco and Britain, he has said he had no doubts about remaining with Renault in 2007.
"I was pretty confident for some time," he explained. "The atmosphere in the team is great. The reliability and the performance are great. Thinking about all these things, I am happy to be with the team in 2007 and I am really looking forward to it.
"It is a benefit this deal being announced. It really helps knowing where you are going next year � especially after two years of working with the team. You normally take one to two years to integrate and build up a team, so it will be easier for me. I did some hard work in the last two years so now I can build on it."
Looking ahead to the rest of this season, Fisichella believes that judging by his current pace he could expect to take more victories to add to his triumph in Malaysia.
"Sure I have got the pace," he said. "I know I have had a few problems but I am stronger mentally and physically, and I do not see why I cannot win more races."
[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE]Fisichella: no preferences on teammate
By Jonathan Noble Thursday, June 15th 2006, 12:46 GMT
Giancarlo Fisichella has said he has no preference about who he wants as his teammate at Renault next year.
The Italian has had his contract with the team extended by another season, while it is still unknown who the French manufacturer will bring in to replace Fernando Alonso.
The two favourites for the drive are Renault tester Heikki Kovalainen and McLaren's Kimi Raikkonen - with speculation suggesting that Fisichella's deal makes it more likely that the team have got hold of Raikkonen.
But Fisichella has said that he has no idea yet who has won the fight to be Renault's second driver next year - although he suggested earlier this week that it would definitely be a Finn.
"I really don't know, it's too early to say," he told autosport.com. "The other day I was joking that it would be a Finnish driver and I do believe that Kovalainen, who has done a good job, has a good chance. I am sure he is one of the candidates.
"And the other Finn? Yes, he is a very good driver. I would relish the challenge of driving alongside him, but I do not care who it is really. Personally, if Kovalainen drives then I am happy with him because I know the guy and he is very good."
Although Fisichella has recently endured a difficult few races, having missed out on the podium in Monaco and Britain, he has said he had no doubts about remaining with Renault in 2007.
"I was pretty confident for some time," he explained. "The atmosphere in the team is great. The reliability and the performance are great. Thinking about all these things, I am happy to be with the team in 2007 and I am really looking forward to it.
"It is a benefit this deal being announced. It really helps knowing where you are going next year � especially after two years of working with the team. You normally take one to two years to integrate and build up a team, so it will be easier for me. I did some hard work in the last two years so now I can build on it."
Looking ahead to the rest of this season, Fisichella believes that judging by his current pace he could expect to take more victories to add to his triumph in Malaysia.
"Sure I have got the pace," he said. "I know I have had a few problems but I am stronger mentally and physically, and I do not see why I cannot win more races."
[/QUOTE]
| Bonzo | 06-15-2006 10:32 AM |
[QUOTE=meebs]The US is just SO different than Europe and part of it is size. Most countries, you can drive across in a day or less, as a result each one has a stronger identity. Our sense of nationalism is not the same and as a result F1 will never hit mainstream. Never say never? I did. Never.
And I don't know if I really care. :o There seems to be enough of a following that we get TV coverage and magazines on the news stands so I'm happy. :)[/QUOTE]
Excellent point.
Now if a driver from my home state were in F1 we'd see considerably more press on him vs any other state or national media.
Look at Nascar. #17 is from WI and his stickers outnumber any other sticker at least 2 to 1 on the pick-up drivin public round these parts. ;)
The US is too big for F1. ??
And I don't know if I really care. :o There seems to be enough of a following that we get TV coverage and magazines on the news stands so I'm happy. :)[/QUOTE]
Excellent point.
Now if a driver from my home state were in F1 we'd see considerably more press on him vs any other state or national media.
Look at Nascar. #17 is from WI and his stickers outnumber any other sticker at least 2 to 1 on the pick-up drivin public round these parts. ;)
The US is too big for F1. ??
| TimStevens | 06-15-2006 10:38 AM |
I don't think it's so much a particular state as it is a part of the country and name recognition. Scott Speed is IIRC from California, and most of the motorsports fans in the US (i.e. NASCAR fans) don't think much of Californians. (How many Calvin pissing on #24 stickers have you seen?) That, and he was a nobody to most Americans before he hit F1.
If we had a good 'ol boy from NASCAR in F1 I think interest would pick up drastically, or whatsherface because she's a chick, but just having some random unknown short guy from California in F1 isn't going to do much to help the cause.
If we had a good 'ol boy from NASCAR in F1 I think interest would pick up drastically, or whatsherface because she's a chick, but just having some random unknown short guy from California in F1 isn't going to do much to help the cause.
| Ferg | 06-15-2006 11:09 AM |
And the flexi-wing controversy continues..
[QUOTE]FIA moves to stop flexi-wings concerns
By Jonathan Noble Thursday, June 15th 2006, 14:57 GMT
Motor racing's governing body has moved to bring an end to renewed concerns about flexi-wings in Formula One by implementing immediate changes to the rear wing regulations, autosport.com can reveal.
FIA technical delegate Charlie Whiting has written to the teams advising them that, from the Canadian Grand Prix, slot-gap separators will have to be added to their rear wings in a bid to ensure that no teams' wings can flex at high speed.
The controversy surrounding flexi-wings in the sport appeared to have died down after Ferrari, McLaren and BMW were asked to make revisions to their design after the Malaysian Grand Prix - when a number of teams had threatened to protest Michael Schumacher's car.
However, continued strong straight line performance from Ferrari, allied to dramatic improvements to speed from BMW-Sauber, led to renewed suspicions within the paddock that some teams were continuing to make use of some flexibility in their wings. There were no suggestions that the teams were breaking the regulations though.
The key area of exploitation was in designing the wings in such a way that the slot-gap between the two elements of the rear wing closed up at high speed, thereby reducing drag and increasing straight line speed. The slot gap would then open up at lower speed to ensure the wing delivered maximum downforce through the corners.
There are also suggestions that above a certain speed some teams have managed to get their aero package to stall - which leaves them with zero drag.
With the forthcoming Montreal and Indianapolis circuits being ideal venues for making best use of flexi-wings, because of their long straights and relatively slow corners, action has now been taken to try and alleviate concerns about the situation.
The teams have been asked to fit a central slot-gap separator to their cars from the Montreal race to ensure the two wings remain 50mm apart. These will ensure that there is no chance of them exploiting the regulations as the separator material will stop the elements of the wing flexing and therefore prevent teams from closing up the slot gap.
Williams technical director Sam Michael said: "The teams will have to have a slot gap separator so the slot gap cannot close.
"The wording of the directive is that no part of the wing can be more than 250mm laterally away from the support. So you can have a separator to stop it or you can have a snubber so that the support does not move."
The issue of flexi-wings has been discussed at length by F1 think tank the Technical Working Group, which recently approved a proposal for the slot gap separators to be introduced in 2007. Those plans have now been brought forward for immediate implementation.
Although it is hoped that the introduction of slot-gap separators will bring an end to suspicions about rear wings, it is unlikely to quell all talk about flexible parts.
"Everything flexes on a car," said one leading source. "The front wings flex, the winglets flex, most car parts flex. The issue is just likely to move on to somewhere else now."[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE]FIA moves to stop flexi-wings concerns
By Jonathan Noble Thursday, June 15th 2006, 14:57 GMT
Motor racing's governing body has moved to bring an end to renewed concerns about flexi-wings in Formula One by implementing immediate changes to the rear wing regulations, autosport.com can reveal.
FIA technical delegate Charlie Whiting has written to the teams advising them that, from the Canadian Grand Prix, slot-gap separators will have to be added to their rear wings in a bid to ensure that no teams' wings can flex at high speed.
The controversy surrounding flexi-wings in the sport appeared to have died down after Ferrari, McLaren and BMW were asked to make revisions to their design after the Malaysian Grand Prix - when a number of teams had threatened to protest Michael Schumacher's car.
However, continued strong straight line performance from Ferrari, allied to dramatic improvements to speed from BMW-Sauber, led to renewed suspicions within the paddock that some teams were continuing to make use of some flexibility in their wings. There were no suggestions that the teams were breaking the regulations though.
The key area of exploitation was in designing the wings in such a way that the slot-gap between the two elements of the rear wing closed up at high speed, thereby reducing drag and increasing straight line speed. The slot gap would then open up at lower speed to ensure the wing delivered maximum downforce through the corners.
There are also suggestions that above a certain speed some teams have managed to get their aero package to stall - which leaves them with zero drag.
With the forthcoming Montreal and Indianapolis circuits being ideal venues for making best use of flexi-wings, because of their long straights and relatively slow corners, action has now been taken to try and alleviate concerns about the situation.
The teams have been asked to fit a central slot-gap separator to their cars from the Montreal race to ensure the two wings remain 50mm apart. These will ensure that there is no chance of them exploiting the regulations as the separator material will stop the elements of the wing flexing and therefore prevent teams from closing up the slot gap.
Williams technical director Sam Michael said: "The teams will have to have a slot gap separator so the slot gap cannot close.
"The wording of the directive is that no part of the wing can be more than 250mm laterally away from the support. So you can have a separator to stop it or you can have a snubber so that the support does not move."
The issue of flexi-wings has been discussed at length by F1 think tank the Technical Working Group, which recently approved a proposal for the slot gap separators to be introduced in 2007. Those plans have now been brought forward for immediate implementation.
Although it is hoped that the introduction of slot-gap separators will bring an end to suspicions about rear wings, it is unlikely to quell all talk about flexible parts.
"Everything flexes on a car," said one leading source. "The front wings flex, the winglets flex, most car parts flex. The issue is just likely to move on to somewhere else now."[/QUOTE]
| finnRex | 06-15-2006 12:09 PM |
[QUOTE=StuBeck]Yep, that's what I'm fearing. An American in F1 hasn't seemed to help, hopefully having him for the USGP will create more interest.[/QUOTE]
We'll find out in Indy in a few weeks. I really do think that after last year's fiasco, Speed can bring some folks into the USGP crowd. I'm hoping that the USGP doesn't go away.
Mika
We'll find out in Indy in a few weeks. I really do think that after last year's fiasco, Speed can bring some folks into the USGP crowd. I'm hoping that the USGP doesn't go away.
Mika
| BriDrive | 06-15-2006 12:25 PM |
I think the analogy which goes furthest in explaining the US's relative disinterest in S.Speed and F1 is:
Picture some obscure uber athlete from Germany(let's say) being recruited to play quarter-back for the Houston Texans. Germany will have some very marginal interest in athlete X but still be left scratching their collective heads about this strange NFL football league in general. Most Germans would rather contemplate if Mr. X could actually hack it on the German World Cup team after his silly love affair with that strange foreign sport is over. And then they quickly retune to the World Cup / FIFA matches at hand.
BriDrive
Picture some obscure uber athlete from Germany(let's say) being recruited to play quarter-back for the Houston Texans. Germany will have some very marginal interest in athlete X but still be left scratching their collective heads about this strange NFL football league in general. Most Germans would rather contemplate if Mr. X could actually hack it on the German World Cup team after his silly love affair with that strange foreign sport is over. And then they quickly retune to the World Cup / FIFA matches at hand.
BriDrive
| StuBeck | 06-15-2006 12:37 PM |
[QUOTE=finnRex]We'll find out in Indy in a few weeks. I really do think that after last year's fiasco, Speed can bring some folks into the USGP crowd. I'm hoping that the USGP doesn't go away.
Mika[/QUOTE]
Yep, that's what I'm saying. He hasn't been able to make the US interested, but with the USGP it should be obvious if he can promote himself (or is allowed to promote himself) well during the event.
Mika[/QUOTE]
Yep, that's what I'm saying. He hasn't been able to make the US interested, but with the USGP it should be obvious if he can promote himself (or is allowed to promote himself) well during the event.
| StuBeck | 06-15-2006 12:39 PM |
That's good to hear about the flexing wing issue. Ferrari's speed was taken away once everyone made their own flexiable wings.
| Ferg | 06-15-2006 01:12 PM |
Monza, day three.
[QUOTE]Button on top on final day at Monza
Thursday, June 15th 2006, 16:48 GMT
Seven Formula One teams wrapped up their preparations for the Canadian and United States Grand Prix on Thursday, completing a three-day test at the Monza circuit in Italy.
Briton Jenson Button gave a boost to his Honda team following their disastrous British Grand Prix by setting the quickest time of the week on his final day of work at the Italian track.
The Honda driver, who was joined today by teammate Rubens Barrichello, was also the man with the most laps completed, covering well over two Grand Prix distances on a single session.
Button's time of 1:22.925 was nearly four tenths quickest than BMW's test driver Robert Kubica, second fastest ahead of teammate Jacques Villeneuve, whose team completed a promising test in which they were always close to the top of the times.
Giancarlo Fisichella, boosted by the news that he will stay at the Renault team next year, was fourth quickest as the world champions wrapped up their programme. The Italian worked again alongside test driver Heikki Kovalainen, one of the main candidates to land the second Renault seat next year.
Toyota's Jarno Trulli was eighth fastest as the Japanese squad continued working on the development of the TF106B car, the Italian covering 67 laps. Teammate Ralf Schumacher was also in action, but the German could not complete his programme after being hit by an engine problem.
"We lost a bit of time with an engine electronic problem and had a lot to get through," said Schumacher.
"As well as the tyre and suspension programme, I was also planning to try some different rear wing arrangements before we head across the Atlantic for two races on consecutive weekends in Montreal and Indianapolis but we will have to leave that for a later test.
"The bulk of the set-up work was successful and we hope to have strong races in North America."
David Coulthard and Robert Doornbos completed Red Bull's programme, the Dutchman returning to action after being forced to skip yesterday afternoon's session due to food poisoning.
Doornbos was replaced yesterday by Toro Rosso's Tonio Liuzzi, who today returned to his usual car to wrap up the test.
Today's times:
Pos Driver Team Time Laps
1. Button Honda (M) 1:22.925 135
2. Kubica BMW-Sauber (M) 1:23.318 89
3. Villeneuve BMW-Sauber (M) 1:23.648 124
4. Fisichella Renault (M) 1:23.793 57
5. Barrichello Honda (M) 1:23.877 90
6. Webber Williams-Cosworth (B) 1:23.916 86
7. Kovalainen Renault (M) 1:23.932 108
8. Trulli Toyota (B) 1:24.037 67
9. Rosberg Williams-Cosworth (B) 1:24.169 80
10. R.Schumacher Toyota (B) 1:24.232 63
11. Coulthard Red Bull-Ferrari (M) 1:24.416 80
12. Liuzzi Toro Rosso-Cosworth (M) 1:24.671 96
13. Doornbos Red Bull-Ferrari (M) 1:25.074 70
All Timing Unofficial[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE]Button on top on final day at Monza
Thursday, June 15th 2006, 16:48 GMT
Seven Formula One teams wrapped up their preparations for the Canadian and United States Grand Prix on Thursday, completing a three-day test at the Monza circuit in Italy.
Briton Jenson Button gave a boost to his Honda team following their disastrous British Grand Prix by setting the quickest time of the week on his final day of work at the Italian track.
The Honda driver, who was joined today by teammate Rubens Barrichello, was also the man with the most laps completed, covering well over two Grand Prix distances on a single session.
Button's time of 1:22.925 was nearly four tenths quickest than BMW's test driver Robert Kubica, second fastest ahead of teammate Jacques Villeneuve, whose team completed a promising test in which they were always close to the top of the times.
Giancarlo Fisichella, boosted by the news that he will stay at the Renault team next year, was fourth quickest as the world champions wrapped up their programme. The Italian worked again alongside test driver Heikki Kovalainen, one of the main candidates to land the second Renault seat next year.
Toyota's Jarno Trulli was eighth fastest as the Japanese squad continued working on the development of the TF106B car, the Italian covering 67 laps. Teammate Ralf Schumacher was also in action, but the German could not complete his programme after being hit by an engine problem.
"We lost a bit of time with an engine electronic problem and had a lot to get through," said Schumacher.
"As well as the tyre and suspension programme, I was also planning to try some different rear wing arrangements before we head across the Atlantic for two races on consecutive weekends in Montreal and Indianapolis but we will have to leave that for a later test.
"The bulk of the set-up work was successful and we hope to have strong races in North America."
David Coulthard and Robert Doornbos completed Red Bull's programme, the Dutchman returning to action after being forced to skip yesterday afternoon's session due to food poisoning.
Doornbos was replaced yesterday by Toro Rosso's Tonio Liuzzi, who today returned to his usual car to wrap up the test.
Today's times:
Pos Driver Team Time Laps
1. Button Honda (M) 1:22.925 135
2. Kubica BMW-Sauber (M) 1:23.318 89
3. Villeneuve BMW-Sauber (M) 1:23.648 124
4. Fisichella Renault (M) 1:23.793 57
5. Barrichello Honda (M) 1:23.877 90
6. Webber Williams-Cosworth (B) 1:23.916 86
7. Kovalainen Renault (M) 1:23.932 108
8. Trulli Toyota (B) 1:24.037 67
9. Rosberg Williams-Cosworth (B) 1:24.169 80
10. R.Schumacher Toyota (B) 1:24.232 63
11. Coulthard Red Bull-Ferrari (M) 1:24.416 80
12. Liuzzi Toro Rosso-Cosworth (M) 1:24.671 96
13. Doornbos Red Bull-Ferrari (M) 1:25.074 70
All Timing Unofficial[/QUOTE]
| artkevin | 06-15-2006 01:37 PM |
I don't understand how you can get the aero to "stall" and how that would be illegal as long as it was from a non-movable aero piece.
| Ferg | 06-15-2006 01:41 PM |
You're guess is as good as mine Kevin.
Can anyone explain (in really simple terms) how something can stop creating downforce at a certain speed without moving?
Can anyone explain (in really simple terms) how something can stop creating downforce at a certain speed without moving?
| artkevin | 06-15-2006 01:48 PM |
I would guess it would be about harmonics and natural frequency. Basically vibrations lining up with each other at a certain speed. I guess it would be like what Steve Matchet was saying about air in the engines hitting supersonic speed and using that to your advantage/disadvantage. But then again, I can barely use a calculator and my head already hurts.
| meebs | 06-15-2006 08:42 PM |
[QUOTE=Bonzo]Excellent point.
Now if a driver from my home state were in F1 we'd see considerably more press on him vs any other state or national media.
Look at Nascar. #17 is from WI and his stickers outnumber any other sticker at least 2 to 1 on the pick-up drivin public round these parts. ;)
The US is too big for F1. ??[/QUOTE]
True... I have friends in Enumclaw, WA, Kasey Kain's hometown, people who aren't even into cars now "follow" Nascar. You do have a point there, reigon interest goes through the roof when you have a guy from your town/state. I guess the sad thing is, corporations tend to only look at national interest.
While I do see Kasey Kain cardboard cutouts glaring at me at the Enumclaw Safeway... I doubt I'll ever see a Rebull display with Scott standing next to him. :/
Now if a driver from my home state were in F1 we'd see considerably more press on him vs any other state or national media.
Look at Nascar. #17 is from WI and his stickers outnumber any other sticker at least 2 to 1 on the pick-up drivin public round these parts. ;)
The US is too big for F1. ??[/QUOTE]
True... I have friends in Enumclaw, WA, Kasey Kain's hometown, people who aren't even into cars now "follow" Nascar. You do have a point there, reigon interest goes through the roof when you have a guy from your town/state. I guess the sad thing is, corporations tend to only look at national interest.
While I do see Kasey Kain cardboard cutouts glaring at me at the Enumclaw Safeway... I doubt I'll ever see a Rebull display with Scott standing next to him. :/
| meebs | 06-15-2006 09:26 PM |
[QUOTE=Ferg]You're guess is as good as mine Kevin.
Can anyone explain (in really simple terms) how something can stop creating downforce at a certain speed without moving?[/QUOTE]
I think I might be on to something thanks to this link, and the spreadsheet that you can download. This sheet is calculating the downforce for a motorbike.
[url]http://www.msgroup.org/TIP180.html[/url]
Remember what Matchett goes on and on about? The tires providing an area of lift. Lift being the opposite of downforce, the faster you go, the more lift is generated which reduces the ammount of moving weight, but of course downforce goes up too.
According to this spreadsheet, if you go 1 mile an hour, your moving weight is 797 pounds. If you go 288 miles per hour, the ammount of moving weight is negative 3 pounds, which I would consider a "stall" as the effect of lift is countering downforce.
How you accheive this on a modern Formula one car with out any moving bits is beyond me. You would have to get very tricky with how you manage the air under the car and over the tires is my guess.
Can anyone explain (in really simple terms) how something can stop creating downforce at a certain speed without moving?[/QUOTE]
I think I might be on to something thanks to this link, and the spreadsheet that you can download. This sheet is calculating the downforce for a motorbike.
[url]http://www.msgroup.org/TIP180.html[/url]
Remember what Matchett goes on and on about? The tires providing an area of lift. Lift being the opposite of downforce, the faster you go, the more lift is generated which reduces the ammount of moving weight, but of course downforce goes up too.
According to this spreadsheet, if you go 1 mile an hour, your moving weight is 797 pounds. If you go 288 miles per hour, the ammount of moving weight is negative 3 pounds, which I would consider a "stall" as the effect of lift is countering downforce.
How you accheive this on a modern Formula one car with out any moving bits is beyond me. You would have to get very tricky with how you manage the air under the car and over the tires is my guess.
| TimStevens | 06-15-2006 09:32 PM |
No pilots in this thread? A "stall" is when a wing loses its aerodynamic efficiency due to having too high an angle of attack when compared to the airflow.
[img]http://ultralighthomepage.com/STALL/stallanim.gif[/img]
[url]http://ultralighthomepage.com/STALL/stall.html[/url]
Stalling in a plane is bad, as your wings don't work anymore and you fall out of the sky. However, stalling the wings of the car would be a good thing because their drag would be greatly reduced (less air making contact with the wing).
So, effectively when the wings flex they change their orientation against the incoming airflow and, at a certain speed they stall out and don't drag as much, earning you a few extra MPH on the straights where you don't need the d/f anyway. The Benetton and Williams and other active suspension cars in the early 90's had buttons you could push to jack up the rear suspension and stall out the wings.
[img]http://ultralighthomepage.com/STALL/stallanim.gif[/img]
[url]http://ultralighthomepage.com/STALL/stall.html[/url]
Stalling in a plane is bad, as your wings don't work anymore and you fall out of the sky. However, stalling the wings of the car would be a good thing because their drag would be greatly reduced (less air making contact with the wing).
So, effectively when the wings flex they change their orientation against the incoming airflow and, at a certain speed they stall out and don't drag as much, earning you a few extra MPH on the straights where you don't need the d/f anyway. The Benetton and Williams and other active suspension cars in the early 90's had buttons you could push to jack up the rear suspension and stall out the wings.
| meebs | 06-15-2006 09:45 PM |
[QUOTE=TimStevens]No pilots in this thread? A "stall" is when a wing loses its aerodynamic efficiency due to having too high an angle of attack when compared to the airflow.
[img]http://ultralighthomepage.com/STALL/stallanim.gif[/img]
[url]http://ultralighthomepage.com/STALL/stall.html[/url]
Stalling in a plane is bad, as your wings don't work anymore and you fall out of the sky. However, stalling the wings of the car would be a good thing because their drag would be greatly reduced (less air making contact with the wing).
So, effectively when the wings flex they change their orientation against the incoming airflow and, at a certain speed they stall out and don't drag as much, earning you a few extra MPH on the straights where you don't need the d/f anyway. The Benetton and Williams and other active suspension cars in the early 90's had buttons you could push to jack up the rear suspension and stall out the wings.[/QUOTE]
I thought about how planes stall as well but couldn't make the connection.
My understanding is airplane stalling is a result of a high angle of attack in addition to slow speed. (my dad is an avid model airplane flyer :))
How can the opposite be true where on a Formula One car, the angle of attack is great while the speed is high. Higher angle of attack is more (too much) downforce at high speeds.
Wouldn't increasing ride height (active suspention) be simply reducing downforce under the car, thus making the car "weigh less"?
Remember all downforce is doing is making the car "weigh more". So if it weighs less, the engine can make it go faster. And if you can make it weigh zero, then all the engine has to push against is drag.
[img]http://ultralighthomepage.com/STALL/stallanim.gif[/img]
[url]http://ultralighthomepage.com/STALL/stall.html[/url]
Stalling in a plane is bad, as your wings don't work anymore and you fall out of the sky. However, stalling the wings of the car would be a good thing because their drag would be greatly reduced (less air making contact with the wing).
So, effectively when the wings flex they change their orientation against the incoming airflow and, at a certain speed they stall out and don't drag as much, earning you a few extra MPH on the straights where you don't need the d/f anyway. The Benetton and Williams and other active suspension cars in the early 90's had buttons you could push to jack up the rear suspension and stall out the wings.[/QUOTE]
I thought about how planes stall as well but couldn't make the connection.
My understanding is airplane stalling is a result of a high angle of attack in addition to slow speed. (my dad is an avid model airplane flyer :))
How can the opposite be true where on a Formula One car, the angle of attack is great while the speed is high. Higher angle of attack is more (too much) downforce at high speeds.
Wouldn't increasing ride height (active suspention) be simply reducing downforce under the car, thus making the car "weigh less"?
Remember all downforce is doing is making the car "weigh more". So if it weighs less, the engine can make it go faster. And if you can make it weigh zero, then all the engine has to push against is drag.
| KAX | 06-15-2006 09:50 PM |
[QUOTE=meebs]I thought about how planes stall as well but couldn't make the connection.
My understanding is airplane stalling is a result of a high angle of attack in addition to slow speed. (my dad is an avid model airplane flyer :))
How can the opposite be true where on a Formula One car, the angle of attack is great while the speed is high. Higher angle of attack is more (too much) downforce at high speeds.
Wouldn't increasing ride height (active suspention) be simply reducing downforce under the car, thus making the car "weigh less"?
Remember all downforce is doing is making the car "weigh more". So if it weighs less, the engine can make it go faster. And if you can make it weigh zero, then all the engine has to push against is drag.[/QUOTE]
its not just adding weight, but like Tim said, its adding drag to the car. So by stalling out your not only losing the weight like you say, but also the drag making your car even faster. I cant explain it because i just switched my major to aerospace today :lol: , but thats what ive picked up from this thread. Chaging the height of one half of the car, changes the pitch of the wing and its orientation, therefore changing the d/f and drag effects.
My understanding is airplane stalling is a result of a high angle of attack in addition to slow speed. (my dad is an avid model airplane flyer :))
How can the opposite be true where on a Formula One car, the angle of attack is great while the speed is high. Higher angle of attack is more (too much) downforce at high speeds.
Wouldn't increasing ride height (active suspention) be simply reducing downforce under the car, thus making the car "weigh less"?
Remember all downforce is doing is making the car "weigh more". So if it weighs less, the engine can make it go faster. And if you can make it weigh zero, then all the engine has to push against is drag.[/QUOTE]
its not just adding weight, but like Tim said, its adding drag to the car. So by stalling out your not only losing the weight like you say, but also the drag making your car even faster. I cant explain it because i just switched my major to aerospace today :lol: , but thats what ive picked up from this thread. Chaging the height of one half of the car, changes the pitch of the wing and its orientation, therefore changing the d/f and drag effects.
| meebs | 06-16-2006 01:48 AM |
[QUOTE=KAX]its not just adding weight, but like Tim said, its adding drag to the car. So by stalling out your not only losing the weight like you say, but also the drag making your car even faster. I cant explain it because i just switched my major to aerospace today :lol: , but thats what ive picked up from this thread. Chaging the height of one half of the car, changes the pitch of the wing and its orientation, therefore changing the d/f and drag effects.[/QUOTE]
The only problem is drag makes your car (and airplane) have a lower top speed. The comparison between airplanes and cars isn't exactly direct, as the desired results are not the same.
High speed tracks such as Monza and "old/new" Hockenheim were tracks where you would see the cars flatten their wings in an attempt to increase top end. What this is doing is reducing downforce, which makes the car "weigh" less.
If you increase the angle of attack at high speed, you are generating more downforce, or inversely "lift" with an airplane. Stalling for an airplane only happens at very slow speeds. If you increase your angle of attack with a wing on a plane at "high" speed.... you go up (thankfully :))
In the days of active suspention, much of the downforce was generated from the bottom of the car. As a result, if you increase the ride height, you lost the [b]majority[/b] of your downforce. The rear wing may have had a higher angle of attack, but the downforce generated by this was the [b]much[/b] lesser of the two evils.
Back on topic in the modern era...
Somehow they *have* to be introducing an extra ammount of lift to negate downforce. How is the million dollar question (literally, I'm sure) as there is a supposed ban on moveable bits. There was an issue of Race Tech (excellent though expensive magazine on how race cars work) that went over CFD in F1. Having read through it a few times, what they can do for Aero with CFD as compared to a wind tunnel is nothing short of ground breaking, and creating a method of variable downforce at different speeds would not supprise me at all.
The only problem is drag makes your car (and airplane) have a lower top speed. The comparison between airplanes and cars isn't exactly direct, as the desired results are not the same.
High speed tracks such as Monza and "old/new" Hockenheim were tracks where you would see the cars flatten their wings in an attempt to increase top end. What this is doing is reducing downforce, which makes the car "weigh" less.
If you increase the angle of attack at high speed, you are generating more downforce, or inversely "lift" with an airplane. Stalling for an airplane only happens at very slow speeds. If you increase your angle of attack with a wing on a plane at "high" speed.... you go up (thankfully :))
In the days of active suspention, much of the downforce was generated from the bottom of the car. As a result, if you increase the ride height, you lost the [b]majority[/b] of your downforce. The rear wing may have had a higher angle of attack, but the downforce generated by this was the [b]much[/b] lesser of the two evils.
Back on topic in the modern era...
Somehow they *have* to be introducing an extra ammount of lift to negate downforce. How is the million dollar question (literally, I'm sure) as there is a supposed ban on moveable bits. There was an issue of Race Tech (excellent though expensive magazine on how race cars work) that went over CFD in F1. Having read through it a few times, what they can do for Aero with CFD as compared to a wind tunnel is nothing short of ground breaking, and creating a method of variable downforce at different speeds would not supprise me at all.
| TimStevens | 06-16-2006 06:46 AM |
What a car "weighs" doesn't really affect how fast it can accelerate. Acceleration is a combination of force and mass, but weight is a combination of weight and gravity. Yes, if you put scales under the cars of an F1 car and weighed it it'd be X and then if you put it in a wind tunnel and weighed it again it'd weigh 3X. However, the mass of the car stays the same, and basically when you're talking about acceleration you're talking about mass and aerodynamic drag as being two penalties. F1 cars can't get rid of mass (unless they're BAR running a trick fuel tank) so the only thing they can do is get rid of drag.
Stalling doesn't necessarily happen at low speed. Dive bombers before WWII hurtling toward the ground stalled out all the time when their pilots tried to pull them level too abruptly. It took awhile before anyone figured out what was going on. Anyhow, a wing that's stalling generates less drag.
Stalling doesn't necessarily happen at low speed. Dive bombers before WWII hurtling toward the ground stalled out all the time when their pilots tried to pull them level too abruptly. It took awhile before anyone figured out what was going on. Anyhow, a wing that's stalling generates less drag.
| JoD | 06-16-2006 08:13 AM |
All this technical stuff... I'm so confused. So - here's an interesting (?) story from F1 racing net... (Why this is a headliner, I don't know... But it made me laugh a bit...)
[B]Doornbos vomit halts Red Bull test[/B]
16 June 2006
Red Bull Racing's two-day test at Monza hit a brief hiccough on the first day as Robert Doornbos ate something that disagreed with him and after a handful of laps the Dutchman had to throw up and throw in the towel. The team continued running just with David Coulthard until Scuderia Toro Rosso's Tonio Liuzzi arrived in late afternoon to stand in for the poorly Doornbos.
The programme was pretty much the same over the two days: given the peculiarities of both the Montreal and Indianapolis tracks with their long fast sections, the team evaluated low drag configuration front and rear wings and various other aerodynamic tweaks, which had produced encouraging data in the wind tunnel.
"Although it is hard to quantify the results of aerodynamic changes, the results seemed good," said chief test engineer, Ian Morgan. "Although we lost time with one car on the first day, when Robert was unwell, this was a useful test. We also worked on tyre choice for Indianapolis and looked at weight distribution as well as trying other chassis
modifications."
:lol: Poor Doornbos. He can't even puke without it being a big headline. Ah... the life of an F1 test driver...
[B]Doornbos vomit halts Red Bull test[/B]
16 June 2006
Red Bull Racing's two-day test at Monza hit a brief hiccough on the first day as Robert Doornbos ate something that disagreed with him and after a handful of laps the Dutchman had to throw up and throw in the towel. The team continued running just with David Coulthard until Scuderia Toro Rosso's Tonio Liuzzi arrived in late afternoon to stand in for the poorly Doornbos.
The programme was pretty much the same over the two days: given the peculiarities of both the Montreal and Indianapolis tracks with their long fast sections, the team evaluated low drag configuration front and rear wings and various other aerodynamic tweaks, which had produced encouraging data in the wind tunnel.
"Although it is hard to quantify the results of aerodynamic changes, the results seemed good," said chief test engineer, Ian Morgan. "Although we lost time with one car on the first day, when Robert was unwell, this was a useful test. We also worked on tyre choice for Indianapolis and looked at weight distribution as well as trying other chassis
modifications."
:lol: Poor Doornbos. He can't even puke without it being a big headline. Ah... the life of an F1 test driver...
| Ferg | 06-16-2006 08:36 AM |
That reminds me of the the time Jenson had a bird slam into his helmet during preseason testing, it might have been his very first season, and when asked how he felt about it all Jenson could say was..
"That's the first time I've been unhappy to have a bird on my face."
Cheeky lad that Jense.
"That's the first time I've been unhappy to have a bird on my face."
Cheeky lad that Jense.
| artkevin | 06-16-2006 09:31 AM |
I hope he didn't throw up in his helmet. That would be horrible because it would get all in your eyes and have no place to go. How would you like to be the mech that had to clean up 200moh vomit streaks?
| Ferg | 06-16-2006 09:52 AM |
I always felt bad for the Ferrari tech that had to clean up after Eddie Irvine, who freely admitted to sometimes relieving his bladder during races.
Icky.
Icky.
| TimStevens | 06-16-2006 10:00 AM |
I think most do it, but few admit it.
| meebs | 06-16-2006 12:52 PM |
When you gotta go, you gotta go!
| artkevin | 06-16-2006 01:05 PM |
#1 or #2?
Big difference.
Big difference.
| NYEJ25 | 06-16-2006 04:20 PM |
I just got my confirmation email from my hotel telling me about attractions for grand prix weekend in Montreal. I'm so excited!!!! I can't wait. I am bring my laptop so I will be able to give you guys updates of anything I happen to see around the track. I'm leaving Wednesday! Can't freakin wait.
I know you probably don't care, but I had to tell someone.
I know you probably don't care, but I had to tell someone.
| KAX | 06-16-2006 04:33 PM |
[QUOTE=NYEJ25]I just got my confirmation email from my hotel telling me about attractions for grand prix weekend in Montreal. I'm so excited!!!! I can't wait. I am bring my laptop so I will be able to give you guys updates of anything I happen to see around the track. I'm leaving Wednesday! Can't freakin wait.
I know you probably don't care, but I had to tell someone.[/QUOTE]
im excited for you. wish i had the money to go.
I know you probably don't care, but I had to tell someone.[/QUOTE]
im excited for you. wish i had the money to go.
| StuBeck | 06-16-2006 05:16 PM |
In one of Matchett's books he talks about how one of their drivers would also fart when the mechanic was working on the shock setting in the cockpit (guy had to put his entire head in the cockpit.) I know in NASCAR because it's so long the drivers just go, but its one of those things that better water control is needed at that point so you don't overhydrate. Breaking your bladder is a bad thing.
| artkevin | 06-16-2006 08:05 PM |
[QUOTE=KAX]im excited for you. wish i had the money to go.[/QUOTE]
I 2nd that. I am going to Indy but I love the Canadian track ten times more then the Indy. I will take what I can get. If they weren't back to back I would try to do both.
I 2nd that. I am going to Indy but I love the Canadian track ten times more then the Indy. I will take what I can get. If they weren't back to back I would try to do both.
| f1vlad | 06-16-2006 10:21 PM |
I am goin to Indy too, can't wait :) I've been waiting for a year!
| StuBeck | 06-16-2006 10:54 PM |
Montreal is so expensive though, that's my main problem. Its 60 bucks for awesome general admision tickets for the entire weekend at Indy, but its more than that for Montreal and you basically don't get to watch the race and can't walk around at all to watch other parts of the track. I like the track but its become one of the many ones which there is just no passing at, which sucks.
| grandpa rex | 06-17-2006 06:52 AM |
Hey Artkevin. Will you be set up at the Hyatt on Thursday afternoon in Indy?
| artkevin | 06-17-2006 02:58 PM |
Yup, here is an invite that you might see around the city during the race weekend. Stop by if you can, its free and I will be there Friday from 4-6 and Sunday from 5-7 and any other time I can too.
[IMG]http://kevinpaigeart.com/images/hyatt.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://kevinpaigeart.com/images/hyatt.jpg[/IMG]
| TimStevens | 06-17-2006 03:44 PM |
Congrats again man, that's great, and drat again I won't be able to make it. :mad:
Any sneak-previews of what'll be on display?
Any sneak-previews of what'll be on display?
| GotWRX03 | 06-17-2006 04:00 PM |
very nice work, artkevin. kudos!
| artkevin | 06-17-2006 04:22 PM |
Thanks guys,
Heres a preview of some of my favs from this 06 crop. There are a couple of more that need to be posted but this is what I have for now.
[IMG]http://kevinpaigeart.com/images/motorsports/2006/full/Reds-36x36.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://kevinpaigeart.com/images/motorsports/2006/full/Throwback-24x36.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://kevinpaigeart.com/images/motorsports/2006/full/Voodoo-15x30.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://kevinpaigeart.com/images/motorsports/2006/full/Burden-48x30.jpg[/IMG]
Heres a preview of some of my favs from this 06 crop. There are a couple of more that need to be posted but this is what I have for now.
[IMG]http://kevinpaigeart.com/images/motorsports/2006/full/Reds-36x36.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://kevinpaigeart.com/images/motorsports/2006/full/Throwback-24x36.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://kevinpaigeart.com/images/motorsports/2006/full/Voodoo-15x30.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://kevinpaigeart.com/images/motorsports/2006/full/Burden-48x30.jpg[/IMG]
| StuBeck | 06-18-2006 01:26 PM |
Those are really nice!
Quick question on people's USGP tickets, what do the ticket numbers say on the order form? My number is 11994, I hope that doesn't mean only 12k people have bought tickets so far.
Quick question on people's USGP tickets, what do the ticket numbers say on the order form? My number is 11994, I hope that doesn't mean only 12k people have bought tickets so far.
| TimStevens | 06-18-2006 02:37 PM |
Well, Michelin did buy half, so that's still a lot of tickets.
| ptclaus98 | 06-18-2006 03:41 PM |
[QUOTE=artkevin]Thanks guys,
Heres a preview of some of my favs from this 06 crop. There are a couple of more that need to be posted but this is what I have for now.
[IMG]http://kevinpaigeart.com/images/motorsports/2006/full/Reds-36x36.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://kevinpaigeart.com/images/motorsports/2006/full/Throwback-24x36.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://kevinpaigeart.com/images/motorsports/2006/full/Voodoo-15x30.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://kevinpaigeart.com/images/motorsports/2006/full/Burden-48x30.jpg[/IMG][/QUOTE]
That's insane! :eek:
Heres a preview of some of my favs from this 06 crop. There are a couple of more that need to be posted but this is what I have for now.
[IMG]http://kevinpaigeart.com/images/motorsports/2006/full/Reds-36x36.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://kevinpaigeart.com/images/motorsports/2006/full/Throwback-24x36.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://kevinpaigeart.com/images/motorsports/2006/full/Voodoo-15x30.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://kevinpaigeart.com/images/motorsports/2006/full/Burden-48x30.jpg[/IMG][/QUOTE]
That's insane! :eek:
| artkevin | 06-18-2006 03:46 PM |
Thanks ptclaus98. I work really hard at it so it's good to hear that people like to look at them. :D
| ptclaus98 | 06-18-2006 05:19 PM |
[QUOTE=artkevin]Thanks ptclaus98. I work really hard at it so it's good to hear that people like to look at them. :D[/QUOTE]
I thought the first one was an F1 car at first. Then I was watching Champ Car and it hit me.
How long have you been doing this? This is really cool.
How 'bout one of Kimi. Preferably his pass at Suzuka. :devil: :lol:
I thought the first one was an F1 car at first. Then I was watching Champ Car and it hit me.
How long have you been doing this? This is really cool.
How 'bout one of Kimi. Preferably his pass at Suzuka. :devil: :lol:
| JoD | 06-18-2006 05:59 PM |
[QUOTE=ptclaus98]I thought the first one was an F1 car at first. Then I was watching Champ Car and it hit me.
How long have you been doing this? This is really cool.
How 'bout one of Kimi. Preferably his pass at Suzuka. :devil: :lol:[/QUOTE]
Heh - I have one oil of Kimi that Kevin has done for me and three watercolors. With his permission, I'll do some posting later....
None of mine are from the pass at Suzuka (which made me cry, btw, and later spawned the Kimi helmet tattoo decision). That event is definitely on the list of "things I plan to ask Kevin to paint in my mansion after I win the lottery and buy an SLR." :banana:
How long have you been doing this? This is really cool.
How 'bout one of Kimi. Preferably his pass at Suzuka. :devil: :lol:[/QUOTE]
Heh - I have one oil of Kimi that Kevin has done for me and three watercolors. With his permission, I'll do some posting later....
None of mine are from the pass at Suzuka (which made me cry, btw, and later spawned the Kimi helmet tattoo decision). That event is definitely on the list of "things I plan to ask Kevin to paint in my mansion after I win the lottery and buy an SLR." :banana:
| JoD | 06-18-2006 06:48 PM |
"Crown" -
[IMG]http://myspace-947.vo.llnwd.net/00483/74/93/483623947_l.jpg[/IMG]
Watercolor 1
[IMG]http://myspace-500.vo.llnwd.net/00483/00/57/483647500_l.jpg[/IMG]
Watercolor 2
[IMG]http://myspace-035.vo.llnwd.net/00483/53/01/483661035_l.jpg[/IMG]
Thanks Kevin. :)
[IMG]http://myspace-947.vo.llnwd.net/00483/74/93/483623947_l.jpg[/IMG]
Watercolor 1
[IMG]http://myspace-500.vo.llnwd.net/00483/00/57/483647500_l.jpg[/IMG]
Watercolor 2
[IMG]http://myspace-035.vo.llnwd.net/00483/53/01/483661035_l.jpg[/IMG]
Thanks Kevin. :)
| StuBeck | 06-18-2006 06:55 PM |
[QUOTE=TimStevens]Well, Michelin did buy half, so that's still a lot of tickets.[/QUOTE]
Not really, Michelin only bought 10k, so if thats true only 2k people are going. I hope I'm just looking too much into this though.
Not really, Michelin only bought 10k, so if thats true only 2k people are going. I hope I'm just looking too much into this though.
| ptclaus98 | 06-18-2006 08:33 PM |
[QUOTE=JoD]"Crown" -
[IMG]http://myspace-947.vo.llnwd.net/00483/74/93/483623947_l.jpg[/IMG]
Watercolor 1
[IMG]http://myspace-500.vo.llnwd.net/00483/00/57/483647500_l.jpg[/IMG]
Watercolor 2
[IMG]http://myspace-035.vo.llnwd.net/00483/53/01/483661035_l.jpg[/IMG]
Thanks Kevin. :)[/QUOTE]
Sweet pics! If you ever make one of "The Pass" let me know.
But please don't make one of any of Kimi's failures.
[IMG]http://myspace-947.vo.llnwd.net/00483/74/93/483623947_l.jpg[/IMG]
Watercolor 1
[IMG]http://myspace-500.vo.llnwd.net/00483/00/57/483647500_l.jpg[/IMG]
Watercolor 2
[IMG]http://myspace-035.vo.llnwd.net/00483/53/01/483661035_l.jpg[/IMG]
Thanks Kevin. :)[/QUOTE]
Sweet pics! If you ever make one of "The Pass" let me know.
But please don't make one of any of Kimi's failures.
| JoD | 06-18-2006 09:01 PM |
[QUOTE=ptclaus98]Sweet pics! If you ever make one of "The Pass" let me know.
But please don't make one of any of Kimi's failures.[/QUOTE]
Yeah - Kevin does great work. Don't worry -I feel no need to commemorate any of those Kimi moments I'd rather forget...
But please don't make one of any of Kimi's failures.[/QUOTE]
Yeah - Kevin does great work. Don't worry -I feel no need to commemorate any of those Kimi moments I'd rather forget...
| artkevin | 06-18-2006 10:41 PM |
I usually don't do "moments in time". I try to stick to static emotional works but I might give "the pass" a shot. But if I do I might have to the "the pass part 1" when Alonso took Schumi on the outside of 130R.
| KAX | 06-19-2006 01:45 AM |
[QUOTE=artkevin]I usually don't do "moments in time". I try to stick to static emotional works but I might give "the pass" a shot. But if I do I might have to the "the pass part 1" when Alonso took Schumi on the outside of 130R.[/QUOTE]
that pales in comparison to kimi's! :p :banana:
that pales in comparison to kimi's! :p :banana:
| REX8 | 06-19-2006 09:40 AM |
Opinions:
Will JPM even have an F1 seat next year? There are rumors he made an emergency call to Chip G. for a seat here in the states next year.
Its kinda hard to swallow that no one would give him a seat...
Will JPM even have an F1 seat next year? There are rumors he made an emergency call to Chip G. for a seat here in the states next year.
Its kinda hard to swallow that no one would give him a seat...
| artkevin | 06-19-2006 10:29 AM |
I can't believe that one of the top 6 drivers in F1 could not find a drive. There will be something that comes up IMO. It strange becuase he is my favortite driver but I am actually hoping that L. Hamilton gets his seat. I feel torn. :(
| NYEJ25 | 06-19-2006 10:37 AM |
Hey Kevin. How much does your work sell for? I really like the one you posted of Rossi and was wondering the price. Please let me know. You can PM me if you don't want to post it here. Your work is incredible. Keep it up.
| MattDell | 06-19-2006 10:56 AM |
[QUOTE=KAX]Yeh, i think Speed is a good plug for advertising in america and brings Red Bull and Toro Rosso good support (just look at the first few races and see how many people rooted for speed). They shouldnt get rid of him after one poor season. But hell have to really show next season or he might not get another ride at all.[/QUOTE]
I really don't think Speed has had a poor season at all. He's finished 5/8 races with an average finish of 14th. Every time he has finished a race, he has gained position in the field. I believe that he is just in a slower car than the rest of the pack.
Look: [url]http://www.mattdell.com/PHP/formula1/drivers.php?DriverId=21[/url]
Vitantonio Liuzzi doesn't do much better, in fact Speed is sometimes quicker than he.
Also, look at Nico Rosberg. He's in a much better car, and he only averages 13th place. He had a great race at Bahrain, but not much after that.
Look: [url]http://www.mattdell.com/PHP/formula1/drivers.php?DriverId=10[/url]
-Matt
I really don't think Speed has had a poor season at all. He's finished 5/8 races with an average finish of 14th. Every time he has finished a race, he has gained position in the field. I believe that he is just in a slower car than the rest of the pack.
Look: [url]http://www.mattdell.com/PHP/formula1/drivers.php?DriverId=21[/url]
Vitantonio Liuzzi doesn't do much better, in fact Speed is sometimes quicker than he.
Also, look at Nico Rosberg. He's in a much better car, and he only averages 13th place. He had a great race at Bahrain, but not much after that.
Look: [url]http://www.mattdell.com/PHP/formula1/drivers.php?DriverId=10[/url]
-Matt
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