| Dussander | 12-17-2003 11:33 AM |
I hate F1 Decade,
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I love watching the races, but it reminds me of the impending doom just around the corner in the shows. I hope they play some sort of Senna tribute movie when we get to that time. Each episode, I'm reminded how we are getting closer to that dreadful day. It's really weird too because we know it is coming, but the world at that time, could not. :(
-- F1 Decade 93 Suzuka spoilers to follow!
Senna owned at Suzuka in 93. I think I made that race better for myself by misreading my TiVo description of the race. I *thought* it said, "Mikka Hakkinon wins his first Grand Prix." So I watched the whole episode waiting for the impending problem for Senna. It actually said, "Mikka Hakkinon wins his first podium." But they probably spelled his name correctly. ;)
-- F1 Decade 93 Suzuka spoilers to follow!
Senna owned at Suzuka in 93. I think I made that race better for myself by misreading my TiVo description of the race. I *thought* it said, "Mikka Hakkinon wins his first Grand Prix." So I watched the whole episode waiting for the impending problem for Senna. It actually said, "Mikka Hakkinon wins his first podium." But they probably spelled his name correctly. ;)
| artkevin | 12-17-2003 01:05 PM |
Do you think that they'll play the Senna tribute at the end of the 94 decade series if there is one or after the Monza race? Or will they even show the Monza race? If I recall, didn't 2 people die that weekend, Senna on race day and someone else during qualifing? Damn, now I am sad too.
| Dr. WOT | 12-17-2003 01:24 PM |
It was at Imola. Roland Ratzenberg died in practice, and Rubins Barrichello nearly died in qualifying but was resuscitated trackside. If that isn't bad enough there was also a huge crash at the start which sent debris into the main grandstand and injured several spectators. Worst GP weekend ever.
Worth noting is the next F1 Decade (Adelaide 93) is Senna's last win. Also the last race before the electronic driver aids were banned (well, temporally at least). Certainly the end of an era as Varsha eluded to at the end of the Suzuka show.
Hakkinen's first win was Australia 98, which was controversial because Colthard was leading but moved over and let him past. Mika cried tears of joy on the podium while the crowd booed the result. Not a fitting first win for such a great driver.
Worth noting is the next F1 Decade (Adelaide 93) is Senna's last win. Also the last race before the electronic driver aids were banned (well, temporally at least). Certainly the end of an era as Varsha eluded to at the end of the Suzuka show.
Hakkinen's first win was Australia 98, which was controversial because Colthard was leading but moved over and let him past. Mika cried tears of joy on the podium while the crowd booed the result. Not a fitting first win for such a great driver.
| gtguy | 12-17-2003 01:40 PM |
I still have that fateful race on tape, and it still freaks me out to watch it.
Kevin
Kevin
| skuttledude | 12-17-2003 02:02 PM |
I totally agree. Every race they show gets more and more closer to THE tragic race of Senna (my F1 hero of all time).
Any tribute they show is going to be full of tears.
Truly,
Davis
Any tribute they show is going to be full of tears.
Truly,
Davis
| TimStevens | 12-17-2003 02:52 PM |
I'm curious as to what they'll do for that race next season too. I'm sure it'll be difficult for them to rebroadcast something as tragic as that, but on the other hand it would be wrong to simply skip that race.
Big Senna fan here too :(
Big Senna fan here too :(
| Dussander | 12-17-2003 03:08 PM |
Doh, Dr. WOT spoiled the next F1 Decade race for me. ;)
I'm pretty much a F1 noob, but I REALLY loved the 2003 season. I just had to go to Indy this year and I'm already planning on how I can go in 2004.
I'm pretty much a F1 noob, but I REALLY loved the 2003 season. I just had to go to Indy this year and I'm already planning on how I can go in 2004.
| Dr. WOT | 12-17-2003 03:36 PM |
lol Dussander... I should have put a spoiler warning on that!!
The thing that really strikes me when I watch those old races is how beautiful those cars were-- low noses, wide tires, slicks, no stupid "T" bar on the airbox. Todays cars are more radical and I appreciate how far they've come, but they're ugly compared to the older ones. In fact I'm going to hunt down a miniature of the 93 McLaren
The thing that really strikes me when I watch those old races is how beautiful those cars were-- low noses, wide tires, slicks, no stupid "T" bar on the airbox. Todays cars are more radical and I appreciate how far they've come, but they're ugly compared to the older ones. In fact I'm going to hunt down a miniature of the 93 McLaren
| ElGranBan� | 12-17-2003 05:08 PM |
Mmmm, miniature 93 McLaren (gomp gomp). I _think_ thats the MP4 8. Anyway, Minichamps makes very nice little cars. I encourage everyone to begin collecting! :banana:
| 944 turbo guy | 12-17-2003 05:10 PM |
Senna.......
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I agree with you guys ,.I only watched it twice. I Felt so strongly about this subject and Senna that I named by son's middle name Senna. He is almost 4 and getting his first Go-kart this x-mas. He now knows who he was named after and wants to see as much Senna file stuff as possible. I found old file photo's of him 'go-karting in Brazil, and it made my son just go off,..I have never seen anything like it. So when this decade series started,..his mom would call me(were not together) and say,."hey your son ONLY watches Speed !!!
He is soooo into what he see's daddy doing and that inspires me as well on the racetrack.
So I have a different reason for watching Decade,....
944 turbo guy
ps. he goes to a small track here in maryland,..4 dollars for 3 minutes,..he races against 8-10 other 5-8 year old kids. He shuffle steers and looks where he wants to go, and looks through people when he is about to pass. Once he won his 5th race I gave him a black fleece jacket with the "Senna " patch on it,..and that meant the world to him.
Remember Senna is with us all,.and his spirit lives in all of us.
Myles.
He is soooo into what he see's daddy doing and that inspires me as well on the racetrack.
So I have a different reason for watching Decade,....
944 turbo guy
ps. he goes to a small track here in maryland,..4 dollars for 3 minutes,..he races against 8-10 other 5-8 year old kids. He shuffle steers and looks where he wants to go, and looks through people when he is about to pass. Once he won his 5th race I gave him a black fleece jacket with the "Senna " patch on it,..and that meant the world to him.
Remember Senna is with us all,.and his spirit lives in all of us.
Myles.
| Dussander | 12-17-2003 06:02 PM |
The downside of 93 tech seems to be how much oil those cars spewed.
The shots of the active spension traveling over everything are amazing.
The shots of the active spension traveling over everything are amazing.
| artkevin | 12-17-2003 06:06 PM |
I agree with you Dr. Wot about the older cars being attractive but I have to disagree with your take on the current gen. I am an artist that paints/draws motorsports and I have so say that the new shapes are great. A23 (last Arrows) with the high nose is lovely. The F2002 with the "coke bottle" rear end.... FW25 with the swept nose and the MP4-19 is all sorts of good stuff.
| esteve | 12-17-2003 11:03 PM |
After Senna died, I lost interest in F1. To me, he was the best and fastest driver. His death robbed us of the greatest rivalry to be in F1 that never was...Senna vs Schumacher.
I still remember clearly watching Senna hold off Mansell in pouring rain for several laps while on slicks with Mansell on rain tires...just unreal!!
I still remember clearly watching Senna hold off Mansell in pouring rain for several laps while on slicks with Mansell on rain tires...just unreal!!
| TimStevens | 12-18-2003 07:56 AM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by esteve[/i]
[B] After Senna died, I lost interest in F1. To me, he was the best and fastest driver. His death robbed us of the greatest rivalry to be in F1 that never was...Senna vs Schumacher. [/B][/QUOTE]
Well, then you missed Schumacher vs. Hakkinen, Schumacher vs. Villeneuve, and a number of other great rivalries. And, if you don't start watching soon, you'll be sure to miss another: Montoya vs. Raikonnen. ;)
[B] After Senna died, I lost interest in F1. To me, he was the best and fastest driver. His death robbed us of the greatest rivalry to be in F1 that never was...Senna vs Schumacher. [/B][/QUOTE]
Well, then you missed Schumacher vs. Hakkinen, Schumacher vs. Villeneuve, and a number of other great rivalries. And, if you don't start watching soon, you'll be sure to miss another: Montoya vs. Raikonnen. ;)
| skuttledude | 12-18-2003 09:17 AM |
Re: Senna.......
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[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by 944 turbo guy [/i]
[B]I agree with you guys ,.I only watched it twice. I Felt so strongly about this subject and Senna that I named by son's middle name Senna. He is almost 4 and getting his first Go-kart this x-mas. He now knows who he was named after and wants to see as much Senna file stuff as possible. I found old file photo's of him 'go-karting in Brazil, and it made my son just go off,..I have never seen anything like it. So when this decade series started,..his mom would call me(were not together) and say,."hey your son ONLY watches Speed !!!
He is soooo into what he see's daddy doing and that inspires me as well on the racetrack.
So I have a different reason for watching Decade,....
944 turbo guy
ps. he goes to a small track here in maryland,..4 dollars for 3 minutes,..he races against 8-10 other 5-8 year old kids. He shuffle steers and looks where he wants to go, and looks through people when he is about to pass. Once he won his 5th race I gave him a black fleece jacket with the "Senna " patch on it,..and that meant the world to him.
Remember Senna is with us all,.and his spirit lives in all of us.
Myles. [/B][/QUOTE]
That's awesome!
Davis
[B]I agree with you guys ,.I only watched it twice. I Felt so strongly about this subject and Senna that I named by son's middle name Senna. He is almost 4 and getting his first Go-kart this x-mas. He now knows who he was named after and wants to see as much Senna file stuff as possible. I found old file photo's of him 'go-karting in Brazil, and it made my son just go off,..I have never seen anything like it. So when this decade series started,..his mom would call me(were not together) and say,."hey your son ONLY watches Speed !!!
He is soooo into what he see's daddy doing and that inspires me as well on the racetrack.
So I have a different reason for watching Decade,....
944 turbo guy
ps. he goes to a small track here in maryland,..4 dollars for 3 minutes,..he races against 8-10 other 5-8 year old kids. He shuffle steers and looks where he wants to go, and looks through people when he is about to pass. Once he won his 5th race I gave him a black fleece jacket with the "Senna " patch on it,..and that meant the world to him.
Remember Senna is with us all,.and his spirit lives in all of us.
Myles. [/B][/QUOTE]
That's awesome!
Davis
| grandpa rex | 12-18-2003 10:02 AM |
I had only been an F1 fan for a few years when Senna died. What I regret the most is the titanic battles we would have seen between him and MS.
I have desktop PC and a laptop. Wallpapers have always been photos of Senna.
This pic is my daily tribute:
I have desktop PC and a laptop. Wallpapers have always been photos of Senna.
This pic is my daily tribute:
| 944 turbo guy | 12-18-2003 10:51 AM |
Senna..
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When Senna died I was @ Watkins Glen with Porsche Club,.my girlfriend at the time,called me on my big 3lb cell phone, and said,..have you driven already,..I said,.no,.why,..........
she said,.......Senna died at Imola today,.................................
............
seemed like everything went black and white i got light headed,.and all I could think about was,..all the Senna-Prost battles that I had watched at like 0700 am and my ex-wife was bitchin about the tv cranked up at the start of the race..........
alot of things went through my mind,.........it was a gloomy day,...
I later drove that day,.and my lap time dropped from a 2:11 down to a 2:09,......all emotion !!! caution was thrown to the wind and the very core of what makes racers race was in its purest form that day.
Schumacher is great,.but he's a different kinda' legend,..Senna you knew drove from the heart and with a huge amount of emotion,..all you have to do is read some of the books,.and his book to know his thoughT processes.
When I race I have three things on my dash,.smal picture of Willy T. Ribbs ansd myself,..picture of Senna, and a picture of my son. Total motivation,.........it puts me in that zone ,.like the "Last Samurai" stuff,....ya know what I mean?....
Long live Senna !!
944 turbo guy
she said,.......Senna died at Imola today,.................................
............
seemed like everything went black and white i got light headed,.and all I could think about was,..all the Senna-Prost battles that I had watched at like 0700 am and my ex-wife was bitchin about the tv cranked up at the start of the race..........
alot of things went through my mind,.........it was a gloomy day,...
I later drove that day,.and my lap time dropped from a 2:11 down to a 2:09,......all emotion !!! caution was thrown to the wind and the very core of what makes racers race was in its purest form that day.
Schumacher is great,.but he's a different kinda' legend,..Senna you knew drove from the heart and with a huge amount of emotion,..all you have to do is read some of the books,.and his book to know his thoughT processes.
When I race I have three things on my dash,.smal picture of Willy T. Ribbs ansd myself,..picture of Senna, and a picture of my son. Total motivation,.........it puts me in that zone ,.like the "Last Samurai" stuff,....ya know what I mean?....
Long live Senna !!
944 turbo guy
| artkevin | 12-18-2003 11:27 AM |
I did not start watching racing until the late 90's but I love going back and finding as much footage of the vintage stuff that I can. 2 people I wish I could have seen in all of sports that I missed are Jim Brown and Senna. I am so happy the are showing F1 decade.
| grandpa rex | 12-18-2003 01:47 PM |
my PC and laptop wallpaper:
| Cigar2 | 12-18-2003 02:38 PM |
Yep, That whole weekend was a black one indeed.:(
I remember watching that race live on tv (ESPN 2 can't remember when ESPN switched their coverage to the Deuce) and the over head coverage of the helicopter and tarck saftey people swarming over Senna.
And Senna slumped over in the cockpit of his car with some slight body movement of Senna.
Which led me to think he would be okay. But in the end it not turning out that way. Senna had gotten off to his typical fast start and then thing's going all wrong.
Heck that whole month was a bad one adding with a death of a driver at Indy that week or the next.
The only thing that comes close for me at least is the death of Greg Moore at Fontucky.
Ugly times all around. With the taking of a one legend and geat champion and the taking of a future champion/legend in the making.
I'm hoping too hoping Speed does something special in marking the ten anniversary of Senna's death.
And knowing that if this was still Speedvision and not Speed they would certainly be doing something special and not have to worry about it.
Also I don't know if anyone else has pick up on the underlining feeling's I'm getting from David, Steve, Bob in their mood's during these boardcasts has the boardcast draws nearer.
About the whole rotten thing all three of them giving off a somber mood has this season carry's on being aired on Speed.
When talking and remembering Senna and how great he really was and is.
I remember watching that race live on tv (ESPN 2 can't remember when ESPN switched their coverage to the Deuce) and the over head coverage of the helicopter and tarck saftey people swarming over Senna.
And Senna slumped over in the cockpit of his car with some slight body movement of Senna.
Which led me to think he would be okay. But in the end it not turning out that way. Senna had gotten off to his typical fast start and then thing's going all wrong.
Heck that whole month was a bad one adding with a death of a driver at Indy that week or the next.
The only thing that comes close for me at least is the death of Greg Moore at Fontucky.
Ugly times all around. With the taking of a one legend and geat champion and the taking of a future champion/legend in the making.
I'm hoping too hoping Speed does something special in marking the ten anniversary of Senna's death.
And knowing that if this was still Speedvision and not Speed they would certainly be doing something special and not have to worry about it.
Also I don't know if anyone else has pick up on the underlining feeling's I'm getting from David, Steve, Bob in their mood's during these boardcasts has the boardcast draws nearer.
About the whole rotten thing all three of them giving off a somber mood has this season carry's on being aired on Speed.
When talking and remembering Senna and how great he really was and is.
| AlanO | 12-18-2003 04:08 PM |
I had been a Senna fan since I was a young child. At the age of 6, I cheered for Senna because I liked his yellow helmet. Later I grew to admire the awesome skill he displayed behind the wheel and the obvious passion he had for the sport.
I had only started to regularly watch F1 late in the 1993 season. I was looking forward to a Senna championship in 1994 - at the time, few thought that anyone could pose a serious threat to him. Some were predicting that he would win every race that year. Not many thought that Williams would produce a poor package and that Schumacher would really pose a serious challenge at such a young age, but both occurred, and for me it was disappointing to see Senna struggle so badly during the first two races. Imola looked like it might be a turnaround, but as we all know, it was one of the most horrific weekends in Grand Prix history.
At the age of 11, I watched my hero die live on television.
I still have a copy of this race in the back of the video cupboard, where it will always remain and will never be seen again. I can't bear to watch it.
Many thanks to Speed for showing the F1 Decade, hopefully it will continue in the future.
I had only started to regularly watch F1 late in the 1993 season. I was looking forward to a Senna championship in 1994 - at the time, few thought that anyone could pose a serious threat to him. Some were predicting that he would win every race that year. Not many thought that Williams would produce a poor package and that Schumacher would really pose a serious challenge at such a young age, but both occurred, and for me it was disappointing to see Senna struggle so badly during the first two races. Imola looked like it might be a turnaround, but as we all know, it was one of the most horrific weekends in Grand Prix history.
At the age of 11, I watched my hero die live on television.
I still have a copy of this race in the back of the video cupboard, where it will always remain and will never be seen again. I can't bear to watch it.
Many thanks to Speed for showing the F1 Decade, hopefully it will continue in the future.
| esteve | 12-18-2003 09:42 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by TimStevens [/i]
[B]Well, then you missed Schumacher vs. Hakkinen, Schumacher vs. Villeneuve, and a number of other great rivalries. And, if you don't start watching soon, you'll be sure to miss another: Montoya vs. Raikonnen. ;) [/B][/QUOTE]
All world-class F1 racers but Senna vs. Schumacher would've been a rivalry of a totally different caliber.
[B]Well, then you missed Schumacher vs. Hakkinen, Schumacher vs. Villeneuve, and a number of other great rivalries. And, if you don't start watching soon, you'll be sure to miss another: Montoya vs. Raikonnen. ;) [/B][/QUOTE]
All world-class F1 racers but Senna vs. Schumacher would've been a rivalry of a totally different caliber.
| OnTheGas | 12-19-2003 03:35 AM |
Re: Hakkinen's 1st Win
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[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Dr. WOT [/i]
[B]Hakkinen's first win was Australia 98, which was controversial because Colthard was leading but moved over and let him past. Mika cried tears of joy on the podium while the crowd booed the result. Not a fitting first win for such a great driver. [/B][/QUOTE] Hakkinen's 1st win was the '97 European GP @ Jerez.
Oz '98 was Hakkinen's second F1 win. Mika was leading the race from the green lights, but McLaren's engineers made a mistake, and accidently called in Mika for an extra pitstop. Realizing the error, Mika drove straight thru the pits, but the time lost was enough for DC to pass for the lead.
That is when the "first corner agreement" of the two came to effect. Mika and David had agreed before the race that if the team would dominate the race, the one who got out of the first corner in front would win the race. As Mika exited the first chicane first he had the agreement on his side and the Scot let him past before the finish.
Mika was clearly faster on the weekend, during the race, (and during his whole career for that matter!), so it only seemed fair, and very sporting, for David to let Mika by for the win.
[B]Hakkinen's first win was Australia 98, which was controversial because Colthard was leading but moved over and let him past. Mika cried tears of joy on the podium while the crowd booed the result. Not a fitting first win for such a great driver. [/B][/QUOTE] Hakkinen's 1st win was the '97 European GP @ Jerez.
Oz '98 was Hakkinen's second F1 win. Mika was leading the race from the green lights, but McLaren's engineers made a mistake, and accidently called in Mika for an extra pitstop. Realizing the error, Mika drove straight thru the pits, but the time lost was enough for DC to pass for the lead.
That is when the "first corner agreement" of the two came to effect. Mika and David had agreed before the race that if the team would dominate the race, the one who got out of the first corner in front would win the race. As Mika exited the first chicane first he had the agreement on his side and the Scot let him past before the finish.
Mika was clearly faster on the weekend, during the race, (and during his whole career for that matter!), so it only seemed fair, and very sporting, for David to let Mika by for the win.
| TimStevens | 12-19-2003 07:54 AM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by esteve[/i]
[B] All world-class F1 racers but Senna vs. Schumacher would've been a rivalry of a totally different caliber. [/B][/QUOTE]
I dunno... Schumacher was always too dirty for me. Eventually it would have turned into Schumacher trying to run Senna off the road, as he did with Hill and Villeneuve.
I wish they'd go back to the late 80's and play more of the Prost vs. Senna stuff.
[B] All world-class F1 racers but Senna vs. Schumacher would've been a rivalry of a totally different caliber. [/B][/QUOTE]
I dunno... Schumacher was always too dirty for me. Eventually it would have turned into Schumacher trying to run Senna off the road, as he did with Hill and Villeneuve.
I wish they'd go back to the late 80's and play more of the Prost vs. Senna stuff.
| Dr. WOT | 12-19-2003 08:10 AM |
OnTheGas, you are so right, how could I forget Jerez 97? (Although that race is memorable for reasons other than won one it.) I know the story of the gentleman's agreement, and was careful to not say DC was forced to move over.
On that note, the Senna - Prost rivalry ignited over a similar agreement, ironically at Imola in 1988. They had a existing first corner agreement, but this race was red flagged a few laps in. Prost got to the corner first on the initial start, so the second time around he assumed Senna regarded the lead as his, while Senna took the second start as a blank slate and went for it. Prost left the line carefully and deliberately while Ayrton went for it and took the lead. Senna went on to win and Prost was furious. This disagreement caused the underlying tensions of teammates to boil over and led to a battle which raged for several seasons, sometimes producing very ugly results.
On that note, the Senna - Prost rivalry ignited over a similar agreement, ironically at Imola in 1988. They had a existing first corner agreement, but this race was red flagged a few laps in. Prost got to the corner first on the initial start, so the second time around he assumed Senna regarded the lead as his, while Senna took the second start as a blank slate and went for it. Prost left the line carefully and deliberately while Ayrton went for it and took the lead. Senna went on to win and Prost was furious. This disagreement caused the underlying tensions of teammates to boil over and led to a battle which raged for several seasons, sometimes producing very ugly results.
| Ryouga | 12-21-2003 11:31 AM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by TimStevens [/i]
[B]I dunno... Schumacher was always too dirty for me. Eventually it would have turned into Schumacher trying to run Senna off the road, as he did with Hill and Villeneuve.
I wish they'd go back to the late 80's and play more of the Prost vs. Senna stuff.[/B][/QUOTE]
Ummm, didn't Senna also run Prost off the road during the height of their battles for the championship? :)
[B]I dunno... Schumacher was always too dirty for me. Eventually it would have turned into Schumacher trying to run Senna off the road, as he did with Hill and Villeneuve.
I wish they'd go back to the late 80's and play more of the Prost vs. Senna stuff.[/B][/QUOTE]
Ummm, didn't Senna also run Prost off the road during the height of their battles for the championship? :)
| StuBeck | 12-21-2003 12:35 PM |
Ehh, that's taken out of context a bit, he ran him off the road because of what happened the year before when Senna was disquaified from Suzuka for a BS rulling with Prost.
| esteve | 12-21-2003 01:01 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by StuBeck [/i]
[B]Ehh, that's taken out of context a bit, he ran him off the road because of what happened the year before when Senna was disquaified from Suzuka for a BS rulling with Prost. [/B][/QUOTE]
So that justifies running someone off the road??:lol:
Senna was somewhat of a dirty racer himself, but Schumacher takes the cake. Schumacher may have the stats, but Senna was at least his equal.
[B]Ehh, that's taken out of context a bit, he ran him off the road because of what happened the year before when Senna was disquaified from Suzuka for a BS rulling with Prost. [/B][/QUOTE]
So that justifies running someone off the road??:lol:
Senna was somewhat of a dirty racer himself, but Schumacher takes the cake. Schumacher may have the stats, but Senna was at least his equal.
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