| sajohnson | 10-20-2002 03:05 AM |
Best Replacement for Stock Headlamps?
Searched but came up empty.
So far I've determined that GE 9007HO's are brighter and whiter than the stock Syvania's.
The 9007HO specs are as follows:
15.6 Mcd/ square meter
1,040 Avg. Lumens
3,220 degrees Kelvin (color temp.)
I like the stock headlight assembly, it seems to throw a good light pattern, I am just looking for the best 9007 lamp. Any suggestions?
So far I've determined that GE 9007HO's are brighter and whiter than the stock Syvania's.
The 9007HO specs are as follows:
15.6 Mcd/ square meter
1,040 Avg. Lumens
3,220 degrees Kelvin (color temp.)
I like the stock headlight assembly, it seems to throw a good light pattern, I am just looking for the best 9007 lamp. Any suggestions?
| ScoobyBoy | 10-20-2002 04:29 AM |
yup i agree with HID's.
i want to grab a pair too, but im trying to decide whether or not i want the jdm projectors or the hids. either way itll take me awhile to save up for either one.
:D
i want to grab a pair too, but im trying to decide whether or not i want the jdm projectors or the hids. either way itll take me awhile to save up for either one.
:D
| sajohnson | 10-20-2002 02:57 PM |
HID's vs. 9007's
There is no question that HID's are superior to _any_ 9007-type lamp, whether it uses hologen, zenon or whatever.
My question is, for those of us who aren't ready to convert to HID yet, what is a good 9007-type lamp to use in the meantime?
I know most of the poseur HID "look" 9007 lamps are lame. GE's own literature shows that while the avg. lumens (1,345) and candlepower (107) are equal on highbeam for their 9007SB and 9007HO lamps, the HO's are much better on lowbeam: 1,043 lumens/83 cp vs. 995 lumens/80 cp for the superblues.
The last thing I want to do is go down the road scorching the retinas of all oncoming drivers. I'm just looking for the best lamp that will fit in the stock headlight assembly.
My question is, for those of us who aren't ready to convert to HID yet, what is a good 9007-type lamp to use in the meantime?
I know most of the poseur HID "look" 9007 lamps are lame. GE's own literature shows that while the avg. lumens (1,345) and candlepower (107) are equal on highbeam for their 9007SB and 9007HO lamps, the HO's are much better on lowbeam: 1,043 lumens/83 cp vs. 995 lumens/80 cp for the superblues.
The last thing I want to do is go down the road scorching the retinas of all oncoming drivers. I'm just looking for the best lamp that will fit in the stock headlight assembly.
| krazedant | 10-20-2002 04:28 PM |
HIDs rock :D
| krazedant | 10-20-2002 04:29 PM |
HIDs rock :D
| judgegavel | 10-20-2002 05:08 PM |
How much do HID's run for the OEM light anyway, and how dificult an install is it.
SAJ: do you have a bulb out or just want to upgrade?
SAJ: do you have a bulb out or just want to upgrade?
| vividracing | 10-20-2002 05:15 PM |
We have 7000K kits for $400. I use one on our car and they are brighter then any audi or bmw.
| sajohnson | 10-20-2002 05:24 PM |
My stock Sylvania lamps are fine, I just want to upgrade.
At $400 the HID lights are becoming tempting but for now I just want the best replacement 9007's I can find.
Before I spend hundreds of dollars on HID's, I would want to do some serious research. My guess is they are like anything else in that there are varying degrees of construction quality, light quality, light output, beam pattern, service life, replacement parts cost and availability, etc, etc.
Sooooo...any info on 9007's?
At $400 the HID lights are becoming tempting but for now I just want the best replacement 9007's I can find.
Before I spend hundreds of dollars on HID's, I would want to do some serious research. My guess is they are like anything else in that there are varying degrees of construction quality, light quality, light output, beam pattern, service life, replacement parts cost and availability, etc, etc.
Sooooo...any info on 9007's?
| judgegavel | 10-20-2002 05:55 PM |
SAJ, the only reason I ask is I doubt their will be that big of an improvement to warrent a change. Unless they were out (I mean burned out) already, I'd sooner save the money for the HID's which make a huge diff.
| hpracingwrx | 10-20-2002 06:50 PM |
can u have hids with the stock headlights or do u need to go to morettes or sometype of projecting headlight?
| sajohnson | 10-20-2002 10:23 PM |
judgegavel:
You may very well be correct. I just thought there might be some advances in conventional lighting that I wasn't aware of.
I can say that the GE 9007HO's are brighter and _whiter_ than the stock Sylvanias, at least on low beam. There doesn't seem to be as much of a difference on high. I need to look up the specs on the Sylvania 9007's.
How about it -- anyboby know of any decent HO 9007 (stock) replacement headlamps?
You may very well be correct. I just thought there might be some advances in conventional lighting that I wasn't aware of.
I can say that the GE 9007HO's are brighter and _whiter_ than the stock Sylvanias, at least on low beam. There doesn't seem to be as much of a difference on high. I need to look up the specs on the Sylvania 9007's.
How about it -- anyboby know of any decent HO 9007 (stock) replacement headlamps?
| superhawk44 | 10-20-2002 10:49 PM |
best bulbs
The best bulbs by far are the PIAA"s super white's or xtreme white's. Much whiter and brighter than stock or any other bulbs out there. As far as HID's go they are the best but you have to sacrifice your high beams to get them,Hid's have no high beam capability. Just something to think about,CHRIS....:alien:
| Avedis | 10-20-2002 11:09 PM |
I think [url]http://www.rallylights.com/[/url] has some high-Xenon content normal driving lights that are basically slightly brighter than your stockers, if that's what you're really looking for. Pretty inexpensive when compared to upgrading to projector lamps or HIDs, but of course not nearly so effective.
But if you're looking for bang-for-buck and want to basically stay stock, it's a good deal. No dichrotic film or garbage like that... just better gases inside the bulb. I got a set for my Morettes and they're brighter than what the Morettes came with... I figure I'll just use the originals as a replacement if one goes out while I order another from Susquehanna MotorSports. :)
--jeff
But if you're looking for bang-for-buck and want to basically stay stock, it's a good deal. No dichrotic film or garbage like that... just better gases inside the bulb. I got a set for my Morettes and they're brighter than what the Morettes came with... I figure I'll just use the originals as a replacement if one goes out while I order another from Susquehanna MotorSports. :)
--jeff
| yuletak | 10-20-2002 11:15 PM |
sajohnson,
i'm in the same boat that u are. actually, i just want to match the clear corners that i got from Revolutions a little while ago. :p
but i'm not sure i want to spend the few hundred bucks on HIDs. i'd rather put that money towards some suspension setup or brakes. i may go w/ the sylvania's or something similar. [url]www.autobarn.com[/url] has a bunch of different brands. seems like those regular bulbs aren't too popular here. i'm just going for the look. let me know how things work out for you.
yuletak
i'm in the same boat that u are. actually, i just want to match the clear corners that i got from Revolutions a little while ago. :p
but i'm not sure i want to spend the few hundred bucks on HIDs. i'd rather put that money towards some suspension setup or brakes. i may go w/ the sylvania's or something similar. [url]www.autobarn.com[/url] has a bunch of different brands. seems like those regular bulbs aren't too popular here. i'm just going for the look. let me know how things work out for you.
yuletak
| Frederf | 10-20-2002 11:18 PM |
Silvania Silverstars are the best IMHO way to upgrade your 9007.
[url]http://www.sylvania.com/auto/silverstar.htm[/url]
[url]http://www.sylvania.com/bin/carApp/carApp_ver2.pl?flag=model_quals&make=&make=Subaru&year=&year=2002&model=Impreza&x=20&y=11#1[/url]
[url]http://www.sylvania.com/auto/silverstar.htm[/url]
[url]http://www.sylvania.com/bin/carApp/carApp_ver2.pl?flag=model_quals&make=&make=Subaru&year=&year=2002&model=Impreza&x=20&y=11#1[/url]
| sajohnson | 10-20-2002 11:39 PM |
Sylvania
Frederf:
I just left Sylvania's site. The Silverstars do look good. Their color temp. is up there at 4,000 degrees Kelvin. I did notice that their actual light output in lumens is no greater (actually a little less) than the GE 9007HO's. The Silverstars may be worth it for the whiter light though. They were pricey, I think about $30 each:(
Of course that's a lot less than the HID systems they sell ($400-$500). They had some round HID units that looked like they might fit in place of the stock fog lamps but that really isn't the ideal location.
I just left Sylvania's site. The Silverstars do look good. Their color temp. is up there at 4,000 degrees Kelvin. I did notice that their actual light output in lumens is no greater (actually a little less) than the GE 9007HO's. The Silverstars may be worth it for the whiter light though. They were pricey, I think about $30 each:(
Of course that's a lot less than the HID systems they sell ($400-$500). They had some round HID units that looked like they might fit in place of the stock fog lamps but that really isn't the ideal location.
| Frederf | 10-21-2002 02:19 AM |
I wouldn't consider $30 ea. pricey. In the world of $2k JDM LHD STi lights, it's a drop in the bucket.
| sajohnson | 10-21-2002 03:28 AM |
Avedis:
Thanks for the link to Susquehanna MotorSports. Lots of good info there. I was impressed with their honesty and their advice to check your car's electrical system and headlight beam pattern before ordering.
I'm considering trying their 100w/80w halogen 9007 replacements. Does anyone have experience with these? 100 watts is a 50% increase in current draw over stock, I guess I should check the shop manual to verify what guage wiring the stock system has. Can the WRX headlight assembly handle the extra heat?
Thanks for the link to Susquehanna MotorSports. Lots of good info there. I was impressed with their honesty and their advice to check your car's electrical system and headlight beam pattern before ordering.
I'm considering trying their 100w/80w halogen 9007 replacements. Does anyone have experience with these? 100 watts is a 50% increase in current draw over stock, I guess I should check the shop manual to verify what guage wiring the stock system has. Can the WRX headlight assembly handle the extra heat?
| sajohnson | 10-21-2002 03:41 AM |
Frederf:
Like so much else in life, it is relative. You are correct that compared to the cost of some high-end lighting systems $30 is nothing. However, compared to other HO 9007 halogens that cost around $10, they are three times as expensive. As I said, they may still be worth it, if only for their higher color temp.
I may have to devise my own testing method. If I had each headlight independently switched I could do A/B comparisons easily. As it is, all I have been able to do is park the car facing a (preferably white) wall and stand in front with a piece of cardboard in each hand and alternately block the left and right headlights. Pretty low-tech, but it gives at least some idea of the differences. I would think that being able to drive down a dark road and switch between lamps would be better.
Like so much else in life, it is relative. You are correct that compared to the cost of some high-end lighting systems $30 is nothing. However, compared to other HO 9007 halogens that cost around $10, they are three times as expensive. As I said, they may still be worth it, if only for their higher color temp.
I may have to devise my own testing method. If I had each headlight independently switched I could do A/B comparisons easily. As it is, all I have been able to do is park the car facing a (preferably white) wall and stand in front with a piece of cardboard in each hand and alternately block the left and right headlights. Pretty low-tech, but it gives at least some idea of the differences. I would think that being able to drive down a dark road and switch between lamps would be better.
| ewc | 10-21-2002 06:47 AM |
sajohnson, i bought the hella 9007s from [url]www.rallylights.com.[/url] huge difference from stock, especially for highbeams. low beams throw a very clean pattern, and highbeams actually look like highbeams, compared to the anemic stock bulbs. go for this before hid.
| decibel_dj | 10-21-2002 09:46 AM |
IMO i would get the 4300k kit its way brighter and the color spectrum is closer to white than the purpl'ish blue you get with the higher kits.
| STR8OUT | 10-21-2002 10:22 AM |
1 Attachment(s)
I think that 4300K might be brighter than 7000K but I love the BMW purple look.
I have found a guy that can get sets for $370 shipped for whatever "K" you need. 4000K-7000K.
Very nice quality and great warranty too. I would highly recomend him to anyone.
Heres my 7000K HID kit in my STI lights.
I have found a guy that can get sets for $370 shipped for whatever "K" you need. 4000K-7000K.
Very nice quality and great warranty too. I would highly recomend him to anyone.
Heres my 7000K HID kit in my STI lights.
| Costas | 10-21-2002 10:27 AM |
Guy before me had a set of "high intensity' type of lights in my RS...
Im switching the connectors now because they are fried...
not worth the switch...
the real question is..
which lights WONT fry your connectors?
(The original question was replacements for the 9007...I see its kind of morphed into a HID discussion...)
Im switching the connectors now because they are fried...
not worth the switch...
the real question is..
which lights WONT fry your connectors?
(The original question was replacements for the 9007...I see its kind of morphed into a HID discussion...)
| Dr. WOT | 10-21-2002 10:43 AM |
A fact about HID is that the brightest output is 4300k, anything higher is more blue, therefore more dark, meaning not as much light output.
I'd like to see some pictures of beam patterns from anyone who has HID bulbs in the stock housings. A picture of the lights agaist a wall would be the ideal picture to show how the optics of the stock housing refect the light.
After researching HID for a little while now, I'm ready to debunk the myth that you need LHD projectors. The shield inside any projector lamp can be replaced with a custom fabricated shield (from a soda can) to create any type of beam step you want. Higher on the right, higher on the left, whatever... it's all dictated by a tiny of metal with a notch in it.
[url=http://faq.auto.light.tripod.com/headlight-menu1.htm]Here's a website that will learned you on the facts of HID.[/url]
I'd like to see some pictures of beam patterns from anyone who has HID bulbs in the stock housings. A picture of the lights agaist a wall would be the ideal picture to show how the optics of the stock housing refect the light.
After researching HID for a little while now, I'm ready to debunk the myth that you need LHD projectors. The shield inside any projector lamp can be replaced with a custom fabricated shield (from a soda can) to create any type of beam step you want. Higher on the right, higher on the left, whatever... it's all dictated by a tiny of metal with a notch in it.
[url=http://faq.auto.light.tripod.com/headlight-menu1.htm]Here's a website that will learned you on the facts of HID.[/url]
| sajohnson | 10-21-2002 01:50 PM |
A swerve to the left, and there we are...
Back on topic!
As Costas said, the original question was (and still is) -- are there any 9007 lamps that are significantly better than the stock Sylvanias?
He also brings up a good point -- will the 100w/80w lamps fry wiring or connectors? 100 watts/13 volts(approx.) = 7.7 amps. Too much? I guess I should check the size of the wiring and the voltage drop with the GE 9007HO's I'm testing now before going any further.
ewc:
Do you remember the color temp and wattage of those Hellas?
As Costas said, the original question was (and still is) -- are there any 9007 lamps that are significantly better than the stock Sylvanias?
He also brings up a good point -- will the 100w/80w lamps fry wiring or connectors? 100 watts/13 volts(approx.) = 7.7 amps. Too much? I guess I should check the size of the wiring and the voltage drop with the GE 9007HO's I'm testing now before going any further.
ewc:
Do you remember the color temp and wattage of those Hellas?
| ewc | 10-21-2002 02:03 PM |
sajohnson, i believe they are the standard (non-"xenon") replacement bulbs found here: [url]http://www.rallylights.com/hella/standard_bulbs.asp[/url]
100/55 stock wattage. No need to go to the 100/85. If you were satisfied with the standard sylvanias, you will be blown away by these. The light output is the standard yellowish tint, but it puts out a much brighter pattern.
100/55 stock wattage. No need to go to the 100/85. If you were satisfied with the standard sylvanias, you will be blown away by these. The light output is the standard yellowish tint, but it puts out a much brighter pattern.
| EklEktEk79 | 10-21-2002 02:11 PM |
ewc: thank you for the info finally somebody comes up with some "K"nowledge they've learned rather than directionless jabbering that goes on all the time here. ehh more so technical threads, seems people with some style have a clue
| Kha0S | 10-21-2002 02:24 PM |
ewc/sajohonson -- thanks for this sane discussion of replacement headlamp bulbs.
All too many people (including PIAA devotees) insist that higher color temperatures are "brighter" ... only when it comes to scatter! :D
Those Hella 9007 replacements look very tempting, I think I'm going to pick up a set in the 100/55W when my paycheck comes this week.
/Andrew
All too many people (including PIAA devotees) insist that higher color temperatures are "brighter" ... only when it comes to scatter! :D
Those Hella 9007 replacements look very tempting, I think I'm going to pick up a set in the 100/55W when my paycheck comes this week.
/Andrew
| Avedis | 10-22-2002 12:42 AM |
Well, it looks like Hella doesn't actually make 9007 high-Xenon-content bulbs (that I can find), but for anybody looking for H1, H4, or H7 bulbs, you can find them [URL=http://www.rallylights.com/hella/xenon_bulbs.asp]here.[/URL] They're simply brighter, no blue/purple tint, thanks to the easily-excitable Xenon in 'em.
If you were to find some high-Xenon-content 9007s that don't claim to be "HID-look", you'd be in business.
--jeff (I love my Morettes, by the way... knowing how nice they are now, I'd have replaced my stock lights ages ago ;) )
edit: clarification
If you were to find some high-Xenon-content 9007s that don't claim to be "HID-look", you'd be in business.
--jeff (I love my Morettes, by the way... knowing how nice they are now, I'd have replaced my stock lights ages ago ;) )
edit: clarification
| Frederf | 10-22-2002 02:00 AM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Avedis [/i]
[B]Well, it looks like Hella doesn't actually make 9007 high-Xenon-content bulbs (that I can find), but for anybody looking for H1, H4, or H7 bulbs, you can find them [URL=http://www.rallylights.com/hella/xenon_bulbs.asp]here.[/URL] They're simply brighter, no blue/purple tint, thanks to the easily-excitable Xenon in 'em.
If you were to find some high-Xenon-content 9007s that don't claim to be "HID-look", you'd be in business.
--jeff (I love my Morettes, by the way... knowing how nice they are now, I'd have replaced my stock lights ages ago ;) )
edit: clarification [/B][/QUOTE]
[quote]
The XENON bulbs use a mixture of Halogen gases including Xenon [b](in the halogen family)[/b] at an increased pressure. The resulting color shift to the whiter end of the spectrum gives the effect of 30% or 50% greater output over an equivalent standard Halogen. For a good description of the technology, try the Hella New Zealand Web Site at [url]http://www.hella.co.nz/newprod/xenon_premium/xenon.htm[/url] (opens a new window on your desktop). In a DOT headlight, you may not see much improvement, if any, as the DOT lighting pattern is so poor. The improvement is most marked in lamps with a Euro lighting pattern. See the Help Guide reference to DOT lighting for more information.
[/quote]
The above link DOES NOT describe the technology. First of all, Xenon is not in the Halogen family... it's in the noble gas family. [url]http://www.chemicalelements.com/groups/halogens.html[/url]
[url]http://www.chemicalelements.com/groups/noblegases.html[/url]
Can anyone here give a good technical explination of the pros/cons of filling the bulb with a halogen vs filling the bulb with a noble gas? Isn't Xenon's emmision spectrum the most favorable? Why are H4 bulbs typically filled with halogen elements? Can a filiment properly excite a noble gas like Xenon to produce the correct results?
I've looked some more and found this very informative test of various bulbs. My only complaint is he concluded that the bulbs weren't brighter because his radiometer detected no big change in intensity at only 2 different wavelengths when in fact maybe the big change was in a totally different wavelength. What he does describe is the difference in noble gases, and the fact halogen lights "cycle".
[url]http://www.ibmwr.org/prodreview/xenonbulb.html[/url]
Another discussion of bulbs:
[url]http://www.ibmwr.org/otech/h4bulbs.html[/url]
interesting note: not clear bulbs are artifically changing the color (and what looks like the color temp) by simply filtering out the light of the lower temps that they don't want, which in turn lowers the overall output of the light.
ARG, I hate when they say "HID ignites the gas." If it ignited the gas it'd burn and blow up the bulb. It excites the electrons of the Xenon atoms, and when the electrons settle down they emit photons of a certain energy/color.
So, this is going to my best guess at how these 3 headlight types work:
1. Filiment, halogen filled
Electricity -> Filiment glows -> Road
2. Filiment, xenon filled
Electricity -> Filiment glows -> Absorbed by xenon, excited -> Emitted by Xenon (different color) -> Road
3. HID
Electricity -> Excited Xenon -> Emitted by Xenon -> Road
So the #2 method would be using the xenon gas as a type of filter to change the emmision spectrum from tungsten (or whatever it is) to the xenon emmision spectrum, with less than 100% efficiency.:confused:
[B]Well, it looks like Hella doesn't actually make 9007 high-Xenon-content bulbs (that I can find), but for anybody looking for H1, H4, or H7 bulbs, you can find them [URL=http://www.rallylights.com/hella/xenon_bulbs.asp]here.[/URL] They're simply brighter, no blue/purple tint, thanks to the easily-excitable Xenon in 'em.
If you were to find some high-Xenon-content 9007s that don't claim to be "HID-look", you'd be in business.
--jeff (I love my Morettes, by the way... knowing how nice they are now, I'd have replaced my stock lights ages ago ;) )
edit: clarification [/B][/QUOTE]
[quote]
The XENON bulbs use a mixture of Halogen gases including Xenon [b](in the halogen family)[/b] at an increased pressure. The resulting color shift to the whiter end of the spectrum gives the effect of 30% or 50% greater output over an equivalent standard Halogen. For a good description of the technology, try the Hella New Zealand Web Site at [url]http://www.hella.co.nz/newprod/xenon_premium/xenon.htm[/url] (opens a new window on your desktop). In a DOT headlight, you may not see much improvement, if any, as the DOT lighting pattern is so poor. The improvement is most marked in lamps with a Euro lighting pattern. See the Help Guide reference to DOT lighting for more information.
[/quote]
The above link DOES NOT describe the technology. First of all, Xenon is not in the Halogen family... it's in the noble gas family. [url]http://www.chemicalelements.com/groups/halogens.html[/url]
[url]http://www.chemicalelements.com/groups/noblegases.html[/url]
Can anyone here give a good technical explination of the pros/cons of filling the bulb with a halogen vs filling the bulb with a noble gas? Isn't Xenon's emmision spectrum the most favorable? Why are H4 bulbs typically filled with halogen elements? Can a filiment properly excite a noble gas like Xenon to produce the correct results?
I've looked some more and found this very informative test of various bulbs. My only complaint is he concluded that the bulbs weren't brighter because his radiometer detected no big change in intensity at only 2 different wavelengths when in fact maybe the big change was in a totally different wavelength. What he does describe is the difference in noble gases, and the fact halogen lights "cycle".
[url]http://www.ibmwr.org/prodreview/xenonbulb.html[/url]
Another discussion of bulbs:
[url]http://www.ibmwr.org/otech/h4bulbs.html[/url]
interesting note: not clear bulbs are artifically changing the color (and what looks like the color temp) by simply filtering out the light of the lower temps that they don't want, which in turn lowers the overall output of the light.
ARG, I hate when they say "HID ignites the gas." If it ignited the gas it'd burn and blow up the bulb. It excites the electrons of the Xenon atoms, and when the electrons settle down they emit photons of a certain energy/color.
So, this is going to my best guess at how these 3 headlight types work:
1. Filiment, halogen filled
Electricity -> Filiment glows -> Road
2. Filiment, xenon filled
Electricity -> Filiment glows -> Absorbed by xenon, excited -> Emitted by Xenon (different color) -> Road
3. HID
Electricity -> Excited Xenon -> Emitted by Xenon -> Road
So the #2 method would be using the xenon gas as a type of filter to change the emmision spectrum from tungsten (or whatever it is) to the xenon emmision spectrum, with less than 100% efficiency.:confused:
Không có nhận xét nào:
Đăng nhận xét