| snakebit8 | 06-24-2006 06:31 PM |
Auto-x Coilover suggestions for 05 STI
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Im pretty sure this has already been discussed but search came up with nothing useable. Im looking for reviews/ thoughs / suggestions, ect on a set of coilovers for a 05 STI. Its my friends car and we are looking for a good platform to get started with. Priced under $2000 is perferable. Camber plates would be a must and ones that didnt require rebuilding would be nice but not required if its worth it not to have it. I would perfer linear springs because they are easier to set up with. Car will be set up for STU or BSP if we have to have more boost than stock. Im shootin for STU but he loves his boost go figure. Im just lookin for whats been used what being used by competetive cars ect. Thanks in advance for your responces.
| crystalhelix | 06-24-2006 11:25 PM |
spend the money up front for zzyzx coilovers. I have been through 2 sets of coil-overs all with the same droop issues. Take 1k from somewhere else in the budget and give steve a call. I will likely switch to zzyzx next year. I have used JIC's and Tein's and neither will be fantastic (although useable) for a serious BSP (maybe STU as well) car and you will be rueing the day you didn't listen to everyone
<----like this guy..lol
<----like this guy..lol
| WRXedUSA | 06-25-2006 12:20 AM |
For under 2k you can get Tein Flex, Motons, KW's.
3 very good options.
3 very good options.
| Butt Dyno | 06-25-2006 12:50 AM |
[QUOTE=snakebit8]Im pretty sure this has already been discussed but search came up with nothing useable.[/QUOTE]
Search for 'stu' in 'titles only' in 'motorsports'
You will get hits.
Search for 'stu' in 'titles only' in 'motorsports'
You will get hits.
| snakebit8 | 06-25-2006 01:28 AM |
[QUOTE=WRXedUSA]For under 2k you can get Tein Flex, Motons, KW's.
3 very good options.[/QUOTE]
You can get Moton coilovers with springs and everything for under 2k? Cheapest shocks of their's was like 3k if so point them out to me.
also thanks for the search tip. Found lots of good stuff
3 very good options.[/QUOTE]
You can get Moton coilovers with springs and everything for under 2k? Cheapest shocks of their's was like 3k if so point them out to me.
also thanks for the search tip. Found lots of good stuff
| WRXedUSA | 06-25-2006 01:38 AM |
[url]http://racecompengineering.com/coilover.html[/url]
I believe someone on here had them for around 2k. Might try searching.
I believe someone on here had them for around 2k. Might try searching.
| skuttledude | 06-25-2006 07:48 AM |
For the past year, I've used HKS Hipermax RS coilovers with good success. 30-point dampening/rebound adjustability, camber adjustment etc. These have been perfect for me as my Autox car is also my daily driver.
Must agree thou with crystallhelix above, the zzyzx coilovers is a serious setup, especially if you are going to really commit to a nationally ranked car.
Must agree thou with crystallhelix above, the zzyzx coilovers is a serious setup, especially if you are going to really commit to a nationally ranked car.
| makofoto | 06-25-2006 10:55 AM |
Most of the National Champ winning Suby's have been on Tein's. The Flex's are popular on STI's. The new ones are mono tube and have a new spring lock washer to address the occasional slight problem of the lower locking nut working itself loose. Rebuilds are a fact of life with coil overs ... but you should be good for a couple of years. The Tein rebuilds are fast and cheap compared to most coilovers. They have a rebuild center in Los Angeles; $100 per strut. When it's time to get a rebuild, you can easily get custom AX specific valving. Some coilover rebuilds are so time consuming and expensive that some folk decide to just get a set of Tein's instead of going back to what they had. Comes with camber plates. But the "hot" set-up is now to use a round camber plate that can be rotated so that the slot runs about 40, 45 degrees in and back so that you can get extra caster and camber. The added caster is necessary to maintain your static camber when turning. The slot should also be elongated to increase the amount of caster/camber when rotating the plate.
If money was no object, I would also get the zzyzx's ... although they aren't too expensive (not really sure how much they are). Very nicely made, virtually custom for STI's ...
If money was no object, I would also get the zzyzx's ... although they aren't too expensive (not really sure how much they are). Very nicely made, virtually custom for STI's ...
| crystalhelix | 06-25-2006 11:15 AM |
[QUOTE=Davis K Powers]
Must agree thou with crystallhelix above, the zzyzx coilovers is a serious setup, especially if you are going to really commit to a nationally ranked car.[/QUOTE]
That is of course the stipulation...I have found once you really start pusing the envelope it's too late and you realize you should have gone with a better suspension. I am learning things every year (my 3rd year of autoX). One of the newer theories is to go outside in. Starting with tires, biggest that work best for you. I am having issues with 315's and I think now it's based mostly on my springrate and need to hack fenders..next looking at bearings, if you have an 04 STi you may want to upgrade to 05 hubs. Big tires will need the extra support. Then you need to look at brakes and struts. I think struts would be the next most important things next to tires and getting the right bar/rate/settings will make big changes in your times. Then you need decent pads. I find horsepower is not the key to getting FTD anymore or winning the class. I guess it would be tougher if you were in a region with well developed BSP/STU cars to catch up in 1 season. I know locally I don't get the competition I need to get better so I always look forward to bigger events where I can get the adrenaline rush of competition going again and really focus on developing my A-game. Anyways, the point is that I have done well locally on JIC's and Tein's but when I travel to larger events I realize I am underclassed on stuts, just my 0.02...
Must agree thou with crystallhelix above, the zzyzx coilovers is a serious setup, especially if you are going to really commit to a nationally ranked car.[/QUOTE]
That is of course the stipulation...I have found once you really start pusing the envelope it's too late and you realize you should have gone with a better suspension. I am learning things every year (my 3rd year of autoX). One of the newer theories is to go outside in. Starting with tires, biggest that work best for you. I am having issues with 315's and I think now it's based mostly on my springrate and need to hack fenders..next looking at bearings, if you have an 04 STi you may want to upgrade to 05 hubs. Big tires will need the extra support. Then you need to look at brakes and struts. I think struts would be the next most important things next to tires and getting the right bar/rate/settings will make big changes in your times. Then you need decent pads. I find horsepower is not the key to getting FTD anymore or winning the class. I guess it would be tougher if you were in a region with well developed BSP/STU cars to catch up in 1 season. I know locally I don't get the competition I need to get better so I always look forward to bigger events where I can get the adrenaline rush of competition going again and really focus on developing my A-game. Anyways, the point is that I have done well locally on JIC's and Tein's but when I travel to larger events I realize I am underclassed on stuts, just my 0.02...
| snakebit8 | 06-26-2006 09:00 AM |
Thanks for the responces guys they have been super helpful. I think we are probably going with the Teins because thats all we can really afford right now. Just trying to get started now anyway. Thanks for the help though.
| makofoto | 06-26-2006 11:13 AM |
Make sure you get the new mono tube version
| TheWRX | 06-26-2006 11:57 AM |
If the Flex's are now monotubes, you might want to double check that they can be rebuilt in the US. A couple of years ago, they could not rebuild RA's in the US because they were monotubes. HA's and Flex's were rebuilt at the service center in the US, while RA's had to go back to Japan (which is either very slow, or very expensive).
And no, just because vendors tell you that they can be rebuilt in the US, that doesn't necessarily mean that it's true. :furious:
And no, just because vendors tell you that they can be rebuilt in the US, that doesn't necessarily mean that it's true. :furious:
| makofoto | 06-26-2006 12:23 PM |
I'm waiting to hear back from Tein USA on the rebuild question.
| snakebit8 | 06-26-2006 05:35 PM |
[QUOTE=makofoto]I'm waiting to hear back from Tein USA on the rebuild question.[/QUOTE]
Yeah maybe we should hold out til something is heard. keep us posted.
Yeah maybe we should hold out til something is heard. keep us posted.
| omaha03wrx | 06-26-2006 06:35 PM |
[QUOTE=crystalhelix]spend the money up front for zzyzx coilovers. I have been through 2 sets of coil-overs all with the same droop issues. Take 1k from somewhere else in the budget and give steve a call. I will likely switch to zzyzx next year. I have used JIC's and Tein's and neither will be fantastic (although useable) for a serious BSP (maybe STU as well) car and you will be rueing the day you didn't listen to everyone
<----like this guy..lol[/QUOTE]
You'll love them. I really like mine now that I have them set up good enough for now, but they won't fall in to his 2 grand budget, he'll have to double it which would include tophats. If you already have tophats then you could knock a little off that. For having 600f and 500r rates the car rides very nice on the crappy Nebraska roads we have here.
If you have the $$ go with Steve's coilovers! :disco:
<----like this guy..lol[/QUOTE]
You'll love them. I really like mine now that I have them set up good enough for now, but they won't fall in to his 2 grand budget, he'll have to double it which would include tophats. If you already have tophats then you could knock a little off that. For having 600f and 500r rates the car rides very nice on the crappy Nebraska roads we have here.
If you have the $$ go with Steve's coilovers! :disco:
| crystalhelix | 06-26-2006 06:37 PM |
[QUOTE=snakebit8]Yeah maybe we should hold out til something is heard. keep us posted.[/QUOTE]
yeah, until next year at least when you can buy mine when I upgrade.. :p
yeah, until next year at least when you can buy mine when I upgrade.. :p
| snakebit8 | 06-26-2006 09:47 PM |
[QUOTE=crystalhelix]yeah, until next year at least when you can buy mine when I upgrade.. :p[/QUOTE]
Dont thinks were are gonna wait that long. If we did we would have the cash for the zzyzx.
Dont thinks were are gonna wait that long. If we did we would have the cash for the zzyzx.
| EarlQHan | 06-26-2006 10:14 PM |
Try Stances. [url]www.stancesus.com[/url] 240 guys seem to love them.
| makofoto | 06-27-2006 12:59 AM |
The new Mono Tube Flex's will be overhauled in Los Angeles, but not available until August ...
| RaceComp Engineering | 06-27-2006 01:06 AM |
Kw offers a competition spec coilover that is very good( true 2 way) and Moton offers a 2 way, and Ohlins offers a single adj unit that is very impressive for being a single. ALL offer rebuilds in the USA and can do customs valving.
let us know if you need any help.
Myles
let us know if you need any help.
Myles
| makofoto | 06-27-2006 01:09 AM |
Yes ... but how much are the rebuilds ...
| RaceComp Engineering | 06-27-2006 11:30 AM |
[QUOTE=makofoto]Yes ... but how much are the rebuilds ...[/QUOTE]
all average the standard BALL a corner. Motons are a hair more, like maybe 25 a corner more.
mw
all average the standard BALL a corner. Motons are a hair more, like maybe 25 a corner more.
mw
| BriDrive | 06-27-2006 12:13 PM |
Myles,
I recall reading an obscure PDF from KW website on the Variant 3s that stated that those coilovers were approved for camber of up to negative 2 degrees but not further.
Is that accurate?
It's becoming apparent to me that the extreme front negative cambers run on WRX and STI's for auto-x may be the culprit in why alot of the "more affordable" coilovers seem to be self loosening their lower brackets, or otherwise causing potential problems.
At any rate, Andrew's got his gear/plates and I will be assisting him with setup. I'm pretty interested in these KW units as I have not seen them in person yet but they are getting good review/feedback from Suby drivers...
BriDrive
I recall reading an obscure PDF from KW website on the Variant 3s that stated that those coilovers were approved for camber of up to negative 2 degrees but not further.
Is that accurate?
It's becoming apparent to me that the extreme front negative cambers run on WRX and STI's for auto-x may be the culprit in why alot of the "more affordable" coilovers seem to be self loosening their lower brackets, or otherwise causing potential problems.
At any rate, Andrew's got his gear/plates and I will be assisting him with setup. I'm pretty interested in these KW units as I have not seen them in person yet but they are getting good review/feedback from Suby drivers...
BriDrive
| RaceComp Engineering | 06-27-2006 12:26 PM |
[QUOTE=BriDrive]Myles,
I recall reading an obscure PDF from KW website on the Variant 3s that stated that those coilovers were approved for camber of up to negative 2 degrees but not further.
Is that accurate?
It's becoming apparent to me that the extreme front negative cambers run on WRX and STI's for auto-x may be the culprit in why alot of the "more affordable" coilovers seem to be self loosening their lower brackets, or otherwise causing potential problems.
At any rate, Andrew's got his gear/plates and I will be assisting him with setup. I'm pretty interested in these KW units as I have not seen them in person yet but they are getting good review/feedback from Suby drivers...
BriDrive[/QUOTE]
Off the record, I have and others used -3.5 with KW's, so I know there is such a thing as "thinking outside the box" with this stuff. As for the cheaper coilovers issues, I wont even touch that subject. I still have a bad taste in my mouth from a certain manufacture.
mw
I recall reading an obscure PDF from KW website on the Variant 3s that stated that those coilovers were approved for camber of up to negative 2 degrees but not further.
Is that accurate?
It's becoming apparent to me that the extreme front negative cambers run on WRX and STI's for auto-x may be the culprit in why alot of the "more affordable" coilovers seem to be self loosening their lower brackets, or otherwise causing potential problems.
At any rate, Andrew's got his gear/plates and I will be assisting him with setup. I'm pretty interested in these KW units as I have not seen them in person yet but they are getting good review/feedback from Suby drivers...
BriDrive[/QUOTE]
Off the record, I have and others used -3.5 with KW's, so I know there is such a thing as "thinking outside the box" with this stuff. As for the cheaper coilovers issues, I wont even touch that subject. I still have a bad taste in my mouth from a certain manufacture.
mw
| rx713bt | 06-27-2006 08:17 PM |
anyone ever try ohlins?
| Calamity Jesus | 06-28-2006 08:07 AM |
Steven Rankins drives the Boxer4Racing STi, which sports a set of Ohlins.
There's a nice blog of his progress this year on the website. [url]www.boxer4racing.com[/url]
There's a nice blog of his progress this year on the website. [url]www.boxer4racing.com[/url]
| snakebit8 | 06-28-2006 05:42 PM |
Dumb Question. But what exactly is the advantage of Mono tube over the other.
| silver arrow | 06-28-2006 08:51 PM |
[QUOTE=snakebit8]Dumb Question. But what exactly is the advantage of Mono tube over the other.[/QUOTE]
And can older Flex's be upgraded at rebuild time to monotube?
And can older Flex's be upgraded at rebuild time to monotube?
| makofoto | 06-29-2006 02:39 AM |
I doubt it ... totally different design. See the current Sports Compact Car article on Mono Tubes ...
| snakebit8 | 06-30-2006 04:10 PM |
bump......
| STi-MAN | 07-06-2006 01:06 AM |
im very interested in these mono flexes now, so why are mono tubes better then the current flexes?
| makofoto | 07-06-2006 01:22 AM |
Basically it allows the side loads to be spread out over a longer wider area for more consistent effort. Try to find those two recent issues of Sports Compact Car magazine ... each one devoted to type of strut. I've got to get some sleep at the moment ...
| AUTOwrXER | 07-06-2006 04:05 PM |
[QUOTE=crystalhelix]spend the money up front for zzyzx coilovers. I have been through 2 sets of coil-overs all with the same droop issues. Take 1k from somewhere else in the budget and give steve a call. I will likely switch to zzyzx next year. I have used JIC's and Tein's and neither will be fantastic (although useable) for a serious BSP (maybe STU as well) car and you will be rueing the day you didn't listen to everyone
<----like this guy..lol[/QUOTE]
+1 for ZZYZX
<----like this guy..lol[/QUOTE]
+1 for ZZYZX
| solo-x | 07-06-2006 09:36 PM |
a mono tube damper typically has a larger diameter piston then a twin tube damper does. larger diameter piston means a larger volume of fluid displaced for the same amount of suspension movement. ie, greater resolution. a mono-tube damper also has a higher gas pressure then a twin tube does, thus reducing cavitation. additionally, the entire fluid mass can contact the outer most tube allowing the heat built up in the fluid to dissipate better. so in short, a mono tube operates cooler, is more sensitive to small displacements, and is more consistent over time due to the reduction in cavitation over what you get in a twin tube.
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