| skuttledude | 05-19-2004 11:54 AM |
Monaco F1 GP! Talk about it here
�
�
So what's going to happen???
Top 8?
First turn incident?
Vital pole position?
Best handling car?
Will a lower placed team get close to a podium?
Will McLaren ever recover?
Schuy wins again???
My pic:
M.Schumacher;
J.Montoya;
R.Barrichello;
J.Button;
D.Coulthard;
K.Raikkonen;
F.Alonso;
M.Webber
Discuss, debate, fight.
In memory of Fred Z. passing away 1 year ago...can we all give a "Go Chili Dog"!!!!!! (JPM)
Davis
P.S. Please sticky me...
Top 8?
First turn incident?
Vital pole position?
Best handling car?
Will a lower placed team get close to a podium?
Will McLaren ever recover?
Schuy wins again???
My pic:
M.Schumacher;
J.Montoya;
R.Barrichello;
J.Button;
D.Coulthard;
K.Raikkonen;
F.Alonso;
M.Webber
Discuss, debate, fight.
In memory of Fred Z. passing away 1 year ago...can we all give a "Go Chili Dog"!!!!!! (JPM)
Davis
P.S. Please sticky me...
| artkevin | 05-19-2004 01:07 PM |
I am pulling for JPM to get pole and then the race. If not him then Micheal "the Freak" Schumacher. I would to see a dark horse anywere close to the podium. Fisi is do for something special soon.
| TimStevens | 05-19-2004 01:13 PM |
Michael will get the pole and win from there. Ferrari's been testing like crazy to get a fast first lap in. If someone does beat them to pole, they'll lose it on their first stop, just like the last race... *sigh*
| AndyRoo | 05-19-2004 01:36 PM |
If Michael gets pole, i think he might just lap everyone.
| BriDrive | 05-19-2004 01:37 PM |
I don't normally go out on a limb...but just for fun and absolutely no data or insight to back it up, I predict that Renault and specifically Alonso will take the pole but will have mechanical failure later.............
In other bizarre predictions, McLaren (Kimi) will pull out the win and Ferrari will finish only one car (MS), in 2nd place.
Takumo Sato and Fisichella will battle all day with the 3rd podium spot going to Fisichella after a bizarre and controversial day of attrition, accidents etc........................
In other bizarre predictions, McLaren (Kimi) will pull out the win and Ferrari will finish only one car (MS), in 2nd place.
Takumo Sato and Fisichella will battle all day with the 3rd podium spot going to Fisichella after a bizarre and controversial day of attrition, accidents etc........................
| TimStevens | 05-19-2004 02:05 PM |
Well, if you're going to go out on a limb, might as well make it a long and thin one! :)
| kfoote | 05-19-2004 03:05 PM |
My out on a limb predictions:
Qualifying: Coulthard on pole, Michael 2nd, JPM 3rd, Alonso 4th, Barichello 5th. Raikkonen blows engine in 1st round qualifying, has to start last.
Turn 1: Alonso, Michael, Coulthard, JPM, Barichello.
Later lap 1: Ralf and Kimi both have theier front wings taken off in seperate incidents in the corner formerly known as the Loew's Hairpin.
Michael passes Alonso in the first pit stop sequence, leads the rest of the race
Finish: Michael, Alonso, Coulthard, Barichello, Trulli. One of the Minardis, still managing to be running at the end, finishes 8th
Is that enough of a limb? ;)
Qualifying: Coulthard on pole, Michael 2nd, JPM 3rd, Alonso 4th, Barichello 5th. Raikkonen blows engine in 1st round qualifying, has to start last.
Turn 1: Alonso, Michael, Coulthard, JPM, Barichello.
Later lap 1: Ralf and Kimi both have theier front wings taken off in seperate incidents in the corner formerly known as the Loew's Hairpin.
Michael passes Alonso in the first pit stop sequence, leads the rest of the race
Finish: Michael, Alonso, Coulthard, Barichello, Trulli. One of the Minardis, still managing to be running at the end, finishes 8th
Is that enough of a limb? ;)
| HoRo1 | 05-19-2004 03:14 PM |
To celebrate 1000 posts I'll gamble on a Schumacher victory. Whoever gets through the first lap in the lead should win.
| skuttledude | 05-19-2004 03:21 PM |
If you want to go out on a limb......
GO Zsolt Baumgartner!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
He will win for sure. Amazing dash from last on the grid to first position on the 1st turn. Oh yes...I can see it now....
Davis:)
GO Zsolt Baumgartner!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
He will win for sure. Amazing dash from last on the grid to first position on the 1st turn. Oh yes...I can see it now....
Davis:)
| gtguy | 05-19-2004 04:03 PM |
There's all kinds of crazy stuff floating around, from Ferrari getting a "super soft" compound from Bridgestone, to Ross Brawn figuring on a one-stop strategy for M. Schumacher, running the hardest Bridgestone tire on offer, and saying to heck with pole.
But, given the quality and degree of traffic, that seems a tactic that relies upon one's fellow man too much. Don't forget that Schumacher, though caught behind traffic, actually had the race-winning strategy last year. But he was stuck behind (Trulli?) someone, and couldn't really go full speed until it was too late.
I think Ferrari will go for pole, on the super-softs, Schumacher will get it, and it will be game over. Nobody is faster than he is around Monaco, because nobody else has the focus, fitness and precision that he does.
If it rains, he'll lap the field. :lol:
Two potential bugbears are rain during qualifying. If someone is running later in the session, for example, they could get hosed. And rain during the race, which changes everything. Suddenly, slower Bridgetstone cars, because of the excellence of the Bridgestone rain compound, move up.
Having said all that...
1. M. Schumacher (best in the rain, best at Monaco, best car, best pit strategist...too many bests to ignore)
2. Trulli (the Renault will rock at this track, and if a Renault gets on the second row, watch out)
3. Button (he'll qualify well, and the BAR is fast)
4. Montoya (Monaco tends to rein in his wildness)
5. Coulthard (fuel strategy...)
6. Barrichello (I know, seems low for him, but...)
7. Alonso (deserves to be higher)
8. Sato (he's getting better and better)
Kevin
But, given the quality and degree of traffic, that seems a tactic that relies upon one's fellow man too much. Don't forget that Schumacher, though caught behind traffic, actually had the race-winning strategy last year. But he was stuck behind (Trulli?) someone, and couldn't really go full speed until it was too late.
I think Ferrari will go for pole, on the super-softs, Schumacher will get it, and it will be game over. Nobody is faster than he is around Monaco, because nobody else has the focus, fitness and precision that he does.
If it rains, he'll lap the field. :lol:
Two potential bugbears are rain during qualifying. If someone is running later in the session, for example, they could get hosed. And rain during the race, which changes everything. Suddenly, slower Bridgetstone cars, because of the excellence of the Bridgestone rain compound, move up.
Having said all that...
1. M. Schumacher (best in the rain, best at Monaco, best car, best pit strategist...too many bests to ignore)
2. Trulli (the Renault will rock at this track, and if a Renault gets on the second row, watch out)
3. Button (he'll qualify well, and the BAR is fast)
4. Montoya (Monaco tends to rein in his wildness)
5. Coulthard (fuel strategy...)
6. Barrichello (I know, seems low for him, but...)
7. Alonso (deserves to be higher)
8. Sato (he's getting better and better)
Kevin
| BillT | 05-19-2004 04:12 PM |
Ferrari has been talking about their concern over Bridgestone providing them a tire good enough for a fast 1 lap to help them win the pole and they've also been hinting on perhaps a crazy pit strategy so who knows what will happen. Here are my picks for the race:
1. MS - Gotta go with him until someone can step up to the plate and dethrone him. I think that if he qualifies well and starts out first, he'll totally walk away with it and perhaps lap a good portion of the field
2. JB - Gets back on the podium and puts past memories away
3. RB - helping to pad Ferrari's constructors point lead
4. JT - Renault should be fast here and JT looks to be faster than FA this year
5. FA - see above
6. JPM - won't qualify well, won't start well, and will blame everyone but himself for his poor showing :)
7. RS - Ralfie's miracle won't happen this race
8. KR - makes it to the end of the race!
1. MS - Gotta go with him until someone can step up to the plate and dethrone him. I think that if he qualifies well and starts out first, he'll totally walk away with it and perhaps lap a good portion of the field
2. JB - Gets back on the podium and puts past memories away
3. RB - helping to pad Ferrari's constructors point lead
4. JT - Renault should be fast here and JT looks to be faster than FA this year
5. FA - see above
6. JPM - won't qualify well, won't start well, and will blame everyone but himself for his poor showing :)
7. RS - Ralfie's miracle won't happen this race
8. KR - makes it to the end of the race!
| Kitsune | 05-19-2004 04:25 PM |
Nothing new. Lots of talk off track, little differance on track.
| TimStevens | 05-19-2004 04:29 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Kitsune[/i]
[B] Nothing new. Lots of talk off track, little differance on track. [/B][/QUOTE]
That's because the races are becoming so boring we need to at least create some interest between them :lol:
[B] Nothing new. Lots of talk off track, little differance on track. [/B][/QUOTE]
That's because the races are becoming so boring we need to at least create some interest between them :lol:
| BriDrive | 05-19-2004 04:42 PM |
"Nobody is faster than he is around Monaco, because nobody else has the focus, fitness and precision that he does." GTGUY
I disagree with this one...............If that was all there was to it, there are at least 3~5 guys out there with just as much Focus, Fitness and Precision.......................
Traffic is certainly key there, and there is historically alot of attrition due to mechanicals and the circuit itself.....
Schumacher has not always had the best of luck there....
My prior post was attempting to be somewhat humorous BUT, strange things happen at Monaco all the time and I instinctively feel this year will be no different....after the race, if I'm wrong, I'll put out the fire extinguisher....BriDrive
I disagree with this one...............If that was all there was to it, there are at least 3~5 guys out there with just as much Focus, Fitness and Precision.......................
Traffic is certainly key there, and there is historically alot of attrition due to mechanicals and the circuit itself.....
Schumacher has not always had the best of luck there....
My prior post was attempting to be somewhat humorous BUT, strange things happen at Monaco all the time and I instinctively feel this year will be no different....after the race, if I'm wrong, I'll put out the fire extinguisher....BriDrive
| bgsntth | 05-19-2004 06:15 PM |
I think JPM and MS will take each other out in the first turn. Payback is a beetch, even though JPM is a whiner.
1) Buttons
2) Alonso
3) Barricello
4) Trulli
5) RS
6) Sato
Let's hear it for Buttons! I actually like JPM a lot-awesome driver IMO, but he should let the commentators take MS to task.
For Monaco I think they should remove all wings from the cars.......
1) Buttons
2) Alonso
3) Barricello
4) Trulli
5) RS
6) Sato
Let's hear it for Buttons! I actually like JPM a lot-awesome driver IMO, but he should let the commentators take MS to task.
For Monaco I think they should remove all wings from the cars.......
| NegativeC | 05-19-2004 06:34 PM |
Alonzo in that beautiful blue rocket followed by this guy.
[IMG]http://www.msu.edu/~hubbell5/JBPZ1.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://www.msu.edu/~hubbell5/JBPZ1.jpg[/IMG]
| Bumsarama | 05-19-2004 07:19 PM |
Scuderia Ferrari
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I believe Michael "The Machine" Schumacher will win yet once again. I wouldnt be surprised if he will also get the pole. The most number of pole positions is the only record which eludes him and you can bet he'll try to get it. The only thing to keep in mind is that Montoya does well at Monaco, so we'll have to see what happens. As usual, traffic or mechanical failures can always change everything.
| gtguy | 05-19-2004 08:57 PM |
Then we'll have to agree to disagree, BriDrive. Schumacher is the fittest, hardest-working, most precise driver in F1 right now, and he is at the top of his game. Just look at the press conference after the Spanish GP. Barrichello is a sweaty mess, while Schumacher is sitting there, looking like he just came from having tea.
You have to see Schumacher drive live, if you never have...his lines are beautiful, and he can hit the exact same spot at the apex, every single time.
There are some talented drivers out there right now, without question. But there isn't a one who can go as fast, for as long as Schumacher can, in terms of not fastest lap, but near fastest lap. Where other drivers will have a fastest lap of, theoretically, 1:20:10, Schumacher will be doing lap after lap at 1:20:11, 1:20:12, 1:20:11, etc, etc. It's like a metronome.
I'm not taking anything away from the other drivers, mind you. But who out there can go as fast, for as long, as Schumacher? Not Raikkonen, who can be error prone. Montoya is erratic, Alonso tries too hard, Barrichello isn't fast enough, ditto for Button and Sato. R. Schumacher will hit somebody before spinning, etc, etc. I just don't see the guy out there who is the equal of M. Schumacher.
Kevin
You have to see Schumacher drive live, if you never have...his lines are beautiful, and he can hit the exact same spot at the apex, every single time.
There are some talented drivers out there right now, without question. But there isn't a one who can go as fast, for as long as Schumacher can, in terms of not fastest lap, but near fastest lap. Where other drivers will have a fastest lap of, theoretically, 1:20:10, Schumacher will be doing lap after lap at 1:20:11, 1:20:12, 1:20:11, etc, etc. It's like a metronome.
I'm not taking anything away from the other drivers, mind you. But who out there can go as fast, for as long, as Schumacher? Not Raikkonen, who can be error prone. Montoya is erratic, Alonso tries too hard, Barrichello isn't fast enough, ditto for Button and Sato. R. Schumacher will hit somebody before spinning, etc, etc. I just don't see the guy out there who is the equal of M. Schumacher.
Kevin
| artkevin | 05-19-2004 09:37 PM |
M. Schumacher was born without sweet glands. Quite sad really but explains a lot. :alien:
| DrBiggly | 05-19-2004 11:58 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by artkevin[/i]
[B]...Micheal "the Freak" Schumacher... [/B][/QUOTE]
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by artkevin[/i]
[B] M. Schumacher was born without sweet glands. Quite sad really but explains a lot. :alien: [/B][/QUOTE]
:lol: :lol:
[B]...Micheal "the Freak" Schumacher... [/B][/QUOTE]
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by artkevin[/i]
[B] M. Schumacher was born without sweet glands. Quite sad really but explains a lot. :alien: [/B][/QUOTE]
:lol: :lol:
| nhluhr | 05-20-2004 03:00 AM |
If montoya doesn't crash him out, Michael Shumacher will win.
| grandpa rex | 05-20-2004 07:00 AM |
Go Chili dog!!!!
And RIP Fred Z.
Can Schumi run the table this year? The chances are slim but better than ever before.
1. MS
2. Alonso
3. RB
4. JPM
5. Button
6. Trulli
7. Ralfie
8. Sato
And RIP Fred Z.
Can Schumi run the table this year? The chances are slim but better than ever before.
1. MS
2. Alonso
3. RB
4. JPM
5. Button
6. Trulli
7. Ralfie
8. Sato
| Bonzo | 05-20-2004 10:18 AM |
I missed mornings practice. Who was fast. I spose my lazy arse could take a peak too.
I agree MS is part alien. I do find it fascinating to watch in person the precision many of these drivers possess. A few years ago I was impressed by Mika H's throttle take-up on the final coner leading onto the main staright at the USGP a few years ago. It was exact every time. Just a few ticks before the apex every time:eek: I was like wow.
I agree MS is part alien. I do find it fascinating to watch in person the precision many of these drivers possess. A few years ago I was impressed by Mika H's throttle take-up on the final coner leading onto the main staright at the USGP a few years ago. It was exact every time. Just a few ticks before the apex every time:eek: I was like wow.
| cdvma | 05-20-2004 10:57 AM |
MS was the fastest, the only guy to run in the 1:14s.
| Patrick L | 05-20-2004 11:01 AM |
Anyone have the special pass to see all the pictures on F1-Live?
There is a pic I can't seee but the thumb nail in the PreGP pics what looks like Alonso sitting next to Sainz at a Soccer event.
[img]http://f1.racing-live.com/photos/2004/monaco/vign/diapo_082.jpg[/img]
There is a pic I can't seee but the thumb nail in the PreGP pics what looks like Alonso sitting next to Sainz at a Soccer event.
[img]http://f1.racing-live.com/photos/2004/monaco/vign/diapo_082.jpg[/img]
| gtguy | 05-20-2004 11:23 AM |
Schumacher was fastest in both sessions, by a comfortable margin. I didn't see it, because I too forgot that Friday is market day in Monaco, so practice is on Thursday. But from reports, it appears that he wasn't even trying that hard.
Kevin
Kevin
| erich_sc | 05-20-2004 11:34 PM |
I picked Michael for first... again... can't wait to see the race in Montreal. My first one! :D
| Leonardo | 05-20-2004 11:53 PM |
MOntoya, all the way!
Hey, somone needs to take Fred's place!
Go ChilliDog!
[img]http://www.somershoe.com/images/tardface-small.gif[/img]
Hey, somone needs to take Fred's place!
Go ChilliDog!
[img]http://www.somershoe.com/images/tardface-small.gif[/img]
| TimStevens | 05-21-2004 08:05 AM |
Just saw this quote from DC and had to share it. Thought it was good for a chuckle:
[quote]Yet another driver having an unhappy time in �04 is David Coulthard, who faces the prospect of imminent unemployment with Juan Pablo Montoya set to replace him at the end of the year. Adding to that worry, the continuing uncompetitive ness of his MP4-19 is preventing the Scot from demonstrating much to potential alternative employers. McLaren boss Ron Dennis suggested earlier this year that Coulthard might like a testing role with McLaren rather than a race seat with a lesser team, and DC was asked in Monaco if he does actually want to race next year.
�Actually,� he replied, �I'd quite like to be able to race this year�.� [/quote]
[url]http://www.speedtv.com/articles/auto/formulaone/11138/[/url]
:lol:
[quote]Yet another driver having an unhappy time in �04 is David Coulthard, who faces the prospect of imminent unemployment with Juan Pablo Montoya set to replace him at the end of the year. Adding to that worry, the continuing uncompetitive ness of his MP4-19 is preventing the Scot from demonstrating much to potential alternative employers. McLaren boss Ron Dennis suggested earlier this year that Coulthard might like a testing role with McLaren rather than a race seat with a lesser team, and DC was asked in Monaco if he does actually want to race next year.
�Actually,� he replied, �I'd quite like to be able to race this year�.� [/quote]
[url]http://www.speedtv.com/articles/auto/formulaone/11138/[/url]
:lol:
| artkevin | 05-21-2004 09:44 AM |
I would like to see DC in a Williams next year. Maybe paired with Webber or Fisichella. I am surprised he crapped in McLaren's corn flakes like that.
| TimStevens | 05-21-2004 09:49 AM |
Just shows that he's on his way out of McLaren.
I'd actually like to see him at Jag with Webber. Not the fastest cars, but two of my fav drivers at the moment, and I think the team could do well with some further dedication.
I'd actually like to see him at Jag with Webber. Not the fastest cars, but two of my fav drivers at the moment, and I think the team could do well with some further dedication.
| kfoote | 05-21-2004 10:46 AM |
I think It's more likely that you would see DC and Webber together at Williams than at Jag. I don't think DC will be willing to drive for a team that isn't capable of winning, and Jag is still a few years away.
| TimStevens | 05-21-2004 10:49 AM |
What do you mean!? Jacque Villeneuve is totally coming back for Williams next year! :mad:
j/k Having them both at Williams would be even better. But, Jag would be just fine too. Unlike every other team, Jag merchandise is actually affordable at the races :)
j/k Having them both at Williams would be even better. But, Jag would be just fine too. Unlike every other team, Jag merchandise is actually affordable at the races :)
| Bonzo | 05-21-2004 01:14 PM |
no DC is going to Teryoda.
| gtguy | 05-21-2004 01:56 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by erich_sc [/i]
[B]I picked Michael for first... again... can't wait to see the race in Montreal. My first one! :D [/B][/QUOTE]
What a race to have your debutante F1 experience. Canada is awesome, and the fans are crazed. Earplugs. Don't forget earplugs. Those F1 cars are really, really loud. Something about 19,000 rpm from a normally-aspirated engine or something...
Kevin
[B]I picked Michael for first... again... can't wait to see the race in Montreal. My first one! :D [/B][/QUOTE]
What a race to have your debutante F1 experience. Canada is awesome, and the fans are crazed. Earplugs. Don't forget earplugs. Those F1 cars are really, really loud. Something about 19,000 rpm from a normally-aspirated engine or something...
Kevin
| BriDrive | 05-21-2004 02:20 PM |
My personal take on DC....
I really think, by listening to him in several interviews recently, that he is thinking he has 1 maybe 2 years left racing F1. His manager is probably telling him to go to whomever is willing to pay the most for his time left. The question is, which team wants to pick David's mind the most on McLaren. Unfortunately that information was more valuable last year than it is this year.....
I doubt that team is Williams, who probably doesn't have anything to gain from DC's knowledge of McLaren. However, if Williams can put together a strong enough car next year, DC is probably one of the best bets for maximising it.
I would offer DC as a rebuttal to GTGUY's driver ability comment aforementioned.
Allrighty then, let's all sit back and turn up the volume.........
Brian
I really think, by listening to him in several interviews recently, that he is thinking he has 1 maybe 2 years left racing F1. His manager is probably telling him to go to whomever is willing to pay the most for his time left. The question is, which team wants to pick David's mind the most on McLaren. Unfortunately that information was more valuable last year than it is this year.....
I doubt that team is Williams, who probably doesn't have anything to gain from DC's knowledge of McLaren. However, if Williams can put together a strong enough car next year, DC is probably one of the best bets for maximising it.
I would offer DC as a rebuttal to GTGUY's driver ability comment aforementioned.
Allrighty then, let's all sit back and turn up the volume.........
Brian
| TimStevens | 05-21-2004 02:28 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Bonzo[/i]
[B] no DC is going to Teryoda. [/B][/QUOTE]
Rumor has it Ralphie S. said to the toyota management that he didn't want a teammate like DC... i.e. someone who knows hwo to drive.
[B] no DC is going to Teryoda. [/B][/QUOTE]
Rumor has it Ralphie S. said to the toyota management that he didn't want a teammate like DC... i.e. someone who knows hwo to drive.
| Bonzo | 05-21-2004 02:42 PM |
yeah I think you are correct. I went looking for that article after I posted this. I could'nt find. I think it's an age thing goin on:p
| skuttledude | 05-21-2004 02:52 PM |
No offence, but I have yet to see DC do any incredible drives as of late. Nice guy and all but he just does not have championship quality.
I agree that he probablyt only has 1-2 yrs left. A move to Jag could be his best offer. (Minardi may need some help:))
Webber and DC at Jag would be fine.
Its about time DC gave up his sweet seat at McLaren for somebody that'll drive faster. (sry DC)
I agree that he probablyt only has 1-2 yrs left. A move to Jag could be his best offer. (Minardi may need some help:))
Webber and DC at Jag would be fine.
Its about time DC gave up his sweet seat at McLaren for somebody that'll drive faster. (sry DC)
| TimStevens | 05-21-2004 02:55 PM |
Well, he's been consistently outpacing Kimi this year (when he doesn't blow up), and everyone seems to think he's a championship contender. So, that should speak to something.
But, then again, I'm a baised DC fan, have been since he took over for Senna.
But, then again, I'm a baised DC fan, have been since he took over for Senna.
| BriDrive | 05-21-2004 03:36 PM |
Stick Schumacher in the McLaren and he's going to be an also ran at every event this year................The McLaren is lame.....I guess my question for you Davis, would be: what would be considered incredible this year in that MP-19 chariot....DC being more aggressive, taking more risks...................??? With the season and circuits thus far, even the cars that have proved stronger runners than the McLaren have been unable to make passes....
DC is no Schumacher, but he's got LOADS of experience and he is phenomenally fit and he's had to play second fiddle for most of his career save for a year or two....Put him in a Ferrari for a few races and you would see a guy that can fly.
BTW, and noone ever really mentions this, but the slower cars out there are being driven INCREDIBLY hard as they are. It is agonizing to watch, for example, the in car footage of the also rans compared to say Schumacher. Its all relative of course, but if you could lift the face shield you may see Schumacher whistling a Sinatra tune......Pantano, Webber, Fisichella & others....lift the shield and you might think these guys need a doctor judging from the strain on their faces.............The driveability of the car makes a HUGE difference in what appears or doesn't appear to be a drivers' "incredible race".....................
BriDrive
DC is no Schumacher, but he's got LOADS of experience and he is phenomenally fit and he's had to play second fiddle for most of his career save for a year or two....Put him in a Ferrari for a few races and you would see a guy that can fly.
BTW, and noone ever really mentions this, but the slower cars out there are being driven INCREDIBLY hard as they are. It is agonizing to watch, for example, the in car footage of the also rans compared to say Schumacher. Its all relative of course, but if you could lift the face shield you may see Schumacher whistling a Sinatra tune......Pantano, Webber, Fisichella & others....lift the shield and you might think these guys need a doctor judging from the strain on their faces.............The driveability of the car makes a HUGE difference in what appears or doesn't appear to be a drivers' "incredible race".....................
BriDrive
| ShockWave | 05-21-2004 03:44 PM |
Out on a Limb:
Tony Stewart gets pissed by the way MS was looking at him through the television and crashes the race in his 3500 lb stock car. He wrecks the top 7 cars then jumps out and bites off the leg of two nearby photographers before punching out a corner worker.
Sorry couldn't resist.
Honestly, I think Ferarri will run the super softs on MS, regulars on RB, because if MS is in front and the tires go, no one can pass anyway so it doesn't matter. On top of that, MS doesn't have to lead, he only needs to be in the top three. he can use his superhuman in and out laps to pass two cars. The only way I don't see MS winning this one is if someone puts him out at the start, and I don't think anyone wants to sacrifice their career like that.
1. MS
2. FA
3. RB
4. JPM
5. JB
6. JT
7. RS
8. GF
Tony Stewart gets pissed by the way MS was looking at him through the television and crashes the race in his 3500 lb stock car. He wrecks the top 7 cars then jumps out and bites off the leg of two nearby photographers before punching out a corner worker.
Sorry couldn't resist.
Honestly, I think Ferarri will run the super softs on MS, regulars on RB, because if MS is in front and the tires go, no one can pass anyway so it doesn't matter. On top of that, MS doesn't have to lead, he only needs to be in the top three. he can use his superhuman in and out laps to pass two cars. The only way I don't see MS winning this one is if someone puts him out at the start, and I don't think anyone wants to sacrifice their career like that.
1. MS
2. FA
3. RB
4. JPM
5. JB
6. JT
7. RS
8. GF
| gtguy | 05-21-2004 06:14 PM |
I dunno BriDrive, if driving the Ferrari is so easy, and the car is so fast, how come Schumacher beats Barrichello like a drum every time they're out. Admittedly, some races (not all) they have been on different fuel strategies. When they've been straight up, Schumacher has been, during the competitive part of the race, lapping up to a second per lap faster than Barrichello, who is a very good driver.
Yes, the slower cars are more difficult to drive, but those cars are hopeless. Even Schumacher can't make a Sauber win races. But let's take a car that is about a second back in race trim, like BAR. If Button and Schumacher were to swap places, Schumacher would have won a race by now in a BAR. Evidence is that he is just that good.
Coulthard is a nice guy, has that Prince Valiant face and all that, but he just isn't championship quality. He had the chance to step up when Hakkinen was there, and he could have put his stamp on the team when Raikkonen came in. Neither time did he demonstrate the consistent speed necessary to make it work. I think of Eddie Irvine, who, when Schumacher crashed and broke his leg...(what year was that?) was left in the championship lead. He didn't have the speed to seal the deal. M. Schumacher came back and was immediately faster than Irvine, and tried to help him win races, to no avail.
I just think that, if you're going to compare drivers and cars, remember that they say that Schumacher is worth about a second a lap, so I think that if you put him in a car that is almost there, he can take it the rest of the way. Look at what he did that year he heinously rammed Villeneuve. He was leading the championship going into that race, in an inferior car to Villeneuve's Williams, but wrestled it to race wins and the championship lead.
Also, think about the other drivers who have come to a team in decline, and raised it to juggernaut level, who are on the grid right now. There is one...Michael Schumacher. I am admittedly, a fan. When he switched from Benetton to Ferrari, so did my allegiance. But the evidence of his superiority is there.
I think it's funny that Bernie Ecclestone is saying to Ferrari, "Let Barrichello race Schumacher," as if Ferrari is somehow telling Barrichello to drive slow, so as not to threaten Schumacher, which is SO not the case. :lol:
Kevin
Yes, the slower cars are more difficult to drive, but those cars are hopeless. Even Schumacher can't make a Sauber win races. But let's take a car that is about a second back in race trim, like BAR. If Button and Schumacher were to swap places, Schumacher would have won a race by now in a BAR. Evidence is that he is just that good.
Coulthard is a nice guy, has that Prince Valiant face and all that, but he just isn't championship quality. He had the chance to step up when Hakkinen was there, and he could have put his stamp on the team when Raikkonen came in. Neither time did he demonstrate the consistent speed necessary to make it work. I think of Eddie Irvine, who, when Schumacher crashed and broke his leg...(what year was that?) was left in the championship lead. He didn't have the speed to seal the deal. M. Schumacher came back and was immediately faster than Irvine, and tried to help him win races, to no avail.
I just think that, if you're going to compare drivers and cars, remember that they say that Schumacher is worth about a second a lap, so I think that if you put him in a car that is almost there, he can take it the rest of the way. Look at what he did that year he heinously rammed Villeneuve. He was leading the championship going into that race, in an inferior car to Villeneuve's Williams, but wrestled it to race wins and the championship lead.
Also, think about the other drivers who have come to a team in decline, and raised it to juggernaut level, who are on the grid right now. There is one...Michael Schumacher. I am admittedly, a fan. When he switched from Benetton to Ferrari, so did my allegiance. But the evidence of his superiority is there.
I think it's funny that Bernie Ecclestone is saying to Ferrari, "Let Barrichello race Schumacher," as if Ferrari is somehow telling Barrichello to drive slow, so as not to threaten Schumacher, which is SO not the case. :lol:
Kevin
| artkevin | 05-21-2004 08:38 PM |
I agree with Bidrive about driveablity. All you have to do is take one look at Heidfeld in ther Jordan and realise that he is hanging on for dear life. That car is nothing short of a demon! Even the Renualt, which was known for its handling last year, looks like the drivers are having a fist fight with the steering wheel. Meanwhile the red cars look like they are floating. What do you guys attribute that to? I personally think all the teams ( top 4 other then Ferrari) have had to try to make such a leap to catch up with the pace that they could have possibly pushed too hard (MP4-19 and FW26).
| Chromer | 05-21-2004 11:03 PM |
Grip and balance. The Ferrari has more, mechanical or aero, or both, so it can hold the pace being driven at 9/10ths while the others are at 10/10ths or 11/10ths (understeering, getting sideways, spinning off the track...).
Now, why is that? Better aerodymanics? More chassis stiffness? I dunno.
I DO know that MS is adjusting *something* in the cockpit all the way around the track, every lap. Supposedly brake balance. Maybe he's tweaking something else too? (But what?)
Now, why is that? Better aerodymanics? More chassis stiffness? I dunno.
I DO know that MS is adjusting *something* in the cockpit all the way around the track, every lap. Supposedly brake balance. Maybe he's tweaking something else too? (But what?)
| OnTheGas | 05-22-2004 02:07 PM |
Bridgestone vs. Michelin
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[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by gtguy [/i]
[B]Where other drivers will have a fastest lap of, theoretically, 1:20:10, Schumacher will be doing lap after lap at 1:20:11, 1:20:12, 1:20:11, etc, etc. It's like a metronome.[/B][/QUOTE]True, but that's not Michael, it's his tires. The b-stones have a more consistant, and faster race pace, but they do not have that one sticky fast lap when new. The michelins have an incredibly fast first hot lap when new, but they settle into a slower race pace vs. the b-stones.
[B]Where other drivers will have a fastest lap of, theoretically, 1:20:10, Schumacher will be doing lap after lap at 1:20:11, 1:20:12, 1:20:11, etc, etc. It's like a metronome.[/B][/QUOTE]True, but that's not Michael, it's his tires. The b-stones have a more consistant, and faster race pace, but they do not have that one sticky fast lap when new. The michelins have an incredibly fast first hot lap when new, but they settle into a slower race pace vs. the b-stones.
| OnTheGas | 05-22-2004 02:23 PM |
My Carry-over Pics...
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OK, I had a pretty busy week this week, and I wasn't able to update my pics on motorsport.com, so now I'm stuck with my pics from the spanish gp... which were:[list=1][*][b]Micheal[/b][*][b]Rubinho[/b][*][b]Juan[/b][*][b]Ralfie[/b][*][b]Fernando[/b][*][b]Jarno[/b][*][b]Jenson[/b][*][b]Takuma[/b][/list=1]If I had taken my chance to massage my pics, I would have moved Rubinho down a position or two...
As it is, Juan screwed up in qualifying, so he won't podium, unless 6 cars crash at St. Devote on the 1st lap...
Fernando will have a hard time getting around Jarno, so I'll lose points there, also. Rubinho will have a hard time getting near the podium, so I'm losing points there... Qualifying is more than 50% of this race, so I'm screwed. If Michael wins, it will be a brilliant piece of race-craft, though!
I predict that his little brother Ralfie takes out an innocent or two from his 12 position on the grid.
As it is, Juan screwed up in qualifying, so he won't podium, unless 6 cars crash at St. Devote on the 1st lap...
Fernando will have a hard time getting around Jarno, so I'll lose points there, also. Rubinho will have a hard time getting near the podium, so I'm losing points there... Qualifying is more than 50% of this race, so I'm screwed. If Michael wins, it will be a brilliant piece of race-craft, though!
I predict that his little brother Ralfie takes out an innocent or two from his 12 position on the grid.
| Snowphun | 05-22-2004 04:07 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Chromer[/i]
[B] I DO know that MS is adjusting *something* in the cockpit all the way around the track, every lap. Supposedly brake balance. Maybe he's tweaking something else too? (But what?) [/B][/QUOTE]
XM? Sirius?
Any race where MS has to fight is a good one, IMO.
[B] I DO know that MS is adjusting *something* in the cockpit all the way around the track, every lap. Supposedly brake balance. Maybe he's tweaking something else too? (But what?) [/B][/QUOTE]
XM? Sirius?
Any race where MS has to fight is a good one, IMO.
| gtguy | 05-22-2004 06:36 PM |
Re: Bridgestone vs. Michelin
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[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by OnTheGas [/i]
[B]True, but that's not Michael, it's his tires. The b-stones have a more consistant, and faster race pace, but they do not have that one sticky fast lap when new. The michelins have an incredibly fast first hot lap when new, but they settle into a slower race pace vs. the b-stones. [/B][/QUOTE]
But if it's his tires, why doesn't Barrichello have that same near-qualifying pace speed for lap after lap the way Michael does? And why aren't the Saubers faster if the Bridgestones are so great this year?
I think that Bridgestone has definitely improved, but Michelin is still the best tire on the grid. But that new Ferrari is so good, and Schumacher is so on form, that the Bridgestones, even though they aren't better than the Michelin in most conditions, are close enough where the driver can do the rest.
The race is going to be interesting. I'm betting that M. Schumacher has more fuel than any of the other folks in front of him...that's how it's been all season, at any rate. This means that, theoretically, the other folks stop, Schumacher stays out 2-3 laps longer and does his usual near-qualifying pace thing, gets a great stop from Ferrari, and it's game over.
Unless Ferrari was running light to try to get pole, but I don't think that Brawn is stupid enough to have thought they were going to actually get pole, particularly after the first qualifying session.
Monaco is always interesting.
Kevin
[B]True, but that's not Michael, it's his tires. The b-stones have a more consistant, and faster race pace, but they do not have that one sticky fast lap when new. The michelins have an incredibly fast first hot lap when new, but they settle into a slower race pace vs. the b-stones. [/B][/QUOTE]
But if it's his tires, why doesn't Barrichello have that same near-qualifying pace speed for lap after lap the way Michael does? And why aren't the Saubers faster if the Bridgestones are so great this year?
I think that Bridgestone has definitely improved, but Michelin is still the best tire on the grid. But that new Ferrari is so good, and Schumacher is so on form, that the Bridgestones, even though they aren't better than the Michelin in most conditions, are close enough where the driver can do the rest.
The race is going to be interesting. I'm betting that M. Schumacher has more fuel than any of the other folks in front of him...that's how it's been all season, at any rate. This means that, theoretically, the other folks stop, Schumacher stays out 2-3 laps longer and does his usual near-qualifying pace thing, gets a great stop from Ferrari, and it's game over.
Unless Ferrari was running light to try to get pole, but I don't think that Brawn is stupid enough to have thought they were going to actually get pole, particularly after the first qualifying session.
Monaco is always interesting.
Kevin
| 2cam16 | 05-22-2004 07:00 PM |
This is gonna be a good one.Tight track,Michael coming from behind with the young-uns infront. :banana:
| artkevin | 05-22-2004 07:24 PM |
gtguy.
I was under the impression that you have to declare your fuel load to the FIA before the first qualifing session on Saturday morning. I could be wrong.
I was under the impression that you have to declare your fuel load to the FIA before the first qualifing session on Saturday morning. I could be wrong.
| Snowphun | 05-22-2004 07:30 PM |
First qualifing is on Friday. AFAIK tire, fuel and other tweaks can be made until Saturday prior to final qualifing.
| nhluhr | 05-23-2004 12:03 AM |
Hopefully Trulli can make another "Demon start" in renault fashion and do really well. He deserves a race win and he's in the best possible spot to pull it off. My bet is that renault will use Alonso to slow down Michael Schumacher a bit while trulli is in the pits. Trulli clearly has the lighter fuel load so he'll be pitting early and needing MS to be held up in traffic.
I am a huge MS fan, but those Renaults are doing great this year!
I am a huge MS fan, but those Renaults are doing great this year!
| OnTheGas | 05-23-2004 02:38 AM |
RE: Bridgestone vs. Michelin
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[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by gtguy [/i]
[B]But if it's his tires, why doesn't Barrichello have that same near-qualifying pace speed for lap after lap the way Michael does?[/B][/QUOTE]If we toss out 2 of the 5 races run so far, Malaysia because Rubens ran the harder compound, and Imola where Rubens was hung up deep in a pack of Michelin runners, the lap charts of the other races, OZ, Bahrain, and Spain show that Rubens has been running very similar laptimes as Michael. At Spain, though Rubens was on a 2 stopper, and Michael was on a 3 stopper, after Michael's 2nd stop, Ruben and Michael were running the same times.
But you might be missing my point... which is that the Bridgestones are a better tire than the Michelins. The Bridgestone advantage is that they do not go off early in their stint, like the Michelins. While the Michelins are faster on their first hot lap, thereafter all the Michelin teams appear to practice tire management for the rest of the stint. Some of the Michelin runners have mentioned (complained about) this in interviews, and it can be easily seen in graphed lapcharts.
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by gtguy [/i]
[B]And why aren't the Saubers faster if the Bridgestones are so great this year?[/B][/QUOTE]Sauber is a low budget team. Currently, they have more points than Jaguar, and Toyota. Sauber is the fastest of the low budget teams, but then all low budget teams are running Bridgestones, (Minardi, Jordan, & Sauber).
Bridgestones are engineered to work with the Ferrari chassis, whereas the Michelins are designed to work for all their teams' cars. Which is why BAR switched over from B'stones to Michelins this season. The close, and exclusive, engineering relationship between the Bridgestone and Ferrari engineers is part of the reason why Ferrari has been so dominant. The tires may be the single most important part of the suspension system, and Ferrari has an advantage in their very close relationship w/B'stone.
[B]But if it's his tires, why doesn't Barrichello have that same near-qualifying pace speed for lap after lap the way Michael does?[/B][/QUOTE]If we toss out 2 of the 5 races run so far, Malaysia because Rubens ran the harder compound, and Imola where Rubens was hung up deep in a pack of Michelin runners, the lap charts of the other races, OZ, Bahrain, and Spain show that Rubens has been running very similar laptimes as Michael. At Spain, though Rubens was on a 2 stopper, and Michael was on a 3 stopper, after Michael's 2nd stop, Ruben and Michael were running the same times.
But you might be missing my point... which is that the Bridgestones are a better tire than the Michelins. The Bridgestone advantage is that they do not go off early in their stint, like the Michelins. While the Michelins are faster on their first hot lap, thereafter all the Michelin teams appear to practice tire management for the rest of the stint. Some of the Michelin runners have mentioned (complained about) this in interviews, and it can be easily seen in graphed lapcharts.
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by gtguy [/i]
[B]And why aren't the Saubers faster if the Bridgestones are so great this year?[/B][/QUOTE]Sauber is a low budget team. Currently, they have more points than Jaguar, and Toyota. Sauber is the fastest of the low budget teams, but then all low budget teams are running Bridgestones, (Minardi, Jordan, & Sauber).
Bridgestones are engineered to work with the Ferrari chassis, whereas the Michelins are designed to work for all their teams' cars. Which is why BAR switched over from B'stones to Michelins this season. The close, and exclusive, engineering relationship between the Bridgestone and Ferrari engineers is part of the reason why Ferrari has been so dominant. The tires may be the single most important part of the suspension system, and Ferrari has an advantage in their very close relationship w/B'stone.
| pio!pio! | 05-23-2004 02:48 AM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Snowphun[/i]
[B] First qualifing is on Friday. AFAIK tire, fuel and other tweaks can be made until Saturday prior to final qualifing. [/B][/QUOTE]
that's how it was last year. this year they are back to back..but you are still allwoed to change fuel and tweak settings and stuff..dunno about tires but I dont see why not
[B] First qualifing is on Friday. AFAIK tire, fuel and other tweaks can be made until Saturday prior to final qualifing. [/B][/QUOTE]
that's how it was last year. this year they are back to back..but you are still allwoed to change fuel and tweak settings and stuff..dunno about tires but I dont see why not
| finnRex | 05-23-2004 09:02 AM |
Another McLaren letdown weekend. Don't know if it's worse that Fisi knocked out DC. It's good in that it wasn't the motor going blammo, bad in that he *may* have gotten a point or two this weekend. :( Should be interesting to see why they pulled Kimi in(what part of the motor is beginning to fail).
Mika
Mika
| Patrick L | 05-23-2004 09:27 AM |
MS is not going to talk his way out of that one. Him or his car caused the incedent during the safety car. If the FIA pentalizes JPM there is going to be hell to pay. :furious:
| bastich | 05-23-2004 09:55 AM |
Yeah, that replay made it pretty clear that MS was as much to blame as anyone.
| OnTheGas | 05-23-2004 10:19 AM |
Brake Check!
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Brake check in the dark of the tunnel! Doh!
| 2cam16 | 05-23-2004 10:41 AM |
Action filled race for once this year. Nice. :)
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