| PKer | 06-15-2006 02:50 PM |
Isley's a *****!:D
Edit: Forgot the smilie
Edit: Forgot the smilie
| -OneWay- | 07-04-2006 03:48 AM |
[QUOTE=BlueSTI4Me]OneWay,
What model car is this installed on? WRX or STi? Are both sides hitting the bar? What size tires and wheels?
Thanks for any information you provide.
Blue[/QUOTE]
05 STi, yes both sides hit..
275/40 Kumho v710's on Rota 17x8+48
[QUOTE=crystalhelix]Are you seriously saying some rubbing on the inside of your tire caused the rest of the entire tire to heat up and you lost grip? :lol: I am sorry but that makes no sense to me, I would just stay away from trying to drive an autocross course at full lock. :rolleyes:[/QUOTE]
Sorry things don't make sense to you, I've been racing Karts or cars in some form or other since I was 5 years old so I sometimes take for granted the things I have learned over the years.
Have you ever been to an auto-x?
ever notice all the people spraying thier tires down with water? If you did, maybe that didn't make sense to you either so let me explain...
the idea is to remove the heat from the tires in between runs because hot tires wear out faster also when they get overheated they have much less grip and the breakaway on a hot tire is much more sudden and dramatic.
Since Auto-x tires are designed to heat up quick they are paticularly vulnerable to over heating and it is very easy to cook them with or without rubbing. a tire rubbing for a second or two is more than enough to cause problems.
Now, to answer your questions.
yes, heat anywhere on the tire is going to be conducted in to the rest of the tire.
Maybe in magic fairy land where nothing makes sense the heat from the tire being burned across an entire area would magically disappear in to nothingness but here in reality the tire is going to heat up.
yes, you can tell when a tire lets go from being hot. it feels like you run over a patch of grease as compaired to the slow predictable breakaway of a properly heated tire..
as far as staying away from having to do a full lock turn at an auto-x......
that's an ignorant statement but i'll address it anyway.
You don't turn anymore or less than you have to in an auto-x you DON'T really have much of a choice on lines YOU ARE GOING THRU GATES. you either make the gate or don't.
But, Good-Luck with that.. I see alot of DNF's in your future.
What model car is this installed on? WRX or STi? Are both sides hitting the bar? What size tires and wheels?
Thanks for any information you provide.
Blue[/QUOTE]
05 STi, yes both sides hit..
275/40 Kumho v710's on Rota 17x8+48
[QUOTE=crystalhelix]Are you seriously saying some rubbing on the inside of your tire caused the rest of the entire tire to heat up and you lost grip? :lol: I am sorry but that makes no sense to me, I would just stay away from trying to drive an autocross course at full lock. :rolleyes:[/QUOTE]
Sorry things don't make sense to you, I've been racing Karts or cars in some form or other since I was 5 years old so I sometimes take for granted the things I have learned over the years.
Have you ever been to an auto-x?
ever notice all the people spraying thier tires down with water? If you did, maybe that didn't make sense to you either so let me explain...
the idea is to remove the heat from the tires in between runs because hot tires wear out faster also when they get overheated they have much less grip and the breakaway on a hot tire is much more sudden and dramatic.
Since Auto-x tires are designed to heat up quick they are paticularly vulnerable to over heating and it is very easy to cook them with or without rubbing. a tire rubbing for a second or two is more than enough to cause problems.
Now, to answer your questions.
yes, heat anywhere on the tire is going to be conducted in to the rest of the tire.
Maybe in magic fairy land where nothing makes sense the heat from the tire being burned across an entire area would magically disappear in to nothingness but here in reality the tire is going to heat up.
yes, you can tell when a tire lets go from being hot. it feels like you run over a patch of grease as compaired to the slow predictable breakaway of a properly heated tire..
as far as staying away from having to do a full lock turn at an auto-x......
that's an ignorant statement but i'll address it anyway.
You don't turn anymore or less than you have to in an auto-x you DON'T really have much of a choice on lines YOU ARE GOING THRU GATES. you either make the gate or don't.
But, Good-Luck with that.. I see alot of DNF's in your future.
| afpdl | 07-04-2006 04:04 AM |
A ds autoxer here in houston broke the steel contol arms on his 05. He contacted strano, was put in contact with addco and sent his bar back so they can redesign it.
And I have to say in 3 years of autoxing with 2-3 events a month I have never hit full lock on course and have never dnf'ed because of lack of steering angle.
And I have to say in 3 years of autoxing with 2-3 events a month I have never hit full lock on course and have never dnf'ed because of lack of steering angle.
| GreasedLightning | 07-04-2006 08:25 AM |
[QUOTE=-OneWay-]05 STi, yes both sides hit..
275/40 Kumho v710's on Rota 17x8+48
Sorry things don't make sense to you, I've been racing Karts or cars in some form or other since I was 5 years old so I sometimes take for granted the things I have learned over the years.
Have you ever been to an auto-x?
ever notice all the people spraying thier tires down with water? If you did, maybe that didn't make sense to you either so let me explain...
the idea is to remove the heat from the tires in between runs because hot tires wear out faster also when they get overheated they have much less grip and the breakaway on a hot tire is much more sudden and dramatic.
Since Auto-x tires are designed to heat up quick they are paticularly vulnerable to over heating and it is very easy to cook them with or without rubbing. a tire rubbing for a second or two is more than enough to cause problems.
Now, to answer your questions.
yes, heat anywhere on the tire is going to be conducted in to the rest of the tire.
Maybe in magic fairy land where nothing makes sense the heat from the tire being burned across an entire area would magically disappear in to nothingness but here in reality the tire is going to heat up.
yes, you can tell when a tire lets go from being hot. it feels like you run over a patch of grease as compaired to the slow predictable breakaway of a properly heated tire..
as far as staying away from having to do a full lock turn at an auto-x......
that's an ignorant statement but i'll address it anyway.
You don't turn anymore or less than you have to in an auto-x you DON'T really have much of a choice on lines YOU ARE GOING THRU GATES. you either make the gate or don't.
But, Good-Luck with that.. I see alot of DNF's in your future.[/QUOTE]
Here's a tip for you: Driving he proper line through the course is very important at AutoX. Hardly ever is the proper line one that requires full lock. If you are going to full lock and your tires are overheating, you are UNDERSTEERING. Don't blame all your problems on a little rubbing at full lock.
275/40 Kumho v710's on Rota 17x8+48
Sorry things don't make sense to you, I've been racing Karts or cars in some form or other since I was 5 years old so I sometimes take for granted the things I have learned over the years.
Have you ever been to an auto-x?
ever notice all the people spraying thier tires down with water? If you did, maybe that didn't make sense to you either so let me explain...
the idea is to remove the heat from the tires in between runs because hot tires wear out faster also when they get overheated they have much less grip and the breakaway on a hot tire is much more sudden and dramatic.
Since Auto-x tires are designed to heat up quick they are paticularly vulnerable to over heating and it is very easy to cook them with or without rubbing. a tire rubbing for a second or two is more than enough to cause problems.
Now, to answer your questions.
yes, heat anywhere on the tire is going to be conducted in to the rest of the tire.
Maybe in magic fairy land where nothing makes sense the heat from the tire being burned across an entire area would magically disappear in to nothingness but here in reality the tire is going to heat up.
yes, you can tell when a tire lets go from being hot. it feels like you run over a patch of grease as compaired to the slow predictable breakaway of a properly heated tire..
as far as staying away from having to do a full lock turn at an auto-x......
that's an ignorant statement but i'll address it anyway.
You don't turn anymore or less than you have to in an auto-x you DON'T really have much of a choice on lines YOU ARE GOING THRU GATES. you either make the gate or don't.
But, Good-Luck with that.. I see alot of DNF's in your future.[/QUOTE]
Here's a tip for you: Driving he proper line through the course is very important at AutoX. Hardly ever is the proper line one that requires full lock. If you are going to full lock and your tires are overheating, you are UNDERSTEERING. Don't blame all your problems on a little rubbing at full lock.
| makofoto | 07-04-2006 11:38 AM |
A friend (Z06) is digging a groove into his right lower A arm from having to go full lock sometimes. The inside edge of the wheel hits the A arm. We put limiters on his steering arms, but they must have slipped. Colin Chapman/Lotus said that the more steering lock you design into your car, the bigger the slide you can get out of! ;-)
[IMG]http://images15.fotki.com/v232/photos/4/43793/2710569/Henryslide-vi.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://images15.fotki.com/v232/photos/4/43793/2710569/Henryslide-vi.jpg[/IMG]
| ULLLOSE | 07-04-2006 12:28 PM |
[QUOTE=makofoto]A friend (Z06) is digging a groove into his right lower A arm from having to go full lock sometimes. The inside edge of the wheel hits the A arm. We put limiters on his steering arms, but they must have slipped. Colin Chapman/Lotus said that the more steering lock you design into your car, the bigger the slide you can get out of! ;-)
[/QUOTE]
Funny how Thomason ran much wider wheels than your friend on the front of his C5 and almost never hit. Take the right line and don't drive over your head, like he is doing in the pic, and you should not have a problem.
[/QUOTE]
Funny how Thomason ran much wider wheels than your friend on the front of his C5 and almost never hit. Take the right line and don't drive over your head, like he is doing in the pic, and you should not have a problem.
| makofoto | 07-04-2006 12:33 PM |
Friend's car is now ASP, as you know, and has the wider front wheels, as suggested by Gary ... and is digging in worse ... but only on the right hand side. As the photo above suggests, Henry seems to prefer to do big slides on that side! :-) You don't know the limit until you go over it ... when you're starting off. ;-)
| Arnie | 07-04-2006 12:43 PM |
it looks like henry just got out of his Mini and hopped into the Vette, forgetting what its like having rearwheel drive and a gazillion horsepower!
| makofoto | 07-04-2006 03:00 PM |
Power to weight isn't that different between his Twin Turbo Mini and the Z06. The Mini had 275 wheel hp! Hard to put that power down through the little Mini front wheels, even with 245 R tires. Z06 is on 335 Kuhmo 710's.
| ULLLOSE | 07-04-2006 06:02 PM |
[QUOTE=makofoto]Friend's car is now ASP, as you know, and has the wider front wheels, as suggested by Gary ... and is digging in worse ... but only on the right hand side. As the photo above suggests, Henry seems to prefer to do big slides on that side! :-) You don't know the limit until you go over it ... when you're starting off. ;-)[/QUOTE]
True but I doubt they are still as wide as Gary's were. He might want to check the offset, make sure those custom built wheels are the same, I have seen them mess up before. He could also try a small spacer on that side to space it out from the arm more. Or he could just learn to drive it. :lol:
True but I doubt they are still as wide as Gary's were. He might want to check the offset, make sure those custom built wheels are the same, I have seen them mess up before. He could also try a small spacer on that side to space it out from the arm more. Or he could just learn to drive it. :lol:
| GSRNick | 07-04-2006 07:22 PM |
[QUOTE=-OneWay-]05 STi, yes both sides hit..
275/40 Kumho v710's on Rota 17x8+48
Sorry things don't make sense to you, I've been racing Karts or cars in some form or other since I was 5 years old so I sometimes take for granted the things I have learned over the years.
Have you ever been to an auto-x?
ever notice all the people spraying thier tires down with water? If you did, maybe that didn't make sense to you either so let me explain...
the idea is to remove the heat from the tires in between runs because hot tires wear out faster also when they get overheated they have much less grip and the breakaway on a hot tire is much more sudden and dramatic.
Since Auto-x tires are designed to heat up quick they are paticularly vulnerable to over heating and it is very easy to cook them with or without rubbing. a tire rubbing for a second or two is more than enough to cause problems.
Now, to answer your questions.
yes, heat anywhere on the tire is going to be conducted in to the rest of the tire.
Maybe in magic fairy land where nothing makes sense the heat from the tire being burned across an entire area would magically disappear in to nothingness but here in reality the tire is going to heat up.
yes, you can tell when a tire lets go from being hot. it feels like you run over a patch of grease as compaired to the slow predictable breakaway of a properly heated tire..
as far as staying away from having to do a full lock turn at an auto-x......
that's an ignorant statement but i'll address it anyway.
You don't turn anymore or less than you have to in an auto-x you DON'T really have much of a choice on lines YOU ARE GOING THRU GATES. you either make the gate or don't.
But, Good-Luck with that.. I see alot of DNF's in your future.[/QUOTE]
I don't even know where to start with this one but I'll do my best since you obviously need a learning
1. You better research who you are talking to before you spout your mouth off. Justin (crystalhelix) has won a National Tour event in one of the most prepped STi's in the country for BSP. He is also a mechanical engineer that works on a daily basis with polymers and plastics so discussing heat distribution with him is not a good idea.
2. If you are running full lock at an autox then you suck
3. If your tire hits a control arm there is friction (duh) and then there is heat. At autox speeds you need to be in contact with the arm for more a decent period of time to create enough friction that the heat is going to travel all the way across the tire. The CA might hit the tire on a spot the size of a quarter, if you take a propane torch and heat a quarter inch of tire why don't you tell me how long it takes to make the whole tire that same temperature? Minutes, hours? Autox runs are not that long. You are in more danger of actually ripping the tire off the wheel if you generate enough friction (or puncturing it). Comparing this to actual watering down of tires inbetween runs is just stupid.
4. If you are just driving through gates then maybe you would be better at drag racing where thinking and planning is not really needed
275/40 Kumho v710's on Rota 17x8+48
Sorry things don't make sense to you, I've been racing Karts or cars in some form or other since I was 5 years old so I sometimes take for granted the things I have learned over the years.
Have you ever been to an auto-x?
ever notice all the people spraying thier tires down with water? If you did, maybe that didn't make sense to you either so let me explain...
the idea is to remove the heat from the tires in between runs because hot tires wear out faster also when they get overheated they have much less grip and the breakaway on a hot tire is much more sudden and dramatic.
Since Auto-x tires are designed to heat up quick they are paticularly vulnerable to over heating and it is very easy to cook them with or without rubbing. a tire rubbing for a second or two is more than enough to cause problems.
Now, to answer your questions.
yes, heat anywhere on the tire is going to be conducted in to the rest of the tire.
Maybe in magic fairy land where nothing makes sense the heat from the tire being burned across an entire area would magically disappear in to nothingness but here in reality the tire is going to heat up.
yes, you can tell when a tire lets go from being hot. it feels like you run over a patch of grease as compaired to the slow predictable breakaway of a properly heated tire..
as far as staying away from having to do a full lock turn at an auto-x......
that's an ignorant statement but i'll address it anyway.
You don't turn anymore or less than you have to in an auto-x you DON'T really have much of a choice on lines YOU ARE GOING THRU GATES. you either make the gate or don't.
But, Good-Luck with that.. I see alot of DNF's in your future.[/QUOTE]
I don't even know where to start with this one but I'll do my best since you obviously need a learning
1. You better research who you are talking to before you spout your mouth off. Justin (crystalhelix) has won a National Tour event in one of the most prepped STi's in the country for BSP. He is also a mechanical engineer that works on a daily basis with polymers and plastics so discussing heat distribution with him is not a good idea.
2. If you are running full lock at an autox then you suck
3. If your tire hits a control arm there is friction (duh) and then there is heat. At autox speeds you need to be in contact with the arm for more a decent period of time to create enough friction that the heat is going to travel all the way across the tire. The CA might hit the tire on a spot the size of a quarter, if you take a propane torch and heat a quarter inch of tire why don't you tell me how long it takes to make the whole tire that same temperature? Minutes, hours? Autox runs are not that long. You are in more danger of actually ripping the tire off the wheel if you generate enough friction (or puncturing it). Comparing this to actual watering down of tires inbetween runs is just stupid.
4. If you are just driving through gates then maybe you would be better at drag racing where thinking and planning is not really needed
| makofoto | 07-04-2006 07:49 PM |
[QUOTE]Or he could just learn to drive it. :lol:[/QUOTE]
Ouch ... kick a man with a compound fracture when he's on the ground! Hey ... he WAS learning, and he'll be back, slowly, perhaps starting this weekend. ;) When Ken was co-driving that car, he was 3, then 2 and finally one second behind him ...
He's copying Gary too much however. Now he doesn't want to load up the pick-up and trailer and is going to start driving the Vette on it's 710's to CA Spdwy from Burbank. :(
What's this got to do with STRANO's bars anyway! Jason ... stop lurking over here, otherwise people are going to start believing the rumors about your next car! :D
Ouch ... kick a man with a compound fracture when he's on the ground! Hey ... he WAS learning, and he'll be back, slowly, perhaps starting this weekend. ;) When Ken was co-driving that car, he was 3, then 2 and finally one second behind him ...
He's copying Gary too much however. Now he doesn't want to load up the pick-up and trailer and is going to start driving the Vette on it's 710's to CA Spdwy from Burbank. :(
What's this got to do with STRANO's bars anyway! Jason ... stop lurking over here, otherwise people are going to start believing the rumors about your next car! :D
| crystalhelix | 07-04-2006 08:15 PM |
[QUOTE=-OneWay-]05 STi, yes both sides hit..
275/40 Kumho v710's on Rota 17x8+48
Sorry things don't make sense to you, I've been racing Karts or cars in some form or other since I was 5 years old so I sometimes take for granted the things I have learned over the years.
Have you ever been to an auto-x?
ever notice all the people spraying thier tires down with water? If you did, maybe that didn't make sense to you either so let me explain...
the idea is to remove the heat from the tires in between runs because hot tires wear out faster also when they get overheated they have much less grip and the breakaway on a hot tire is much more sudden and dramatic.
Since Auto-x tires are designed to heat up quick they are paticularly vulnerable to over heating and it is very easy to cook them with or without rubbing. a tire rubbing for a second or two is more than enough to cause problems.
Now, to answer your questions.
yes, heat anywhere on the tire is going to be conducted in to the rest of the tire.
Maybe in magic fairy land where nothing makes sense the heat from the tire being burned across an entire area would magically disappear in to nothingness but here in reality the tire is going to heat up.
yes, you can tell when a tire lets go from being hot. it feels like you run over a patch of grease as compaired to the slow predictable breakaway of a properly heated tire..
as far as staying away from having to do a full lock turn at an auto-x......
that's an ignorant statement but i'll address it anyway.
You don't turn anymore or less than you have to in an auto-x you DON'T really have much of a choice on lines YOU ARE GOING THRU GATES. you either make the gate or don't.
But, Good-Luck with that.. I see alot of DNF's in your future.[/QUOTE]
I didn't mean to start anything negative here...
One thing to check to add some positivity to this argument is how much rubbing you are getting on the sway vs. strut. On the STi's running AS on 275's there is barely more than a couple credit-cards worth of room under the fenders. Rubbing on the strut for an entire run sounds more like the culprit to heating up an entire tire. FWIW I run 275's and 315's and I do make slight contact with the sway but it only looks like from when I am turning around in grid in a tight spot.
peace,
Justin
275/40 Kumho v710's on Rota 17x8+48
Sorry things don't make sense to you, I've been racing Karts or cars in some form or other since I was 5 years old so I sometimes take for granted the things I have learned over the years.
Have you ever been to an auto-x?
ever notice all the people spraying thier tires down with water? If you did, maybe that didn't make sense to you either so let me explain...
the idea is to remove the heat from the tires in between runs because hot tires wear out faster also when they get overheated they have much less grip and the breakaway on a hot tire is much more sudden and dramatic.
Since Auto-x tires are designed to heat up quick they are paticularly vulnerable to over heating and it is very easy to cook them with or without rubbing. a tire rubbing for a second or two is more than enough to cause problems.
Now, to answer your questions.
yes, heat anywhere on the tire is going to be conducted in to the rest of the tire.
Maybe in magic fairy land where nothing makes sense the heat from the tire being burned across an entire area would magically disappear in to nothingness but here in reality the tire is going to heat up.
yes, you can tell when a tire lets go from being hot. it feels like you run over a patch of grease as compaired to the slow predictable breakaway of a properly heated tire..
as far as staying away from having to do a full lock turn at an auto-x......
that's an ignorant statement but i'll address it anyway.
You don't turn anymore or less than you have to in an auto-x you DON'T really have much of a choice on lines YOU ARE GOING THRU GATES. you either make the gate or don't.
But, Good-Luck with that.. I see alot of DNF's in your future.[/QUOTE]
I didn't mean to start anything negative here...
One thing to check to add some positivity to this argument is how much rubbing you are getting on the sway vs. strut. On the STi's running AS on 275's there is barely more than a couple credit-cards worth of room under the fenders. Rubbing on the strut for an entire run sounds more like the culprit to heating up an entire tire. FWIW I run 275's and 315's and I do make slight contact with the sway but it only looks like from when I am turning around in grid in a tight spot.
peace,
Justin
| pignoseSTI | 07-05-2006 02:55 AM |
Well my Dad created some endlinks for my STI, as he didn't like the bushing type of endlinks, especially after he read of the control arm tab problems. So he welded up a set of brackets and bought some spherical bearing endlinks with teflon races, and everything seems great so far! Take a look here and tell me what you think. [url]http:[email�protected]/album?.dir=/d0dbscd&.src=ph&.tok=phBjgIFBCdrLlhEW[/url]
| subieworx | 07-05-2006 08:21 AM |
I still don't understand why the ends of the bar were not bent 90* from where they are. That would solve all the problems.
| crystalhelix | 07-05-2006 08:43 AM |
[QUOTE=pignoseSTI]Well my Dad created some endlinks for my STI, as he didn't like the bushing type of endlinks, especially after he read of the control arm tab problems. So he welded up a set of brackets and bought some spherical bearing endlinks with teflon races, and everything seems great so far! Take a look here and tell me what you think. [url]http:[email�protected]/album?.dir=/d0dbscd&.src=ph&.tok=phBjgIFBCdrLlhEW[/url][/QUOTE]
So give us a price...that looks cool. nice work. :devil: ;)
So give us a price...that looks cool. nice work. :devil: ;)
| kursplat | 07-05-2006 09:55 AM |
looks good, how about a pic with the car on the ground ? basically what i'm going to do when i get time
tia
tia
| ULLLOSE | 07-05-2006 01:06 PM |
[QUOTE=makofoto]What's this got to do with STRANO's bars anyway! Jason ... stop lurking over here, otherwise people are going to start believing the rumors about your next car! :D[/QUOTE]
You are the one that took it off topic with your friends C5 arm pic and story.
You are the one that took it off topic with your friends C5 arm pic and story.
| ULLLOSE | 07-05-2006 01:10 PM |
Before: weak @ss Fbody type endlink [url]http://powergridinc.com/swaybar1_big.asp[/url]
After: adjustable mono ball [url]http://powergridinc.com/swaybar2_big.asp[/url]
These guy do not list a Subi app but I am sure if you call them with the size you need they could build something for you.
After: adjustable mono ball [url]http://powergridinc.com/swaybar2_big.asp[/url]
These guy do not list a Subi app but I am sure if you call them with the size you need they could build something for you.
| pignoseSTI | 07-05-2006 04:15 PM |
Thanks for the feedback guys. Kursplat I added more pics to my photo album of the car on the ground. This design is pretty much a bolt on, except you have to trim a bit of the strano bar end to give clearance to the endlink. The previous design my dad made was a true bolt on, however at full lock my 17x8 et48 wheel would just barely hit the bottom of the endlink, though my 17x9 et 45 wheels did not. If anyone is willing to cut the strano bar like in the pic I can have have my dad make a couple more sets, as he bought extra endlinks just in case. As for the pricing i'll have to ask him how much everything cost, but I would assume cheaper than say a set of Kartboy endlinks
| stretchsje | 07-06-2006 09:46 PM |
I'm interested. :)
| jweiss | 07-07-2006 08:58 AM |
[QUOTE=makofoto]A friend (Z06) is digging a groove into his right lower A arm from having to go full lock sometimes. The inside edge of the wheel hits the A arm. We put limiters on his steering arms, but they must have slipped.[/QUOTE]
My friend owns this company - makes a nice set of bars for the C5/C6 vettes.
[url]www.pfasome shop.com[/url]
I told him that he should look into make a similar product for the STi :)
My friend owns this company - makes a nice set of bars for the C5/C6 vettes.
[url]www.pfasome shop.com[/url]
I told him that he should look into make a similar product for the STi :)
| AndrewSS | 07-11-2006 03:18 PM |
Well, join me to the club of broken control arms......
my driver side control arm endlink tab snapped on track yesterday at gingerman.
I got a 05 STi, I am using 245/40 yoko advan neovas with the strano bar up front, WL 24mm RSB, noltec front plates (-2.7) then basically all stock every where else (stock struts/springs).
Pictures:
[img]http://img129.imageshack.us/img129/6886/dscn16009ws.jpg[/img]
[img]http://img65.imageshack.us/img65/1236/dscn16013jf.jpg[/img]
[img]http://img65.imageshack.us/img65/705/dscn16021oe.jpg[/img]
Well, I am quite pissed, I dont think I would recommend this bar to anyone except those running stiff coilovers and probably on street tires (well, I guess that means STU people) I guess if you have stiff coilovers and R-comps you could be ok, but I would be nervous.
I think it sucks that you gotta replace the endlink bushings atleast every 6 months to keep it working decent (I think that is kinda what happened to me, the bushings got old and let the bar slap the endlink bracket pretty good).
Anyway, I am PISSED I replaced my old WL bar with this strano thing, its a BAD design for a cast aluminum control arm - several people commented that they thought the endlink was pretty sad at the track.
Oh well - gotta pay to play, sucks for sure though. But there is NO doubt I am switching back to the whiteline 27-29mm bar after this crap.
my driver side control arm endlink tab snapped on track yesterday at gingerman.
I got a 05 STi, I am using 245/40 yoko advan neovas with the strano bar up front, WL 24mm RSB, noltec front plates (-2.7) then basically all stock every where else (stock struts/springs).
Pictures:
[img]http://img129.imageshack.us/img129/6886/dscn16009ws.jpg[/img]
[img]http://img65.imageshack.us/img65/1236/dscn16013jf.jpg[/img]
[img]http://img65.imageshack.us/img65/705/dscn16021oe.jpg[/img]
Well, I am quite pissed, I dont think I would recommend this bar to anyone except those running stiff coilovers and probably on street tires (well, I guess that means STU people) I guess if you have stiff coilovers and R-comps you could be ok, but I would be nervous.
I think it sucks that you gotta replace the endlink bushings atleast every 6 months to keep it working decent (I think that is kinda what happened to me, the bushings got old and let the bar slap the endlink bracket pretty good).
Anyway, I am PISSED I replaced my old WL bar with this strano thing, its a BAD design for a cast aluminum control arm - several people commented that they thought the endlink was pretty sad at the track.
Oh well - gotta pay to play, sucks for sure though. But there is NO doubt I am switching back to the whiteline 27-29mm bar after this crap.
| Crash477 | 07-11-2006 03:58 PM |
I am pretty sure I am taking my strano bar off and going to a WL 27. It hits my driver side control arm as well, and makes alot of noise.. sooner or later something is going to break.
| Sideshowbob | 07-11-2006 04:27 PM |
[QUOTE=sstrano]The bushings do not soften the rate of the bar in the least..... The stiffness of the bar is derived from the bar, not the bushings. Also, the bushigns are a very hard urethane, not a soft and squishy rubber, so bar reaction remains very quick. Once any slop is taken up from whatever bushings exist in the ends, the bar rate is the bar rate, even if you we were using some extremely soft rubber.
I reiterate we do not use rubber, but urethane and strongly suggest there be no slop or play in the endlinks, lest you get a sudden and nasty spike in bar rate.[/QUOTE]oh rly?
[QUOTE=AndrewSS]
I think it sucks that you gotta replace the endlink bushings atleast every 6 months to keep it working decent (I think that is kinda what happened to me, the bushings got old and let the bar slap the endlink bracket pretty good).
[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=AndrewSS]
Anyway, I am PISSED I replaced my old WL bar with this strano thing, its a BAD design for a cast aluminum control arm - several people commented that they thought the endlink was pretty sad at the track.
[/QUOTE]
WTpostaboutghettolinks
[QUOTE=AndrewSS]
I am not trying to provoke anything, just saying (btw, I like my strano, the troubles were worth it)[/QUOTE]
Are they Still? ;)
I reiterate we do not use rubber, but urethane and strongly suggest there be no slop or play in the endlinks, lest you get a sudden and nasty spike in bar rate.[/QUOTE]oh rly?
[QUOTE=AndrewSS]
I think it sucks that you gotta replace the endlink bushings atleast every 6 months to keep it working decent (I think that is kinda what happened to me, the bushings got old and let the bar slap the endlink bracket pretty good).
[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=AndrewSS]
Anyway, I am PISSED I replaced my old WL bar with this strano thing, its a BAD design for a cast aluminum control arm - several people commented that they thought the endlink was pretty sad at the track.
[/QUOTE]
WTpostaboutghettolinks
[QUOTE=AndrewSS]
I am not trying to provoke anything, just saying (btw, I like my strano, the troubles were worth it)[/QUOTE]
Are they Still? ;)
| AndrewSS | 07-11-2006 04:27 PM |
^ uhhh NO, hey I was referring to the steering rack braket bolts, not the freaking control arm failure.
| wrxkix | 07-11-2006 04:33 PM |
Just an update. Since I reinforced the mounting tab, then redesigned the endlink, I have been to one 2-day event and a Prosolo and everything held up fine. With the adjustments I made I feel very comfortable I will not have any further issues. But I would not recommend running the bar in the stock configuration. Above is the same issue I encountered before the extra bracing. Sorry to hear about the bad luck and good luck to all, which ever way you chose to go.
AndrewSS
As you can see in your pics the bar was contacting the mounting bracket and the washers were rubbing as well. Those were the items I addressed by redesigning the endlink to get the bar away from the bracket. Triangulating the bracket was just as important to keep the bar from getting leverage on the bracket at the sway bar tab.
AndrewSS
As you can see in your pics the bar was contacting the mounting bracket and the washers were rubbing as well. Those were the items I addressed by redesigning the endlink to get the bar away from the bracket. Triangulating the bracket was just as important to keep the bar from getting leverage on the bracket at the sway bar tab.
| Draken | 07-11-2006 04:34 PM |
IBitsbecauseyourunstockspringseventhoughthebarissoldforAstock
| DrBiggly | 07-11-2006 04:37 PM |
AndrewSS,
Have you called Strano to mention this failure? I'm expecting another post any time now about how he's never received any calls and that it's all internet conjecture despite pictures.
-Biggly
Have you called Strano to mention this failure? I'm expecting another post any time now about how he's never received any calls and that it's all internet conjecture despite pictures.
-Biggly
| AndrewSS | 07-11-2006 04:39 PM |
[QUOTE=wrxkix]Just an update. Since I reinforced the mounting tab, then redesigned the endlink, I have been to one 2-day event and a Prosolo and everything held up fine. With the adjustments I made I feel very comfortable I will not have any further issues. But I would not recommend running the bar in the stock configuration. Above is the same issue I encountered before the extra bracing. Sorry to hear about the bad luck and good luck to all, which ever way you chose to go.[/QUOTE]
Yeah, I spoke to sam strano and dan from addco and mentioned that some on here have come up with pretty nice solutions to beef up the setup.
I think that strano should include some sort of info on their site that some have had failures with the control arms using this bar. Personally I think really only those with stiff struts should really run it... I used to think I would be totally ok as long as I didnt switch to R-comps... guess not huh :mad: :o
Yeah, I spoke to sam strano and dan from addco and mentioned that some on here have come up with pretty nice solutions to beef up the setup.
I think that strano should include some sort of info on their site that some have had failures with the control arms using this bar. Personally I think really only those with stiff struts should really run it... I used to think I would be totally ok as long as I didnt switch to R-comps... guess not huh :mad: :o
| afpdl | 07-11-2006 04:57 PM |
[QUOTE=DrBiggly]AndrewSS,
Have you called Strano to mention this failure? I'm expecting another post any time now about how he's never received any calls and that it's all internet conjecture despite pictures.
-Biggly[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=afpdl]A ds autoxer here in houston broke the steel contol arms on his 05. He contacted strano, was put in contact with addco and sent his bar back so they can redesign it.
[/QUOTE]
I dont think the no one called excuse works anymore.
Have you called Strano to mention this failure? I'm expecting another post any time now about how he's never received any calls and that it's all internet conjecture despite pictures.
-Biggly[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=afpdl]A ds autoxer here in houston broke the steel contol arms on his 05. He contacted strano, was put in contact with addco and sent his bar back so they can redesign it.
[/QUOTE]
I dont think the no one called excuse works anymore.
| Arnie | 07-11-2006 05:25 PM |
It shouldn't matter if you are running soft suspension, r-comps or whatever. The bar should not be breaking the control arm. Its an improperly designed part for the Impreza, no way around that.
| DrBiggly | 07-11-2006 09:16 PM |
[QUOTE=afpdl]I dont think the no one called excuse works anymore.[/QUOTE]
I don't think the bar so much needs redesigning as the endlinks do. I suppose time will tell for sure though. :)
-Biggly wonders why this didn't show up from a PE's analysis
I don't think the bar so much needs redesigning as the endlinks do. I suppose time will tell for sure though. :)
-Biggly wonders why this didn't show up from a PE's analysis
| Draken | 07-11-2006 11:13 PM |
[QUOTE=DrBiggly]I don't think the bar so much needs redesigning as the endlinks do. I suppose time will tell for sure though. :)
-Biggly wonders why this didn't show up from a PE's analysis[/QUOTE]
Didn't you know? National Champ > Stamped Engineer.
-Biggly wonders why this didn't show up from a PE's analysis[/QUOTE]
Didn't you know? National Champ > Stamped Engineer.
| DrBiggly | 07-11-2006 11:27 PM |
If that's the case then you can't make fun of Hoppe's ball joint extenders as he's got both. Although you can still make fun of him. :p :)
Honestly I think that the product is a good thing; the Subarus need a big ass front bar and the only things keeping this from ultimate greatness are the endlinks and perhaps a clearance issue on 1% of the units (to be expected with ginormous bar sizes really.) Looks like some additional analysis is needed and then the bar will be perfect. :)
-Biggly loves the 36mm front bar in his truck
Honestly I think that the product is a good thing; the Subarus need a big ass front bar and the only things keeping this from ultimate greatness are the endlinks and perhaps a clearance issue on 1% of the units (to be expected with ginormous bar sizes really.) Looks like some additional analysis is needed and then the bar will be perfect. :)
-Biggly loves the 36mm front bar in his truck
| Arnie | 07-12-2006 12:35 AM |
Unfortunately, $hit flows downhill. The bar design is crap(for the Impreza), which necessitates the endlink style they are using, which necessitates the reinforcements that have been made, etc. etc.
I understand there's no need to reinvent the wheel (they use the same designs for the F-bodies) but c'mon, please use the correct wheel design!
Yes, a larger front sway bar is a good thing. But please, just use a tried and true shape that mounts up the same as stock and doesn't damage major suspension components. :p
I understand there's no need to reinvent the wheel (they use the same designs for the F-bodies) but c'mon, please use the correct wheel design!
Yes, a larger front sway bar is a good thing. But please, just use a tried and true shape that mounts up the same as stock and doesn't damage major suspension components. :p
| The_Wolf | 07-12-2006 08:22 AM |
I actually have been watching this thread for awhile and decided to go with the strano anyway...when I was on the phone placing my order, I was told that a new endlink design was due to come out in the next month. Don't have any details beyond that...
| AndrewSS | 07-12-2006 12:42 PM |
^ well I hope you get the "new" design because I wouldnt risk running that bar the way it is now really, it wasnt worth it to me to break the damn control arm plus there is the WL 27-29mm bar that isnt gonna be much different than the strano bar. But like I said if you are using nice stiff struts with this bar maybe you will be ok - but keep in mind you ought to switch those endlink bushings atleast every 6months - hopefully they will revise the endlink bracket so if the bushings degrade some they wont quickly let the bar contact it and stress it even more.
| WRXedUSA | 07-12-2006 01:52 PM |
Sorry for jinxing you AndrewSS.
:lol:
:lol:
| AndrewSS | 07-12-2006 02:09 PM |
^ bah, hey do you wanna sell me your (believe you have it) WL 27-29mm fsb? I am really "happy" that I will probably not be able to get one by my next PE july 29-30th... :( :mad:
| WRXedUSA | 07-12-2006 04:49 PM |
Gruppe-S is out of stock :(
| Nis01 | 07-12-2006 06:03 PM |
I'm making the swtich to Whiteline as well. I can't risk the suspension failure. I am on the waitlist for the next batch of whiteline bars. Sorry for the misfortune Andrew... I've been following your mods for auto-x but the Strano is just going to have to go after reading this... Live and learn. :(
| Chiketkd | 07-12-2006 10:21 PM |
[QUOTE=WRXedUSA]Gruppe-S is out of stock :([/QUOTE]
Call Patrick at [url]www.boxer4racing.com[/url]
I got my 27/29 Whiteline bar from them about 2-3 weeks ago and they still had a couple left. :)
Call Patrick at [url]www.boxer4racing.com[/url]
I got my 27/29 Whiteline bar from them about 2-3 weeks ago and they still had a couple left. :)
| KC | 07-13-2006 07:39 AM |
Look at it this way, you now have a 'fully' independant front suspension! :devil:
| subieworx | 07-13-2006 08:43 AM |
[QUOTE=WRXedUSA]Gruppe-S is out of stock :([/QUOTE]
Everywhere is out of stock. We have 10 or so waiting to get here. The national Whiteline distributors are not expecting them to arrive until August.
Everywhere is out of stock. We have 10 or so waiting to get here. The national Whiteline distributors are not expecting them to arrive until August.
| Chiketkd | 07-13-2006 01:16 PM |
[QUOTE=subieworx]Everywhere is out of stock. We have 10 or so waiting to get here. The national Whiteline distributors are not expecting them to arrive until August.[/QUOTE]
You're right. I just called the guys at boxer4racing.com and they're fresh out as well and not expecting a shipment until late August at the very earliest. I was told that if a group of people really needed the bar asap, they could try to put in an expedited order with Whiteline and get the bars air freighted to the US. They can be reached at: (828) 683-9218
P.S. I don't work for Boxer4racing, but I'm very pleased with their customer service as well as the fact that they're sponsoring great AutoX drivers such as Tara K. and Steve R.! :banana:
You're right. I just called the guys at boxer4racing.com and they're fresh out as well and not expecting a shipment until late August at the very earliest. I was told that if a group of people really needed the bar asap, they could try to put in an expedited order with Whiteline and get the bars air freighted to the US. They can be reached at: (828) 683-9218
P.S. I don't work for Boxer4racing, but I'm very pleased with their customer service as well as the fact that they're sponsoring great AutoX drivers such as Tara K. and Steve R.! :banana:
| subieworx | 07-13-2006 01:18 PM |
Good luck getting them expedited. They are already on a slow boat from Down Under.
| AndrewSS | 07-13-2006 01:51 PM |
:( yeah, I am trying to get a used one or something... ugh this sucks :(
| drees | 07-13-2006 02:58 PM |
Can't you order directly from Whiteline's webstore? [url]https://www.whiteline.com.au/store/[/url]
I priced the BSF36XXZ at AU$451.64 w/shipping which is about US$341.
Not sure how fast the USA "Courier" shipping is, but it will probably be worth it to call them and make sure they have them in stock and find out how fast the "Courier" shipping is.
I priced the BSF36XXZ at AU$451.64 w/shipping which is about US$341.
Not sure how fast the USA "Courier" shipping is, but it will probably be worth it to call them and make sure they have them in stock and find out how fast the "Courier" shipping is.
| subieworx | 07-13-2006 03:14 PM |
Wow, that's like $130 to ship it.
| drees | 07-13-2006 03:19 PM |
Yeah, shipping not cheap overseas especially when it's on a plane instead of a boat, but I'm not positive that the Courier shipping uses a plane or not... I have ordered stuff from Whiteline directly in the past when having trouble sourcing parts from distributors in the US.
| Arnie | 07-13-2006 03:31 PM |
They usually use TNT air couriers to ship, so it can be fairly pricey for that huge bar.
| STFU STi | 07-13-2006 09:59 PM |
[QUOTE=pignoseSTI]Well my Dad created some endlinks for my STI, as he didn't like the bushing type of endlinks, especially after he read of the control arm tab problems. So he welded up a set of brackets and bought some spherical bearing endlinks with teflon races, and everything seems great so far! Take a look here and tell me what you think. [url]http:[email�protected]/album?.dir=/d0dbscd&.src=ph&.tok=phBjgIFBCdrLlhEW[/url][/QUOTE]
This looks like a good solution, almost exactly what I've been thinking about.
Looking at picture 4....
I like how the endlink is angled, so as the control arm pivots, the spherical bearing as it moves.
One difference I was thinking in my plan was instead of using a box/l bracket below the bar... use another spherical bushing going downwards and link that to the dual bushing endlink set-up going to the control arm. this would provide a bit more pivot.
its been a long day, so please excuse my lame explanation. If you like I'll build it, and let you guys know
This looks like a good solution, almost exactly what I've been thinking about.
Looking at picture 4....
I like how the endlink is angled, so as the control arm pivots, the spherical bearing as it moves.
One difference I was thinking in my plan was instead of using a box/l bracket below the bar... use another spherical bushing going downwards and link that to the dual bushing endlink set-up going to the control arm. this would provide a bit more pivot.
its been a long day, so please excuse my lame explanation. If you like I'll build it, and let you guys know
| sil0nt | 07-14-2006 09:34 AM |
[QUOTE=drees]Can't you order directly from Whiteline's webstore? [url]https://www.whiteline.com.au/store/[/url]
I priced the BSF36XXZ at AU$451.64 w/shipping which is about US$341.
Not sure how fast the USA "Courier" shipping is, but it will probably be worth it to call them and make sure they have them in stock and find out how fast the "Courier" shipping is.[/QUOTE]
Groupbuy to save on shipping, anyone? ;)
I priced the BSF36XXZ at AU$451.64 w/shipping which is about US$341.
Not sure how fast the USA "Courier" shipping is, but it will probably be worth it to call them and make sure they have them in stock and find out how fast the "Courier" shipping is.[/QUOTE]
Groupbuy to save on shipping, anyone? ;)
| WL Flatout | 07-14-2006 05:42 PM |
G'day everyone,
Have been updated on your difficulty, Whiteline and Global are trying to work something out to get some stock to you soon at a reasonable price.
Can I suggest that you stay in touch with your local Whiteline dealer or contact Global Parts Source for answers.
Will keep you informed.
Cheers
Jim Gurieff
Whiteline
Have been updated on your difficulty, Whiteline and Global are trying to work something out to get some stock to you soon at a reasonable price.
Can I suggest that you stay in touch with your local Whiteline dealer or contact Global Parts Source for answers.
Will keep you informed.
Cheers
Jim Gurieff
Whiteline
| AndrewSS | 07-14-2006 07:59 PM |
^ cool, let us know what happens!
| Arnie | 07-14-2006 11:15 PM |
Now that is service!
| AndrewSS | 07-19-2006 05:53 PM |
little update: I just got a used WL 27-29mm FSB in today, thankfully! And then I just ordered a driver side STi control arm from [url]www.subarugenuineparts.com[/url] - thanks jamie ;)
Well - so far all is going as planned and the car should be ready for my next autox (29th-30th).
*edit*
I dont know if anyone has posted side by side pictures of the strano and WL bar... but for the hell of it I thought I would share, since I have both lying around for now...
[img]http://img522.imageshack.us/img522/3886/dscn1604av8.jpg[/img]
[img]http://img412.imageshack.us/img412/6733/dscn1605gz3.jpg[/img]
yep, pink with polished bushing markers... lol :p
Well - so far all is going as planned and the car should be ready for my next autox (29th-30th).
*edit*
I dont know if anyone has posted side by side pictures of the strano and WL bar... but for the hell of it I thought I would share, since I have both lying around for now...
[img]http://img522.imageshack.us/img522/3886/dscn1604av8.jpg[/img]
[img]http://img412.imageshack.us/img412/6733/dscn1605gz3.jpg[/img]
yep, pink with polished bushing markers... lol :p
| AndrewSS | 07-24-2006 07:50 PM |
Ok, control arm is on its way!
I gotta question - is there any online tech resource I can look up to get instructions how to do the control arm swap - I looked up some info on it: [url]http://www.clubwrx.net/forums/showthread.php?t=73983[/url]
But I was wondering if there was any online official subaru tech resource to find out exactly how its done on the STi - but then again its a pretty straight forward thing and I will have good help. Anway let me know if you guys got any ideas or advice.
-Andrew
I gotta question - is there any online tech resource I can look up to get instructions how to do the control arm swap - I looked up some info on it: [url]http://www.clubwrx.net/forums/showthread.php?t=73983[/url]
But I was wondering if there was any online official subaru tech resource to find out exactly how its done on the STi - but then again its a pretty straight forward thing and I will have good help. Anway let me know if you guys got any ideas or advice.
-Andrew
| AndrewSS | 07-28-2006 12:05 AM |
Ok, good - my car is repaired in time for the autox on sat and sunday.
here it is:
[img]http://img137.imageshack.us/img137/5877/dscn1606zs0.jpg[/img]
[img]http://img139.imageshack.us/img139/2435/dscn1607bq4.jpg[/img]
[img]http://img233.imageshack.us/img233/2487/dscn1608wn8.jpg[/img]
Glad is back to normal ;)
here it is:
[img]http://img137.imageshack.us/img137/5877/dscn1606zs0.jpg[/img]
[img]http://img139.imageshack.us/img139/2435/dscn1607bq4.jpg[/img]
[img]http://img233.imageshack.us/img233/2487/dscn1608wn8.jpg[/img]
Glad is back to normal ;)
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