| Urban_Scooby | 02-13-2007 11:41 AM |
any N/A autocrossers?
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I just bought my '07 2.5i less than 2 weeks ago and am going to take some time to enjoy autocrossing it. I used to autox my RX-7 a while back. I know lots of WRX and STi guys are running, but what about the N/As???
-Mike
-Mike
| Mavrik | 02-13-2007 11:54 AM |
well its not quite the same but I run my N/A Pontiac Vibe in SCCA STS class along with my friend who owns an N/A Impreza wagon. He's the far better driver but car to car they match up pretty evenly with our respectable mods on.
My suggestion though before you mod the car in any way, run stock and see how it is. I'm sure you will want to add better sway and strut bars... better tires. maybe lower profile tires and larger rims. N/A is a great car. You don't need a lot of power to go fast. A lot of it is driver ability. On the courses I've driven on for autocross... even the STi guys don't get out of second to third. Plus you'll be in a different class and shouldn't be discouraged by their times. :D Compare yourself to those in your class.
And like I said... powerful cars are not always fast. My Vibe autocrosses circles around my wife's stage 2 Legacy GT that can do 13.6 in the 1/4 compared to my 16.8 in the 1/4 :D
Have fun autocrossing. I'm doing it again this year.
on a side note I am getting an STi this spring and will autocross that, bye bye Vibe... :(
My suggestion though before you mod the car in any way, run stock and see how it is. I'm sure you will want to add better sway and strut bars... better tires. maybe lower profile tires and larger rims. N/A is a great car. You don't need a lot of power to go fast. A lot of it is driver ability. On the courses I've driven on for autocross... even the STi guys don't get out of second to third. Plus you'll be in a different class and shouldn't be discouraged by their times. :D Compare yourself to those in your class.
And like I said... powerful cars are not always fast. My Vibe autocrosses circles around my wife's stage 2 Legacy GT that can do 13.6 in the 1/4 compared to my 16.8 in the 1/4 :D
Have fun autocrossing. I'm doing it again this year.
on a side note I am getting an STi this spring and will autocross that, bye bye Vibe... :(
| jeisen | 02-13-2007 12:56 PM |
I ran a few events last year, and am looking forward to getting out as much as I can this year. Enjoy the new car!
| Urban_Scooby | 02-13-2007 01:21 PM |
Very cool. i'm with ya about mods. Originally I bought my '90 RX-7 and modded the hell out of it. Then I got stomped in CSP. So i backed off everything, stayed within C Stock mods and ended up winning the WDCR-SCCA CS Championship as well as the MWCSCC (D.C.) CS championship. Of course, that was in '96, so I'm a damn Noob again. You HAVE to be smooth to win. Mavrik, enjoy the STi!
| Mavrik | 02-13-2007 01:30 PM |
Smooth = Fast is what they stress over and over again. And its true.
Unfortunatly for me I started out with a modified car, I never had a chance to see if everything I did helped. I'm sure it was better then if the Vibe was stock but I plan on being stock with the STi for a while... at least the 2007 year :D I came in second place in STS class last year having never done this before. I personally think the N/A has a slight advantage over say a STi or WRX in that its power is there. No need for high RPM to spool a turbo to get going. Now suspension wise the STi has them all beat. Stock STi suspension is still better then the best suspension parts on a WRX as far as handling that I've experienced.
Unfortunatly for me I started out with a modified car, I never had a chance to see if everything I did helped. I'm sure it was better then if the Vibe was stock but I plan on being stock with the STi for a while... at least the 2007 year :D I came in second place in STS class last year having never done this before. I personally think the N/A has a slight advantage over say a STi or WRX in that its power is there. No need for high RPM to spool a turbo to get going. Now suspension wise the STi has them all beat. Stock STi suspension is still better then the best suspension parts on a WRX as far as handling that I've experienced.
| bl_easy | 02-13-2007 01:37 PM |
I'm N/A and a regular autocrosser. :D
| Calamity Jesus | 02-13-2007 01:56 PM |
There are lots of us here.
Screw the no-mods approach. If it's SCCA Solo, then you're already completely out-gunned in stock class. Aim for minor mods in STS. Swaybars, springs, shocks and tires will make you competitive (assuming your driving is up to it) on a local level without destroying your daily driver.
To elaborate, the camber curve for the front wheel travel is horrible. If you want to maintain any grip (or the tread on your tires) you'll need stiffer springs and a very aggressive front swaybar to minimise roll.
Screw the no-mods approach. If it's SCCA Solo, then you're already completely out-gunned in stock class. Aim for minor mods in STS. Swaybars, springs, shocks and tires will make you competitive (assuming your driving is up to it) on a local level without destroying your daily driver.
To elaborate, the camber curve for the front wheel travel is horrible. If you want to maintain any grip (or the tread on your tires) you'll need stiffer springs and a very aggressive front swaybar to minimise roll.
| SCOOBIEdoo | 02-13-2007 02:01 PM |
check out the first article in THE MONKEY'S TRUNK its the e-zine on the home page.
| cooparu | 02-13-2007 02:05 PM |
N/A cars do fine out there. Whether you're just out to have fun, or looking to mod the car (suspension-wise) and be competitive, just go to an event and take it from there.
Break it in before your first event, and do yourself a favor and get some better tires in the very least. Have fun!:)
Break it in before your first event, and do yourself a favor and get some better tires in the very least. Have fun!:)
| Patrick Olsen | 02-13-2007 02:42 PM |
I have limited experience with the turbo Subies when it comes to auto-x (just a couple fun runs here and there) but I have to say I prefer the N/A power delivery. I've found my car can be quite competitive with the turbo crowd on an auto-x course.
Pat Olsen
'97 Legacy 2.5GT sedan
2006 Mid-Atlantic Subaru Challenge Street Mod Champ (only N/A car of 28 entries in SM)
Pat Olsen
'97 Legacy 2.5GT sedan
2006 Mid-Atlantic Subaru Challenge Street Mod Champ (only N/A car of 28 entries in SM)
| Storm | 02-13-2007 02:49 PM |
We don't need no stinkin turbos..... ;)
Jay Storm
Jay Storm
| Urban_Scooby | 02-13-2007 02:51 PM |
I've been going thru all the break in stuff and break in miles. Going to change the oil tonite. Tires do e a huge difference. I'm actually gonna have fun at a couple autocrosses on the stock tires, then buy some new street wheels and tires and put some autox tires on the stock wheels. I don't know how long she'll stay stock as I figured for fun and looks I was going to mod it. I believe stock the N/A is in GS, correct? I was going to sell my E36 BMW but have since been convinced to gut it and finish building it for my track car. So the majority of the money will go toward that.
I just can't wait to play with the new car! :) Girl friend saw some rally cross vids and said we should do that. Woohoo! Now to find one close by...
I just can't wait to play with the new car! :) Girl friend saw some rally cross vids and said we should do that. Woohoo! Now to find one close by...
| Imprezivblue | 02-13-2007 03:07 PM |
[QUOTE=Urban_Scooby;17038760]I've been going thru all the break in stuff and break in miles. Going to change the oil tonite. Tires do e a huge difference. I'm actually gonna have fun at a couple autocrosses on the stock tires, then buy some new street wheels and tires and put some autox tires on the stock wheels. I don't know how long she'll stay stock as I figured for fun and looks I was going to mod it. I believe stock the N/A is in GS, correct? I was going to sell my E36 BMW but have since been convinced to gut it and finish building it for my track car. So the majority of the money will go toward that.
I just can't wait to play with the new car! :) Girl friend saw some rally cross vids and said we should do that. Woohoo! Now to find one close by...[/QUOTE]
GS is correct.
Check out Tarheel Sports Car Club for rallyx stuff.
There's a ton of N/A 2.5's on here. ;)
I just can't wait to play with the new car! :) Girl friend saw some rally cross vids and said we should do that. Woohoo! Now to find one close by...[/QUOTE]
GS is correct.
Check out Tarheel Sports Car Club for rallyx stuff.
There's a ton of N/A 2.5's on here. ;)
| Mirage | 02-13-2007 03:13 PM |
ST* is action central :D
| 10th Warrior | 02-13-2007 04:03 PM |
[quote]I believe stock the N/A is in GS, correct?[/quote]
only the 2.5L. The older 2.2 & 1.8L are in HS under the Subaru catch-all. [I]Techinically[/I], so is the 2.5i since the GS listing is only for the 2.5RS but I would expect that to be clarified soon.
only the 2.5L. The older 2.2 & 1.8L are in HS under the Subaru catch-all. [I]Techinically[/I], so is the 2.5i since the GS listing is only for the 2.5RS but I would expect that to be clarified soon.
| Scooby South | 02-13-2007 04:07 PM |
[QUOTE=Storm;17038744]We don't need no stinkin turbos..... ;)
Jay Storm[/QUOTE]
:mad: Heeeeeeeeey......:lol:
Former GS/STS/STX N/A RS....;)
Bill
Jay Storm[/QUOTE]
:mad: Heeeeeeeeey......:lol:
Former GS/STS/STX N/A RS....;)
Bill
| sc00ter | 02-13-2007 04:16 PM |
Storz Auto-X's his 05 RS like it's his freakin' job.
| TimStevens | 02-13-2007 07:02 PM |
Haven't been able to much lately, but I have quite a bit in the past
<-----
(n/a MR-2)
<-----
(n/a MR-2)
| kwh29 | 02-13-2007 08:39 PM |
NA cars can do well nationally too - my car was 4th in STX at nationals two years ago (not me driving! I haven't autocrossed more than 5 times in the past two years!) with somewhat less than max prep. Pleiades was the owner then - he was the CCR solo chair (your SCCA region) for the last several years. You won't be able to miss him at an event.
That said, I'm with the people who say keep the car stock for a while - the only thing I'd do to a 2.5i or TS or RS or whatever it's called this week is get as much camber as possible in front and about a degree in rear. Set the toe at 0 all around unless you like killing tires daily driving. Get some Azenis or Hankooks on the stock wheels for autox, get someone's ebay rotas for daily driving duties and you'll be set for lots of fun regionally. It's not even necessary to get a bigger front sway bar, although most people have more fun and eat through tires slower with a big front bar.
--Kevin H.
That said, I'm with the people who say keep the car stock for a while - the only thing I'd do to a 2.5i or TS or RS or whatever it's called this week is get as much camber as possible in front and about a degree in rear. Set the toe at 0 all around unless you like killing tires daily driving. Get some Azenis or Hankooks on the stock wheels for autox, get someone's ebay rotas for daily driving duties and you'll be set for lots of fun regionally. It's not even necessary to get a bigger front sway bar, although most people have more fun and eat through tires slower with a big front bar.
--Kevin H.
| andypress | 02-13-2007 10:47 PM |
Just be prepared for mass body-roll on the stock suspension. After two autox's my re92's had had it.
[IMG]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v320/parasitic/67055230.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v320/parasitic/67055230.jpg[/IMG]
| adhowe70 | 02-13-2007 11:50 PM |
All NA all the time over here. 4 seasons in a 2.5RS and now with something more exotic. NA rocks the casbah.
| Rice & Gravy | 02-14-2007 09:51 AM |
I'll be trying my hand this year in my RS Wagon. It'll be in STS b/c of suspension mods and BBS wheels. My first "event" will be the novice 1 school my region puts on in March. :)
| Calamity Jesus | 02-14-2007 11:02 AM |
[QUOTE=SCOOBIEdoo;17038003]check out the first article in THE MONKEY'S TRUNK its the e-zine on the home page.[/QUOTE]
Good advice.... especially since I'm the one that kicked his ass in STS at the '05 Maggie Valley Subaru Challenge. [/brag] :lol: I stand by my previous suggestion about swaybars shocks and tires.. that's all I've got. The only cars that I can't compete with are the Civic hatches.. but those are STS ringers.
See you at some [url=http://ccrscca.com/]CCR[/url] and [url=http://highlandssportscarclub.com/]HSCC[/url] events, Urban-Scooby. ;)
Good advice.... especially since I'm the one that kicked his ass in STS at the '05 Maggie Valley Subaru Challenge. [/brag] :lol: I stand by my previous suggestion about swaybars shocks and tires.. that's all I've got. The only cars that I can't compete with are the Civic hatches.. but those are STS ringers.
See you at some [url=http://ccrscca.com/]CCR[/url] and [url=http://highlandssportscarclub.com/]HSCC[/url] events, Urban-Scooby. ;)
| Urban_Scooby | 02-14-2007 01:43 PM |
Sure seems to be some smack talkin' in STS. I guess I'll have to see how the car does and figure out where I want to play. :lol:
Beaverboy, you going to CMP this weekend? Since moving from my home track, Summit Point, I have yet to spend time at CMP. I may go check out the races this weekend.
Beaverboy, you going to CMP this weekend? Since moving from my home track, Summit Point, I have yet to spend time at CMP. I may go check out the races this weekend.
| Chiketkd | 02-14-2007 02:25 PM |
[QUOTE=kwh29;17043381]It's not even necessary to get a bigger front sway bar, although most people have more fun and eat through tires slower with a big front bar.
--Kevin H.[/QUOTE]
Big front bar is definitely a huge plus and like you mentioned - it'll help reduce tire wear. One plus about getting a big FSB for the 2.5i/RS is that the bar "to have" can be purchased for cheap from your Subaru dealer - 25mm Tribeca FSB (~$100).
My 27/29mm solid aluminum Whiteline FSB ran me close to $250 + shipping!
--Kevin H.[/QUOTE]
Big front bar is definitely a huge plus and like you mentioned - it'll help reduce tire wear. One plus about getting a big FSB for the 2.5i/RS is that the bar "to have" can be purchased for cheap from your Subaru dealer - 25mm Tribeca FSB (~$100).
My 27/29mm solid aluminum Whiteline FSB ran me close to $250 + shipping!
| Urban_Scooby | 02-14-2007 02:47 PM |
[quote=Chiketkd;17052214]Big front bar is definitely a huge plus and like you mentioned - it'll help reduce tire wear. One plus about getting a big FSB for the 2.5i/RS is that the bar "to have" can be purchased for cheap from your Subaru dealer - 25mm Tribeca FSB (~$100).
My 27/29mm solid aluminum Whiteline FSB ran me close to $250 + shipping![/quote]
Anyone else? For the 2.5i, would I be better off w/ a 25mm vs a 27mm? I'm about to hit send w/o searching. :(
My 27/29mm solid aluminum Whiteline FSB ran me close to $250 + shipping![/quote]
Anyone else? For the 2.5i, would I be better off w/ a 25mm vs a 27mm? I'm about to hit send w/o searching. :(
| Urban_Scooby | 02-14-2007 03:09 PM |
ok, just snuck a few minutes away from work to read thru the sticky on sway bars. lots of info, but definitely helps. i'll have to play a bit.
| Chiketkd | 02-14-2007 03:35 PM |
Is there even a 27mm FSB for the n/a 2.5i? I think Perin makes a 22mm bar, but the Tribeca 25mm is biggest that I know of which is a direct bolt-on for the 2.5i.
| adhowe70 | 02-14-2007 09:48 PM |
In '07, the exhaust on the 2.5i is routed the same was as on the WRX, etc - the left bank wraps around the front to pick up the right bank and then heads back. Its very possible that WRX parts fit '07 2.5i's. Seemed like the only good reason that Subaru would do that to the car.
| ratt_finkel | 02-14-2007 09:57 PM |
I have a pretty large thread on Setting up an RS for G-stock. I haven't updated it in awhile. And I've finally decided to retire the RS from autocross duty after 3 seasons. It just does not have what it takes to keep up with the mini cooper S, %99 of the time.
EDIT: Not to discourage you, but I would highly advise finding another car to autocross.
EDIT: Not to discourage you, but I would highly advise finding another car to autocross.
| Urban_Scooby | 02-15-2007 09:42 AM |
For GS, i don't know of a better autox car than the Mini S at the moment. But I'm not looking to win at Nationals. This is my daily driver, that gets better gas mileage than my Tahoe and is a blast to drive. And I've already written off the GS thing as I can't help but want to upgrade. So I'm gonna have fun playing in STS. And I'll leave the BMW up to track day pounding.
| 10th Warrior | 02-15-2007 09:54 AM |
[QUOTE=adhowe70;17057567]In '07, the exhaust on the 2.5i is routed the same was as on the WRX, etc - the left bank wraps around the front to pick up the right bank and then heads back. Its very possible that WRX parts fit '07 2.5i's. Seemed like the only good reason that Subaru would do that to the car.[/QUOTE]
Really? Intriguing. Only 7 years too late for some of us :)
GS was alot of fun before the LSD'ed MCS. Then it became DS-II. Oh well. SP STi's are alot of fun as well, but I'm back to N/A this year. w00t for Toyota power :banana:
Really? Intriguing. Only 7 years too late for some of us :)
GS was alot of fun before the LSD'ed MCS. Then it became DS-II. Oh well. SP STi's are alot of fun as well, but I'm back to N/A this year. w00t for Toyota power :banana:
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