| ConeMasher | 10-15-2002 10:23 PM |
Building an STX Class Killer WRX (Not a dupe)
Looks like an excited admin deleted the original thread, most likely because it closely resembled the "SM Class Killer WRX" thread.
Read more carefully people.
Rest assured, STX is a _different_ class than SM (Street Mod), and warrants a seperate thread!
Now...
How would one go about building a class killer STX WRX? List out the mods that would allow it to put the smack down in STX.
Final note:
Beware of the future threat in STX... an ultra-light 89-91 base model Civic EF hatch. Fully prepped it will weigh in under 2000 lbs (stock is ~2100). Use the update/backdate rule to drop in the Si drivetrain, and toss on the Falkens and a nice limited slip diff, and that spells trouble.
Read more carefully people.
Rest assured, STX is a _different_ class than SM (Street Mod), and warrants a seperate thread!
Now...
How would one go about building a class killer STX WRX? List out the mods that would allow it to put the smack down in STX.
Final note:
Beware of the future threat in STX... an ultra-light 89-91 base model Civic EF hatch. Fully prepped it will weigh in under 2000 lbs (stock is ~2100). Use the update/backdate rule to drop in the Si drivetrain, and toss on the Falkens and a nice limited slip diff, and that spells trouble.
| DiMensionX | 10-16-2002 12:13 AM |
Heh, thats kinda funny. Glad we didn't have a ton of info in the thread yet!
Shawn
Shawn
| Jeff 2.5RS | 10-16-2002 12:21 AM |
Is money not an object here? If not...
Custon Valved coil overs, cobb sells konis and dms can make a set any way you like. You'll need camber plates front and rear. Oh and wheels/tires. 17" wheels would probably be fine with 225/45/17 falkens, 18" wheels might be offset by their higher weight. Buy the lightest wheels you can find too, ssr's, volks and the such. After that do every other available suspension mod, strut tower bars, lower arm bars etc. Keep in mind that an anti-lift kit and sti control arms are illegal sine they change the geometry of the suspension.
As for engine mods best bet would be a catless up-pipe, racing downpipe with a high flow cat that matches an exhaust. (vishnus would probably be the best as it's 3" all the way from the turbo back), hell you could probably just skip the muffler to while you're at it and install a straight pipe, no need for that weight ;). I don't think you'll be pushing enough power on the stock turbo (and boost controller) to make an intake usefull.
Engine managment-unichip would be the cheapest and probably the easiest, but since money is no object you might as well get a full engine managment system. A tec-III would do nicely, althought I'm sure a tec-II would suffice. Both would be legal as long as you don't change injectors or use them to control boost.
I'm sure there's still quiet a bit you can do, as I think of stuff I'll remember to post it here.
-Jeff
Custon Valved coil overs, cobb sells konis and dms can make a set any way you like. You'll need camber plates front and rear. Oh and wheels/tires. 17" wheels would probably be fine with 225/45/17 falkens, 18" wheels might be offset by their higher weight. Buy the lightest wheels you can find too, ssr's, volks and the such. After that do every other available suspension mod, strut tower bars, lower arm bars etc. Keep in mind that an anti-lift kit and sti control arms are illegal sine they change the geometry of the suspension.
As for engine mods best bet would be a catless up-pipe, racing downpipe with a high flow cat that matches an exhaust. (vishnus would probably be the best as it's 3" all the way from the turbo back), hell you could probably just skip the muffler to while you're at it and install a straight pipe, no need for that weight ;). I don't think you'll be pushing enough power on the stock turbo (and boost controller) to make an intake usefull.
Engine managment-unichip would be the cheapest and probably the easiest, but since money is no object you might as well get a full engine managment system. A tec-III would do nicely, althought I'm sure a tec-II would suffice. Both would be legal as long as you don't change injectors or use them to control boost.
I'm sure there's still quiet a bit you can do, as I think of stuff I'll remember to post it here.
-Jeff
| Gary (gg) | 10-16-2002 02:06 AM |
Well, let us start with suspension first. I would go with a set of Tein RA coilovers. Aluminum body and inverted strut design. The WRX that finished 3rd at Nats in STX was using them. I would actually remove the swaybars completely. I would swap the springs the 8 kg/mm to the rear and 6 kg/mm to the front. If a car pushes then a higher spring rate in the rear is called for. Corner weigh, lowering the car ~2", and align the car, max neg camber and zero toe all around to start. Volk TE-37's 8" x 15", which fit over the stock rotors, with a set of BF Goodrich G-Force KD's in the 225/50R15. SS brakelines and a set of Hawk HP+ pads, Car and Driver tests show that at autocross speeds the Hawks braked as well as the big brake kits.
Second area is power. A Godspeed uppipe/downpipe with a high flow cat with a Kakimoto or JIC titanium catback exhaust. An Injen intake to have the air go in and a Cusco, Maxim, or HKS header out the other end. I don't think a TEC 3 is legal for STX but the Unichip is.
Third area is miscellaneous stuff. I would go with Bride Brix seats, they have a lot of side and thigh bolster. STI linkage, guages, TRW Sabelt harness, Momo Race Air leather shift knob, shop manuals, race #'s,
Second area is power. A Godspeed uppipe/downpipe with a high flow cat with a Kakimoto or JIC titanium catback exhaust. An Injen intake to have the air go in and a Cusco, Maxim, or HKS header out the other end. I don't think a TEC 3 is legal for STX but the Unichip is.
Third area is miscellaneous stuff. I would go with Bride Brix seats, they have a lot of side and thigh bolster. STI linkage, guages, TRW Sabelt harness, Momo Race Air leather shift knob, shop manuals, race #'s,
| zzyzx | 10-16-2002 03:31 AM |
Figure I better post here quick as it seems to be a "local" thread. ;)
Brakes - Stoptech. Perhaps the STi dual-pistons in the rear. You need to be able to stop that pig, too.
You need to run 245s, too. 225s aren't gonna cut it. This will require 8" wide wheels. Harder to find a combo that'll work for this, methinks.
- Steve
Brakes - Stoptech. Perhaps the STi dual-pistons in the rear. You need to be able to stop that pig, too.
You need to run 245s, too. 225s aren't gonna cut it. This will require 8" wide wheels. Harder to find a combo that'll work for this, methinks.
- Steve
| DiMensionX | 10-16-2002 03:40 AM |
Ummm, I run 245/45/17 Kumho Victor Racer's on 17x7.5" SSR Comp's. I have the Tien HA Coilovers as well.
Shawn
Shawn
| lil'redwagon | 10-16-2002 04:20 AM |
uuummm...245's aren't legal in STX are they?!?!?
| KC | 10-16-2002 07:58 AM |
Other than the fact that you need to start with a wagon, I ain't tellin!!! :p
I actually don't know yet... but I can tell you this, DMS40's and stock exhaust are NOT the way to go.
I'll be working on something a little different over the winter. ;)
If 245's become legal, then I'll be running them.
Also, even though I have the STi 4-pots, again, this is my opinion, I think you'd be better served putting the $$ for big brakes elsewhere and just upgrade the pads on the stock rotors. 4pots work best at speeds over 100, at an auto-x the stockers should work fine. You also don't have to go crazy trying to find wheels to fit. :)
--kC
I actually don't know yet... but I can tell you this, DMS40's and stock exhaust are NOT the way to go.
I'll be working on something a little different over the winter. ;)
If 245's become legal, then I'll be running them.
Also, even though I have the STi 4-pots, again, this is my opinion, I think you'd be better served putting the $$ for big brakes elsewhere and just upgrade the pads on the stock rotors. 4pots work best at speeds over 100, at an auto-x the stockers should work fine. You also don't have to go crazy trying to find wheels to fit. :)
--kC
| Orion | 10-16-2002 08:09 AM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by DiMensionX [/i]
[B]Ummm, I run 245/45/17 Kumho Victor Racer's on 17x7.5" SSR Comp's. I have the Tien HA Coilovers as well.
Shawn [/B][/QUOTE]
I hope you're running in SM.
I'm with KC... [b]IF[/b] 245's become legal, then i'll get some.
[B]Ummm, I run 245/45/17 Kumho Victor Racer's on 17x7.5" SSR Comp's. I have the Tien HA Coilovers as well.
Shawn [/B][/QUOTE]
I hope you're running in SM.
I'm with KC... [b]IF[/b] 245's become legal, then i'll get some.
| trhoppe | 10-16-2002 08:59 AM |
Same here. I still have 3 sets of 16" wheels laying around. IF the 245s become legal I will be running 245/40/17 BFG KDs at all 4 corners, otherwise I will stick with the 215/45 azenis and get the gearing.
I will share a bit with my car, that is almost done :devil:
suspension - Tein with custom spring rates, MRT plates at all 4 corners, whiteline big front and rear bars
brakes - stainless lines, R4S pads, big brake ducting (mostly for road race, but still will come in handy)
engine - intake, stock manifolds, uppipe, custom downpipe, 3" high flow cat, 3" straight pipe with supertrapp tip, unorthodox pulleys, utec
misc - some kind of seat (havent decided yet), boost, egt, oil press gauges, custom short shifter,
Should net 220-230whp on stock boost with 100 octane.
fun fun.
None of this matters if you can't drive though :lol: :lol:
Work on the nut behind the wheel before you work on ANYTHING else. Guaranteed someone like Tim Aro could jump in a stock WRX with azenis and whoop on on almost any STX car.
-Tom
I will share a bit with my car, that is almost done :devil:
suspension - Tein with custom spring rates, MRT plates at all 4 corners, whiteline big front and rear bars
brakes - stainless lines, R4S pads, big brake ducting (mostly for road race, but still will come in handy)
engine - intake, stock manifolds, uppipe, custom downpipe, 3" high flow cat, 3" straight pipe with supertrapp tip, unorthodox pulleys, utec
misc - some kind of seat (havent decided yet), boost, egt, oil press gauges, custom short shifter,
Should net 220-230whp on stock boost with 100 octane.
fun fun.
None of this matters if you can't drive though :lol: :lol:
Work on the nut behind the wheel before you work on ANYTHING else. Guaranteed someone like Tim Aro could jump in a stock WRX with azenis and whoop on on almost any STX car.
-Tom
| elgorey | 10-16-2002 11:00 AM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by DiMensionX [/i]
[B]Ummm, I run 245/45/17 Kumho Victor Racer's on 17x7.5" SSR [/B][/QUOTE]
Because those are R-tires, which can be mounted to a narrower width rim than a street tire. All 245 street tires I have seen require at least a 8" rim.
If 245s become legal then STX will become a tire budget battle :(
[B]Ummm, I run 245/45/17 Kumho Victor Racer's on 17x7.5" SSR [/B][/QUOTE]
Because those are R-tires, which can be mounted to a narrower width rim than a street tire. All 245 street tires I have seen require at least a 8" rim.
If 245s become legal then STX will become a tire budget battle :(
| elgorey | 10-16-2002 11:09 AM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by trhoppe [/i]
suspension - Tein with custom spring rates, [/quote]
what rates are you going with if you dont mind me asking?
[quote] unorthodox pulleys, utec[/QUOTE]
are the pulleys legal now?
How are you working the UTEC so that the boost control is disabled and bypassed?
My setup for next year , will (hopefully) be
Cusco Zero2R with 6k front, 7k rear
cusco front swaybar, front and rear strut bars
whiteline 26mm rear swaybar
turboXS turboback
equal length manifold (if the cheap one ever becomes available)
225 Azenis on 17x7.5 rotas (no 245 for me)
no unichip or engine management
but being only my 2nd season of AutoX, the driver is going to be the slowest part of the car :cool: I still plan on going to a couple national events though :)
Evan
suspension - Tein with custom spring rates, [/quote]
what rates are you going with if you dont mind me asking?
[quote] unorthodox pulleys, utec[/QUOTE]
are the pulleys legal now?
How are you working the UTEC so that the boost control is disabled and bypassed?
My setup for next year , will (hopefully) be
Cusco Zero2R with 6k front, 7k rear
cusco front swaybar, front and rear strut bars
whiteline 26mm rear swaybar
turboXS turboback
equal length manifold (if the cheap one ever becomes available)
225 Azenis on 17x7.5 rotas (no 245 for me)
no unichip or engine management
but being only my 2nd season of AutoX, the driver is going to be the slowest part of the car :cool: I still plan on going to a couple national events though :)
Evan
| trhoppe | 10-16-2002 11:22 AM |
[QUOTE]what rates are you going with if you dont mind me asking?[/QUOTE] I'll never tell! :devil:
Actually I will need to do some testing before I settle on a spring rate, so I don't knwo yet.
[QUOTE]are the pulleys legal now?[/QUOTE] The accessory pulleys are legal NOW, the crank pulley will be legal in 03
[QUOTE]How are you working the UTEC so that the boost control is disabled and bypassed? [/QUOTE] I plan on bypassing the utec with the boost solenoid wire. That way the utec CANNOT control boost because the boost solenoid wire will go straight into the ECU and bypass the UTEC. This is a "theory" that I have yet to test because I cannot get my grubby hands on a utec until jan or so. Im going to put a unichip on the car in 2 weeks and get some initial testing done and start a fuel map that I can expand on once I get the utec. I dont think the power will be THAT important. I can probably make almost the same HP with both, on 93 octane, its just the utec will allow me to make a 100 octane map to which I can switch to on the fly. IMHO 100 octane will allow for about 20 or so more HP and torque. Also the UTEC will have launch control and that will work wonders at the Pros.
[QUOTE]If 245s become legal then STX will become a tire budget battle [/QUOTE] Agreed. But you will need 245s in order to win. You CAN mound 245s on a 7.5" wheel no problem. Just like you can mount 225s on a 6.5" wheel.
Actually I will need to do some testing before I settle on a spring rate, so I don't knwo yet.
[QUOTE]are the pulleys legal now?[/QUOTE] The accessory pulleys are legal NOW, the crank pulley will be legal in 03
[QUOTE]How are you working the UTEC so that the boost control is disabled and bypassed? [/QUOTE] I plan on bypassing the utec with the boost solenoid wire. That way the utec CANNOT control boost because the boost solenoid wire will go straight into the ECU and bypass the UTEC. This is a "theory" that I have yet to test because I cannot get my grubby hands on a utec until jan or so. Im going to put a unichip on the car in 2 weeks and get some initial testing done and start a fuel map that I can expand on once I get the utec. I dont think the power will be THAT important. I can probably make almost the same HP with both, on 93 octane, its just the utec will allow me to make a 100 octane map to which I can switch to on the fly. IMHO 100 octane will allow for about 20 or so more HP and torque. Also the UTEC will have launch control and that will work wonders at the Pros.
[QUOTE]If 245s become legal then STX will become a tire budget battle [/QUOTE] Agreed. But you will need 245s in order to win. You CAN mound 245s on a 7.5" wheel no problem. Just like you can mount 225s on a 6.5" wheel.
| elgorey | 10-16-2002 11:37 AM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by trhoppe [/i]
I'll never tell! :devil:
Actually I will need to do some testing before I settle on a spring rate, so I don't knwo yet.
[/quote] awww..come on! I told you mine! ;)
[quote] Agreed. But you will need 245s in order to win. You CAN mound 245s on a 7.5" wheel no problem. Just like you can mount 225s on a 6.5" wheel.[/QUOTE] Really? I was nervous about going under the manuf minimum wheel widths. R-tires I know can take smaller wheel widths due to their construction, but does the same hold true for streets?
Hmmm...maybe I will have to mount up the 245 Kuhmo MX on my rotas
I'll never tell! :devil:
Actually I will need to do some testing before I settle on a spring rate, so I don't knwo yet.
[/quote] awww..come on! I told you mine! ;)
[quote] Agreed. But you will need 245s in order to win. You CAN mound 245s on a 7.5" wheel no problem. Just like you can mount 225s on a 6.5" wheel.[/QUOTE] Really? I was nervous about going under the manuf minimum wheel widths. R-tires I know can take smaller wheel widths due to their construction, but does the same hold true for streets?
Hmmm...maybe I will have to mount up the 245 Kuhmo MX on my rotas
| Orion | 10-16-2002 11:49 AM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by elgorey [/i]
[B] Hmmm...maybe I will have to mount up the 245 Kuhmo MX on my rotas [/B][/QUOTE]
That's what I'm thinking. The MX's won't be at the top of the heap, but they offer a few better sizing options.
At Nationals I'd have to hope I improve dramatically next season AND everyone has a really bad 2 days like I had this year. I [i]might[/i] get lucky and be in the top 10 then.:lol:
PS: Tom - What is your choice for number in STX next season? I still have 5 and Todd Meade has 15...;)
[B] Hmmm...maybe I will have to mount up the 245 Kuhmo MX on my rotas [/B][/QUOTE]
That's what I'm thinking. The MX's won't be at the top of the heap, but they offer a few better sizing options.
At Nationals I'd have to hope I improve dramatically next season AND everyone has a really bad 2 days like I had this year. I [i]might[/i] get lucky and be in the top 10 then.:lol:
PS: Tom - What is your choice for number in STX next season? I still have 5 and Todd Meade has 15...;)
| trhoppe | 10-16-2002 12:02 PM |
[QUOTE]That's what I'm thinking. The MX's won't be at the top of the heap, but they offer a few better sizing options.[/QUOTE] Yup, they will be good for local events. But you will be 0.5 secs back over the same size KDs. IMHO.
[QUOTE]PS: Tom - What is your choice for number in STX next season? I still have 5 and Todd Meade has 15...[/QUOTE] Hahahaha....We may have to armwrestle for it! I'll take anything that has a 5 in it though. Probably will be 5 for everything unless youre there and I'll take 55 or something.....
-Tom
[QUOTE]PS: Tom - What is your choice for number in STX next season? I still have 5 and Todd Meade has 15...[/QUOTE] Hahahaha....We may have to armwrestle for it! I'll take anything that has a 5 in it though. Probably will be 5 for everything unless youre there and I'll take 55 or something.....
-Tom
| trhoppe | 10-16-2002 12:18 PM |
[QUOTE]are the pulleys legal now?[/QUOTE]
This is for STS and STX from howard backing up what I said earlier. Its not "official" until the 03 rule book comes out.
The only pulley that came under question this year is the crank
pulley. All other pulleys can be replaced under the rules. The crank
pulley issue centered around whether the pulley also served as a
damper or balancer. For 2003 all the language that created the
controversy is being dropped so crank pulleys can also be changed no
matter the design or function.
Hope this helps.
Howard Duncan
SCCA Director of Program Development
303-779-6622, FAX 303-694-3654
1-800-770-2055
This is for STS and STX from howard backing up what I said earlier. Its not "official" until the 03 rule book comes out.
The only pulley that came under question this year is the crank
pulley. All other pulleys can be replaced under the rules. The crank
pulley issue centered around whether the pulley also served as a
damper or balancer. For 2003 all the language that created the
controversy is being dropped so crank pulleys can also be changed no
matter the design or function.
Hope this helps.
Howard Duncan
SCCA Director of Program Development
303-779-6622, FAX 303-694-3654
1-800-770-2055
| DiMensionX | 10-16-2002 12:37 PM |
Ok, sorry I posted about my tires as I AM in SM.
Answer about the UTEC, simply tell it to use the ECU for boost control, DONE end of story.
Shawn
Answer about the UTEC, simply tell it to use the ECU for boost control, DONE end of story.
Shawn
| elgorey | 10-16-2002 12:55 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by trhoppe [/i]
[B] Probably will be 5 for everything unless youre there and I'll take 55 or something.....
[/B][/QUOTE]
You better not! ;)
Evan
#55 STX :)
[B] Probably will be 5 for everything unless youre there and I'll take 55 or something.....
[/B][/QUOTE]
You better not! ;)
Evan
#55 STX :)
| PaulC | 10-16-2002 01:04 PM |
Seems everyone is overlooking the importance of a good LSD.
I would put mods in this order of importance:
1) Driver
2) Traction: Tires, Coilovers, Sways (maybe), Quaife LSD
3) POWA: all that turbo stuff
Too much power without an LSD to keep it under control means a very difficult car to drive.
I would put mods in this order of importance:
1) Driver
2) Traction: Tires, Coilovers, Sways (maybe), Quaife LSD
3) POWA: all that turbo stuff
Too much power without an LSD to keep it under control means a very difficult car to drive.
| elgorey | 10-16-2002 01:04 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by DiMensionX [/i]
[B]Answer about the UTEC, simply tell it to use the ECU for boost control, DONE end of story.
[/B][/QUOTE]
No can do, you will get protested. You cant just say "yeah this [i]can[/i] control boost but it isnt. honest" There has got to be no possible way of boost conrol. ie no Unichip boost module, or like what Tom is doing, wiring it so that it cannot control boost.
[B]Answer about the UTEC, simply tell it to use the ECU for boost control, DONE end of story.
[/B][/QUOTE]
No can do, you will get protested. You cant just say "yeah this [i]can[/i] control boost but it isnt. honest" There has got to be no possible way of boost conrol. ie no Unichip boost module, or like what Tom is doing, wiring it so that it cannot control boost.
| Orion | 10-16-2002 01:18 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by PaulC [/i]
[B]Seems everyone is overlooking the importance of a good LSD.
[/B][/QUOTE]
You're right. We are overlooking it due to one big reason, we can't add one to the WRX and stay in STX.;)
[B]Seems everyone is overlooking the importance of a good LSD.
[/B][/QUOTE]
You're right. We are overlooking it due to one big reason, we can't add one to the WRX and stay in STX.;)
| DiMensionX | 10-16-2002 01:18 PM |
I would imagine that TurboXS would be willing to put out a firmware specific to this task, completely eliminating Boost control with that revision.
Shawn
Shawn
| trhoppe | 10-16-2002 01:33 PM |
[QUOTE]I would imagine that TurboXS would be willing to put out a firmware specific to this task, completely eliminating Boost control with that revision.[/QUOTE] I would STILL protest, unless you physically cannot change boost. If its software, it will NOT be legal.
-Tom
-Tom
| PaulC | 10-16-2002 02:11 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by orionf [/i]
[B]
You're right. We are overlooking it due to one big reason, we can't add one to the WRX and stay in STX.;) [/B][/QUOTE]
Really? Doh sorry about that then! What a ripoff! :)
[B]
You're right. We are overlooking it due to one big reason, we can't add one to the WRX and stay in STX.;) [/B][/QUOTE]
Really? Doh sorry about that then! What a ripoff! :)
| elgorey | 10-16-2002 02:43 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by trhoppe [/i]
[B] I would STILL protest, unless you physically cannot change boost. If its software, it will NOT be legal.
[/B][/QUOTE]
Tom the Unichip uses a seperate boost control module which can be taken off, so running a unichip without that would be legal. (example- the vishnu unichip uses an MBC instead of the boost module)
[B] I would STILL protest, unless you physically cannot change boost. If its software, it will NOT be legal.
[/B][/QUOTE]
Tom the Unichip uses a seperate boost control module which can be taken off, so running a unichip without that would be legal. (example- the vishnu unichip uses an MBC instead of the boost module)
| elgorey | 10-16-2002 02:46 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by trhoppe [/i]
[B] Yup, they will be good for local events. But you will be 0.5 secs back over the same size KDs. IMHO.
[/B][/QUOTE] yeah you are probably right. should still be better than (or at least as good as) 225 Azenis
[B] Yup, they will be good for local events. But you will be 0.5 secs back over the same size KDs. IMHO.
[/B][/QUOTE] yeah you are probably right. should still be better than (or at least as good as) 225 Azenis
| trhoppe | 10-16-2002 03:04 PM |
[QUOTE]Tom the Unichip uses a seperate boost control module which can be taken off, so running a unichip without that would be legal. (example- the vishnu unichip uses an MBC instead of the boost module)[/QUOTE] Yes I realize that, but dimensionX was talking about the utec AFAIK. If the utec is plugged into the system and the boost solenoid wire runs through it, that is ILLEGAL because the utec has the capability to change boost. Even if it has different software or firmware.
The unichip w/o the boost module, has no physical way in HELL of modifying the boost and that is what it will take on a national level not to get protested.
-Tom
The unichip w/o the boost module, has no physical way in HELL of modifying the boost and that is what it will take on a national level not to get protested.
-Tom
| zzyzx | 10-16-2002 03:05 PM |
You can not (currently) add/change/do anything to an LSD in an AWD car in STX.
- Steve
- Steve
| ChrisW | 10-16-2002 03:22 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by zzyzx [/i]
[B]You can not (currently) add/change/do anything to an LSD in an AWD car in STX.
- Steve [/B][/QUOTE]
that is not quite true. If you happen to have a AWD car with F/R open diffs, you can add a LSD to one of the axles.
[B]You can not (currently) add/change/do anything to an LSD in an AWD car in STX.
- Steve [/B][/QUOTE]
that is not quite true. If you happen to have a AWD car with F/R open diffs, you can add a LSD to one of the axles.
| DiMensionX | 10-16-2002 05:09 PM |
Tom, yet another reason I just chose to run SM:D .
Shawn
Shawn
| zzyzx | 10-16-2002 06:11 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by ChrisW [/i]
[B]
that is not quite true. If you happen to have a AWD car with F/R open diffs, you can add a LSD to one of the axles. [/B][/QUOTE]
Really? Is this how you interpret the current rule, stated below:
[b]
Only factory limited slip differentials (LSD) are allowed on AWD vehicles, as defined in Section 12.4. For AWD vehicles that did not come with any type of limited slip differential (including center differential or transfer case), a single aftermarket LSD may be added. 2WD vehicles may use any LSD unit.
[/b]
So, how do you convince "others" that the center diff is not a type of limited slip diff? I'm curious to know...
- Steve
[B]
that is not quite true. If you happen to have a AWD car with F/R open diffs, you can add a LSD to one of the axles. [/B][/QUOTE]
Really? Is this how you interpret the current rule, stated below:
[b]
Only factory limited slip differentials (LSD) are allowed on AWD vehicles, as defined in Section 12.4. For AWD vehicles that did not come with any type of limited slip differential (including center differential or transfer case), a single aftermarket LSD may be added. 2WD vehicles may use any LSD unit.
[/b]
So, how do you convince "others" that the center diff is not a type of limited slip diff? I'm curious to know...
- Steve
| elgorey | 10-16-2002 06:20 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by DiMensionX [/i]
[B]Tom, yet another reason I just chose to run SM:D .
[/B][/QUOTE]
Only you will never be nationally competitive without taking out a huge loan....and even then who knows. Just look at the Cobb car.
my money is on Tom for the STX national champ next year
[B]Tom, yet another reason I just chose to run SM:D .
[/B][/QUOTE]
Only you will never be nationally competitive without taking out a huge loan....and even then who knows. Just look at the Cobb car.
my money is on Tom for the STX national champ next year
| trhoppe | 10-17-2002 09:37 AM |
[QUOTE]Tom, yet another reason I just chose to run SM .[/QUOTE] Hehe, I have a VERY limited budget for parts next year. Thats why. Also I wanted a "safe" car. Stock boost and stock turbo in my mind creates a "safe" car that I will be able to take on track and not worry about blowing up. I need to have that beotch last through one lap of america next year :devil: .
[QUOTE]my money is on Tom for the STX national champ next year[/QUOTE] Hahaha, I wish. But Im sure as hell going to try! I think I will do quite allright in the ProSolos, but Im really afraid of someone making a killer 90 civic si hybrid and wooping everyones ass at the tours and championship.
-Tom
[QUOTE]my money is on Tom for the STX national champ next year[/QUOTE] Hahaha, I wish. But Im sure as hell going to try! I think I will do quite allright in the ProSolos, but Im really afraid of someone making a killer 90 civic si hybrid and wooping everyones ass at the tours and championship.
-Tom
| Orion | 10-17-2002 11:42 AM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by trhoppe [/i]
[B] Hahaha, I wish. But Im sure as hell going to try! I think I will do quite allright in the ProSolos, but Im really afraid of someone making a killer 90 civic si hybrid and wooping everyones ass at the tours and championship.
-Tom [/B][/QUOTE]
Yep. Tom will have a tough time at Nats next year. Those ITR's are whining like crazy about rule changes and they finished 1-2!!!
I'd like to see a podium sweep by Tom, Jeff, and Kiko next year!:devil:
Orion
#5 STX
2002 Solo II Nationals backmarker
[B] Hahaha, I wish. But Im sure as hell going to try! I think I will do quite allright in the ProSolos, but Im really afraid of someone making a killer 90 civic si hybrid and wooping everyones ass at the tours and championship.
-Tom [/B][/QUOTE]
Yep. Tom will have a tough time at Nats next year. Those ITR's are whining like crazy about rule changes and they finished 1-2!!!
I'd like to see a podium sweep by Tom, Jeff, and Kiko next year!:devil:
Orion
#5 STX
2002 Solo II Nationals backmarker
| TyrannoSullyRex | 10-17-2002 11:45 AM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by orionf [/i]
[B]
Orion
#5 STX
2002 Solo II Nationals backmarker [/B][/QUOTE]
Still claiming that #5 STX, huh?
Has anyone talked to TurboXS about having an absence of boost control for STX competitors on the UTEC? Or modifying the harness in such a way to accomplish this (like a switch, or something)?
[B]
Orion
#5 STX
2002 Solo II Nationals backmarker [/B][/QUOTE]
Still claiming that #5 STX, huh?
Has anyone talked to TurboXS about having an absence of boost control for STX competitors on the UTEC? Or modifying the harness in such a way to accomplish this (like a switch, or something)?
| Orion | 10-17-2002 12:01 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by TyrannoSullyRex [/i]
[B]
Still claiming that #5 STX, huh?
Has anyone talked to TurboXS about having an absence of boost control for STX competitors on the UTEC? Or modifying the harness in such a way to accomplish this (like a switch, or something)? [/B][/QUOTE]
Yes. It's gonna have to be a permanent hard wired bypass. There's only gonna be a few of us running it in SCCA Solo II in the grand scheme of things so they won't spend the R&D time and money on a 'boostless' board.
#5 is mine!!! I aint' gonna give it up!:devil:
[B]
Still claiming that #5 STX, huh?
Has anyone talked to TurboXS about having an absence of boost control for STX competitors on the UTEC? Or modifying the harness in such a way to accomplish this (like a switch, or something)? [/B][/QUOTE]
Yes. It's gonna have to be a permanent hard wired bypass. There's only gonna be a few of us running it in SCCA Solo II in the grand scheme of things so they won't spend the R&D time and money on a 'boostless' board.
#5 is mine!!! I aint' gonna give it up!:devil:
| trhoppe | 10-17-2002 12:11 PM |
[QUOTE]Yes. It's gonna have to be a permanent hard wired bypass[/QUOTE] What he said. There has to be no way in HELL to modify the boost.
TurboXS already told me that we are on our own with this.
Im actually going to start using the unichip and then go to a utec later IF they do the software update which will have launch control. Even though the 4 maps would be AWESOME, it might just
a) not be legal at all
b) not worth the extra hassle because one of us running it WILL get protested guaranteed
unless it does have the launch control IMHO, then it will be worth it. That will be about 2 or 3 tenths PER SIDE at a ProSolo.
[QUOTE]Yep. Tom will have a tough time at Nats next year. Those ITR's are whining like crazy about rule changes and they finished 1-2!!! [/QUOTE] The ITR is the LEAST of my worries. They will not stand a chance with 245 KDs on my car and 300hp. Its the 90 civic si that Im worried about.
-Tom
TurboXS already told me that we are on our own with this.
Im actually going to start using the unichip and then go to a utec later IF they do the software update which will have launch control. Even though the 4 maps would be AWESOME, it might just
a) not be legal at all
b) not worth the extra hassle because one of us running it WILL get protested guaranteed
unless it does have the launch control IMHO, then it will be worth it. That will be about 2 or 3 tenths PER SIDE at a ProSolo.
[QUOTE]Yep. Tom will have a tough time at Nats next year. Those ITR's are whining like crazy about rule changes and they finished 1-2!!! [/QUOTE] The ITR is the LEAST of my worries. They will not stand a chance with 245 KDs on my car and 300hp. Its the 90 civic si that Im worried about.
-Tom
| KC | 10-17-2002 01:12 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by orionf [/i]
[B]I'd like to see a podium sweep by Tom, Jeff, and Kiko next year!:devil: [/B][/QUOTE]
:monkey: :p
[B]I'd like to see a podium sweep by Tom, Jeff, and Kiko next year!:devil: [/B][/QUOTE]
:monkey: :p
| Crosser | 10-17-2002 01:18 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by trhoppe [/i]
[B] Hahaha, I wish. But Im sure as hell going to try! I think I will do quite allright in the ProSolos, but Im really afraid of someone making a killer 90 civic si hybrid and wooping everyones ass at the tours and championship.
-Tom [/B][/QUOTE]
Tom,
You only need to worry about a TRUE 89-91 Civic Si. The hybrid discussion was based on a mistake in the classifications in the 2001 rule book for SP. It classed the base model civic and all the CRX's for 88-91 together. This was a misprint and has been fixed in the 2002 rule book. Trust me I was one of the original people considering this idea. I had an 1988 dx civic a long time ago, so I know how light they really are. Even saying this though, I still think that if you took one of the top STS civics and put a Quaife in them, they will smoke STX. I have a 91 CRX Si that is set up for CSP, currently the car is just outside what is legal for ST, so I know very well how fast these cars can be. They will not be the killer at Pro's, but they will not do that bad either. However, at Tours, they will FLY.
Good luck with STX Tom.
Eric Carman
[B] Hahaha, I wish. But Im sure as hell going to try! I think I will do quite allright in the ProSolos, but Im really afraid of someone making a killer 90 civic si hybrid and wooping everyones ass at the tours and championship.
-Tom [/B][/QUOTE]
Tom,
You only need to worry about a TRUE 89-91 Civic Si. The hybrid discussion was based on a mistake in the classifications in the 2001 rule book for SP. It classed the base model civic and all the CRX's for 88-91 together. This was a misprint and has been fixed in the 2002 rule book. Trust me I was one of the original people considering this idea. I had an 1988 dx civic a long time ago, so I know how light they really are. Even saying this though, I still think that if you took one of the top STS civics and put a Quaife in them, they will smoke STX. I have a 91 CRX Si that is set up for CSP, currently the car is just outside what is legal for ST, so I know very well how fast these cars can be. They will not be the killer at Pro's, but they will not do that bad either. However, at Tours, they will FLY.
Good luck with STX Tom.
Eric Carman
| Orion | 10-17-2002 01:51 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by KC [/i]
[B]
:monkey: :p [/B][/QUOTE]
that was just some of my anti-wagon love showing through!:lol:
KC is gonna destroy us all at Nats in '03!
Go Pats!:rolleyes: :D
[B]
:monkey: :p [/B][/QUOTE]
that was just some of my anti-wagon love showing through!:lol:
KC is gonna destroy us all at Nats in '03!
Go Pats!:rolleyes: :D
| zzyzx | 10-17-2002 05:06 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Crosser [/i]
[B]
You only need to worry about a TRUE 89-91 Civic Si. The hybrid discussion was based on a mistake in the classifications in the 2001 rule book for SP.
[/B][/QUOTE]
Sorry but that's not the case. Go back to streettouting on Yahoo! and read Chris Shenefield's post again:
[quote]
Ok, since there is so much confusion over the 88-91 Civic (including Si) listings, let's try this again.
Listings for update/backdate in SP as of right now -
89-91 Civic Si
88-91 Civic (not otherwise classified)
On separate lines. Right. But the 90 and 91 Civic EX has the Si motor!!!!!!! So, while it's not ok to ud/bd from a 89-91 Civic Si, it is legal to ud/bd from a 90-91 Civic EX (which has the Si motor and trans in it).
So, as is now, a base Civic with an Ex (same as Si) motor IS LEGAL and will remain that way until it gets changed somehow (if it gets changed). So, that's the deal. I am glad to see that Steve W is getting all this straight before proceeding. This has gotten so confusing.
Chris
[/quote]
- Steve
[B]
You only need to worry about a TRUE 89-91 Civic Si. The hybrid discussion was based on a mistake in the classifications in the 2001 rule book for SP.
[/B][/QUOTE]
Sorry but that's not the case. Go back to streettouting on Yahoo! and read Chris Shenefield's post again:
[quote]
Ok, since there is so much confusion over the 88-91 Civic (including Si) listings, let's try this again.
Listings for update/backdate in SP as of right now -
89-91 Civic Si
88-91 Civic (not otherwise classified)
On separate lines. Right. But the 90 and 91 Civic EX has the Si motor!!!!!!! So, while it's not ok to ud/bd from a 89-91 Civic Si, it is legal to ud/bd from a 90-91 Civic EX (which has the Si motor and trans in it).
So, as is now, a base Civic with an Ex (same as Si) motor IS LEGAL and will remain that way until it gets changed somehow (if it gets changed). So, that's the deal. I am glad to see that Steve W is getting all this straight before proceeding. This has gotten so confusing.
Chris
[/quote]
- Steve
| Jeff 2.5RS | 10-18-2002 02:46 AM |
The civic fiasco has had me confused for a while, thanks for clearing that up, and Gary...teins? They're nice, especially for the street, but in an all-out-no-money-held-back suspension setup they're not going to be close the the dms's or konis' in terms of quality or handling. They may be more comfortable on the street but I'll put money on dms's being a the more performance orientated suspension, and custon valved koni's from cobb are most likely high quality too. On a side note, doesn't Gary run custom ground control coil overs in the USTCC, might be something to look into, nothing like 700pd front and 1100pd rear spings for auto-xing ;).
| KC | 10-18-2002 07:00 AM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by orionf [/i]
[B] that was just some of my anti-wagon love showing through!:lol:
KC is gonna destroy us all at Nats in '03!
Go Pats!:rolleyes: :D [/B][/QUOTE] Only if it rains! Check these results out from last weekend: [url]http://www.ner.org/soloII/solo2002/TeamChallengeRaw.html[/url]
[B] that was just some of my anti-wagon love showing through!:lol:
KC is gonna destroy us all at Nats in '03!
Go Pats!:rolleyes: :D [/B][/QUOTE] Only if it rains! Check these results out from last weekend: [url]http://www.ner.org/soloII/solo2002/TeamChallengeRaw.html[/url]
| rupertberr | 10-18-2002 09:31 PM |
Wow!
KC, you were faster then a F125! The only cars that beat you were 2 A modifieds and 2 B modifieds!:eek:
Holy $#!+!:eek:
You are awesome!:D
Ok you can be on the front cover!
Holy $#!+!:eek:
You are awesome!:D
Ok you can be on the front cover!
| TheWRX | 10-18-2002 11:41 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by trhoppe [/i]
[B] If the utec is plugged into the system and the boost solenoid wire runs through it, that is ILLEGAL because the utec has the capability to change boost.[/B][/QUOTE]
Can't you also change boost by reprogramming the stock ECU? And as far as I understand, reprogramming the stock ECU is legal, as long as you only change fuel and ignition. So I don't really see a big difference: stock ECU can be remapped to run higher boost, UTEC can be mapped to run higher boost. Only that with the UTEC, it's easy to verify that you don't cheat by hooking up a laptop and looking at the map, while checking if a stock ECU was remapped in an illegal way would be very hard.
I don't really doubt that you're right, it just seems like interpreting the rules this way doesn't seem to help much. If somebody wants to cheat, they can remap the stock ECU, and you will never know.
Talking about the legality of the UTEC, there's another interesting subitem in the rule (17.10.D.2): "Electronic components may be installed inline between an engine's sensors and ECU. These components may alter the signal coming from the sensor in order to affect the ECU's operation of the engine management system." Is that the case for the UTEC? I thought it could take full control of the timing, instead of only modifying the input to the ECU, like the Unichip does? If that's the case, it looks to me like the timing control of the UTEC would be illegal.
[B] If the utec is plugged into the system and the boost solenoid wire runs through it, that is ILLEGAL because the utec has the capability to change boost.[/B][/QUOTE]
Can't you also change boost by reprogramming the stock ECU? And as far as I understand, reprogramming the stock ECU is legal, as long as you only change fuel and ignition. So I don't really see a big difference: stock ECU can be remapped to run higher boost, UTEC can be mapped to run higher boost. Only that with the UTEC, it's easy to verify that you don't cheat by hooking up a laptop and looking at the map, while checking if a stock ECU was remapped in an illegal way would be very hard.
I don't really doubt that you're right, it just seems like interpreting the rules this way doesn't seem to help much. If somebody wants to cheat, they can remap the stock ECU, and you will never know.
Talking about the legality of the UTEC, there's another interesting subitem in the rule (17.10.D.2): "Electronic components may be installed inline between an engine's sensors and ECU. These components may alter the signal coming from the sensor in order to affect the ECU's operation of the engine management system." Is that the case for the UTEC? I thought it could take full control of the timing, instead of only modifying the input to the ECU, like the Unichip does? If that's the case, it looks to me like the timing control of the UTEC would be illegal.
| KC | 10-19-2002 06:47 AM |
Re: Wow!
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by rupertberr [/i]
[B]KC, you were faster then a F125! The only cars that beat you were 2 A modifieds and 2 B modifieds!:eek:
Holy $#!+!:eek:
You are awesome!:D
Ok you can be on the front cover! [/B][/QUOTE]Oops, did I forget to say it was raining that day? No standing water, but just enough to make the asphalt slippery. :D
Back on topic... On the remapping of the Stock ECU.... has anyone heard how to do this? I haven't seen anything on this club (I'd like to think we'd know) that has come up with a way.
--kC
[B]KC, you were faster then a F125! The only cars that beat you were 2 A modifieds and 2 B modifieds!:eek:
Holy $#!+!:eek:
You are awesome!:D
Ok you can be on the front cover! [/B][/QUOTE]Oops, did I forget to say it was raining that day? No standing water, but just enough to make the asphalt slippery. :D
Back on topic... On the remapping of the Stock ECU.... has anyone heard how to do this? I haven't seen anything on this club (I'd like to think we'd know) that has come up with a way.
--kC
| ellisnc | 10-19-2002 08:51 AM |
some guy named Yoshio in Canada can do it
| trhoppe | 10-19-2002 10:24 AM |
[QUOTE]Talking about the legality of the UTEC, there's another interesting subitem in the rule (17.10.D.2): "Electronic components may be installed inline between an engine's sensors and ECU. These components may alter the signal coming from the sensor in order to affect the ECU's operation of the engine management system." Is that the case for the UTEC? I thought it could take full control of the timing, instead of only modifying the input to the ECU, like the Unichip does? If that's the case, it looks to me like the timing control of the UTEC would be illegal.[/QUOTE] First off, I have NEVER looked at this before and you bring up an incredibly valid point. The UTEC does take full control of the timing and intercepts the signal and the ECU never even sees it. Yes you are right, the UTEC might be totally illegal. I will call TurboXS and talk to them about this on monday. See what they tell me.
[QUOTE]I don't really doubt that you're right, it just seems like interpreting the rules this way doesn't seem to help much. If somebody wants to cheat, they can remap the stock ECU, and you will never know.[/QUOTE] I raced nationally this year and learned a LOT about the rules. I got protested two times, and won both times because I WAS legal. I am taking a point of view that a Type R or a Honda would take if we beat them. Also I am talking about nationals here. People got protested for having different shift knobs in stock class, or missing some trim pieces.
If someone wants to cheat, they will cheat. Its just up to us to find them. BUT let me put it to you this way. If you are running the stock ECU reprogrammed or some other way to raise boost, you run higher boost ALL the time. On course and also after you are off course, in inpund. If you call them on it and test their car, they will have higher boost. If you are running a UTEC, you can run higher boost on course, flip a switch on the way to inpound and then have stock boost for a protest. If you protest that person for having higher boost, oops they switched their map, so now they are at stock boost, or oops they modified their map real quick so they ARE at stock boost. They can promise up and down that they didnt change anything off course, but you cannot PROVE it. You cannot have the means to change the boost available to you.
Thats how I really feel :lol: :lol:
-Tom
[QUOTE]I don't really doubt that you're right, it just seems like interpreting the rules this way doesn't seem to help much. If somebody wants to cheat, they can remap the stock ECU, and you will never know.[/QUOTE] I raced nationally this year and learned a LOT about the rules. I got protested two times, and won both times because I WAS legal. I am taking a point of view that a Type R or a Honda would take if we beat them. Also I am talking about nationals here. People got protested for having different shift knobs in stock class, or missing some trim pieces.
If someone wants to cheat, they will cheat. Its just up to us to find them. BUT let me put it to you this way. If you are running the stock ECU reprogrammed or some other way to raise boost, you run higher boost ALL the time. On course and also after you are off course, in inpund. If you call them on it and test their car, they will have higher boost. If you are running a UTEC, you can run higher boost on course, flip a switch on the way to inpound and then have stock boost for a protest. If you protest that person for having higher boost, oops they switched their map, so now they are at stock boost, or oops they modified their map real quick so they ARE at stock boost. They can promise up and down that they didnt change anything off course, but you cannot PROVE it. You cannot have the means to change the boost available to you.
Thats how I really feel :lol: :lol:
-Tom
| Dussander | 10-19-2002 03:09 PM |
Anyone plane on any weight reduction/shifting stuff like:
putting the battery in the trunk
removing A/C
stripping stereo
I *may* do the battery part, but since this is my daily driver (and more to the point, my wife would freak) I won't be removing the A/C or stereo. I should probably pull off the diff protector and maybe even the trailer hitch...hum. Do I have to put those stupid hooks back on if I take the hitch off...I bet I do.
putting the battery in the trunk
removing A/C
stripping stereo
I *may* do the battery part, but since this is my daily driver (and more to the point, my wife would freak) I won't be removing the A/C or stereo. I should probably pull off the diff protector and maybe even the trailer hitch...hum. Do I have to put those stupid hooks back on if I take the hitch off...I bet I do.
| driggity | 10-19-2002 05:11 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by KC [/i]
[B]Also, even though I have the STi 4-pots, again, this is my opinion, I think you'd be better served putting the $$ for big brakes elsewhere and just upgrade the pads on the stock rotors. 4pots work best at speeds over 100, at an auto-x the stockers should work fine. You also don't have to go crazy trying to find wheels to fit. :)
--kC [/B][/QUOTE]
It makes sense that the upgraded brakes aren't really needed for their stopping power, but what about the weight reduction they can supply. I'm not sure about the STi 4-pots, but the Willwood 4 pots are supposed to be way later than the stock brakes. Seems like at the level at which some of you guys are competing that reduction in unsprung weight could be a big deal. Or maybe I'm completely wrong. It may be something to consider though.
[B]Also, even though I have the STi 4-pots, again, this is my opinion, I think you'd be better served putting the $$ for big brakes elsewhere and just upgrade the pads on the stock rotors. 4pots work best at speeds over 100, at an auto-x the stockers should work fine. You also don't have to go crazy trying to find wheels to fit. :)
--kC [/B][/QUOTE]
It makes sense that the upgraded brakes aren't really needed for their stopping power, but what about the weight reduction they can supply. I'm not sure about the STi 4-pots, but the Willwood 4 pots are supposed to be way later than the stock brakes. Seems like at the level at which some of you guys are competing that reduction in unsprung weight could be a big deal. Or maybe I'm completely wrong. It may be something to consider though.
| trhoppe | 10-19-2002 06:59 PM |
Well Im going to be one to test my brake theory. My brakes are staying stock with R4S pads for autoxing and R4 pads for the track. I will be removing the foglights and running 3" brake ducting straight to the rotors, so I think they should be ok on track.
As far as weight reduction, since I drive the car the stereo and AC are staying in, but my battery will get reloated to where the spare tire used to sit and be replaced with a lightweight one.
Also the drivers seat will be replaced with a light corbeu seat, and if the funds allow it, the passanger seat as well. That should knock 30-40 lbs off for both seats.
-Tom
As far as weight reduction, since I drive the car the stereo and AC are staying in, but my battery will get reloated to where the spare tire used to sit and be replaced with a lightweight one.
Also the drivers seat will be replaced with a light corbeu seat, and if the funds allow it, the passanger seat as well. That should knock 30-40 lbs off for both seats.
-Tom
| TheWRX | 10-19-2002 09:51 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by trhoppe [/i]
[B]If you are running a UTEC, you can run higher boost on course, flip a switch on the way to inpound and then have stock boost for a protest.[/B][/QUOTE]
Well, it's probably all wishful thinking on my part. I want a UTEC, and I want it to be legal in STX! ;) I would gladly pass on the remote switch for changing maps, I certainly understand how that would make the competition nervous. I would even be happy to arrive at the event site without any maps that modify boost. But since there's something wired into the boost control circuit, even if it's letting the signal pass unmodified, it's probably still protestable. Not that anybody would protest me as long as I'm slow, but I want to play fair.
Let us know if you find out more about this. It would be great to have some fun making the car faster, without going to SM.
[B]If you are running a UTEC, you can run higher boost on course, flip a switch on the way to inpound and then have stock boost for a protest.[/B][/QUOTE]
Well, it's probably all wishful thinking on my part. I want a UTEC, and I want it to be legal in STX! ;) I would gladly pass on the remote switch for changing maps, I certainly understand how that would make the competition nervous. I would even be happy to arrive at the event site without any maps that modify boost. But since there's something wired into the boost control circuit, even if it's letting the signal pass unmodified, it's probably still protestable. Not that anybody would protest me as long as I'm slow, but I want to play fair.
Let us know if you find out more about this. It would be great to have some fun making the car faster, without going to SM.
| trhoppe | 10-20-2002 10:48 AM |
See, its got nothing to do with a remote switch. The actual utec has a switch on it. All you would have to do is bend over to the passenger side and flip a switch.
Anyways, this might be a mute point because................according to jorge (riftswrx) the utec takes full control of the ecu timing. [QUOTE]The UTEC has it's OWN (READ: ON BOARD) ignition AND injector drivers. It can take the ECU's request to fire an injector and IT (READ: the UTEC) will fire the injectors.[/QUOTE]
If you read the rules as they are, this means that the UTEC could not be used in STX. Is anyone else interpret the rule another way?
Although this would suck (no user tuning, no launch control, no 100 octane switchable maps), this would make it pretty easy to police. You run the vishnu unichip or an AFC. Those are your choices for now. That ECUTek programmed ECU could be another choice in the future, but it sounds like its a hassle and pretty expensive. It would pretty much do what the unichip does though, for 2x the price.
-Tom
Anyways, this might be a mute point because................according to jorge (riftswrx) the utec takes full control of the ecu timing. [QUOTE]The UTEC has it's OWN (READ: ON BOARD) ignition AND injector drivers. It can take the ECU's request to fire an injector and IT (READ: the UTEC) will fire the injectors.[/QUOTE]
If you read the rules as they are, this means that the UTEC could not be used in STX. Is anyone else interpret the rule another way?
Although this would suck (no user tuning, no launch control, no 100 octane switchable maps), this would make it pretty easy to police. You run the vishnu unichip or an AFC. Those are your choices for now. That ECUTek programmed ECU could be another choice in the future, but it sounds like its a hassle and pretty expensive. It would pretty much do what the unichip does though, for 2x the price.
-Tom
| DrBiggly | 10-21-2002 11:23 PM |
Sounds like people are going to be pulling up their carpets a lot in protest....
Is the Shiv harness or setup easy to identify vs. the TurboXS harness? Is it obvious?
Is the Shiv harness or setup easy to identify vs. the TurboXS harness? Is it obvious?
| ChrisW | 10-22-2002 12:13 AM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by zzyzx [/i]
[B]
Really? Is this how you interpret the current rule, stated below:
[b]
Only factory limited slip differentials (LSD) are allowed on AWD vehicles, as defined in Section 12.4. For AWD vehicles that did not come with any type of limited slip differential (including center differential or transfer case), a single aftermarket LSD may be added. 2WD vehicles may use any LSD unit.
[/b]
So, how do you convince "others" that the center diff is not a type of limited slip diff? I'm curious to know...
- Steve [/B][/QUOTE]
my old DSM (a 95 eagle talon tsi AWD) had open diff's front/rear/center making it eligible under the rules you just quoted
;)
[B]
Really? Is this how you interpret the current rule, stated below:
[b]
Only factory limited slip differentials (LSD) are allowed on AWD vehicles, as defined in Section 12.4. For AWD vehicles that did not come with any type of limited slip differential (including center differential or transfer case), a single aftermarket LSD may be added. 2WD vehicles may use any LSD unit.
[/b]
So, how do you convince "others" that the center diff is not a type of limited slip diff? I'm curious to know...
- Steve [/B][/QUOTE]
my old DSM (a 95 eagle talon tsi AWD) had open diff's front/rear/center making it eligible under the rules you just quoted
;)
| AnimalMother | 10-22-2002 06:15 PM |
IF the UTEC is legal for STX, why not use a tell-tale gauge under the hood? Wouldn't that negate the increased boost argument?
AnimalMother
AnimalMother
| trhoppe | 10-22-2002 11:13 PM |
The UTEC is illegal for the way it modifies timing, and not the boost. BUT the way the SCCA protests boost mods (as I found out), is to hook up a calibrated standard boost gauge and test the boost on the car, even if you have your own gauge. You could modify your own gauge to not show over 15psi :)
-Tom
-Tom
| Subdued | 10-23-2002 12:07 AM |
Tom,
What coilovers, are you planning to run? Are you going to be selling your OE struts with the Koni's?
What coilovers, are you planning to run? Are you going to be selling your OE struts with the Koni's?
| trhoppe | 10-23-2002 09:20 AM |
Teins, and the konis are already sold..sorry
-Tom
-Tom
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