| Ferg | 09-30-2006 10:38 PM |
Fisi's an absolute master in the wet.
Anyone remember him hauling the Jordan to second place behind Michael at an extremely wet Spa in 1997?
Wet or dry, tonight's race promises to be a nail biter!
Anyone remember him hauling the Jordan to second place behind Michael at an extremely wet Spa in 1997?
Wet or dry, tonight's race promises to be a nail biter!
| StuBeck | 09-30-2006 11:52 PM |
Alonso will be given the opportunity to win by renault and fisi will do what he did last year, block everyone. I liked the track in 04, but last year it showed how if they just run with no downforce so they're fast on the straights you can hold people off pretty easily.
| soldmyboxster | 10-01-2006 12:37 AM |
If the track is wet at the start, Alonso and Fisi have it made, as they'll have a clear view forward. Everyone else will be driving into a grey curtain.
I'm quietly hoping MS will get punted by someone from behind in the first turn.
GO ALONSO!
I'm quietly hoping MS will get punted by someone from behind in the first turn.
GO ALONSO!
| soldmyboxster | 10-01-2006 01:32 AM |
Wet Start!
Where the hell is everybody?
Where the hell is everybody?
| KAX | 10-01-2006 02:07 AM |
im here. Kimi's looking quick, overtook button and barrichello and chasing down Fisi.
not to mention theres no rain, so it shouldnt be long until the bridgestones come into their own. we'll see how long it takes and what kind of a gap alonso can put before that.
not to mention theres no rain, so it shouldnt be long until the bridgestones come into their own. we'll see how long it takes and what kind of a gap alonso can put before that.
| KAX | 10-01-2006 02:34 AM |
looks like bridgestones are up to speed, Michael chasing down Fisi, Raikkonen and Alonso.
and theres goes Kimi, engine failure.
and Im posting to myself, but oh well.
great race though.
and theres goes Kimi, engine failure.
and Im posting to myself, but oh well.
great race though.
| racerjon1 | 10-01-2006 03:01 AM |
not totally by yourself.. is a great race.
| bitterWRX | 10-01-2006 03:20 AM |
wow. never a dull moment.
| OnTheGas | 10-01-2006 03:34 AM |
wow!
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Fabulous race!
I did not think that Michael would make the podium when it started as a wet race, and here is winning it! Nice drive!
Can't wait to find out what happened to Fernando in the middle of the race when his pace dropped off about 2 secs per lap.
I did not think that Michael would make the podium when it started as a wet race, and here is winning it! Nice drive!
Can't wait to find out what happened to Fernando in the middle of the race when his pace dropped off about 2 secs per lap.
| racerjon1 | 10-01-2006 03:38 AM |
[QUOTE=OnTheGas;15447991]Can't wait to find out what happened to Fernando in the middle of the race when his pace dropped off about 2 secs per lap.[/QUOTE]
He was understeering horribly, I could see the front end sliding, especially in the longer corners. It seemed to me that the lack of acceleration the announcers were talking about was just him waiting to get on the throttle as more might have just caused more understeer.
Jon K
He was understeering horribly, I could see the front end sliding, especially in the longer corners. It seemed to me that the lack of acceleration the announcers were talking about was just him waiting to get on the throttle as more might have just caused more understeer.
Jon K
| OnTheGas | 10-01-2006 03:40 AM |
Quick Nick!
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Another nice drive by Heidfeld to bring home more big points for BMW! If Kubica and BMW hadn't taken the early gamble on drys, they would have been 4th & 5th, instead of just Nick in 4th...
| OnTheGas | 10-01-2006 03:42 AM |
Ooh Button!
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Button nips Rubens for 5th on the last lap! :lol:
| racerjon1 | 10-01-2006 03:43 AM |
what a last lap.. and I was about to be so amazed they made it the whole race without crashing..
| OnTheGas | 10-01-2006 03:43 AM |
thanks!
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[QUOTE=racerjon1;15447999]He was understeering horribly, I could see the front end sliding, especially in the longer corners. It seemed to me that the lack of acceleration the announcers were talking about was just him waiting to get on the throttle as more might have just caused more understeer.[/QUOTE]Thanks! I'm w/out video for a few hours... that is very helpful!
| psg | 10-01-2006 03:43 AM |
I don't even know why they allow Super Aguri out there. :lol:
| afpdl | 10-01-2006 03:45 AM |
Sato strikes again!
| bitterWRX | 10-01-2006 03:45 AM |
[QUOTE=OnTheGas;15448005]Another nice drive by Heidfeld to bring home more big points for BMW! If Kubica and BMW hadn't taken the early gamble on drys, they would have been 4th & 5th, instead of just Nick in 4th...[/QUOTE]
You spoke too soon.
You spoke too soon.
| OnTheGas | 10-01-2006 03:46 AM |
Ohmigawd!
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[QUOTE=OnTheGas;15448005]Another nice drive by Heidfeld to bring home more big points for BMW! ... Nick in 4th.[/QUOTE]Oh crap! He gave 3 points paying spots at the end of the last lap! Now he's 7th! Argh! Horrible!
| KAX | 10-01-2006 03:47 AM |
ah, there you guys are!
that was an awesome race. Schumacher is stoked, as am I! all square with 2 races to go.
that was an awesome race. Schumacher is stoked, as am I! all square with 2 races to go.
| Tony117s | 10-01-2006 03:52 AM |
greatest driver ever. shut the whiney bitch alonso up.
| themarxist | 10-01-2006 03:52 AM |
That was amazing! I never thought I'd see another race as exciting as Turkey was just a few weeks ago, but that one was right up there with it. Does anyone know why alonso was slowing down so much there in the middle of the race when he got passed by fisi and schumi? The commentators were talking about tire conservation and mechanical failures but neither of those really makes sense.
| OnTheGas | 10-01-2006 03:53 AM |
He called it early!
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[QUOTE=JZ oo7;15436190]...i actually want to see schuei win and alonso get 2nd. a tie with 2 GPs left would be great.[/QUOTE]Your wish has been granted!
| racerjon1 | 10-01-2006 03:55 AM |
[QUOTE=themarxist;15448047]Does anyone know why alonso was slowing down so much there in the middle of the race when he got passed by fisi and schumi? The commentators were talking about tire conservation and mechanical failures but neither of those really makes sense.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=racerjon1;15447999]He was understeering horribly, I could see the front end sliding, especially in the longer corners. It seemed to me that the lack of acceleration the announcers were talking about was just him waiting to get on the throttle as more might have just caused more understeer.
[/QUOTE]
I think it just had to do with where his set of tires were at that point, messing up the balance of the car.
Jon K
[QUOTE=racerjon1;15447999]He was understeering horribly, I could see the front end sliding, especially in the longer corners. It seemed to me that the lack of acceleration the announcers were talking about was just him waiting to get on the throttle as more might have just caused more understeer.
[/QUOTE]
I think it just had to do with where his set of tires were at that point, messing up the balance of the car.
Jon K
| racerjon1 | 10-01-2006 03:57 AM |
Alanso's dropping of the champaign bottle might be a metaphor for the season...
| OnTheGas | 10-01-2006 04:04 AM |
No tears here...
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[QUOTE=OnTheGas;15427477]Rats! Missed the deadline, so I'm stuck standing on my Italian picks...[/QUOTE]Hmm... I may have 48 points, which is not too bad for a wet race lottery... Of course it is not yet official... remember when Kubica was DQ'd for driving the tires off of his car @ the Hungaroring! :lol:
| sperry | 10-01-2006 04:05 AM |
Anyone else notice the Subaru shout out? :cool:
| OnTheGas | 10-01-2006 04:10 AM |
New front inters killed Fernando's win
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[QUOTE=racerjon1;15448057]I think it just had to do with where his set of tires were at that point, messing up the balance of the car.[/QUOTE]So Formula1.com live scoring said that Alonso had grabbed a fresh pair of front intermediates in his 1st stop. He was only one they mentioned doing that; most everyone else apparently did not change any tires (except Kubica's 1 lap dry tire experiment). Did SpeedTV (or whoever you may have been watching) mention anyone else getting fresh inters for the 1st pit stop?
Seems like a gamble that went horribly wrong... He could have won.
Seems like a gamble that went horribly wrong... He could have won.
| afpdl | 10-01-2006 04:16 AM |
IIRC Alonso was one of the first in and chose new tires. Then Fisi and Shumacher came in and stayed on the now slick inters. I think it was everyone else that was gambling...they just won.
| bitterWRX | 10-01-2006 04:22 AM |
It's true. Alonso could've won. But because of that tire choice with the inters, and the mistake during his 2nd pit stop, he lost it. But just think how great of a battle it could've been if Alonso stayed with his worn inters.
On another note, how do they decide tie breakers in F1?
On another note, how do they decide tie breakers in F1?
| OnTheGas | 10-01-2006 04:22 AM |
Was Alonso on a fresh or used motor?
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[QUOTE=JZ oo7;15436190]i thought both massa and schumacher was running new engines at this grand prix.[/QUOTE]Can anyone confirm this?
Schumacher was able to save his engine for the last 20 laps when he grabbed the lead, because he had a large margin over Alonso in 3rd, plus Renault's team-orders required Fisi to whoa up and let Alonso pass. Therefore, Alonso was really using up his motor to crank out fast laps til the end.
Slight advantage to Schumacher if Alonso has another race to run on that motor.
Schumacher was able to save his engine for the last 20 laps when he grabbed the lead, because he had a large margin over Alonso in 3rd, plus Renault's team-orders required Fisi to whoa up and let Alonso pass. Therefore, Alonso was really using up his motor to crank out fast laps til the end.
Slight advantage to Schumacher if Alonso has another race to run on that motor.
| OnTheGas | 10-01-2006 04:28 AM |
In baseball, a tie goes to the runner, but in F1...
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[QUOTE=bitterWRX;15448136]...how do they decide tie breakers in F1?[/QUOTE]Most wins... if still tied, then most 2nds, then most 3rds, etc.
| OnTheGas | 10-01-2006 04:53 AM |
Webber, Rosberg, Williams, and Bridgestone
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Any of us who chose Webber to grab a point or two were very wise (I wish I had been that wise!).
Webber finished 2nd in the B'Stone class (behind Michael), and 8th overall. That is very impressive. At this race, we saw a Michelin class, and a B'Stone class. In the B'Stone class, Mark Webber's race was really outstanding!
First, he owned his team-mate in qualifying and all race long... his times were superior to Nico's (how long will Nico last in F1?).
But more importantly, outside of Ferrari, the primary B'Stone rival for Williams is Toyota, who are very well funded (some say they are the best funded team). And Mark owned both of their drivers all race long as well.
Mark Webber has been driving very well during the latter half of this season... I hope Red Bull has better equipment to give him next season, (he passed DC for position late in this race).
Bravo to Mark, and bravo to Williams for beating Toyota.
Webber finished 2nd in the B'Stone class (behind Michael), and 8th overall. That is very impressive. At this race, we saw a Michelin class, and a B'Stone class. In the B'Stone class, Mark Webber's race was really outstanding!
First, he owned his team-mate in qualifying and all race long... his times were superior to Nico's (how long will Nico last in F1?).
But more importantly, outside of Ferrari, the primary B'Stone rival for Williams is Toyota, who are very well funded (some say they are the best funded team). And Mark owned both of their drivers all race long as well.
Mark Webber has been driving very well during the latter half of this season... I hope Red Bull has better equipment to give him next season, (he passed DC for position late in this race).
Bravo to Mark, and bravo to Williams for beating Toyota.
| OnTheGas | 10-01-2006 05:04 AM |
Straightline speed remains a Ferrari strength
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I was looking at the trap speeds for sectors 1, 2, 3, and @ end of the back straight... and the fastest cars today at all four traps belonged to Ferrari... Massa and Michael Schumacher... the 2nd fastest car was a Ferrari also on 3 out of the 4 traps... (Fisi 2nd fastest in sect 2, followed by Michael).
So, as we saw at Imola, when it comes to straight line speed, team Ferrari Scuderia are still the ones to beat.
So, as we saw at Imola, when it comes to straight line speed, team Ferrari Scuderia are still the ones to beat.
| meebs | 10-01-2006 10:50 AM |
Another fantastic race -
Anyone else notice this? ;)
[img]http://www.f1racing.net/photodata/large/64852.jpg[/img]
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[img]http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/images/forumlogos/NASIOC_Logo.png[/img]
Anyone else notice this? ;)
[img]http://www.f1racing.net/photodata/large/64852.jpg[/img]
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[img]http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/images/forumlogos/NASIOC_Logo.png[/img]
| StuBeck | 10-01-2006 11:13 AM |
Nico's going to stay in F1 for a while. He's had a lot of mechanical retirements and he's a VERY good technical driver. Next year Williams should be better with two great development drivers. Webber was given the point since Massa didn't turn into the seecond to last turn causing the crash to happen.
Did anyone see de la Rosa hit Barrichello whiched caused Barrichello to fly into Heidfeld? I think its good Sata got dumped for the race, there is no reason he should have been over there.
Schumacher had a good lead, but I at this point in the championship would have at least matched his laptimes for a lap or two, but he was consistatnly off by a second or two. Without Alonso's 20 second pit stop he would have won.
Did anyone see de la Rosa hit Barrichello whiched caused Barrichello to fly into Heidfeld? I think its good Sata got dumped for the race, there is no reason he should have been over there.
Schumacher had a good lead, but I at this point in the championship would have at least matched his laptimes for a lap or two, but he was consistatnly off by a second or two. Without Alonso's 20 second pit stop he would have won.
| Ferg | 10-01-2006 11:53 AM |
As entertaining as race as that was, it was definately one that Renault and Alonso lost rather than Schumacher won.
Alonso on the tire error...
[QUOTE]Yeah, we had a good start and a good 15 or 20 laps and then we decided to change the front tyres because it was nearly a slick tyre, the left front, and that didn't turn out to be a good thing to do because Giancarlo and Michael left their tyres and they caught me really quickly, and the gap disappeared. After that, we were at a disadvantage. We took the risk, we obviously pitted and we tried to put on dry tyres to try and find a miracle but it was too late.[/QUOTE]
Alonso on the tire error...
[QUOTE]Yeah, we had a good start and a good 15 or 20 laps and then we decided to change the front tyres because it was nearly a slick tyre, the left front, and that didn't turn out to be a good thing to do because Giancarlo and Michael left their tyres and they caught me really quickly, and the gap disappeared. After that, we were at a disadvantage. We took the risk, we obviously pitted and we tried to put on dry tyres to try and find a miracle but it was too late.[/QUOTE]
| REX8 | 10-01-2006 12:16 PM |
Really feel bad for Kubica. He was FLYIING out there...
Moved all the way to 5th and was still charging...its a shame...
Honestly, if the gamble would have paid off, I wouldn't have been surprised to see him challenging for a podium...but certainly 4th...
Darn shame...
Moved all the way to 5th and was still charging...its a shame...
Honestly, if the gamble would have paid off, I wouldn't have been surprised to see him challenging for a podium...but certainly 4th...
Darn shame...
| ptclaus98 | 10-01-2006 12:42 PM |
What happened to Speed? He was moving before the first stop.
And Raikkonen's pace was there, but as always, when Macca's pace is up, the reliability goes down.
And Raikkonen's pace was there, but as always, when Macca's pace is up, the reliability goes down.
| Draken | 10-01-2006 12:56 PM |
[QUOTE=StuBeck;15449151]
Did anyone see de la Rosa hit Barrichello whiched caused Barrichello to fly into Heidfeld? I think its good Sata got dumped for the race, there is no reason he should have been over there.
.[/QUOTE]
Nope. I saw Barichello brake way to effin late and run into Heidfeld. De La Rosa was forced around the outside of all the carnage, as he couldn't turn into a normal line.
Sato didn't help things by changing his line directly in front of Heidfeld, but Barichello would have had a tough time slowing for the corner if he didn't have BMW brakes to help slow his progress.
Chris H.
PS: So damn glad to see Kimi getting away from the McClaren train wreck. He deserves to get into a reliable car. Hopefully the Ferrari won't lose its pace with technical staff changes.
Did anyone see de la Rosa hit Barrichello whiched caused Barrichello to fly into Heidfeld? I think its good Sata got dumped for the race, there is no reason he should have been over there.
.[/QUOTE]
Nope. I saw Barichello brake way to effin late and run into Heidfeld. De La Rosa was forced around the outside of all the carnage, as he couldn't turn into a normal line.
Sato didn't help things by changing his line directly in front of Heidfeld, but Barichello would have had a tough time slowing for the corner if he didn't have BMW brakes to help slow his progress.
Chris H.
PS: So damn glad to see Kimi getting away from the McClaren train wreck. He deserves to get into a reliable car. Hopefully the Ferrari won't lose its pace with technical staff changes.
| OnTheGas | 10-01-2006 01:38 PM |
On how to earn a finishing position...
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[QUOTE=Ferg;15449407]As entertaining as race as that was, it was definately one that Renault and Alonso lost rather than Schumacher won.[/QUOTE]Jeez! So the definition of a win should be changed, when ones favorite driver makes a mistake?
By that definition of "winning", Fernando could not have won since Kimi and Mercedes McLaren gave up the win today when their car lost drive. Kimi was chasing down Fernando, and appeared to be the fastest Michelin runner of the day.
By that same definition of winning, Fernando did not even win 2nd place... since it was a gift from Giancarlo.
Or one could say, again looking at the laptimes, that Michael earned the win today by turning lap times as fast as the Renault's of Fernando and Giancarlo during the first stint, while at the same time that Kimi was running faster than the Renaults. So Michael was one of the factors which caused Fernando to use his fronts hard during the 1st stint, and lead to the erroneous, split-second decision on tires.
Whatever! In the end, Michael was awarded 10 points for another F1 victory. It is what it is!
By that definition of "winning", Fernando could not have won since Kimi and Mercedes McLaren gave up the win today when their car lost drive. Kimi was chasing down Fernando, and appeared to be the fastest Michelin runner of the day.
By that same definition of winning, Fernando did not even win 2nd place... since it was a gift from Giancarlo.
Or one could say, again looking at the laptimes, that Michael earned the win today by turning lap times as fast as the Renault's of Fernando and Giancarlo during the first stint, while at the same time that Kimi was running faster than the Renaults. So Michael was one of the factors which caused Fernando to use his fronts hard during the 1st stint, and lead to the erroneous, split-second decision on tires.
Whatever! In the end, Michael was awarded 10 points for another F1 victory. It is what it is!
| OnTheGas | 10-01-2006 01:42 PM |
How to gift a point
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[QUOTE=StuBeck;15449151]Webber was given the point since Massa didn't turn into the seecond to last turn causing the crash to happen.[/QUOTE]Ahh! So that is how points are earned... But why didn't Massa gift the point to Rosberg, instead of Webber?
| Ferg | 10-01-2006 01:50 PM |
Had Alonso not had his issues with the bad call on tires Schumacher wouldn't have gotten close to him.
Props to Michael and Ferrari for being there to take full advantage of Renault's trouble, but Michael won this race on luck (someone else's bad luck specifically) rather than outright speed.
Like you said though, that's racing.
Props to Michael and Ferrari for being there to take full advantage of Renault's trouble, but Michael won this race on luck (someone else's bad luck specifically) rather than outright speed.
Like you said though, that's racing.
| StuBeck | 10-01-2006 01:52 PM |
[QUOTE=OnTheGas;15450158]Jeez! So the definition of a win should be changed, when ones favorite driver makes a mistake?
By that definition of "winning", Fernando could not have won since Kimi and Mercedes McLaren gave up the win today when their car lost drive. Kimi was chasing down Fernando, and appeared to be the fastest Michelin runner of the day.
By that same definition of winning, Fernando did not even win 2nd place... since it was a gift from Giancarlo.
Or one could say, again looking at the laptimes, that Michael earned the win today by turning lap times as fast as the Renault's of Fernando and Giancarlo during the first stint, while at the same time that Kimi was running faster than the Renaults. So Michael was one of the factors which caused Fernando to use his fronts hard during the 1st stint, and lead to the erroneous, split-second decision on tires.
Whatever! In the end, Michael was awarded 10 points for another F1 victory. It is what it is![/QUOTE]
You know what he means. Alonso was the faster driver and except for a botched pit stop he would have won. It wasn't because of a superior strategy or a faster car.
By that definition of "winning", Fernando could not have won since Kimi and Mercedes McLaren gave up the win today when their car lost drive. Kimi was chasing down Fernando, and appeared to be the fastest Michelin runner of the day.
By that same definition of winning, Fernando did not even win 2nd place... since it was a gift from Giancarlo.
Or one could say, again looking at the laptimes, that Michael earned the win today by turning lap times as fast as the Renault's of Fernando and Giancarlo during the first stint, while at the same time that Kimi was running faster than the Renaults. So Michael was one of the factors which caused Fernando to use his fronts hard during the 1st stint, and lead to the erroneous, split-second decision on tires.
Whatever! In the end, Michael was awarded 10 points for another F1 victory. It is what it is![/QUOTE]
You know what he means. Alonso was the faster driver and except for a botched pit stop he would have won. It wasn't because of a superior strategy or a faster car.
| StuBeck | 10-01-2006 01:53 PM |
[QUOTE=OnTheGas;15450188]Ahh! So that is how points are earned... But why didn't Massa gift the point to Rosberg, instead of Webber?[/QUOTE]
What does Rosberg have to do with anything? Massa didn't turn in which caused Coulthard to run into him since Coulthard had a crazy idea that Massa might follow the lines of the course. This damaged Coulthard's car and the next lap he messed up going into turn 13 and Webber got past.
What does Rosberg have to do with anything? Massa didn't turn in which caused Coulthard to run into him since Coulthard had a crazy idea that Massa might follow the lines of the course. This damaged Coulthard's car and the next lap he messed up going into turn 13 and Webber got past.
| Ferg | 10-01-2006 02:01 PM |
Not sure if Speed mentioned this, I fell asleep during the podium ceremony...
If Schumacher wins at Suzuka he's World Champion regardless of what Fernando does.
If Schumacher wins at Suzuka he's World Champion regardless of what Fernando does.
| ptclaus98 | 10-01-2006 02:08 PM |
[QUOTE=Ferg;15450325]Not sure if Speed mentioned this, I fell asleep during the podium ceremony...
If Schumacher wins at Suzuka he's World Champion regardless of what Fernando does.[/QUOTE]
I know it's improbable, but if Alonso gets a second at Suzuka, and wins in Brazil, and Michael wins Suzuka, and gets a DNF at Interlagos, doesn't that mean Alonso wins?
If Schumacher wins at Suzuka he's World Champion regardless of what Fernando does.[/QUOTE]
I know it's improbable, but if Alonso gets a second at Suzuka, and wins in Brazil, and Michael wins Suzuka, and gets a DNF at Interlagos, doesn't that mean Alonso wins?
| ptclaus98 | 10-01-2006 02:11 PM |
[QUOTE=Draken;15449850]
PS: So damn glad to see Kimi getting away from the McClaren train wreck. He deserves to get into a reliable car. Hopefully the Ferrari won't lose its pace with technical staff changes.[/QUOTE]
Next season could be wide open. What if Ferrari's new management doesn't pan out?
That's why Kimi should have stayed for one more year. To see who rises above.
PS: So damn glad to see Kimi getting away from the McClaren train wreck. He deserves to get into a reliable car. Hopefully the Ferrari won't lose its pace with technical staff changes.[/QUOTE]
Next season could be wide open. What if Ferrari's new management doesn't pan out?
That's why Kimi should have stayed for one more year. To see who rises above.
| bitterWRX | 10-01-2006 02:11 PM |
[QUOTE=ptclaus98;15450376]I know it's improbable, but if Alonso gets a second at Suzuka, and wins in Brazil, and Michael wins Suzuka, and gets a DNF at Interlagos, doesn't that mean Alonso wins?[/QUOTE]
Given the reliability of the Ferrrari, a DNF is very unlikely... unless Schumi gets hit by a Super Aguri.
Given the reliability of the Ferrrari, a DNF is very unlikely... unless Schumi gets hit by a Super Aguri.
| KAX | 10-01-2006 02:17 PM |
[QUOTE=Ferg;15450242]Had Alonso not had his issues with the bad call on tires Schumacher wouldn't have gotten close to him.
Props to Michael and Ferrari for being there to take full advantage of Renault's trouble, but Michael won this race on luck (someone else's bad luck specifically) rather than outright speed.
Like you said though, that's racing.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=StuBeck;15450255]You know what he means. Alonso was the faster driver and except for a botched pit stop he would have won. It wasn't because of a superior strategy or a faster car.[/QUOTE]
welcome to the world of being a Kimi fan. you guys are getting silly with this. Always complaining too many people give Kimi too much credit by feeling sorry for his bad luck, and now you guys are doing the same thing with Alonso that we did with Kimi.
OnTheGas is right. If your going to consider one mans bad luck, you have to consider everyones. And Kimi was the fastest off all of them when his bad luck struck, so why does Alonso still win?
And just like what you told us with Alonso's championship, you can't ignore the beautiful driving Schumacher did to get in front of both Alonso and Fisi to take the win, whether Alonso had problems or not.
Props to Michael and Ferrari for being there to take full advantage of Renault's trouble, but Michael won this race on luck (someone else's bad luck specifically) rather than outright speed.
Like you said though, that's racing.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=StuBeck;15450255]You know what he means. Alonso was the faster driver and except for a botched pit stop he would have won. It wasn't because of a superior strategy or a faster car.[/QUOTE]
welcome to the world of being a Kimi fan. you guys are getting silly with this. Always complaining too many people give Kimi too much credit by feeling sorry for his bad luck, and now you guys are doing the same thing with Alonso that we did with Kimi.
OnTheGas is right. If your going to consider one mans bad luck, you have to consider everyones. And Kimi was the fastest off all of them when his bad luck struck, so why does Alonso still win?
And just like what you told us with Alonso's championship, you can't ignore the beautiful driving Schumacher did to get in front of both Alonso and Fisi to take the win, whether Alonso had problems or not.
| ein86 | 10-01-2006 02:21 PM |
"Did I say Japan?"
"...yup"
"Sorry....there's an ugly joke in there somewhere.."
I'd be 37% more bored with F1 if not for them...:banana:
"...yup"
"Sorry....there's an ugly joke in there somewhere.."
I'd be 37% more bored with F1 if not for them...:banana:
| ptclaus98 | 10-01-2006 02:25 PM |
[QUOTE=bitterWRX;15450407]Given the reliability of the Ferrrari, a DNF is very unlikely... unless Schumi gets hit by a Super Aguri.[/QUOTE]
I said it was improbable, but Ferg made it seem like if Schumi won the next race, he didn't even have to show up at Brazil.
I said it was improbable, but Ferg made it seem like if Schumi won the next race, he didn't even have to show up at Brazil.
| Ferg | 10-01-2006 02:26 PM |
Oh snap, you're right!
Let me think...
If as you suggest Michael wins in Suzuka, which is likely given his record there, and Fernando takes second, Fernando will then have to win the race in Brazil and hope that Michael finishes no better than third.
Crikey this is confusing...you guys get cracking on more scenarios!
Let me think...
If as you suggest Michael wins in Suzuka, which is likely given his record there, and Fernando takes second, Fernando will then have to win the race in Brazil and hope that Michael finishes no better than third.
Crikey this is confusing...you guys get cracking on more scenarios!
| StuBeck | 10-01-2006 02:35 PM |
[QUOTE=KAX;15450443]welcome to the world of being a Kimi fan. you guys are getting silly with this. Always complaining too many people give Kimi too much credit by feeling sorry for his bad luck, and now you guys are doing the same thing with Alonso that we did with Kimi.
OnTheGas is right. If your going to consider one mans bad luck, you have to consider everyones. And Kimi was the fastest off all of them when his bad luck struck, so why does Alonso still win?
And just like what you told us with Alonso's championship, you can't ignore the beautiful driving Schumacher did to get in front of both Alonso and Fisi to take the win, whether Alonso had problems or not.[/QUOTE]
I'm a Kimi fan :lol:
I simply REALLY REALLY dislike Schumacher so whoever is beating him is the driver I want to win.
All I'm saying is its not like Schumacher was miles ahead of everyone this race. Renault was at the beginning of the first stint, but made the mistake of changing Alonso's tyres, then had difficulty changing his tyres later on. This lost him a ton of time.
With what happened Raikkonen would have probably won with about a 25 second lead.
OnTheGas is right. If your going to consider one mans bad luck, you have to consider everyones. And Kimi was the fastest off all of them when his bad luck struck, so why does Alonso still win?
And just like what you told us with Alonso's championship, you can't ignore the beautiful driving Schumacher did to get in front of both Alonso and Fisi to take the win, whether Alonso had problems or not.[/QUOTE]
I'm a Kimi fan :lol:
I simply REALLY REALLY dislike Schumacher so whoever is beating him is the driver I want to win.
All I'm saying is its not like Schumacher was miles ahead of everyone this race. Renault was at the beginning of the first stint, but made the mistake of changing Alonso's tyres, then had difficulty changing his tyres later on. This lost him a ton of time.
With what happened Raikkonen would have probably won with about a 25 second lead.
| Ferg | 10-01-2006 02:42 PM |
[QUOTE=KAX;15450443]OnTheGas is right. If your going to consider one mans bad luck, you have to consider everyones. And Kimi was the fastest off all of them when his bad luck struck, so why does Alonso still win?
And just like what you told us with Alonso's championship, you can't ignore the beautiful driving Schumacher did to get in front of both Alonso and Fisi to take the win, whether Alonso had problems or not.[/QUOTE]
All I'm saying is that in this race, China 2006, Michael won because someone else was unlucky. Now we can debate all day as to why Renault hit trouble... Fernando using up his fronts early on, Fisi getting called in a lap too late, leaving him a sitting duck for Michael, Kimi breaking down again...whatever. The luck went with Michael today and against the competition, and as we all know, that's motor racing.
I've already said Schumacher did a fantastic job to take advantage of Renault's slip up with Fernando's tires, Fisi's second stop, and ultimately Kimi's early departure. His driving was vintage Michael Schumacher no doubt about it, but he was on course to finish third, maybe fourth if Kimi had stayed in the fight longer.
Renault threw away an easy one two today, nothing more.
And just like what you told us with Alonso's championship, you can't ignore the beautiful driving Schumacher did to get in front of both Alonso and Fisi to take the win, whether Alonso had problems or not.[/QUOTE]
All I'm saying is that in this race, China 2006, Michael won because someone else was unlucky. Now we can debate all day as to why Renault hit trouble... Fernando using up his fronts early on, Fisi getting called in a lap too late, leaving him a sitting duck for Michael, Kimi breaking down again...whatever. The luck went with Michael today and against the competition, and as we all know, that's motor racing.
I've already said Schumacher did a fantastic job to take advantage of Renault's slip up with Fernando's tires, Fisi's second stop, and ultimately Kimi's early departure. His driving was vintage Michael Schumacher no doubt about it, but he was on course to finish third, maybe fourth if Kimi had stayed in the fight longer.
Renault threw away an easy one two today, nothing more.
| KAX | 10-01-2006 02:54 PM |
ok, agreed then.
on another note, how would michael be gauranteed the championship just by winning next race?
its all tied, if he wins and alonso is 2nd or even 3rd, 4th, 5th, 6th, 7th or 8th, he should still have a chance to win if he wins and Michael DNF's brazil. As long as Alonso beats schumacher by one more points-paying place than Schumacher beats alonso in Japan, he can still win. IE Schumi 1st, and say Alonso 3rd in Japan, if Alonso wins Brazil and Schumacher gets 4th or worse, Alonso would win.
on another note, how would michael be gauranteed the championship just by winning next race?
its all tied, if he wins and alonso is 2nd or even 3rd, 4th, 5th, 6th, 7th or 8th, he should still have a chance to win if he wins and Michael DNF's brazil. As long as Alonso beats schumacher by one more points-paying place than Schumacher beats alonso in Japan, he can still win. IE Schumi 1st, and say Alonso 3rd in Japan, if Alonso wins Brazil and Schumacher gets 4th or worse, Alonso would win.
| StuBeck | 10-01-2006 03:26 PM |
[QUOTE=Ferg;15450644]All I'm saying is that in this race, China 2006, Michael won because someone else was unlucky. Now we can debate all day as to why Renault hit trouble... Fernando using up his fronts early on, Fisi getting called in a lap too late, leaving him a sitting duck for Michael, Kimi breaking down again...whatever. The luck went with Michael today and against the competition, and as we all know, that's motor racing.
[/QUOTE]
That's what I'ms aying too, I don't know whats so hard to figure out about this!
[/QUOTE]
That's what I'ms aying too, I don't know whats so hard to figure out about this!
| KAX | 10-01-2006 03:32 PM |
[QUOTE=StuBeck;15450988]That's what I'ms aying too, I don't know whats so hard to figure out about this![/QUOTE]
its just the way you guys originally put it. Made it seem like you were just looking for excuses for Alonso. I was suprised cuz Ferg is usually very unbiased, but he still was being, just didnt seem that way.
its just the way you guys originally put it. Made it seem like you were just looking for excuses for Alonso. I was suprised cuz Ferg is usually very unbiased, but he still was being, just didnt seem that way.
| afpdl | 10-01-2006 05:03 PM |
[QUOTE=StuBeck;15449151]
Schumacher had a good lead, but I at this point in the championship would have at least matched his laptimes for a lap or two, but he was consistatnly off by a second or two. Without Alonso's 20 second pit stop he would have won.[/QUOTE]
Thats kind of impossible to say, once Shumacher was out in front on they drys he wasnt trying to throw down fast laps. The end of the race was just Alonso driving as fast as he can and Shumacher driving just fast enough to not get passed on the last lap.
Schumacher had a good lead, but I at this point in the championship would have at least matched his laptimes for a lap or two, but he was consistatnly off by a second or two. Without Alonso's 20 second pit stop he would have won.[/QUOTE]
Thats kind of impossible to say, once Shumacher was out in front on they drys he wasnt trying to throw down fast laps. The end of the race was just Alonso driving as fast as he can and Shumacher driving just fast enough to not get passed on the last lap.
| OnTheGas | 10-01-2006 05:05 PM |
The struggles of Nico
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[QUOTE=StuBeck;15450265]What does Rosberg have to do with anything?[/QUOTE]When I pointed out that Williams and Webber in particular had an excellent weekend in the B'Stone class (2nd place in class, 8th place overall), I also pointed out that Webber was faster than Nico all weekend. And that this has been the case in recent races, so I wonder about the length of Williams patience.
You replied that Webber obtained 8th place due to a two car collision that happened in a battle for 8th place ahead of Webber. The collision took out one competitor, and damaged the other competitor, so that Webber was able to pass for the point paying position.
So the reason why Nico did not finish 8th, and Webber did, is that Webber was running faster, and he was able to pass more people on track. That is how he ended up in the position to take advantage of the opportunity presented for 8th place. It was an impressive drive.
I hope that Rosberg is able to step up his performance by early next season, if not these last two races... It is unusual for F1 teams to have much patience for under-performing drivers in F1.
You replied that Webber obtained 8th place due to a two car collision that happened in a battle for 8th place ahead of Webber. The collision took out one competitor, and damaged the other competitor, so that Webber was able to pass for the point paying position.
So the reason why Nico did not finish 8th, and Webber did, is that Webber was running faster, and he was able to pass more people on track. That is how he ended up in the position to take advantage of the opportunity presented for 8th place. It was an impressive drive.
I hope that Rosberg is able to step up his performance by early next season, if not these last two races... It is unusual for F1 teams to have much patience for under-performing drivers in F1.
| ptclaus98 | 10-01-2006 05:10 PM |
At least Nico wasn't a smartass this week.
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