| johnfelstead | 05-12-2004 06:56 PM |
This is what Safari rally water crossing looks like, see the snorkle.
[img]http://www.tte.de/images/st185-safari-93.jpg[/img]
[img]http://www.tte.de/images/st185-safari-93.jpg[/img]
| bjorn240 | 05-12-2004 07:08 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by johnfelstead [/i]
[B]Water crossings have limits to depth on rallies under normal circumstances datageek, [/B][/QUOTE]
The water splash on the SuperSpecial at Rim didn't exceed 25cm at any point. Not to mention it was only about 2 meters wide at its maximum.
I recognize that a lot of people felt the jump was oversized, but I think it's time to take a step back and apply some critical rigor.
The SSS was approximately 1.2km long, and the max and min clean times in any class never varied by more than 7-8 seconds. We set a 1.25, 1.23, and 1.20 or something, driving quite conservatively. If anyone really thought that hammering it on the SSS was the way to win the rally, they deserved to lose it there.
Additionally, as we've already discussed, competitors were allowed to walk the stage before their run, and had at least 45 minutes to do so, given that each SSS was preceded by a service.
Lastly, if a 20-year old Supercross star has enough sense to lift over a jump, so should you. :D
- Christian
[B]Water crossings have limits to depth on rallies under normal circumstances datageek, [/B][/QUOTE]
The water splash on the SuperSpecial at Rim didn't exceed 25cm at any point. Not to mention it was only about 2 meters wide at its maximum.
I recognize that a lot of people felt the jump was oversized, but I think it's time to take a step back and apply some critical rigor.
The SSS was approximately 1.2km long, and the max and min clean times in any class never varied by more than 7-8 seconds. We set a 1.25, 1.23, and 1.20 or something, driving quite conservatively. If anyone really thought that hammering it on the SSS was the way to win the rally, they deserved to lose it there.
Additionally, as we've already discussed, competitors were allowed to walk the stage before their run, and had at least 45 minutes to do so, given that each SSS was preceded by a service.
Lastly, if a 20-year old Supercross star has enough sense to lift over a jump, so should you. :D
- Christian
| Subie Gal | 05-12-2004 07:15 PM |
Christian..... addressing this to you...
all in all, did you think the super-special was safe?
if so i'm suprised.
especially based on your experience(s)
I sure didnt. not when i slid into my competitors lane.
and no, i was not pushing... I know better.... yet i still managed to get m'self stuck... the car just went WHEEEEE.... and there i was :eek:
i saw the exact same scenario happen to many other competitors as well, some with much more driving experience than most... :huh:
I walked the stage...
Still, was quite different when attempting to navigate it.
*shrug*
this is not a bash fest on the organizers nor the rally
just a few things that could be 'better next time' perhaps???
Jamie
all in all, did you think the super-special was safe?
if so i'm suprised.
especially based on your experience(s)
I sure didnt. not when i slid into my competitors lane.
and no, i was not pushing... I know better.... yet i still managed to get m'self stuck... the car just went WHEEEEE.... and there i was :eek:
i saw the exact same scenario happen to many other competitors as well, some with much more driving experience than most... :huh:
I walked the stage...
Still, was quite different when attempting to navigate it.
*shrug*
this is not a bash fest on the organizers nor the rally
just a few things that could be 'better next time' perhaps???
Jamie
| Mako | 05-12-2004 10:14 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by johnfelstead [/i]
[B]
I am glad you are now learning how to co-drive Jason, it apears there is still a lot you dont understand about what makes a good co-driver though. [/B][/QUOTE]
Well, the almighty John has spoken! I'm shocked, SHOCKED! you weren't there to co-drive, as I'm sure your car would have been victorious simply because John Felstead was in the vehicle...
Tell us what makes a good co-driver...a quick google search didn't turn up much record of your WRC wins...
I'm sure you meant well by that statement, but it made you sound a bit of a tall poppy...
[B]
I am glad you are now learning how to co-drive Jason, it apears there is still a lot you dont understand about what makes a good co-driver though. [/B][/QUOTE]
Well, the almighty John has spoken! I'm shocked, SHOCKED! you weren't there to co-drive, as I'm sure your car would have been victorious simply because John Felstead was in the vehicle...
Tell us what makes a good co-driver...a quick google search didn't turn up much record of your WRC wins...
I'm sure you meant well by that statement, but it made you sound a bit of a tall poppy...
| bjorn240 | 05-12-2004 11:04 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Subie Gal[/i]
[B] Christian..... addressing this to you...
all in all, did you think the super-special was safe?
if so i'm suprised.
especially based on your experience(s)
[/B][/QUOTE]
*Shrug* Was it perfect? No. It would have been better with a larger spacing between the lanes, a higher berm, and some bales. Yes.
But from a risk standpoint, I sure don't think it compares to Wilson Mills or Painter Run, and very few (any?) drivers are advocating significant changes to those stages.
I guess my point is, I think putting up a round-bale chicane in the middle of Wilson Mills will do more for our collective safety than any change to the SSS at Rim. Or ensuring that all rallies are made to run sequencing on stage.
But sure, I get your point re: better next time. I'm just saying, I didn't feel like I was in mortal danger at any time and that it wasn't necessary to take the jump at 110%, and anyone who did, should have known better.
Cheers,
- Christian
PS: When you gonna offer me a ride in that wagon, eh?
[B] Christian..... addressing this to you...
all in all, did you think the super-special was safe?
if so i'm suprised.
especially based on your experience(s)
[/B][/QUOTE]
*Shrug* Was it perfect? No. It would have been better with a larger spacing between the lanes, a higher berm, and some bales. Yes.
But from a risk standpoint, I sure don't think it compares to Wilson Mills or Painter Run, and very few (any?) drivers are advocating significant changes to those stages.
I guess my point is, I think putting up a round-bale chicane in the middle of Wilson Mills will do more for our collective safety than any change to the SSS at Rim. Or ensuring that all rallies are made to run sequencing on stage.
But sure, I get your point re: better next time. I'm just saying, I didn't feel like I was in mortal danger at any time and that it wasn't necessary to take the jump at 110%, and anyone who did, should have known better.
Cheers,
- Christian
PS: When you gonna offer me a ride in that wagon, eh?
| datageek | 05-13-2004 01:54 AM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Jgrahn555 [/i]
[B]I think he's referring to shots like this (Stoney Fork Water Crossing):
[url]http://linaracing.com/pics/picturedetail.cfm?picturenumber=1[/url]
[url]http://jenisys.com/fkr/rally/stpr_99/stpr99_2.jpg[/url]
Not so typical for us in the states, but a commonplace for Rally Argentina or what was the Safari Rally. [/B][/QUOTE]
:eek:
Wow, that would be something to see in the California desert in summertime!
Oh, wait. Didn't we see something like that at Rim last year? :)
[B]I think he's referring to shots like this (Stoney Fork Water Crossing):
[url]http://linaracing.com/pics/picturedetail.cfm?picturenumber=1[/url]
[url]http://jenisys.com/fkr/rally/stpr_99/stpr99_2.jpg[/url]
Not so typical for us in the states, but a commonplace for Rally Argentina or what was the Safari Rally. [/B][/QUOTE]
:eek:
Wow, that would be something to see in the California desert in summertime!
Oh, wait. Didn't we see something like that at Rim last year? :)
| WRXMaster | 05-13-2004 03:23 AM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by horatio102 [/i]
[B]:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
mmmmmkay yeaah. :lol:
Next time I'm going to bust out a stopwatch and clock him because his accelleration down the front stretch seemed to be about as fast as Burke's.
:lol: [/B][/QUOTE]
A really well built pgt wrx can almost keep up with a group N car ...........they can use as much boost as they can shoot threw that restrictor ..........they can use all of the group N diffs and other little tricks .............. Verdier isnt cheating hes just a really good driver in a very well built car
[B]:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
mmmmmkay yeaah. :lol:
Next time I'm going to bust out a stopwatch and clock him because his accelleration down the front stretch seemed to be about as fast as Burke's.
:lol: [/B][/QUOTE]
A really well built pgt wrx can almost keep up with a group N car ...........they can use as much boost as they can shoot threw that restrictor ..........they can use all of the group N diffs and other little tricks .............. Verdier isnt cheating hes just a really good driver in a very well built car
| johnfelstead | 05-13-2004 07:56 AM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Mako [/i]
[B]Well, the almighty John has spoken! I'm shocked, SHOCKED! you weren't there to co-drive, as I'm sure your car would have been victorious simply because John Felstead was in the vehicle...
Tell us what makes a good co-driver...a quick google search didn't turn up much record of your WRC wins...
I'm sure you meant well by that statement, but it made you sound a bit of a tall poppy... [/B][/QUOTE]
Where do i mention me or my ability to win at Rim in anything Mako? It wasnt in reference to winning anything at all. What are you so SHOCKED about?
I met you at Rim last year didnt I? If so i am suprised at your tone in this post, especially as you havnt a clue what i said to Jason meant.
[B]Well, the almighty John has spoken! I'm shocked, SHOCKED! you weren't there to co-drive, as I'm sure your car would have been victorious simply because John Felstead was in the vehicle...
Tell us what makes a good co-driver...a quick google search didn't turn up much record of your WRC wins...
I'm sure you meant well by that statement, but it made you sound a bit of a tall poppy... [/B][/QUOTE]
Where do i mention me or my ability to win at Rim in anything Mako? It wasnt in reference to winning anything at all. What are you so SHOCKED about?
I met you at Rim last year didnt I? If so i am suprised at your tone in this post, especially as you havnt a clue what i said to Jason meant.
| ANZAC_1915 | 05-13-2004 01:35 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by WRXMaster [/i]
[B]they can use all of the group N diffs and other little tricks .............. [/B][/QUOTE]
That is not true. If the car comes with an active diff you can keep it, but you can't retrofit them. So an STi 6MT+DCCD+Suretrac in a WRX would not be ok for PGT.
Glenn
[B]they can use all of the group N diffs and other little tricks .............. [/B][/QUOTE]
That is not true. If the car comes with an active diff you can keep it, but you can't retrofit them. So an STi 6MT+DCCD+Suretrac in a WRX would not be ok for PGT.
Glenn
| Jgrahn555 | 05-13-2004 01:47 PM |
Aren't ECU choices open --AS LONG AS-- they plug into the factory harness? In the case of an impreza, get a plug and play aftermarket ECU and you can program to your hearts content your fuel, timing, and boost maps... very handy if the car is in the right hands.
| WRXMaster | 05-13-2004 02:58 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Glenn Wallace [/i]
[B]That is not true. If the car comes with an active diff you can keep it, but you can't retrofit them. So an STi 6MT+DCCD+Suretrac in a WRX would not be ok for PGT.
Glenn [/B][/QUOTE]
You can use the sti diffs in a pgt car ..................I can stick it in my little rs ........but it would be pointless because I have no power ......... Tranny you cant touch
[B]That is not true. If the car comes with an active diff you can keep it, but you can't retrofit them. So an STi 6MT+DCCD+Suretrac in a WRX would not be ok for PGT.
Glenn [/B][/QUOTE]
You can use the sti diffs in a pgt car ..................I can stick it in my little rs ........but it would be pointless because I have no power ......... Tranny you cant touch
| Sergeant_V | 05-13-2004 03:11 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Jgrahn555 [/i]
[B]Aren't ECU choices open --AS LONG AS-- they plug into the factory harness? In the case of an impreza, get a plug and play aftermarket ECU and you can program to your hearts content your fuel, timing, and boost maps... very handy if the car is in the right hands. [/B][/QUOTE] Good question. Glenn, what do you think? By the way, I'm sorry I didn't catch up with you at Rim. Had I known you were there with the ALCAN crew I'd have definitely looked you up.
Abel
[B]Aren't ECU choices open --AS LONG AS-- they plug into the factory harness? In the case of an impreza, get a plug and play aftermarket ECU and you can program to your hearts content your fuel, timing, and boost maps... very handy if the car is in the right hands. [/B][/QUOTE] Good question. Glenn, what do you think? By the way, I'm sorry I didn't catch up with you at Rim. Had I known you were there with the ALCAN crew I'd have definitely looked you up.
Abel
| johnfelstead | 05-13-2004 04:03 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Jgrahn555 [/i]
[B]Aren't ECU choices open --AS LONG AS-- they plug into the factory harness? In the case of an impreza, get a plug and play aftermarket ECU and you can program to your hearts content your fuel, timing, and boost maps... very handy if the car is in the right hands. [/B][/QUOTE]
No, PGT doesnt allow for changes of the factory ECU, you are only allowed to alter boost and fueling control acording to the rules, which means you cant change ignition control system or ignition mapping.
This is why a groupN engine should be producing a lot more torque than PGT, because under groupN rules you can alter all parameters and also replace the ECU with an aftermarket item running ALS etc. If a PGT car is producing the same performance as a groupN car in a straight line drag i would be tempted to look a little closer at that car.
[B]Aren't ECU choices open --AS LONG AS-- they plug into the factory harness? In the case of an impreza, get a plug and play aftermarket ECU and you can program to your hearts content your fuel, timing, and boost maps... very handy if the car is in the right hands. [/B][/QUOTE]
No, PGT doesnt allow for changes of the factory ECU, you are only allowed to alter boost and fueling control acording to the rules, which means you cant change ignition control system or ignition mapping.
This is why a groupN engine should be producing a lot more torque than PGT, because under groupN rules you can alter all parameters and also replace the ECU with an aftermarket item running ALS etc. If a PGT car is producing the same performance as a groupN car in a straight line drag i would be tempted to look a little closer at that car.
| johnfelstead | 05-13-2004 04:09 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by WRXMaster [/i]
[B]You can use the sti diffs in a pgt car ..................I can stick it in my little rs ........but it would be pointless because I have no power ......... Tranny you cant touch [/B][/QUOTE]
What glenn means i think, is you have to retain the diff setup for that model of car, for example the WRX has a diferent type of gearbox centre diff design to the WRX and doesnt have any active control systems. To install the STi DCCD system you would need to physically modify the gearbox and install aditional wiring which wouldnt be legal IMHO. The use of LSD's is free though, so you can install a plated LSD from a groupN car for example. Gear ratios have to be retained though, so if you go installing TypeRA or Spec C gear and diff ratios into a PGT car that will be illegal.
[B]You can use the sti diffs in a pgt car ..................I can stick it in my little rs ........but it would be pointless because I have no power ......... Tranny you cant touch [/B][/QUOTE]
What glenn means i think, is you have to retain the diff setup for that model of car, for example the WRX has a diferent type of gearbox centre diff design to the WRX and doesnt have any active control systems. To install the STi DCCD system you would need to physically modify the gearbox and install aditional wiring which wouldnt be legal IMHO. The use of LSD's is free though, so you can install a plated LSD from a groupN car for example. Gear ratios have to be retained though, so if you go installing TypeRA or Spec C gear and diff ratios into a PGT car that will be illegal.
| akuhner | 05-13-2004 04:14 PM |
It's simple in the rule book, PGT diffs are open. Period, that's all it says! Adding an active diff would problably require modifcations to the transmission, which would make it illegal. But the main point is that you can put what ever diff you can cram into your stock drivetrain...
Regarding Verdier's speed, isn't it funny how accusations (which may or may not have been in jest) fly when someone in a lesser car beats the better cars? We all know that in rally there are an unlimited number of possible reasons he could have beat guys in better cars with similar talent. One simple mistake could have cost Workum the 3 minutes Verdier beat him by - it could have been a spin, or a flat tire, or dust delays.
That said, I do think Verdier is damn fast to get a 3 minute lead on an Open class car, but you have to see my point! You can't make judgements like that based on almost 2.5 hours of flat out racing over rough terrain. It would be different if you were comparing lap times at a track of two cars with the same driver and found a 2% speed difference (that's what Verdier's lead equates to).
Alex
Regarding Verdier's speed, isn't it funny how accusations (which may or may not have been in jest) fly when someone in a lesser car beats the better cars? We all know that in rally there are an unlimited number of possible reasons he could have beat guys in better cars with similar talent. One simple mistake could have cost Workum the 3 minutes Verdier beat him by - it could have been a spin, or a flat tire, or dust delays.
That said, I do think Verdier is damn fast to get a 3 minute lead on an Open class car, but you have to see my point! You can't make judgements like that based on almost 2.5 hours of flat out racing over rough terrain. It would be different if you were comparing lap times at a track of two cars with the same driver and found a 2% speed difference (that's what Verdier's lead equates to).
Alex
| Sergeant_V | 05-13-2004 04:14 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by johnfelstead [/i]
[B]No, PGT doesnt allow for changes of the factory ECU, you are only allowed to alter boost and fueling control acording to the rules, which means you cant change ignition control system or ignition mapping.
This is why a groupN engine should be producing a lot more torque than PGT, because under groupN rules you can alter all parameters and also replace the ECU with an aftermarket item running ALS etc. If a PGT car is producing the same performance as a groupN car in a straight line drag i would be tempted to look a little closer at that car. [/B][/QUOTE]
John,
I've been curious about this. How do you alter boost and fueling without re-flashing the ECU or installing hardware? Is an ECU re-flash legal? Sorry for the silly questions, I'm away from my printed copy of the Performance Rally Rules and the online version is currently unavailable.
Regards,
Abel
[B]No, PGT doesnt allow for changes of the factory ECU, you are only allowed to alter boost and fueling control acording to the rules, which means you cant change ignition control system or ignition mapping.
This is why a groupN engine should be producing a lot more torque than PGT, because under groupN rules you can alter all parameters and also replace the ECU with an aftermarket item running ALS etc. If a PGT car is producing the same performance as a groupN car in a straight line drag i would be tempted to look a little closer at that car. [/B][/QUOTE]
John,
I've been curious about this. How do you alter boost and fueling without re-flashing the ECU or installing hardware? Is an ECU re-flash legal? Sorry for the silly questions, I'm away from my printed copy of the Performance Rally Rules and the online version is currently unavailable.
Regards,
Abel
| johnfelstead | 05-13-2004 04:22 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Car #187 [/i]
[B]It's simple in the rule book, PGT diffs are open. Period, that's all it says! Adding an active diff would problably require modifcations to the transmission, which would make it illegal. But the main point is that you can put what ever diff you can cram into your stock drivetrain... [/B][/QUOTE]
the DCCD centre diff wont fit in a stock WRX tranny, thats the point glenn is making i think.
[B]It's simple in the rule book, PGT diffs are open. Period, that's all it says! Adding an active diff would problably require modifcations to the transmission, which would make it illegal. But the main point is that you can put what ever diff you can cram into your stock drivetrain... [/B][/QUOTE]
the DCCD centre diff wont fit in a stock WRX tranny, thats the point glenn is making i think.
| ANZAC_1915 | 05-13-2004 04:26 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Car #187 [/i]
[B]It's simple in the rule book, PGT diffs are open. Period, that's all it says! Adding an active diff would problably require modifcations to the transmission, which would make it illegal. But the main point is that you can put what ever diff you can cram into your stock drivetrain... [/B][/QUOTE]
Except perhaps in terms of reliability, putting a plate rear diff in a WRX is not going to make a huge difference.
When he said "Group N diffs" I assumed he meant the important bit, the center diff.
Also, I don't think you could put an R180 sized rear in a WRX, that would also be illegal.
It is PRODUCTION GT, not Open GT.
[B]It's simple in the rule book, PGT diffs are open. Period, that's all it says! Adding an active diff would problably require modifcations to the transmission, which would make it illegal. But the main point is that you can put what ever diff you can cram into your stock drivetrain... [/B][/QUOTE]
Except perhaps in terms of reliability, putting a plate rear diff in a WRX is not going to make a huge difference.
When he said "Group N diffs" I assumed he meant the important bit, the center diff.
Also, I don't think you could put an R180 sized rear in a WRX, that would also be illegal.
It is PRODUCTION GT, not Open GT.
| akuhner | 05-13-2004 04:30 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Glenn Wallace [/i]
[B]
Also, I don't think you could put an R180 sized rear in a WRX, that would also be illegal.
It is PRODUCTION GT, not Open GT. [/B][/QUOTE]
Of course not! That wouldn't fit in your stock drive train! I didn't think I had to specify that I meant you'd have to fit it into your stock rear diff casing... I think we all agree here...
[B]
Also, I don't think you could put an R180 sized rear in a WRX, that would also be illegal.
It is PRODUCTION GT, not Open GT. [/B][/QUOTE]
Of course not! That wouldn't fit in your stock drive train! I didn't think I had to specify that I meant you'd have to fit it into your stock rear diff casing... I think we all agree here...
| johnfelstead | 05-13-2004 04:31 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Sergeant_V [/i]
[B]John,
I've been curious about this. How do you alter boost and fueling without re-flashing the ECU or installing hardware? Is an ECU re-flash legal? Sorry for the silly questions, I'm away from my printed copy of the Performance Rally Rules and the online version is currently unavailable.
Regards,
Abel [/B][/QUOTE]
You can reflash the ECU leaving the ignition maps as they were, yet still alter the boost and fuel settings. All parameters are independantly changed using EcuTek software.
Personally i think the rules for PGT on this are stupid and it would be much easier to keep a level playing field and reduce contention if they freed up the ignition mapping too. But as the rules stand right now you cant change ignition.
So reflashing is legal, as long as you dont alter the ignition maps.
[B]John,
I've been curious about this. How do you alter boost and fueling without re-flashing the ECU or installing hardware? Is an ECU re-flash legal? Sorry for the silly questions, I'm away from my printed copy of the Performance Rally Rules and the online version is currently unavailable.
Regards,
Abel [/B][/QUOTE]
You can reflash the ECU leaving the ignition maps as they were, yet still alter the boost and fuel settings. All parameters are independantly changed using EcuTek software.
Personally i think the rules for PGT on this are stupid and it would be much easier to keep a level playing field and reduce contention if they freed up the ignition mapping too. But as the rules stand right now you cant change ignition.
So reflashing is legal, as long as you dont alter the ignition maps.
| Sergeant_V | 05-13-2004 04:33 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by johnfelstead [/i]
[B]You can reflash the ECU leaving the ignition maps as they were, yet still alter the boost and fuel settings. All parameters are independantly changed using EcuTek software.
Personally i think the rules for PGT on this are stupid and it would be much easier to keep a level playing field and reduce contention if they freed up the ignition mapping too. But as the rules stand right now you cant change ignition.
So reflashing is legal, as long as you dont alter the ignition maps. [/B][/QUOTE]
That is good to know. Thanks!
Abel
[B]You can reflash the ECU leaving the ignition maps as they were, yet still alter the boost and fuel settings. All parameters are independantly changed using EcuTek software.
Personally i think the rules for PGT on this are stupid and it would be much easier to keep a level playing field and reduce contention if they freed up the ignition mapping too. But as the rules stand right now you cant change ignition.
So reflashing is legal, as long as you dont alter the ignition maps. [/B][/QUOTE]
That is good to know. Thanks!
Abel
| Mopho | 05-13-2004 04:42 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Kha0S [/i]
[B]Four letters for you: STPR. :D
/Andrew [/B][/QUOTE]
What is your point? The water crossing at STPR gets cancelled if the water is too deep (I think more than 6 inches?) It was cancelled last year, which just confirms what John was saying
STPR 02'
[IMG]http://www.morgansegal.com/images/rally08.jpg[/IMG]
I think it would have been better if they made the lanes wider, not just for safety, but to allow the cars to slide more and hang it out, would have been more entertaining. Perhaps some more smaller jumps and more hairpin turns to juice it up a bit. They also need the lane swap like in the WRC superspecials.
The water in the splash was nasty, mixed with that sand and clay, stained my cloths and made a mess of the cameras, doh!
[IMG]http://www.rally-america.com/Archives/2004/Rim_Of_The_World/day/data/superspecial/images/DSC_4474.jpg[/IMG]
[B]Four letters for you: STPR. :D
/Andrew [/B][/QUOTE]
What is your point? The water crossing at STPR gets cancelled if the water is too deep (I think more than 6 inches?) It was cancelled last year, which just confirms what John was saying
STPR 02'
[IMG]http://www.morgansegal.com/images/rally08.jpg[/IMG]
I think it would have been better if they made the lanes wider, not just for safety, but to allow the cars to slide more and hang it out, would have been more entertaining. Perhaps some more smaller jumps and more hairpin turns to juice it up a bit. They also need the lane swap like in the WRC superspecials.
The water in the splash was nasty, mixed with that sand and clay, stained my cloths and made a mess of the cameras, doh!
[IMG]http://www.rally-america.com/Archives/2004/Rim_Of_The_World/day/data/superspecial/images/DSC_4474.jpg[/IMG]
| CosmoTheCat | 05-13-2004 05:14 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Car #187[/i]
[B]
Regarding Verdier's speed, isn't it funny how accusations (which may or may not have been in jest) fly when someone in a lesser car beats the better cars? We all know that in rally there are an unlimited number of possible reasons he could have beat guys in better cars with similar talent. One simple mistake could have cost Workum the 3 minutes Verdier beat him by - it could have been a spin, or a flat tire, or dust delays.
That said, I do think Verdier is damn fast to get a 3 minute lead on an Open class car, but you have to see my point! You can't make judgements like that based on almost 2.5 hours of flat out racing over rough terrain. It would be different if you were comparing lap times at a track of two cars with the same driver and found a 2% speed difference (that's what Verdier's lead equates to).
Alex [/B][/QUOTE]
My comments regarding Verdier's speed are based upon me watching several of the front runners head down that front stretch. It has nothing to do with the overall times, because I very well know that dkill and luck play into it more over the long haul. However, his speed appeared to be as fast as Burke's Evo, and faster than Richard's grp N car down the front stretch of the super special. What really makes it interesting is the 1/4 mile section at Oregon Trail, where Verdier pulled a 16.3, a full 2 seconds slower than Richard. I'll let everyone draw their own conclusions on that. ;)
I don't think that there's any doubt that Stephan is a good driver, but [quote]If a PGT car is producing the same performance as a groupN car in a straight line drag i would be tempted to look a little closer at that car.[/quote]
[B]
Regarding Verdier's speed, isn't it funny how accusations (which may or may not have been in jest) fly when someone in a lesser car beats the better cars? We all know that in rally there are an unlimited number of possible reasons he could have beat guys in better cars with similar talent. One simple mistake could have cost Workum the 3 minutes Verdier beat him by - it could have been a spin, or a flat tire, or dust delays.
That said, I do think Verdier is damn fast to get a 3 minute lead on an Open class car, but you have to see my point! You can't make judgements like that based on almost 2.5 hours of flat out racing over rough terrain. It would be different if you were comparing lap times at a track of two cars with the same driver and found a 2% speed difference (that's what Verdier's lead equates to).
Alex [/B][/QUOTE]
My comments regarding Verdier's speed are based upon me watching several of the front runners head down that front stretch. It has nothing to do with the overall times, because I very well know that dkill and luck play into it more over the long haul. However, his speed appeared to be as fast as Burke's Evo, and faster than Richard's grp N car down the front stretch of the super special. What really makes it interesting is the 1/4 mile section at Oregon Trail, where Verdier pulled a 16.3, a full 2 seconds slower than Richard. I'll let everyone draw their own conclusions on that. ;)
I don't think that there's any doubt that Stephan is a good driver, but [quote]If a PGT car is producing the same performance as a groupN car in a straight line drag i would be tempted to look a little closer at that car.[/quote]
| Jgrahn555 | 05-13-2004 05:39 PM |
[quote]However, his speed appeared to be as fast as Burke's Evo, and faster than Richard's grp N car down the front stretch of the super special. What really makes it interesting is the 1/4 mile section at Oregon Trail, where Verdier pulled a 16.3, a full 2 seconds slower than Richard. I'll let everyone draw their own conclusions on that. [/quote]
"Appears" is a strong word. big power slides with lots of revving and popping and bang bang appear to be faster, but it seldom is.
As for those quater mile times, a lot of drivers down in Oregon had the mentality of "it's not worth it to break the car on this quarter mile, so what's the point of going crazy, doing a good clutch drop, and banging gears through the .25?"
I agree. And knowing that there is a lot of rally to go enticed the level-headed drivers to just take it easy down the QM.
John Lanes volvo pulls a 13 in the QM, spinning his tires almost all the way. I'll let you draw your own conclusions on that.
"Appears" is a strong word. big power slides with lots of revving and popping and bang bang appear to be faster, but it seldom is.
As for those quater mile times, a lot of drivers down in Oregon had the mentality of "it's not worth it to break the car on this quarter mile, so what's the point of going crazy, doing a good clutch drop, and banging gears through the .25?"
I agree. And knowing that there is a lot of rally to go enticed the level-headed drivers to just take it easy down the QM.
John Lanes volvo pulls a 13 in the QM, spinning his tires almost all the way. I'll let you draw your own conclusions on that.
| ricochet | 05-13-2004 06:28 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Mopho [/i]
[B]The water in the splash was nasty, mixed with that sand and clay, stained my cloths and made a mess of the cameras, doh![/B][/QUOTE]
It helps if you actually [i]get out of the way[/i] of the splash. :D
-Ryan
[B]The water in the splash was nasty, mixed with that sand and clay, stained my cloths and made a mess of the cameras, doh![/B][/QUOTE]
It helps if you actually [i]get out of the way[/i] of the splash. :D
-Ryan
| CosmoTheCat | 05-13-2004 06:33 PM |
yes but the volvo isn't pgt. ;)
I know other drivers were taking it easy on the 1/4, yet still turned times in quite a bit faster.
All I know is that the pgt car appeared to be faster. You didn't seer what I did.
I know other drivers were taking it easy on the 1/4, yet still turned times in quite a bit faster.
All I know is that the pgt car appeared to be faster. You didn't seer what I did.
| WRXMaster | 05-13-2004 06:55 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by johnfelstead [/i]
[B]the DCCD centre diff wont fit in a stock WRX tranny, thats the point glenn is making i think. [/B][/QUOTE]
A while ago he posted that hes running an sti center diff ............. I dont run a wrx so I really dont pay attention to what they do ................but from talking to some experienced rally drivers ......they all say a well built pgt wrx is almost = to a decent GN car .........
[B]the DCCD centre diff wont fit in a stock WRX tranny, thats the point glenn is making i think. [/B][/QUOTE]
A while ago he posted that hes running an sti center diff ............. I dont run a wrx so I really dont pay attention to what they do ................but from talking to some experienced rally drivers ......they all say a well built pgt wrx is almost = to a decent GN car .........
| johnfelstead | 05-13-2004 07:01 PM |
Not even close engine and gearbox wise to a good groupN car. You cant make 535 Nm of torque @ 3250 rpm without playing with the ignition and a whole lot else including diferent ECU.
STi centre diff doesnt mean DCCD, there are uprated VC STi centre diff units, one of those is legal.
STi centre diff doesnt mean DCCD, there are uprated VC STi centre diff units, one of those is legal.
| Mopho | 05-13-2004 07:07 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by ricochet [/i]
[B]It helps if you actually [i]get out of the way[/i] of the splash. :D
-Ryan [/B][/QUOTE]
Well, I did align myself to where the previous splash's had ended, and I stood in the dry spot, figured at worst I would get a little wet, but then Doug Shepard came through and I got soaked-Darn the SRT-4 wins again:D
wheres the pic?
[B]It helps if you actually [i]get out of the way[/i] of the splash. :D
-Ryan [/B][/QUOTE]
Well, I did align myself to where the previous splash's had ended, and I stood in the dry spot, figured at worst I would get a little wet, but then Doug Shepard came through and I got soaked-Darn the SRT-4 wins again:D
wheres the pic?
| Pete 97 GS-T | 05-13-2004 07:09 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Mopho [/i]
[B] They also need the lane swap like in the WRC superspecials.[/B][/QUOTE]
I thought that's what the ramp trailer thingy was there for. One would jump over the other.
Pete
[url]www.onalimbracing.com[/url]
[B] They also need the lane swap like in the WRC superspecials.[/B][/QUOTE]
I thought that's what the ramp trailer thingy was there for. One would jump over the other.
Pete
[url]www.onalimbracing.com[/url]
| Pete 97 GS-T | 05-13-2004 07:12 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by bjorn240 [/i]
[B]I guess my point is, I think putting up a round-bale chicane in the middle of Wilson Mills will do more for our collective safety than any change to the SSS at Rim. [/B][/QUOTE]
Wilson Mills is like a 15 mile long drag strip. Aside from the one bridge, it's like the worst stage ever to photograph also.
Pete
[url]www.onalimbracing.com[/url]
[B]I guess my point is, I think putting up a round-bale chicane in the middle of Wilson Mills will do more for our collective safety than any change to the SSS at Rim. [/B][/QUOTE]
Wilson Mills is like a 15 mile long drag strip. Aside from the one bridge, it's like the worst stage ever to photograph also.
Pete
[url]www.onalimbracing.com[/url]
| CosmoTheCat | 05-13-2004 07:19 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Pete 97 GS-T[/i]
[B] Wilson Mills is like a 15 mile long drag strip. Aside from the one bridge, it's like the worst stage ever to photograph also.
Pete
[url]www.onalimbracing.com[/url] [/B][/QUOTE]
That sounds, um, quite unsafe. I would think that as a competitor you'd want that broken down into a LOT more smaller chunks, with say 60 or so chicanes to keep speeds under 100mph or so.
[B] Wilson Mills is like a 15 mile long drag strip. Aside from the one bridge, it's like the worst stage ever to photograph also.
Pete
[url]www.onalimbracing.com[/url] [/B][/QUOTE]
That sounds, um, quite unsafe. I would think that as a competitor you'd want that broken down into a LOT more smaller chunks, with say 60 or so chicanes to keep speeds under 100mph or so.
| driggity | 05-13-2004 07:22 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by horatio102[/i]
[B]I know other drivers were taking it easy on the 1/4, yet still turned times in quite a bit faster.[/B][/QUOTE]
So maybe he was taking it even easier than them.
Plus trying to judge power based on ETs from a single drag race is silly. Richard had a better ET than some of the Open class cars. Does that mean his car is making more power? The mere fact that the quickest car was .7 seconds ahead of the 2nd car but trapped over 2 mph slower should also tell you something about how good of a comparison ETs make.
Plus everyone knows that the SRT-4 is the fastest car ever and it ran a 16.6. :p
[B]I know other drivers were taking it easy on the 1/4, yet still turned times in quite a bit faster.[/B][/QUOTE]
So maybe he was taking it even easier than them.
Plus trying to judge power based on ETs from a single drag race is silly. Richard had a better ET than some of the Open class cars. Does that mean his car is making more power? The mere fact that the quickest car was .7 seconds ahead of the 2nd car but trapped over 2 mph slower should also tell you something about how good of a comparison ETs make.
Plus everyone knows that the SRT-4 is the fastest car ever and it ran a 16.6. :p
| CosmoTheCat | 05-13-2004 07:34 PM |
You're either missing my point or focusing on other issues just to irritate me. Quit it. :p
Fact of the matter is that pgt cars should be 227hp plus opened up exhaust, plus boost, plus fuel, minus 32mm restrictor, and they shouldn't be nearly as fast as a grp N car which is plus exhaust, boost, fuel, timing, with the same 32mm restrictor. And they shouldn't be nearly as fast as an open class car with the what? 40mm restrictor?
Fact of the matter is that pgt cars should be 227hp plus opened up exhaust, plus boost, plus fuel, minus 32mm restrictor, and they shouldn't be nearly as fast as a grp N car which is plus exhaust, boost, fuel, timing, with the same 32mm restrictor. And they shouldn't be nearly as fast as an open class car with the what? 40mm restrictor?
| johnfelstead | 05-13-2004 07:58 PM |
Give it TypeRA gearing and a 4.444:1 diff ratio and it will fly upto 100MPH, even with a PGT legal engine. My own RA with 300BHP/lbft would wipe the floor with Impreza's using the normal gear ratios that had 100BHP+ more. Mine did 30-90 just using 3rd and 4th gear in 6.6 seconds to give you some idea of how RA gearing affects acceleration, 0-60 was under 4 seconds. But that wouldnt be legal in PGT so no doubt gear ratios wouldnt be played with. :)
| Pete 97 GS-T | 05-13-2004 08:02 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by horatio102 [/i]
[B]That sounds, um, quite unsafe. I would think that as a competitor you'd want that broken down into a LOT more smaller chunks, with say 60 or so chicanes to keep speeds under 100mph or so. [/B][/QUOTE]
Fastest average speeds for Wilson Mills in 2003 were ~85 mph. (12.4 miles in under 9 minutes).
Pete
[url]www.onalimbracing.com[/url]
[B]That sounds, um, quite unsafe. I would think that as a competitor you'd want that broken down into a LOT more smaller chunks, with say 60 or so chicanes to keep speeds under 100mph or so. [/B][/QUOTE]
Fastest average speeds for Wilson Mills in 2003 were ~85 mph. (12.4 miles in under 9 minutes).
Pete
[url]www.onalimbracing.com[/url]
| verdier | 05-13-2004 08:52 PM |
for the people who think I'm cheating. If you look at my second super stage, i was pair with Morbely, who run a wrx PGT. We were exactly the same at the jump. ( i guess he must be cheating as well) Last 2 super stage I was pair with Plesk (open class) he had at least 2 car lenght at the jump on me. ( i guess I must be sandbaging). By the way if you think we were too fast, we should been even faster. We had a off in stage 5, a flat half way in stage 6, broken front shock in stage 7, and we just cruise in stage13, and 14. we were about 30 second slower in the second run of this stages.
My point is people can't admit they are slower. We got beat by Morbely in 3 stages this week end. Do you see me bichting about it. No he was better then me. End of the story. I have been hearing about this cheating story since I started rallying with my Mazda 323 gtx. I was the 4th howner of that car and nobody had done any result with it. We finish 2nd overall in our first rally ever. first thing people said "he is cheating" Every time we would win a race, the cheating crap would come up. I don't like to loose. But when it happen i'll try to look at the obvious reason. Maybe that person is better than me. I'm not new to racing. I'm new to rally. I don't like to brag, but here is a little something about me. I did a driver seach (Brigeston) in 93, they tested 1200 driver all over the us and Canada. I won it.
And for the people who think my car was really fast in the back strech of the super stage. Here is my secret, NITROS. (Hoops!! I just realise it's not legal.)
I'm sorry if I sound like a jerk, but I'm getting tired of this. I work my butt off all week long to have the best car I can, all my money and more goes to rally, and when people say you are cheating it make me look at the all thing and think. Is it really worth it?
About the diff, here is what my car has. Front LSD by KAAZ, Center STI viscous, Rear lsd by QUAIFE. Stock gear box.
Stephan Verdier
My point is people can't admit they are slower. We got beat by Morbely in 3 stages this week end. Do you see me bichting about it. No he was better then me. End of the story. I have been hearing about this cheating story since I started rallying with my Mazda 323 gtx. I was the 4th howner of that car and nobody had done any result with it. We finish 2nd overall in our first rally ever. first thing people said "he is cheating" Every time we would win a race, the cheating crap would come up. I don't like to loose. But when it happen i'll try to look at the obvious reason. Maybe that person is better than me. I'm not new to racing. I'm new to rally. I don't like to brag, but here is a little something about me. I did a driver seach (Brigeston) in 93, they tested 1200 driver all over the us and Canada. I won it.
And for the people who think my car was really fast in the back strech of the super stage. Here is my secret, NITROS. (Hoops!! I just realise it's not legal.)
I'm sorry if I sound like a jerk, but I'm getting tired of this. I work my butt off all week long to have the best car I can, all my money and more goes to rally, and when people say you are cheating it make me look at the all thing and think. Is it really worth it?
About the diff, here is what my car has. Front LSD by KAAZ, Center STI viscous, Rear lsd by QUAIFE. Stock gear box.
Stephan Verdier
| Porsche914boxer4 | 05-13-2004 09:06 PM |
reer. saucer of milk, table for two.
:)
:)
| Porsche914boxer4 | 05-13-2004 09:14 PM |
From the specialstage website regarding the jump: (there are some good discussions going on there if you care to check it out).
Ray Hocker
Member since 3-28-02
211 posts 05-12-04, 01:41 PM (PST)
2. "To jump or not to jump."
In response to message #0
To set the record straight, we did not knowingly or intentionally make any change to the jump between the first and second runs of the super special stage. However, I am certain it did change due to several factors. First, forty cars passed over it in the previous run digging up and softening the approach to the jump. Secondly, we continued to water and run the road grader over the course to removing ruts from the first run. We also widened several corners for safety and to improve the drivability or the course.
Before the grading began, I asked Kengo Takahashi (the stage commander) to make sure the jump was not changed. Our grading crew was also given this instruction. I inspected it myself prior to the second running and I could see no change that was visible to the eye.
My integrity as an organizer would never allow me to knowingly or purposefully make a change that would increase the severity or danger from the jump without notifying the competitors. I would never put a competitor (or their car) at risk in this way.
With that said, I did have the jump flattened before the third running of the stage. I did this with knowledge and agreement of the SCCA National Steward. I chose to do it for safety reasons. Burke's problem was a factor but the real reason was the height that Jim Pierce reached in his truck. I saw this as a real danger to the other car next to him. The SCCA Steward and I both agreed that telling people in writing that we were flattening the jump could put drivers at greater risk because they might read it as permission to go flat out over the reshaped jump.
I feel confident that the "big air" some people got was from a combination of inadvertant changes to the course and other factors. On the first stage of the rally everyone took it easy. On Saturday, some pushed harder and hit the jump going much faster. On Friday, Stephan (see photo from Friday on USA forum) flew every bit as high and as far as Burke.
I was sad to see anyone break on the super special. We know the design and execution of the super special stage was not perfect. We learned a lot and will to make many improvements next year.
Ray Hocker
Chairman, Rim of the World Rally
Ray Hocker
Member since 3-28-02
211 posts 05-12-04, 01:41 PM (PST)
2. "To jump or not to jump."
In response to message #0
To set the record straight, we did not knowingly or intentionally make any change to the jump between the first and second runs of the super special stage. However, I am certain it did change due to several factors. First, forty cars passed over it in the previous run digging up and softening the approach to the jump. Secondly, we continued to water and run the road grader over the course to removing ruts from the first run. We also widened several corners for safety and to improve the drivability or the course.
Before the grading began, I asked Kengo Takahashi (the stage commander) to make sure the jump was not changed. Our grading crew was also given this instruction. I inspected it myself prior to the second running and I could see no change that was visible to the eye.
My integrity as an organizer would never allow me to knowingly or purposefully make a change that would increase the severity or danger from the jump without notifying the competitors. I would never put a competitor (or their car) at risk in this way.
With that said, I did have the jump flattened before the third running of the stage. I did this with knowledge and agreement of the SCCA National Steward. I chose to do it for safety reasons. Burke's problem was a factor but the real reason was the height that Jim Pierce reached in his truck. I saw this as a real danger to the other car next to him. The SCCA Steward and I both agreed that telling people in writing that we were flattening the jump could put drivers at greater risk because they might read it as permission to go flat out over the reshaped jump.
I feel confident that the "big air" some people got was from a combination of inadvertant changes to the course and other factors. On the first stage of the rally everyone took it easy. On Saturday, some pushed harder and hit the jump going much faster. On Friday, Stephan (see photo from Friday on USA forum) flew every bit as high and as far as Burke.
I was sad to see anyone break on the super special. We know the design and execution of the super special stage was not perfect. We learned a lot and will to make many improvements next year.
Ray Hocker
Chairman, Rim of the World Rally
| johnfelstead | 05-13-2004 09:23 PM |
Personally i would be flattered Stephan and would welcome anyone to protest me. As long as you are running legally, especially in terms of engine management, compresion ratio, turbo and gearing you have nothing to fear. These are relatively easy to check should that be required. If it were me i would protest myself and get it over with. :lol:
I can understand your frustration but i am sure you can also see how people can look at your results and scratch their heads, they are outstanding for a PGT spec car. Pity i havnt seen you drive myself as it would allow me to have a personal opinion.
Excellent post from Ray. :)
I can understand your frustration but i am sure you can also see how people can look at your results and scratch their heads, they are outstanding for a PGT spec car. Pity i havnt seen you drive myself as it would allow me to have a personal opinion.
Excellent post from Ray. :)
| CosmoTheCat | 05-13-2004 09:56 PM |
Stephan - my hat is off to you for being quite the gentleman. I only question because your car seems to have phenominal straight-line accelleration when pushed. I'll admit I don't recall which time through that I saw you run though, it's all a blur now. And while I understand it's irritating having people assume that you're cheating, it should also be flattering as John said.
| verdier | 05-14-2004 12:41 AM |
Actualy at Oregon I ask Doug to check my restrictor and the size of it at tech. he wasn't plainning of doing it until I ask him. Checking the compression is kind of a pain on the suby. I don't even know how to changed a plug on this car. But anybody who has the right toll can ask me and I let them check the compression.
What is funny, I was faster last year and nobody said anything. If you look at my times from Oregon 2003 from both club day and add it up, it puts me in 5th overall PRO. I didn't have the money to enter Pro, so nobody realized it. Guys my cars is the same as the other PGT, really.
Maybe you are right, and I'm taking it the wrong way. I should be flater instead of pissed off. I will try that phylosophy from now on. I want to apologize for snapping.
You know what, at least people are talking about me. I think it is a good thing.
I really enjoy rallying and hope to do it for many years.
Stephan
What is funny, I was faster last year and nobody said anything. If you look at my times from Oregon 2003 from both club day and add it up, it puts me in 5th overall PRO. I didn't have the money to enter Pro, so nobody realized it. Guys my cars is the same as the other PGT, really.
Maybe you are right, and I'm taking it the wrong way. I should be flater instead of pissed off. I will try that phylosophy from now on. I want to apologize for snapping.
You know what, at least people are talking about me. I think it is a good thing.
I really enjoy rallying and hope to do it for many years.
Stephan
| Sergeant_V | 05-14-2004 01:00 AM |
Stephan,
I agree with earlier comments from John. To be so fast that everyone assumes you are cheating is complimentary in it's own twisted way. Think about it, for so many competitors and spectators to be consistently suspicious of your ability to compete with and out-rally Open and Group N cars in a PGT spec car is testament to your skill (and in rare cases luck). I've been in the right seat in a PGT car in three events that you've contested (including Rim 04) and I have to concede that you are a terrific driver. Taking into account the amount of post event chatter about your accomplishments, I'm frankly surprised that no one has stepped up to protest your engine. I agree with John Felstead, perhaps you'll have to protest yourself to put it all behind you.
By the way, that was a great speech you gave at the Rim awards breakfast. You are truly a gentleman racer.
Regards,
Abel Villesca
Co-driver, car #423
I agree with earlier comments from John. To be so fast that everyone assumes you are cheating is complimentary in it's own twisted way. Think about it, for so many competitors and spectators to be consistently suspicious of your ability to compete with and out-rally Open and Group N cars in a PGT spec car is testament to your skill (and in rare cases luck). I've been in the right seat in a PGT car in three events that you've contested (including Rim 04) and I have to concede that you are a terrific driver. Taking into account the amount of post event chatter about your accomplishments, I'm frankly surprised that no one has stepped up to protest your engine. I agree with John Felstead, perhaps you'll have to protest yourself to put it all behind you.
By the way, that was a great speech you gave at the Rim awards breakfast. You are truly a gentleman racer.
Regards,
Abel Villesca
Co-driver, car #423
| madmaxxx | 05-14-2004 01:14 AM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by horatio102 [/i]
[B]:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
mmmmmkay yeaah. :lol:
Next time I'm going to bust out a stopwatch and clock him because his accelleration down the front stretch seemed to be about as fast as Burke's.
:lol: [/B][/QUOTE]
AS FAST AS BURKE????
are you serious! Burkes car makes over 400hp. stpehs car
weighs 3200lb(ask ron wood,doug robinson,
todd moberly or david coleman) they saw it at tech... and
makes about 150hp.
why dont you ask for his keys the next time you see him.
he will let you drive it. actually jeff from chasteauto went to
stephs place and drove his car... you want to know what he
said after he drove it?????
he said "dude your car has atleast 150hp" yes 150hp..not 400
like burke.
Oh and one more thing... after driving his car make sure to
tell all your friends.
Im tired of this ****!!!
You ever heard of the BRIDGESTONE DRIVER SEARCH???
1200 drivers participated in this event. there was only
going to be one winner. the winner got to drive a formula
car for a season(open wheel)
guess who won... STEPHEN.... the guy is no amature.
[B]:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
mmmmmkay yeaah. :lol:
Next time I'm going to bust out a stopwatch and clock him because his accelleration down the front stretch seemed to be about as fast as Burke's.
:lol: [/B][/QUOTE]
AS FAST AS BURKE????
are you serious! Burkes car makes over 400hp. stpehs car
weighs 3200lb(ask ron wood,doug robinson,
todd moberly or david coleman) they saw it at tech... and
makes about 150hp.
why dont you ask for his keys the next time you see him.
he will let you drive it. actually jeff from chasteauto went to
stephs place and drove his car... you want to know what he
said after he drove it?????
he said "dude your car has atleast 150hp" yes 150hp..not 400
like burke.
Oh and one more thing... after driving his car make sure to
tell all your friends.
Im tired of this ****!!!
You ever heard of the BRIDGESTONE DRIVER SEARCH???
1200 drivers participated in this event. there was only
going to be one winner. the winner got to drive a formula
car for a season(open wheel)
guess who won... STEPHEN.... the guy is no amature.
| madmaxxx | 05-14-2004 01:22 AM |
OK!!!
1. steph had a new tranny and clutch at oregon with about
50 miles. the last trans broke when he went testing. he drove
for less than 5 min and the tranny went kerrrrrplunk!
2. the last thing he wanted to do was kill the tranny on fri
night at OTPR in a 1/4 mile event.
3. I could do 13sec quarter miles in my eclipse and guess
what??....no one gives a shiat.
1. steph had a new tranny and clutch at oregon with about
50 miles. the last trans broke when he went testing. he drove
for less than 5 min and the tranny went kerrrrrplunk!
2. the last thing he wanted to do was kill the tranny on fri
night at OTPR in a 1/4 mile event.
3. I could do 13sec quarter miles in my eclipse and guess
what??....no one gives a shiat.
| madmaxxx | 05-14-2004 01:25 AM |
Plus everyone knows that the SRT-4 is the fastest car ever and it ran a 16.6. :p [/B][/QUOTE]
Doug was on the brakes about 100 feet from the end.
the srt-4's have a stage 2 kit with a few more things...
the car probably pushes 300hp at full boost.
Doug was on the brakes about 100 feet from the end.
the srt-4's have a stage 2 kit with a few more things...
the car probably pushes 300hp at full boost.
| madmaxxx | 05-14-2004 01:43 AM |
And for the people who think my car was really fast in the back strech of the super stage. Here is my secret, NITROUS. (oops!! I just realise it's not legal.)
Stephan Verdier [/B][/QUOTE]
OH CRAP!!
I told you not to tell anyone about the NOS....:lol:
im sorry for getting all :furious:, but it gets old
after awhile.
Horatio! you have to go for a ride with steph to
understand.
Rally on!
Stephan Verdier [/B][/QUOTE]
OH CRAP!!
I told you not to tell anyone about the NOS....:lol:
im sorry for getting all :furious:, but it gets old
after awhile.
Horatio! you have to go for a ride with steph to
understand.
Rally on!
| CosmoTheCat | 05-14-2004 02:24 AM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by madmaxxx[/i]
[B] AS FAST AS BURKE????
are you serious! Burkes car makes over 400hp. stpehs car
weighs 3200lb(ask ron wood,doug robinson,
todd moberly or david coleman) they saw it at tech... and
makes about 150hp. [/B][/QUOTE]
Yeah, I know. That's why I said it appeared as though...
But I think we've about covered it now. A stock WRX makes 227hp, depending on the dyno about 160hp at the tires. 3200 seems light for that car. :confused: That's about what one weighs stock, before the roll cage and heavy rally tires.
My sunny-day driver is a ~350 hp mustang that weighs several hundred pounds less than a prepped WRX, and I still think his car looks fast. :)
I'd love to go for a ride with Stephan. Hell, I'd buy his entire team the first round of their choice for a ride. ;)
[B] AS FAST AS BURKE????
are you serious! Burkes car makes over 400hp. stpehs car
weighs 3200lb(ask ron wood,doug robinson,
todd moberly or david coleman) they saw it at tech... and
makes about 150hp. [/B][/QUOTE]
Yeah, I know. That's why I said it appeared as though...
But I think we've about covered it now. A stock WRX makes 227hp, depending on the dyno about 160hp at the tires. 3200 seems light for that car. :confused: That's about what one weighs stock, before the roll cage and heavy rally tires.
My sunny-day driver is a ~350 hp mustang that weighs several hundred pounds less than a prepped WRX, and I still think his car looks fast. :)
I'd love to go for a ride with Stephan. Hell, I'd buy his entire team the first round of their choice for a ride. ;)
| madmaxxx | 05-14-2004 03:04 AM |
[QUOTE][i]
I'd love to go for a ride with Stephan. Hell, I'd buy his entire team the first round of their choice for a ride. ;) [/B][/QUOTE]
DEAL!!
Steph,
a free first round :D... El drunko :mad: (crew member) would be really angry if you didnt give horatio a ride...
I'd love to go for a ride with Stephan. Hell, I'd buy his entire team the first round of their choice for a ride. ;) [/B][/QUOTE]
DEAL!!
Steph,
a free first round :D... El drunko :mad: (crew member) would be really angry if you didnt give horatio a ride...
| johnfelstead | 05-14-2004 04:16 AM |
Glad to see you are taking my comment in the way it was intended Stephan. With regards to the diff setup you run, that is a perfect config for a loose surface car, plated front LSD, tight VC centre diff and a quaife gear type rear diff, its the combination we ran in our GroupA cosworth in British National rallies with great success (best we did was 2nd overall, 6 seconds behind the last works Escort WRC built by MSport in our home built car). That diff setup alone is going to find you a few seconds a mile over a PGT car with stock diffs. And yes i am serious, 2-3 seconds a mile all else being equal.
I can change a set of plugs on an impreza in about 10 minutes, not sure if that makes me tellented or sad for having had to do it so many times. :lol: Compresion testing is a piece of cake for a scrutineer on an Impreza, or it should be.
Dont know if you guys have seen a TV program from the BBC called the Royale family? but in the words of Jim Royale, 150BHP my arse. :lol: No one puts together a package with the right diffs and invests all their spare money into that car then runs 150BHP, thats just a rediculous thing to say, it would have to be running on 2.5 cylinders to be that bad! If you have you need a new engineer on your team!
weight wise, the kerb weight of a US Spec WRX sedan is 3075lb (1395Kg) in stock trim without cage/skids or rally tyres. So to get a fully preped PGT car down to 3200lb (1451Kg) is pretty good going. The US Spec WRX Wagon weighs 3155lb (1431Kg) in stock trim as reference, so i would say thats one hell of a light rollcage you have there.
I can change a set of plugs on an impreza in about 10 minutes, not sure if that makes me tellented or sad for having had to do it so many times. :lol: Compresion testing is a piece of cake for a scrutineer on an Impreza, or it should be.
Dont know if you guys have seen a TV program from the BBC called the Royale family? but in the words of Jim Royale, 150BHP my arse. :lol: No one puts together a package with the right diffs and invests all their spare money into that car then runs 150BHP, thats just a rediculous thing to say, it would have to be running on 2.5 cylinders to be that bad! If you have you need a new engineer on your team!
weight wise, the kerb weight of a US Spec WRX sedan is 3075lb (1395Kg) in stock trim without cage/skids or rally tyres. So to get a fully preped PGT car down to 3200lb (1451Kg) is pretty good going. The US Spec WRX Wagon weighs 3155lb (1431Kg) in stock trim as reference, so i would say thats one hell of a light rollcage you have there.
| madmaxxx | 05-14-2004 11:43 AM |
weight wise, the kerb weight of a US Spec WRX sedan is 3075lb (1395Kg) in stock trim without cage/skids or rally tyres. So to get a fully preped PGT car down to 3200lb (1451Kg) is pretty good going. The US Spec WRX Wagon weighs 3155lb (1431Kg) in stock trim as reference, so i would say thats one hell of a light rollcage you have there. [/B][/QUOTE]
Stephs cage is made of DOM. The main hoop and a pillars
are .120 wall. The rest are .095.
The cage has lots of bars and gussets.. Not as light as
the safetydevice or customcages.co.uk cages. They use
T45 steel and the wall thickness is between .047 and .064.
Super thin and super light.
stephs cage was built by: [url]http://gtfabrications.com/gtf/custom/imprezawrx/pages/gallery.htm[/url]
Stephs cage is made of DOM. The main hoop and a pillars
are .120 wall. The rest are .095.
The cage has lots of bars and gussets.. Not as light as
the safetydevice or customcages.co.uk cages. They use
T45 steel and the wall thickness is between .047 and .064.
Super thin and super light.
stephs cage was built by: [url]http://gtfabrications.com/gtf/custom/imprezawrx/pages/gallery.htm[/url]
| Porsche914boxer4 | 05-14-2004 11:49 AM |
god, all these spelling errors are making my head hurt. :D
| verdier | 05-14-2004 11:54 AM |
johnfelstead,
Are you in SOCAL? If you are or anybody else who is and want to test drive my car or check my engine is welcome to come by. I'm serious. That car is bone stock. The reason I have this diffs is a got really good deals on it.
About the weight, I was suprise too. The cage is a pretty big one and I still have the sound proofing stuff on the firewall. An other competitor wieght is STI and he had 3187pds. That guys has the same cage as me. I think the scales were right. the funny thing too is, the car was 40 pds heavier on the right side. I don't understand why.
Are you in SOCAL? If you are or anybody else who is and want to test drive my car or check my engine is welcome to come by. I'm serious. That car is bone stock. The reason I have this diffs is a got really good deals on it.
About the weight, I was suprise too. The cage is a pretty big one and I still have the sound proofing stuff on the firewall. An other competitor wieght is STI and he had 3187pds. That guys has the same cage as me. I think the scales were right. the funny thing too is, the car was 40 pds heavier on the right side. I don't understand why.
| Chaste Automotive | 05-14-2004 12:17 PM |
Okay let me just end all this now, Stephan's car is not fast! Badger him enough he will let anyone drive the thing (yes I gave him a hard time and drove it to check it out) but nowhere near a group n car. People can run around and complain or protest headlights and side skirts but the bottom line is that he is fast and you are not! We are missing some points here people and that is that RIm is not a fast rally, in fact it is one of the slower rallys in SCCA so HP is not as much of an advantage as good road position and a good driver. PErfect example of this would be the fact that we ran so well last year with our 1.0l Starlet and passed as many people as we did. THat car has a short wheelbase so it ran well at rim but at STPR or another rally like that we would be getting killed on the wide open stages. THere are a lot of factors that you have to look at besides one little section of a super special. Look at Julian Masters, his car may look like a POS mirage but that is all EVO 6.5 under there and his car was not flying around either. Good Driver in a mediocre car will always beat a bad driver in a very good car it has happened time and time again.
| JC_595 | 05-14-2004 12:35 PM |
Stephan-
Keep your head up, you have no reason to apologize for answering people who doubt your skill. I run G2 in CENDIV in a very stock GTI with an open diff and stock gearbox & still keep up. People will always doubt the car when you outperform them.
I am starting my 04 WRX PGT car now, and hope to have it by S*D 05. I cant wait to compete against you with closer to the same level equipment. (provided you dont jump to N or open too quick)...
Be flattered that people doubt. It makes you feel that much nicer inside to prove them wrong.
;)
JC
Keep your head up, you have no reason to apologize for answering people who doubt your skill. I run G2 in CENDIV in a very stock GTI with an open diff and stock gearbox & still keep up. People will always doubt the car when you outperform them.
I am starting my 04 WRX PGT car now, and hope to have it by S*D 05. I cant wait to compete against you with closer to the same level equipment. (provided you dont jump to N or open too quick)...
Be flattered that people doubt. It makes you feel that much nicer inside to prove them wrong.
;)
JC
| johnfelstead | 05-14-2004 12:48 PM |
Hi Stephan,
unfortunately not in SOCAL, i am across the pond in the not so sunny England. I do get over to the USA every so often though so if at all posible i would pop down and see you, thats a generous offer. I have driven PGT WRX's (well pretty much every Impreza ever made bar the WRC car) so know what to expect. :)
I'll bring my EcuTek software with me whilst i am at it and see if i can find your missing 100BHP. :lol: Still find the comment about you having 150BHP funny.
Diff wise, if you have the funds available they are one of the best changes you can make on a loose surface car, what matters most is traction and suspension, then brakes and engine.
As for your last comment about the weight, tell the codriver to go on a diet. (j/k) :lol: Seriously, its quite normal for WRX's to have a L/R offset, when you corner weight a tarmac spec version you usually have to run diferent ride heights to compensate. It's less important on a forest spec car, you tend to use ride height setings as your guide rather than corner weights in that aplication.
unfortunately not in SOCAL, i am across the pond in the not so sunny England. I do get over to the USA every so often though so if at all posible i would pop down and see you, thats a generous offer. I have driven PGT WRX's (well pretty much every Impreza ever made bar the WRC car) so know what to expect. :)
I'll bring my EcuTek software with me whilst i am at it and see if i can find your missing 100BHP. :lol: Still find the comment about you having 150BHP funny.
Diff wise, if you have the funds available they are one of the best changes you can make on a loose surface car, what matters most is traction and suspension, then brakes and engine.
As for your last comment about the weight, tell the codriver to go on a diet. (j/k) :lol: Seriously, its quite normal for WRX's to have a L/R offset, when you corner weight a tarmac spec version you usually have to run diferent ride heights to compensate. It's less important on a forest spec car, you tend to use ride height setings as your guide rather than corner weights in that aplication.
| Chaste Automotive | 05-14-2004 01:16 PM |
John I am heading back across at the end of June so have your streetfinder ready for me:lol: I have to go back to wales hoepfully without as many wrong turns this time.
| johnfelstead | 05-14-2004 01:27 PM |
Give me a bit of advanced notice once you know what your plans are and i'll try and meet up with you. I am away for a bit in June, but hopefully we get the chance for a natter. :)
| CosmoTheCat | 05-14-2004 01:28 PM |
JF - Why do you doubt the 150 hp figure? It's really common for mostly-stock WRX's over here to have ~150-160 at the tires on different dynos. Of course within the rules of the PGT class the car should be making a fair bit more than stock power levels, but 250 at the ground?
| verdier | 05-14-2004 01:31 PM |
JOHN,
You are welcome to contact me when you are in SOCAL.
Jeff thanks for the kind words.
Steph
You are welcome to contact me when you are in SOCAL.
Jeff thanks for the kind words.
Steph
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