| 15secWRX | 11-07-2006 09:49 AM |
auto-x noob questions
�
�
on nov 18 ill be running my first auto-x in my 07 sti in ASN. before i run i plan on getting a front sway bar but i have read fitment issues on the strano 32mm. So i may get the whiteline 27/29 fsb. any comments on that?
next season i plan on entering in more events in STU so my desired setup is...
rce springs(which are already ordered)
whisper catback
catted downpipe
whiteline rsb(what size should i get)
cobb shortshifter
perrin intake
anything else i should add or change?
this is my daily and I do not plan on being extremely competetive but i do not plan on getting last place either;) so im basing my mods around that.
Let me know what you guys think since i am a noob at this. thanks!
next season i plan on entering in more events in STU so my desired setup is...
rce springs(which are already ordered)
whisper catback
catted downpipe
whiteline rsb(what size should i get)
cobb shortshifter
perrin intake
anything else i should add or change?
this is my daily and I do not plan on being extremely competetive but i do not plan on getting last place either;) so im basing my mods around that.
Let me know what you guys think since i am a noob at this. thanks!
| Chiketkd | 11-07-2006 10:10 AM |
[QUOTE=15secWRX;15897581]on nov 18 ill be running my first auto-x in my 07 sti in ASN. before i run i plan on getting a front sway bar but i have read fitment issues on the strano 32mm. So i may get the whiteline 27/29 fsb. any comments on that?[/QUOTE]
If you're a novice, run STU at your first event. The PAX index is more friendly in that class than AS.
If you're a novice, run STU at your first event. The PAX index is more friendly in that class than AS.
| 15secWRX | 11-07-2006 10:13 AM |
[QUOTE=Chiketkd;15897819]If you're a novice, run STU at your first event. The PAX index is more friendly in that class than AS.[/QUOTE]
i dont understand. wouldnt i have a better chance in a stock class? and whats the pax index?
i dont understand. wouldnt i have a better chance in a stock class? and whats the pax index?
| jcroy66 | 11-07-2006 10:26 AM |
For your first event, it really doesn't matter what class you run. You're most likely legal for both AS and STU, so just pick one.
Most important thing for your first event: HAVE FUN. Secondary: let the more experienced folks know you're new to the sport. Most people are very willing to help someone out, but they may not notice you if you don't introduce yourself first. They can help let you know the general course of the day, offer driving tips, whatever.
Most important thing for your first event: HAVE FUN. Secondary: let the more experienced folks know you're new to the sport. Most people are very willing to help someone out, but they may not notice you if you don't introduce yourself first. They can help let you know the general course of the day, offer driving tips, whatever.
| bdi | 11-07-2006 10:50 AM |
[QUOTE=15secWRX;15897854]i dont understand. wouldnt i have a better chance in a stock class? and whats the pax index?[/QUOTE]
No because most run R-Compound race tires. These are not allowed in STU...only street tires...thus giving you a better chance.
I would run STU or Novice....get yourself an instructor and have fun.
No because most run R-Compound race tires. These are not allowed in STU...only street tires...thus giving you a better chance.
I would run STU or Novice....get yourself an instructor and have fun.
| leecea | 11-07-2006 11:04 AM |
Although you can drive and probably drive well, without racing/autoxing experience you will be starting from scratch with essentially a new sport. Don't get discouraged. You will almost certainly be slower than you expect and wonder why you're being beaten by "slow" cars (they will have fast drivers!)
Have fun and start the learning process by getting as much help as you can.
First thing is to see if someone will walk the course with you. You need to walk it a number of times and look for landmarks that you will use at speed to aid your memory. That way you will be more likely to stay on course.
Have an instructor ride with you - it will help a lot.
If you can get a ride with an experienced driver it will also be a huge help in showing you how fast people go. It was an eye opener for me.
Have fun and start the learning process by getting as much help as you can.
First thing is to see if someone will walk the course with you. You need to walk it a number of times and look for landmarks that you will use at speed to aid your memory. That way you will be more likely to stay on course.
Have an instructor ride with you - it will help a lot.
If you can get a ride with an experienced driver it will also be a huge help in showing you how fast people go. It was an eye opener for me.
| KC | 11-07-2006 11:10 AM |
[QUOTE=leecea;15898546]Although you can drive and probably drive well, without racing/autoxing experience you will be starting from scratch with essentially a new sport. Don't get discouraged. You will almost certainly be slower than you expect and wonder why you're being beaten by "slow" cars (they will have fast drivers!)
Have fun and start the learning process by getting as much help as you can.
First thing is to see if someone will walk the course with you. You need to walk it a number of times and look for landmarks that you will use at speed to aid your memory. That way you will be more likely to stay on course.
Have an instructor ride with you - it will help a lot.
If you can get a ride with an experienced driver it will also be a huge help in showing you how fast people go. It was an eye opener for me.[/QUOTE]
^^^^^^^^^^ FTW.
Have fun and start the learning process by getting as much help as you can.
First thing is to see if someone will walk the course with you. You need to walk it a number of times and look for landmarks that you will use at speed to aid your memory. That way you will be more likely to stay on course.
Have an instructor ride with you - it will help a lot.
If you can get a ride with an experienced driver it will also be a huge help in showing you how fast people go. It was an eye opener for me.[/QUOTE]
^^^^^^^^^^ FTW.
| rex n effect | 11-07-2006 11:15 AM |
You might want to hold off on the springs until you get more of a taste for the sport. Unless you have the best R compounds, a monster front swaybar is not going to help you win AS. Drive in a couple events, then decide what route you want to take. I started with springs, too, then decided they weren't enough, so I changed the suspension again.
| 15secWRX | 11-07-2006 11:53 AM |
im already expecting to get my butt kicked and hopefully someone will agree to let me ride with them.
anyone have opinions on geting the strano bar?
anyone have opinions on geting the strano bar?
| BlkWRXWag | 11-07-2006 12:04 PM |
My opinion is that you don't buy anything. Just learn to drive the car as it is first.
| crystalhelix | 11-07-2006 12:28 PM |
[QUOTE=15secWRX;15899297]im already expecting to get my butt kicked and hopefully someone will agree to let me ride with them.
anyone have opinions on geting the strano bar?[/QUOTE]
I have one. But I would take to heart what has been said. Say for instance you love the sport, want to do it a lot, and start doing national level stuff, well the expense of the sport grows depending on what class you end up in. You will stuff yourself in a ST or SP class real early in your driving experience and it wont pay off. I would prep your car for AS but running with a STU pax will bring you up the ladder in the PAX results.
What is pax info from our local club.....
[url]http://www.steelcities-scca.org/solo2/whatispax.html[/url]
anyone have opinions on geting the strano bar?[/QUOTE]
I have one. But I would take to heart what has been said. Say for instance you love the sport, want to do it a lot, and start doing national level stuff, well the expense of the sport grows depending on what class you end up in. You will stuff yourself in a ST or SP class real early in your driving experience and it wont pay off. I would prep your car for AS but running with a STU pax will bring you up the ladder in the PAX results.
What is pax info from our local club.....
[url]http://www.steelcities-scca.org/solo2/whatispax.html[/url]
| ratt_finkel | 11-07-2006 12:29 PM |
I don't really think that getting the front sway bar is such a bad thing. No matter what class he goes in, it's a likely upgrade for the future. And it's one of the few parts he will end up using long run.
Like Max said, hold off on putting on any parts on the car for at least a few events. Then do the sway bar and get an alignment.
Continue running the car until you are certain the car is holding you back, and NOT the driver. Your way to qualify is by having a known faster driver your car. If they can go faster, then you still have some learning to do.
Then decide if you want to run AS, STU, BSP, SM, etc.
Like Max said, hold off on putting on any parts on the car for at least a few events. Then do the sway bar and get an alignment.
Continue running the car until you are certain the car is holding you back, and NOT the driver. Your way to qualify is by having a known faster driver your car. If they can go faster, then you still have some learning to do.
Then decide if you want to run AS, STU, BSP, SM, etc.
| silver arrow | 11-07-2006 12:36 PM |
[QUOTE=15secWRX;15897854]i dont understand. wouldnt i have a better chance in a stock class? and whats the pax index?[/QUOTE]
No, AS guys run R comps, STU runs street tires. R comps are a huge advantage in autocross.
No, AS guys run R comps, STU runs street tires. R comps are a huge advantage in autocross.
| silver arrow | 11-07-2006 12:39 PM |
[QUOTE=15secWRX;15899297]im already expecting to get my butt kicked and hopefully someone will agree to let me ride with them.
anyone have opinions on geting the strano bar?[/QUOTE]
Stranos bar has poor fitment and may cause breakage of a arm. I hate mine. get Whiteline instead.
anyone have opinions on geting the strano bar?[/QUOTE]
Stranos bar has poor fitment and may cause breakage of a arm. I hate mine. get Whiteline instead.
| 15secWRX | 11-07-2006 12:49 PM |
[QUOTE=silver arrow;15899995]Stranos bar has poor fitment and may cause breakage of a arm. I hate mine. get Whiteline instead.[/QUOTE]
thanks for the feedback
thanks for the feedback
| MulletSlayer | 11-07-2006 01:02 PM |
I wouldn't go to crazy buying mods if your just starting out. Your car is going to be plenty fast to begin with. Just buy a good set of tires and maybe some camber bolts or plates to so your new tires last a little longer.
You wouldn't think that there is a lot to learn about driving fast around cones but there is.
Good luck and remember to always have fun.
You wouldn't think that there is a lot to learn about driving fast around cones but there is.
Good luck and remember to always have fun.
| Warp3 | 11-07-2006 01:56 PM |
[QUOTE=ratt_finkel;15899847]Like Max said, hold off on putting on any parts on the car for at least a few events. Then do the sway bar and get an alignment.
Continue running the car until you are certain the car is holding you back, and NOT the driver.[/QUOTE]
Agreed! I've been autocrossing a 1999 2.5RS (in STS, then DSP, then SM) for 6 years straight. Regardless, when I recently switched to my 2006 WRX TR, I still forced myself to keep it stock until I had done a few events first to get a baseline and get used to the different way you have to drive this car. Once I feel like I know the car better and am driving it at/near the limit as is, THEN I'll start in with the mods and actually prep it to the limit of D-Stock rules.
I've done 2 events in unmodified form (and even trophied in the 1st event :lol: ) and am doing a 3rd this weekend (with an axleback, though it's a stretch to call that much of a performance mod :lol: ), then it's modifying time. :devil:
[quote]Your way to qualify is by having a known faster driver your car. If they can go faster, then you still have some learning to do.[/quote]
Again, I completely agree. Some of the biggest leaps in course times I've ever seen was hunting down a codriver that was beating me by a full second or more in my own car. If he can make this car go that fast, then I should be able to as well. :D
Continue running the car until you are certain the car is holding you back, and NOT the driver.[/QUOTE]
Agreed! I've been autocrossing a 1999 2.5RS (in STS, then DSP, then SM) for 6 years straight. Regardless, when I recently switched to my 2006 WRX TR, I still forced myself to keep it stock until I had done a few events first to get a baseline and get used to the different way you have to drive this car. Once I feel like I know the car better and am driving it at/near the limit as is, THEN I'll start in with the mods and actually prep it to the limit of D-Stock rules.
I've done 2 events in unmodified form (and even trophied in the 1st event :lol: ) and am doing a 3rd this weekend (with an axleback, though it's a stretch to call that much of a performance mod :lol: ), then it's modifying time. :devil:
[quote]Your way to qualify is by having a known faster driver your car. If they can go faster, then you still have some learning to do.[/quote]
Again, I completely agree. Some of the biggest leaps in course times I've ever seen was hunting down a codriver that was beating me by a full second or more in my own car. If he can make this car go that fast, then I should be able to as well. :D
| RS_Racer | 11-07-2006 02:45 PM |
Get a CG-Lock or Schroth harness. The latter is one of the best stock class upgrades I ever made. No more being thrown around in the car!!
| sstrano | 11-07-2006 03:08 PM |
[QUOTE=rex n effect;15898716]You might want to hold off on the springs until you get more of a taste for the sport. Unless you have the best R compounds, a monster front swaybar is not going to help you win AS. [/QUOTE]
Funny, the car that demolished AS in the Pro Finale and finished 4th for Nationals (ahead or some big-time heavy hitters like Kozlak's) had my bar on it.... and stock struts.
A bar does help in stock, it helps more in stock than anywhere else because it does so much to control camber curve.
And fwiw, yep the bar isn't perfect. It's big, it's a tight fit, it puts stress on things. These are prices you sometimes pay to get the camber curve control you want. And furthermore, while I admit that they aren't perfect, there are also many people (the huge majority in fact) who run them without any issues at all.
Funny, the car that demolished AS in the Pro Finale and finished 4th for Nationals (ahead or some big-time heavy hitters like Kozlak's) had my bar on it.... and stock struts.
A bar does help in stock, it helps more in stock than anywhere else because it does so much to control camber curve.
And fwiw, yep the bar isn't perfect. It's big, it's a tight fit, it puts stress on things. These are prices you sometimes pay to get the camber curve control you want. And furthermore, while I admit that they aren't perfect, there are also many people (the huge majority in fact) who run them without any issues at all.
| crystalhelix | 11-07-2006 03:57 PM |
[QUOTE=sstrano;15902501]It's big, it's a tight fit, it puts stress on things. [/QUOTE]
That's what she said....:p
....sorry sam, had to do it...
..FWIW...I have had Sam's bar for a year and a half IIRC and nothing outside of what I expected from a race application bar as far as problems go...performance wise, it's great!
That's what she said....:p
....sorry sam, had to do it...
..FWIW...I have had Sam's bar for a year and a half IIRC and nothing outside of what I expected from a race application bar as far as problems go...performance wise, it's great!
| Impreza01 | 11-07-2006 04:13 PM |
[QUOTE=15secWRX;15897581]on nov 18 ill be running my first auto-x in my 07 sti in ASN. before i run i plan on getting a front sway bar but i have read fitment issues on the strano 32mm. So i may get the whiteline 27/29 fsb. any comments on that?[/QUOTE]
The strano 32mm hollow bar merely had poor endlink design. The endlink would flex against the control arm causing the mounting hole to be sheared away. This only happened to aluminum control arms (something like 2 STIs and 3 2006 WRX control arms). Some people have redesigned the endlinks to much success and have reported no more issues. Another issue is one person in an 2005MY STI has reported the front wheels rubbing against the bar at full lock.
The latest news is Strano is redesigning the endlinks, but no news was heard after that. I just went with the Whiteline 27/29mm fsb since the Strano 32mm hollow bar is really and equivalent of 29.2mm solid.
The strano 32mm hollow bar merely had poor endlink design. The endlink would flex against the control arm causing the mounting hole to be sheared away. This only happened to aluminum control arms (something like 2 STIs and 3 2006 WRX control arms). Some people have redesigned the endlinks to much success and have reported no more issues. Another issue is one person in an 2005MY STI has reported the front wheels rubbing against the bar at full lock.
The latest news is Strano is redesigning the endlinks, but no news was heard after that. I just went with the Whiteline 27/29mm fsb since the Strano 32mm hollow bar is really and equivalent of 29.2mm solid.
| Warp3 | 11-07-2006 04:23 PM |
[QUOTE=RS_Racer;15902088]Get a CG-Lock or Schroth harness. The latter is one of the best stock class upgrades I ever made. No more being thrown around in the car!![/QUOTE]
Another good point...when I said above that I ran my first two events unmodified that wasn't completely true...I did already have my 3-point harness installed. :D
Another good point...when I said above that I ran my first two events unmodified that wasn't completely true...I did already have my 3-point harness installed. :D
| Hondo88 | 11-07-2006 04:35 PM |
Fight the urge to get R-Compound tires for a year or 2. They are fast and fun, but street tires are great to start with because they make you follow the correct lines at the correct speeds. If you get out of line on street tires, they will let you know.
R-Compounds are like good lawyers, they will do whatever they can to cover up your bad performance. :lol:
R-Compounds are like good lawyers, they will do whatever they can to cover up your bad performance. :lol:
| Calamity Jesus | 11-07-2006 04:38 PM |
The harness is a great suggestion. It's very helpful, when learning how to autocross a new car, to be able to ignore all the extra effort needed to keep yourself in the driver's seat with stock belts. On my old FSP escort, my Schroth harness was a much needed upgrade, and until I added some bolstering to my RS's seats, it was a very welcome upgrade as well. Also, resist the temptation to buy a harness in some wild color.. as it may not match the interior of your next car. :o
| afpdl | 11-08-2006 07:30 AM |
[QUOTE=Impreza01;15903577]The strano 32mm hollow bar merely had poor endlink design. The endlink would flex against the control arm causing the mounting hole to be sheared away. This only happened to aluminum control arms (something like 2 STIs and 3 2006 WRX control arms). Some people have redesigned the endlinks to much success and have reported no more issues. Another issue is one person in an 2005MY STI has reported the front wheels rubbing against the bar at full lock.
The latest news is Strano is redesigning the endlinks, but no news was heard after that. I just went with the Whiteline 27/29mm fsb since the Strano 32mm hollow bar is really and equivalent of 29.2mm solid.[/QUOTE]
Thats not completely correct, I know of at least one person who broke 2 steel control arms on a 2005 wrx before sending his bar back in. It was the typical sticky tires + stock suspension = failure. I havent had any problems with my aluminum arms, despite obvious signs of the bar hitting the mounting tab, but its a STU car.
The latest news is Strano is redesigning the endlinks, but no news was heard after that. I just went with the Whiteline 27/29mm fsb since the Strano 32mm hollow bar is really and equivalent of 29.2mm solid.[/QUOTE]
Thats not completely correct, I know of at least one person who broke 2 steel control arms on a 2005 wrx before sending his bar back in. It was the typical sticky tires + stock suspension = failure. I havent had any problems with my aluminum arms, despite obvious signs of the bar hitting the mounting tab, but its a STU car.
| silver arrow | 11-08-2006 11:24 AM |
[QUOTE=sstrano;15902501]Funny, the car that demolished AS in the Pro Finale and finished 4th for Nationals (ahead or some big-time heavy hitters like Kozlak's) had my bar on it.... and stock struts.
A bar does help in stock, it helps more in stock than anywhere else because it does so much to control camber curve.
And fwiw, yep the bar isn't perfect. It's big, it's a tight fit, it puts stress on things. These are prices you sometimes pay to get the camber curve control you want. And furthermore, while I admit that they aren't perfect, there are also many people (the huge majority in fact) who run them without any issues at all.[/QUOTE]
To be fair, it's a great part for a dedicated autocross car in AS. For the rest of us who drive our cars everyday, I think the gain over the Whiteline is not worth the drawbacks. You have also been very slow to redesign the endlinks to solve these problems which makes it difficult to recommend your bar or company. I have your bar and my neighbor has the Whiteline and when we were both on stock struts, I had more front bite. Now that I am on 12k/10k coilovers I will be going to a 24mm FSB to see the effects. After 8 month on the Stranos bar the endlink bushing things are chewed to peices and it is obvious that the bar is hitting the mount and putting undo stress on the mounting tab, even with high spring rates.
A bar does help in stock, it helps more in stock than anywhere else because it does so much to control camber curve.
And fwiw, yep the bar isn't perfect. It's big, it's a tight fit, it puts stress on things. These are prices you sometimes pay to get the camber curve control you want. And furthermore, while I admit that they aren't perfect, there are also many people (the huge majority in fact) who run them without any issues at all.[/QUOTE]
To be fair, it's a great part for a dedicated autocross car in AS. For the rest of us who drive our cars everyday, I think the gain over the Whiteline is not worth the drawbacks. You have also been very slow to redesign the endlinks to solve these problems which makes it difficult to recommend your bar or company. I have your bar and my neighbor has the Whiteline and when we were both on stock struts, I had more front bite. Now that I am on 12k/10k coilovers I will be going to a 24mm FSB to see the effects. After 8 month on the Stranos bar the endlink bushing things are chewed to peices and it is obvious that the bar is hitting the mount and putting undo stress on the mounting tab, even with high spring rates.
| The_Wolf | 11-08-2006 11:46 AM |
[QUOTE=sstrano;15902501]Funny, the car that demolished AS in the Pro Finale and finished 4th for Nationals (ahead or some big-time heavy hitters like Kozlak's) had my bar on it.... and stock struts.
A bar does help in stock, it helps more in stock than anywhere else because it does so much to control camber curve.
And fwiw, yep the bar isn't perfect. It's big, it's a tight fit, it puts stress on things. These are prices you sometimes pay to get the camber curve control you want. And furthermore, while I admit that they aren't perfect, there are also many people (the huge majority in fact) who run them without any issues at all.[/QUOTE]
I am one that runs the Strano FSB with no major issues (06 AS STI...stock struts and 275 V710's). It made a big difference and I highly recommend it.
A bar does help in stock, it helps more in stock than anywhere else because it does so much to control camber curve.
And fwiw, yep the bar isn't perfect. It's big, it's a tight fit, it puts stress on things. These are prices you sometimes pay to get the camber curve control you want. And furthermore, while I admit that they aren't perfect, there are also many people (the huge majority in fact) who run them without any issues at all.[/QUOTE]
I am one that runs the Strano FSB with no major issues (06 AS STI...stock struts and 275 V710's). It made a big difference and I highly recommend it.
| DrBiggly | 11-09-2006 11:53 PM |
My advice for a first timer: Worry about nothing more than making sure your front tires don't roll over. Seriously.
The largest mistakes I made my first several times out was trying to focus too much on the vehicle and not myself and driving. I learned more in year 2 by having 1 variable: Tire pressure. The rest of the car I didn't change for a year and a half and I know it made me faster because I worked on only a single aspect of my driving for each event for more than a year.
For the first timers that I help instruct I have 3 goals:
1) Try not to get lost.
2) Try to get a little better each run.
3) Try to have fun.
Same thing again for the next 2-3 events. By then one can start picking up course cues and figuring out what aspect of their driving to focus on for that event. Trying to fix several things at one time doesn't make anyone faster.
Regardless of how you choose to go about it all, hope you have fun doing it. :)
-Biggly
P.S. Unless you have done some form of racing before, bicycle, motorcycle, anything...you'll likely get your butt kicked more than you were prepared for.
The largest mistakes I made my first several times out was trying to focus too much on the vehicle and not myself and driving. I learned more in year 2 by having 1 variable: Tire pressure. The rest of the car I didn't change for a year and a half and I know it made me faster because I worked on only a single aspect of my driving for each event for more than a year.
For the first timers that I help instruct I have 3 goals:
1) Try not to get lost.
2) Try to get a little better each run.
3) Try to have fun.
Same thing again for the next 2-3 events. By then one can start picking up course cues and figuring out what aspect of their driving to focus on for that event. Trying to fix several things at one time doesn't make anyone faster.
Regardless of how you choose to go about it all, hope you have fun doing it. :)
-Biggly
P.S. Unless you have done some form of racing before, bicycle, motorcycle, anything...you'll likely get your butt kicked more than you were prepared for.
| silver arrow | 11-09-2006 11:56 PM |
[QUOTE=The_Wolf;15913677]I am one that runs the Strano FSB with no major issues (06 AS STI...stock struts and 275 V710's). It made a big difference and I highly recommend it.[/QUOTE]
Let us know when your a arm breaks. ;)
Let us know when your a arm breaks. ;)
| The_Wolf | 11-10-2006 07:46 AM |
I will hopefully have new endlinks before that happens (autox done till next spring). It was fine for 10+ events (a few dual driven) though...I'm not too worried about it :D
| makofoto | 11-10-2006 01:54 PM |
:rolleyes:
Everyone has been talking about don't mod the car, just concentrate on driving, but most of the discussion has been about mods and almost nothing about driving. :lol:
Last weekend I did instructional runs with three newbs with STI's. One of the best pre-instructional comments was, "I just did my fastest run. The secret was not using my brakes." The best post-instructional comment was, "I'll be right back, I've GOT TO get to the Porta Potty!" At least he didn't pee in his pants like that one gal did while riding with Barco!
We all start off being good at giving gas. Most of us begin AX'ing not using our brakes very well. There is no coasting in racing. You're either on the gas or on the brakes. A lot of Suby owners that complain about understeer make it worse by going into the corners too hot. You typically use your brakes hard and for a short time. But don't jump on them, just be fast and smooth with them. You gain better times by being slow in and fast out. If you can't get on the throttle by the time you're at the apex, you've probably gone in too hot. In AX most corners require late apex's. If you're blowing by your apex's, you're going in to hot.
Your tires can only do one thing at a time, well. Especially at first, try to separate braking and turning. If you are braking and turning and understeering, get off the brakes, open your steering a bit and re-steer into the corner. The tires should re-grip.
You can't be fast if you don't know the course. Walk it at least two, three times. At least once with an experienced driver. At least once by yourself so you can concentrate on learning the course without being distracted by a companion. Pay attention to key cones that you will need to find when driving. Most beginners are too fast in the slow corners and slow in the fast bits. Learn to recognize the fast parts. Learn to distill course combinations into one fast line. Review the course in your head ... you need to be able to "see" the entire course if you want to be fast.
Concentrate on one area of improvement during each run. Review your run after you finish.
Pump up your tires to around 38/38 to start with ... bleed off air between runs, otherwise in a couple of runs you could be running 45/45 and be loosing grip.
Make a list of basic tips on a 4X6 card ... tape it to the inside of your visor.
Good tips here: [url]http://dmvrscca.org/topten.htm[/url]
Everyone has been talking about don't mod the car, just concentrate on driving, but most of the discussion has been about mods and almost nothing about driving. :lol:
Last weekend I did instructional runs with three newbs with STI's. One of the best pre-instructional comments was, "I just did my fastest run. The secret was not using my brakes." The best post-instructional comment was, "I'll be right back, I've GOT TO get to the Porta Potty!" At least he didn't pee in his pants like that one gal did while riding with Barco!
We all start off being good at giving gas. Most of us begin AX'ing not using our brakes very well. There is no coasting in racing. You're either on the gas or on the brakes. A lot of Suby owners that complain about understeer make it worse by going into the corners too hot. You typically use your brakes hard and for a short time. But don't jump on them, just be fast and smooth with them. You gain better times by being slow in and fast out. If you can't get on the throttle by the time you're at the apex, you've probably gone in too hot. In AX most corners require late apex's. If you're blowing by your apex's, you're going in to hot.
Your tires can only do one thing at a time, well. Especially at first, try to separate braking and turning. If you are braking and turning and understeering, get off the brakes, open your steering a bit and re-steer into the corner. The tires should re-grip.
You can't be fast if you don't know the course. Walk it at least two, three times. At least once with an experienced driver. At least once by yourself so you can concentrate on learning the course without being distracted by a companion. Pay attention to key cones that you will need to find when driving. Most beginners are too fast in the slow corners and slow in the fast bits. Learn to recognize the fast parts. Learn to distill course combinations into one fast line. Review the course in your head ... you need to be able to "see" the entire course if you want to be fast.
Concentrate on one area of improvement during each run. Review your run after you finish.
Pump up your tires to around 38/38 to start with ... bleed off air between runs, otherwise in a couple of runs you could be running 45/45 and be loosing grip.
Make a list of basic tips on a 4X6 card ... tape it to the inside of your visor.
Good tips here: [url]http://dmvrscca.org/topten.htm[/url]
| STirocket | 11-10-2006 03:49 PM |
+1 for makofoto...
I blamed my suspension for understeering and went to bigger sways, but guess what? It still understeered! Uh oh... So I started to listen to the guys like makofoto who know what they are talking about. The key things that help me are as makofoto said, "slow in - fast out", and "beginners drive too slow in the fast parts and too fast in the slow parts". Just thinking about those two things will do amazing things to your times... :)
I blamed my suspension for understeering and went to bigger sways, but guess what? It still understeered! Uh oh... So I started to listen to the guys like makofoto who know what they are talking about. The key things that help me are as makofoto said, "slow in - fast out", and "beginners drive too slow in the fast parts and too fast in the slow parts". Just thinking about those two things will do amazing things to your times... :)
| DrBiggly | 11-10-2006 04:04 PM |
[QUOTE=makofoto;15943238]:rolleyes:
Everyone has been talking about don't mod the car, just concentrate on driving, but most of the discussion has been about mods and almost nothing about driving. :lol:
[/QUOTE]
I pointed out the 3 goals for the first autox. I did forget to mention looking ahead, which I believe the lack of to be the root of all autox evils and mistakes, but still. I didn't talk about driving techniques because someone going their first time out cannot absorb and apply all of it at once, just as I stated. Your advice is great but think about how much someone who has to have a potty break is able to actually comprehend at once. Seems like you're doing 100mph when you first start, then after you've been doing it a while it can seem quite slow. It's all relative, give the n00bs a mental break. Focus on looking ahead and that's it for the first 1-3 events. Add in 'brake here!' or 'give more gas!' when they aren't doing enough of one or too late on the other.
I also have found that novices don't remember the courses well so I talk throughout the course of "good!" or "Oh, that wasn't the way to do it...now" (except I'm talking very quickly). They tend to remember more that way when I can ask them to recall when I said 'too much brake' or 'too late on brakes' and then tell them what they did wrong afterwards using what I said during the run as a reference point. :)
-Biggly
Everyone has been talking about don't mod the car, just concentrate on driving, but most of the discussion has been about mods and almost nothing about driving. :lol:
[/QUOTE]
I pointed out the 3 goals for the first autox. I did forget to mention looking ahead, which I believe the lack of to be the root of all autox evils and mistakes, but still. I didn't talk about driving techniques because someone going their first time out cannot absorb and apply all of it at once, just as I stated. Your advice is great but think about how much someone who has to have a potty break is able to actually comprehend at once. Seems like you're doing 100mph when you first start, then after you've been doing it a while it can seem quite slow. It's all relative, give the n00bs a mental break. Focus on looking ahead and that's it for the first 1-3 events. Add in 'brake here!' or 'give more gas!' when they aren't doing enough of one or too late on the other.
I also have found that novices don't remember the courses well so I talk throughout the course of "good!" or "Oh, that wasn't the way to do it...now" (except I'm talking very quickly). They tend to remember more that way when I can ask them to recall when I said 'too much brake' or 'too late on brakes' and then tell them what they did wrong afterwards using what I said during the run as a reference point. :)
-Biggly
| makofoto | 11-10-2006 06:41 PM |
Depends on the person. I've been around racing most of my life ... so I was ready for detailed advice from the beginning. Not saying I really absorbed it and applied it. But I would have welcomed more pointers.
| DrBiggly | 11-10-2006 06:49 PM |
[QUOTE=makofoto;15946993]Depends on the person. I've been around racing most of my life ... so I was ready for detailed advice from the beginning. Not saying I really absorbed it and applied it. But I would have welcomed more pointers.[/QUOTE]
I too welcomed all of the pointers at first until I realized that I couldn't put them all to use. So then I made up my own self-improvement program and started working on something for each event, then seeing where I lacked the most given feedback from friends/spotters/watchers and would work on the area where I lacked the most at the next event.
So here's a question for you man; are the pointers pointless if you can't really apply them all? :)
-Biggly
I too welcomed all of the pointers at first until I realized that I couldn't put them all to use. So then I made up my own self-improvement program and started working on something for each event, then seeing where I lacked the most given feedback from friends/spotters/watchers and would work on the area where I lacked the most at the next event.
So here's a question for you man; are the pointers pointless if you can't really apply them all? :)
-Biggly
| sstrano | 11-15-2006 06:35 PM |
The internet being what it is, you tend to hear all the bitching first. Clearly there are folks out there with no problems at all with our bar (and btw, that's the majority of them). No good deed goes unpunished I guess.
And FWIW, we've found some things that were causing problems on some cars, which were very simple fixes (and not to the bar itself). Will I claim that nobody, ever will break anything? Nope. Would I like Addco to get on with a different link design? Yep, but not making progress there at all.... I'm trying though.
And if the person you are speaking of with the WRX and the breaking of arms is Leonard Kirk... That did happen, and he did send the bar to Addco to look at it. And we met @ Nationals, and he missed the bar so much, I sent him another to replace the first (and with no changes so far other than some gotcha things we discovered and covered in conversation). So maybe the whole story should be told instead of only bits and pieces of it.
And FWIW, we've found some things that were causing problems on some cars, which were very simple fixes (and not to the bar itself). Will I claim that nobody, ever will break anything? Nope. Would I like Addco to get on with a different link design? Yep, but not making progress there at all.... I'm trying though.
And if the person you are speaking of with the WRX and the breaking of arms is Leonard Kirk... That did happen, and he did send the bar to Addco to look at it. And we met @ Nationals, and he missed the bar so much, I sent him another to replace the first (and with no changes so far other than some gotcha things we discovered and covered in conversation). So maybe the whole story should be told instead of only bits and pieces of it.
| sstrano | 11-15-2006 06:37 PM |
[QUOTE=15secWRX;15897581]on nov 18 ill be running my first auto-x in my 07 sti in ASN. [/QUOTE]
I see you are in VA Beach. Are you running the event @ ACU-4? Just curious, I'll be there co-driving a friend's Z06.
I see you are in VA Beach. Are you running the event @ ACU-4? Just curious, I'll be there co-driving a friend's Z06.
| sstrano | 11-15-2006 06:42 PM |
[QUOTE=silver arrow;15913301]To be fair, it's a great part for a dedicated autocross car in AS. For the rest of us who drive our cars everyday, I think the gain over the Whiteline is not worth the drawbacks. You have also been very slow to redesign the endlinks to solve these problems which makes it difficult to recommend your bar or company. I have your bar and my neighbor has the Whiteline and when we were both on stock struts, I had more front bite. Now that I am on 12k/10k coilovers I will be going to a 24mm FSB to see the effects. After 8 month on the Stranos bar the endlink bushing things are chewed to peices and it is obvious that the bar is hitting the mount and putting undo stress on the mounting tab, even with high spring rates.[/QUOTE]
Well, I'm not a huge company like Whiteline. I didn't test fit the bar personally, and don't have a Subaru that I have easy access to change things. I relied on Addco and a customer with an STi for the test fitting, etc. When they said it was ok, I was good with that. In hindsight maybe that wasn't the best move, but testing takes miles, and we know the bar was helpful and that folks wanted it.
It's clear by the results the bar works. It's clear by your own statement that the bar works. You might not feel it's worth any of the "drawbacks". Ok. But most don't have drawbacks (some do, admittedly). And the bar was done for competition purposes first and foremost. If you aren't serious enough to want any advantage, that's fine. But maybe others are.
I have to change limited slips in my car with some frequency. I could run a different diff that I never had to screw with, but that would not be as fast. I choose to go through the pain in the butt of changing it.
Well, I'm not a huge company like Whiteline. I didn't test fit the bar personally, and don't have a Subaru that I have easy access to change things. I relied on Addco and a customer with an STi for the test fitting, etc. When they said it was ok, I was good with that. In hindsight maybe that wasn't the best move, but testing takes miles, and we know the bar was helpful and that folks wanted it.
It's clear by the results the bar works. It's clear by your own statement that the bar works. You might not feel it's worth any of the "drawbacks". Ok. But most don't have drawbacks (some do, admittedly). And the bar was done for competition purposes first and foremost. If you aren't serious enough to want any advantage, that's fine. But maybe others are.
I have to change limited slips in my car with some frequency. I could run a different diff that I never had to screw with, but that would not be as fast. I choose to go through the pain in the butt of changing it.
| afpdl | 11-15-2006 06:49 PM |
[QUOTE=sstrano;16004405]
And if the person you are speaking of with the WRX and the breaking of arms is Leonard Kirk... That did happen, and he did send the bar to Addco to look at it. And we met @ Nationals, and he missed the bar so much, I sent him another to replace the first (and with no changes so far other than some gotcha things we discovered and covered in conversation). So maybe the whole story should be told instead of only bits and pieces of it.[/QUOTE]
All I said is steel a-arms have been broken with the bar (because people keep saying its ONLY on aluminum A-armed cars), I didn't say it sucked. Its a big front bar it does what I expect a big front bar to do. Both Leonard and myself are continuing to run the bar and like the effects from the bar. We just agree it needs a new end link design.
And if the person you are speaking of with the WRX and the breaking of arms is Leonard Kirk... That did happen, and he did send the bar to Addco to look at it. And we met @ Nationals, and he missed the bar so much, I sent him another to replace the first (and with no changes so far other than some gotcha things we discovered and covered in conversation). So maybe the whole story should be told instead of only bits and pieces of it.[/QUOTE]
All I said is steel a-arms have been broken with the bar (because people keep saying its ONLY on aluminum A-armed cars), I didn't say it sucked. Its a big front bar it does what I expect a big front bar to do. Both Leonard and myself are continuing to run the bar and like the effects from the bar. We just agree it needs a new end link design.
| 15secWRX | 11-15-2006 07:51 PM |
[QUOTE=sstrano;16004437]I see you are in VA Beach. Are you running the event @ ACU-4? Just curious, I'll be there co-driving a friend's Z06.[/QUOTE]
yah i sure am. i had no idea you were local. look for me when youre there, ill be in the gray 07 sti limited. You can give me some tips!
yah i sure am. i had no idea you were local. look for me when youre there, ill be in the gray 07 sti limited. You can give me some tips!
Không có nhận xét nào:
Đăng nhận xét