| spazegun2213 | 04-26-2006 09:31 PM |
Boxer engine cooling
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Alright guys i have a few questions about cooling for the track. I have heard a bunch of times about how well our engine does at cooling, but since I'm going to track this car a lot i want to make sure I'm everything i can to keep my engine in top shape cooling wise.
some of the things I know i can do are, new bigger radiator, oil cooler, but I'm looking for more budget oriented ways of cooling. Things like water wetter, maybe a better oil, things like that.
I'm fairly new to all of this, which is why i want to know what i can do to help the engine cool.
should I let the car run for a little while after a few laps on the track? maybe even with the heat on? or would that help at all?
thanks guys.
some of the things I know i can do are, new bigger radiator, oil cooler, but I'm looking for more budget oriented ways of cooling. Things like water wetter, maybe a better oil, things like that.
I'm fairly new to all of this, which is why i want to know what i can do to help the engine cool.
should I let the car run for a little while after a few laps on the track? maybe even with the heat on? or would that help at all?
thanks guys.
| zzyzx | 04-26-2006 09:37 PM |
Water Wetter and "40 Below". I've used both and "40 Below" seems to perform better. And though I'm not FI, my NA motor is [i][url="http://zzyzxmotorsports.com/news/300hpna"]far[/url][/i] from stock.
| Olson | 04-27-2006 12:13 AM |
what is this water wetter and where can you get it?
| Crash477 | 04-27-2006 12:22 AM |
Definitely leave your car running for about 2-5 minutes when you come off track. DOnt use the e-brake too. lol
| zzyzx | 04-27-2006 12:30 AM |
[QUOTE=Olson]what is this water wetter and where can you get it?[/QUOTE]
[url="http://www.redlineoil.com/products_coolant.asp"]Redline Water Wetter + Demo[/url]
[url="http://www.lubricationdynamics.com/tech4032.html"]40 Below[/url]
[url="http://www.redlineoil.com/products_coolant.asp"]Redline Water Wetter + Demo[/url]
[url="http://www.lubricationdynamics.com/tech4032.html"]40 Below[/url]
| spazegun2213 | 04-27-2006 09:59 AM |
[QUOTE=Crash477]Definitely leave your car running for about 2-5 minutes when you come off track. DOnt use the e-brake too. lol[/QUOTE]
I know the no e-brake rule :)
I'm just looking for anything else i can do to help.
I know the no e-brake rule :)
I'm just looking for anything else i can do to help.
| davis10 | 04-27-2006 10:53 AM |
no ebrake because your brakes are hot?
| spazegun2213 | 04-27-2006 02:05 PM |
[QUOTE=davis10]no ebrake because your brakes are hot?[/QUOTE]
yes, if you leave the E-brake on, you will melt the pad compound to the rotor. This is bad for both the pads and the rotors.
yes, if you leave the E-brake on, you will melt the pad compound to the rotor. This is bad for both the pads and the rotors.
| zzyzx | 04-27-2006 02:07 PM |
[QUOTE=spazegun2213]yes, if you leave the E-brake on, you will melt the pad compound to the rotor. This is bad for both the pads and the rotors.[/QUOTE]
You guys just [i]might[/i] want to take a closer look at the e-brake system on our Imprezas...
You guys just [i]might[/i] want to take a closer look at the e-brake system on our Imprezas...
| ghostfoot7 | 04-27-2006 02:08 PM |
Didn't know that about the ebrake.. thanks for the tip!
| zzyzx | 04-27-2006 03:27 PM |
[QUOTE=ghostfoot7]Didn't know that about the ebrake.. thanks for the tip![/QUOTE]
Or not... :(
Or not... :(
| lovesmysuby04 | 04-27-2006 03:33 PM |
When I took my rear brakes apart the e-brake locks from the inside of the rotor. I don't think it locks the rear pads to the rotor.
| Clavo | 04-27-2006 03:39 PM |
ding ding ding Winn4r
| zzyzx | 04-27-2006 03:46 PM |
[QUOTE=ClavoWRX]ding ding ding Winn4r[/QUOTE]
Phew. I was beginning to think Motorsports was the Newbies & FAQ forum. ;)
Phew. I was beginning to think Motorsports was the Newbies & FAQ forum. ;)
| spazegun2213 | 04-27-2006 03:59 PM |
[QUOTE=zzyzx]Phew. I was beginning to think Motorsports was the Newbies & FAQ forum. ;)[/QUOTE]
with the lack of comments on this post I'm about to say the same thing.
where are the people that track their cars?
with the lack of comments on this post I'm about to say the same thing.
where are the people that track their cars?
| rex n effect | 04-27-2006 04:20 PM |
the rotors are still hot as hell and the ebrake pads probably aren't very heat resistant...
to be perfectly safe, drive slow on your cool down lap with almost no brakes, then park on a level surface and take your foot off the brakes while the car runs for a few minutes.
to be perfectly safe, drive slow on your cool down lap with almost no brakes, then park on a level surface and take your foot off the brakes while the car runs for a few minutes.
| WgnWheel | 04-27-2006 04:32 PM |
i run distilled water+water wetter for track use, homemade i/c sprayer and i have a sprayer that i use on the i/c and tires after session, on hot days. otherwise the car runs pretty cool.
| Patrick Olsen | 04-27-2006 07:09 PM |
First of all, Subaru's cooling systems seem pretty damn stout. I've open tracked my car on days when temps were in the upper 90s, track temps probably 115+, and have never had any problems with cooling. My car's not as powerful as the various turbo cars now available, but I'd bet I'm at WOT longer than a WRX or STi would be, so the engine is under heavy load [i]a lot[/i]. I've also run events with guys running turbo'd 2.5RSs, making [i]way[/i] more power than stock, using a stock radiator, and again, no issues.
With that said, there's still value in doing what you can to help optimize the system to keep everything happy.
I've heard/read/seen mixed results with Water Wetter / 40 Below / etc. It can't hurt to try it, but don't expect amazing results.
One cheap thing you can do is add some ducting to ensure that the air coming in the front air dam is actually going where you want it to - through the radiator. It'll take some work, but some aluminum sheeting from Home Depot/Lowe's + some adhesive foam rubber insulation stripping will allow you to create an air box to keep air from leaking around the side of the radiator or over the top. (This will be cheap money-wise, but it's not very cheap time-wise). Use some cardboard to mock things up, then cut the aluminum to fit.
Pat Olsen
'97 Legacy 2.5GT sedan
With that said, there's still value in doing what you can to help optimize the system to keep everything happy.
I've heard/read/seen mixed results with Water Wetter / 40 Below / etc. It can't hurt to try it, but don't expect amazing results.
One cheap thing you can do is add some ducting to ensure that the air coming in the front air dam is actually going where you want it to - through the radiator. It'll take some work, but some aluminum sheeting from Home Depot/Lowe's + some adhesive foam rubber insulation stripping will allow you to create an air box to keep air from leaking around the side of the radiator or over the top. (This will be cheap money-wise, but it's not very cheap time-wise). Use some cardboard to mock things up, then cut the aluminum to fit.
Pat Olsen
'97 Legacy 2.5GT sedan
| drees | 04-27-2006 10:30 PM |
New Imprezas are already good stock at keeping air coming through the grill/bumper directed to the radiator, there are no air gaps that I noticed, it's all sealed by foam.
Water wetter or equivalent + a slightly lower concentration of coolant (perhaps 30% instead of the normal 50%) will improve heat transfer in the cooling system.
Water wetter or equivalent + a slightly lower concentration of coolant (perhaps 30% instead of the normal 50%) will improve heat transfer in the cooling system.
| Homemade WRX | 04-28-2006 12:37 AM |
[QUOTE=zzyzx]You guys just [i]might[/i] want to take a closer look at the e-brake system on our Imprezas...[/QUOTE]
yeah, the drum pad doesn't like being baked...the one inside the rear rotor...the pad also creates hot spots on opposing sides of the rotor....ever wonder how metal warps?...although it would have to be a really hot rear rotor and the brake on for a few minutes...
yeah, the drum pad doesn't like being baked...the one inside the rear rotor...the pad also creates hot spots on opposing sides of the rotor....ever wonder how metal warps?...although it would have to be a really hot rear rotor and the brake on for a few minutes...
| mav1c | 04-28-2006 07:44 AM |
I changed to a 75/25 water/antifreeze mixture and added a bottle of Water Wetter to the old wagon (also had a PWR radiator, but that was in before the change), and I saw about a 2-3C drop in oil temps right away, and the car ran about 5C lower at the track. I think the biggest help was the switch to 75/25 from 50/50, but I'm sure the Water Wetter helped a little too. I plan on doing the same in the STI.
| bushflyr | 04-28-2006 02:48 PM |
I'm no ubertracker, but I fully cooked my brakes to the point I had to come in. (EBC RS Ceramics, FWIW) 1 cool down lap then I stopped it in the pits w/ the e-brake, shut down and released the e-brake. After about 5 minutes or so I rolled it a bit to get the pads over a different bit of rotor. No probs. :) With regards to the engine compartment cooling, OPEN YOUR HOOD. There were 3 subies there, my wagon and 2 STi's, and we all threw CEL's on our second session due to det. Our IC's were so heat soaked they still didn't work right even after a couple warm up laps. Opening the hood in the pits eliminated the problem.
| racekar | 04-29-2006 01:09 PM |
you can also turn on the heater full blast when you run since your windows are opened anyways.
| DemolitionNine | 04-29-2006 02:19 PM |
[QUOTE=racekar]you can also turn on the heater full blast when you run since your windows are opened anyways.[/QUOTE]
Depends on how fast your going.
If I'm doin 120+ I'd like to have my windows closed, thank you very much.
:lol: :lol: :lol:
Wind resistance w/ open windows = slower.
It's actually been proven that if you're doing 75-80 on the highway w/ open windows, you'll get crappier gas mileage than 75-80 w/ the A/C going.
:banana:
Auto-Xing though... windows DOWN! ;)
Depends on how fast your going.
If I'm doin 120+ I'd like to have my windows closed, thank you very much.
:lol: :lol: :lol:
Wind resistance w/ open windows = slower.
It's actually been proven that if you're doing 75-80 on the highway w/ open windows, you'll get crappier gas mileage than 75-80 w/ the A/C going.
:banana:
Auto-Xing though... windows DOWN! ;)
| ralliharri | 04-29-2006 03:58 PM |
[QUOTE=DemolitionNine]Depends on how fast your going.
If I'm doin 120+ I'd like to have my windows closed, thank you very much.
:lol: :lol: :lol:
Wind resistance w/ open windows = slower.
It's actually been proven that if you're doing 75-80 on the highway w/ open windows, you'll get crappier gas mileage than 75-80 w/ the A/C going.
:banana:
Auto-Xing though... windows DOWN! ;)[/QUOTE]
Read the first post again, he's talking about driving at the track and you have to keep windows down at the track!
If I'm doin 120+ I'd like to have my windows closed, thank you very much.
:lol: :lol: :lol:
Wind resistance w/ open windows = slower.
It's actually been proven that if you're doing 75-80 on the highway w/ open windows, you'll get crappier gas mileage than 75-80 w/ the A/C going.
:banana:
Auto-Xing though... windows DOWN! ;)[/QUOTE]
Read the first post again, he's talking about driving at the track and you have to keep windows down at the track!
| racekar | 04-29-2006 05:25 PM |
thank you
| kadafi | 04-29-2006 06:15 PM |
Supp everybody
Who has tried Keep Cool from Neo Synthetics.
About to order there Coolant and Keep Cool. Getting ready to storm across this great land.OOHRAH
Who has tried Keep Cool from Neo Synthetics.
About to order there Coolant and Keep Cool. Getting ready to storm across this great land.OOHRAH
| ghschirtz | 04-29-2006 09:45 PM |
On track days I drive around the parking area after a session for 5-10 minutes to get everything cooled off, 15-20 mph. Stop, open the hood and block a tire so the car won't roll. Idle for a minute and shut down. Probably overkill but it seems to work.
Remember that the turbo needs to cool down from WTO. Otherwise, the oil on the impeller shaft can "coke" (burn), leaving an abrasive solid that will eat the shaft up. Modern oils and turbo design have minimized this, but I don't take a chance.
George
Remember that the turbo needs to cool down from WTO. Otherwise, the oil on the impeller shaft can "coke" (burn), leaving an abrasive solid that will eat the shaft up. Modern oils and turbo design have minimized this, but I don't take a chance.
George
| mav1c | 04-30-2006 10:50 AM |
Yeah, why I run at VIR I always try to run around the pits once, then up the access road all the way to the entrance, and back. Definitely helps cool the car down a lot more before shutting down in the pits. And yes, I always open the hood, and never put the e-Brake on.
| silver arrow | 04-30-2006 04:03 PM |
40 below, drive around alittle to let cool down, open hood between runs, remove dust shields from the brakes, add ducting, use pads rated to handle track driving. Have fun.
| BIGSKYWRX | 04-30-2006 11:25 PM |
+1 on the diluted anti-freeze. I drain from the petcok and remove ~ 5 quarts of 50:50. This leaves in ~ 1.5 quart of pure antifreeze, putting in 5 quarts of distilled water gives me ~ 75:25 mix. Come winter time I "thicken" it up again.
Eventually a oil cooler will go in as well.
Eventually a oil cooler will go in as well.
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