| clbd39 | 02-07-2007 12:49 PM |
Glass wheels?
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I'm involved in a project for my Marketing class. We took the responsibility of helping a nearby company market the use of their product as well as finding a new marketable society. Being the Subie love that I am, I thought, after seeing a great photoCHOP my friend UltimateLurker did, maybe they could make glass wheels! Not 100% glass but the inside would be glass, so you could see the brakes, right through and would basically be a completely differnt look.
The company that we are helping out is called Mo-Sci, they are a world leader in precision glass technology, explore and develops new and exciting ways for their products and services to integrate within a wide variety of useful applications.
[B][U]From their website...[/U][/B]
Mo-Sci Specialty Products
[I]Serving industries with a variety of application needs from space travel to the pharmaceutical industry, Mo-Sci Specialty Products supplies quality glass microspheres, powders, and chopped or continuous glass fibers, and specialty glasses tailor-made for you.
Mo-Sci Specialty Products L.L.C. manufactures and supplies precision glass microspheres, powders and fibers made from either standard (soda-lime glass, E-glass, etc.) or custom compositions. Unique compositions that are alkali-resistant, water soluble, bioactive, magnetic or colored can be custom made.
Our products are highly diverse to meet our customer needs. We offer glass spheres with specialized coatings for use as fillers in thermoplastics, for uniformed gap control used in epoxies as monodispersed or polydispersed glass particles for use as size analysis standards.
Our quality glass spheres are available from 1 micron to as large as 10 mm to fit almost any requirement. With a complete line of glass bond line spacer beads (class IV, class V, & class VI), we can provide you with the gap control you desire.
Need only a few grams of beads or fibers that you can�t find anywhere else? Mo-Sci Specialty Products will produce quantities from grams to tons depending on your requirements.[/I]
When I went on a plant tour they were talking about a very strong glass that will be used on military vehicles in Iraq. They are not only bullet proof, but are 100% transparent and 100% optically clear.
Here is a picture that started my inspiration
[IMG]http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f111/clbd39/glasswheels.jpg[/IMG]
So basically I want to hear your take on these kind of wheels, would it be a cool idea, waste of time and money, or possibly a good idea in the future.
Any input on this would be greatly appreciated!
The company that we are helping out is called Mo-Sci, they are a world leader in precision glass technology, explore and develops new and exciting ways for their products and services to integrate within a wide variety of useful applications.
[B][U]From their website...[/U][/B]
Mo-Sci Specialty Products
[I]Serving industries with a variety of application needs from space travel to the pharmaceutical industry, Mo-Sci Specialty Products supplies quality glass microspheres, powders, and chopped or continuous glass fibers, and specialty glasses tailor-made for you.
Mo-Sci Specialty Products L.L.C. manufactures and supplies precision glass microspheres, powders and fibers made from either standard (soda-lime glass, E-glass, etc.) or custom compositions. Unique compositions that are alkali-resistant, water soluble, bioactive, magnetic or colored can be custom made.
Our products are highly diverse to meet our customer needs. We offer glass spheres with specialized coatings for use as fillers in thermoplastics, for uniformed gap control used in epoxies as monodispersed or polydispersed glass particles for use as size analysis standards.
Our quality glass spheres are available from 1 micron to as large as 10 mm to fit almost any requirement. With a complete line of glass bond line spacer beads (class IV, class V, & class VI), we can provide you with the gap control you desire.
Need only a few grams of beads or fibers that you can�t find anywhere else? Mo-Sci Specialty Products will produce quantities from grams to tons depending on your requirements.[/I]
When I went on a plant tour they were talking about a very strong glass that will be used on military vehicles in Iraq. They are not only bullet proof, but are 100% transparent and 100% optically clear.
Here is a picture that started my inspiration
[IMG]http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f111/clbd39/glasswheels.jpg[/IMG]
So basically I want to hear your take on these kind of wheels, would it be a cool idea, waste of time and money, or possibly a good idea in the future.
Any input on this would be greatly appreciated!
| ittybitty_STI | 02-07-2007 12:53 PM |
I think it would be cool, but how sterdy or rugged would they be, would they take the rally beating that you get out of a rota or a Volk wheel? still sounds kool if you can do it. i know Glass isnt cheap these days.
| "B" | 02-07-2007 12:54 PM |
I think that looks fkn sweet. Definitely a cool idea. Run with it. It might not really catch on with Subarus...but I can see it with show cars. One question though...how long do you think it'd actually be clear before the brembo's epic brake dust coats the inside of the glass?
| Handsdown | 02-07-2007 12:55 PM |
they're not glass and this is like the tenth thread about them, if you want research or ideas for your class why not look through those threads?
| yzracer758 | 02-07-2007 12:57 PM |
I saw this rim at SEMA this year. I think it is actually a very unique and great design that could go some where, just not in the tuner market. I think that the wheel will suit more of the SUV and "DUB" market more then any other. I think it looks pretty good on the STI.
| Lambu | 02-07-2007 01:00 PM |
nice idea but its been done already. the wheel in that pic is an actual production wheel (maybe not exactly the same) made i think by lexani using polycarbonite or acrylic or something along those lines. good idea though and since its been done that means there must be a market for them. but how durable would actual glass be?
edit : damn beaten to it
edit : damn beaten to it
| Handsdown | 02-07-2007 01:12 PM |
these wheels are around 5k each right now... prices won't come down unless manufacturing costs go way way down, which i'm guessing they won't for another twenty or so years.
| clbd39 | 02-07-2007 01:16 PM |
oh wow, i thought my friend just chopped it to make it look like the wheel wasn't there :( sorry
but regardless I was just wondering everyone's take on it because the company, like i said, is looking for a different market to get into
edit: the company is a glass manufacturing company though and can make molds to basically any shape, I dind't know those other wheels were already in production, and therefore didn't know they weren't made of glass...
But anyways... i watched as they poured 2600 *F glass into a crucible, and it was pretty cool actually, and when it's in that molten form it can be transformed into any pattern they want
they use different types of glass which all have their different types of strengths and shear's and strains so i'd have to ask them about those specific forces as far as strength goes
but regardless I was just wondering everyone's take on it because the company, like i said, is looking for a different market to get into
edit: the company is a glass manufacturing company though and can make molds to basically any shape, I dind't know those other wheels were already in production, and therefore didn't know they weren't made of glass...
But anyways... i watched as they poured 2600 *F glass into a crucible, and it was pretty cool actually, and when it's in that molten form it can be transformed into any pattern they want
they use different types of glass which all have their different types of strengths and shear's and strains so i'd have to ask them about those specific forces as far as strength goes
| Marceau1 | 02-07-2007 01:17 PM |
I think they are fine for showcars, but maybe not so much for street usage.
| clbd39 | 02-07-2007 01:25 PM |
[QUOTE=Marceau1;16965525]I think they are fine for showcars, but maybe not so much for street usage.[/QUOTE]
definitely, wouldn't want to be using them in any sort of rally or autoX lol
so i guess my question would be more directed to show cars or people who don't do competitive driving, who knows even for the civic drivers and others....
definitely, wouldn't want to be using them in any sort of rally or autoX lol
so i guess my question would be more directed to show cars or people who don't do competitive driving, who knows even for the civic drivers and others....
| ErasureWRX | 02-07-2007 01:41 PM |
How would the tire removal process work? Something tells me the wheels would chip, break, etc.
| just smurfy | 02-07-2007 09:14 PM |
Since glass or its composites would likely be brittle, I would be concerned about damage from curbs, side impact, etc. Plus the whole brake dust thing everyone else said.
Oh yeah, and with a little cryogenic treatment plus a hammer, "BAM!" the lugnuts are gone and you come back to your car sitting on bare rotors.
----> within the last month someone stole all the stock wheels off our company Ford Ranger pickup. These wheels would disappear in a flash.
Oh yeah, and with a little cryogenic treatment plus a hammer, "BAM!" the lugnuts are gone and you come back to your car sitting on bare rotors.
----> within the last month someone stole all the stock wheels off our company Ford Ranger pickup. These wheels would disappear in a flash.
| CoopsCustomz | 02-07-2007 10:21 PM |
i'm a free thinker... if they acted as normal rims do, and they looked like that, i'd be on it like white on rice... or like clear on glassss lol
| wrxzboost | 02-07-2007 10:26 PM |
glass breaks, cracks, shatters, spiderwebs...etc
[/thread]
[/thread]
| CPTsWRX | 02-07-2007 10:39 PM |
Glass can be made very strong too though, look at the glass that lines ice hockey rinks, it withstands pucks traveling 100+ mphs. As far as the brake dust issue, I'd imagine that glass wheels would be easier to clean than polished, or painted, it'd be more like crome finish.
| Crawdads | 02-07-2007 10:46 PM |
[quote=CPTsWRX;16972900]Glass can be made very strong too though, look at the glass that lines ice hockey rinks, it withstands pucks traveling 100+ mphs. As far as the brake dust issue, I'd imagine that glass wheels would be easier to clean than polished, or painted, it'd be more like crome finish.[/quote]
Except you would have to take the wheel off to clean it, and it will instantly get dirty again.
Here is a blurb from Autoblog about the clear wheels at SEMA:
[url]http://www.autoblog.com/2006/11/03/sema-clear-wheels-steal-the-show/[/url]
Except you would have to take the wheel off to clean it, and it will instantly get dirty again.
Here is a blurb from Autoblog about the clear wheels at SEMA:
[url]http://www.autoblog.com/2006/11/03/sema-clear-wheels-steal-the-show/[/url]
| Ghosthound | 02-07-2007 10:47 PM |
it would actually be cool to see these kind of wheels gain popularity... right now the whole "DUB" trend seems to be all about wheels while the brakes barely get any attention.... clear rims would totally turn that around. no one would want to show off a cheap oem single piston calipers leading them to buy nice looking, as well as functioning brakes... it would be sweet.
| r0nzar | 02-07-2007 10:55 PM |
if it's all bling then sure. bling is retarded though, IMO.
on the street, they get no cooling, and they would get dirty super fast.
I can see these being on the show circuit in full effect soon
on the street, they get no cooling, and they would get dirty super fast.
I can see these being on the show circuit in full effect soon
| clbd39 | 02-08-2007 12:32 AM |
well like i said the glass i was thinking of them using is already used in vehicles in Iraq for their windows, it's 3 inch bulletproof glass that doesn't shatter i'm not sure the force of lug nutes and screws going through it but it was the idea and there are plenty of different glass composities with different strengths not only perpendicular to the material but along the parallel planes
| nich0lai | 02-08-2007 12:40 AM |
I'm a glassblower/artist. Worked at Corning, deal with specialty glass manufacturers on a daily basis. Theres a bit of a problem with surface tension on glass. You break it (scratch the surface) the glass is apt to crack on that spot. Plastic would be better suited. Any flex in the metal transfering would be iffy too. Plus, to safely support 250lbs you need about a 2 inch thick piece of specialized glass. Thats why you normally don't see load bearing glass (like, say, furniture?). To support a car with sideways force in turns? No idea, its gonna be thick. This isn't going to work. Plus its going to weigh 100+ lbs a wheel. Stopping a bullet is easy, cloth can do that. By the way, it's going to cost ya a fortune too. Optic load bearing crystal billets, I was quoted 50,000 for a 1ft cube a month ago.
| WRXjp93 | 02-08-2007 07:26 AM |
personally, i think the wheels look kinda cool but it would really only look good if you were running a big brake kit all the way around that practically filled the inside of the whole wheel without leaving any empty space.
| Calamity Jesus | 02-08-2007 07:53 AM |
"Look at my awesome brakes! Ignore the fact that my brake cooling is reduced significantly since there's no cross-flow of air through the wheels, or that they weigh an incredible amount, I'm a baller."
:rolleyes: This is nothing more than ridiculous show-car crap on par with replacing headlights with LCD screens. [img]http://www.aspsmiley.com/smiley/smilies/rice.gif[/img]
:rolleyes: This is nothing more than ridiculous show-car crap on par with replacing headlights with LCD screens. [img]http://www.aspsmiley.com/smiley/smilies/rice.gif[/img]
| Aaron'z 2.5RS | 02-08-2007 08:00 AM |
I've seen these in a few different truck mags i get.
They ARE made from polycarbonate (sp?) and there is a rivited (bolted) center and rim section, so the lugs never contact plastic, and the tire never contacts plastic. The poly is 2" thick and they said they had a demo drift 350z with them on, to prove the striength issue.
Glass simply would never fly, the crystylin nature of it wouldn't lend itself to the usage. Glass is very strong on it's flat surface but almost any dammage to the edge and it's likely to crack if not shatter.... Feel like testing this, go to a junk yard and wack a car window with a hammer(a glancing blow works best for this test), you "might" break it you might not..... NOW bairly tap a window on the edge...poof...
They ARE made from polycarbonate (sp?) and there is a rivited (bolted) center and rim section, so the lugs never contact plastic, and the tire never contacts plastic. The poly is 2" thick and they said they had a demo drift 350z with them on, to prove the striength issue.
Glass simply would never fly, the crystylin nature of it wouldn't lend itself to the usage. Glass is very strong on it's flat surface but almost any dammage to the edge and it's likely to crack if not shatter.... Feel like testing this, go to a junk yard and wack a car window with a hammer(a glancing blow works best for this test), you "might" break it you might not..... NOW bairly tap a window on the edge...poof...
| clbd39 | 02-08-2007 12:42 PM |
like i said i'm just trying to get ideas basically and inputs, obviously this is a new kind of market, i never knew there WAS one but i guess they do lol i don't focus my eyes into the wheel and tire thread, i guess i shouldve lol
but all opinions and ideas are welcome, thank you [B]nich0lai [/B]for your glass expertise, that's always a plus in finding problems, and also thank you [B]Aaron'z 2.5RS [/B]for the added info of some safely done composite material
but all opinions and ideas are welcome, thank you [B]nich0lai [/B]for your glass expertise, that's always a plus in finding problems, and also thank you [B]Aaron'z 2.5RS [/B]for the added info of some safely done composite material
| imprezaowner27 | 02-08-2007 02:26 PM |
very cool idea....highly unlikely
to get the same effect, check out the chopper rims on this bad boy
[IMG]http://bigbikeriders.com/photopost/data/3466/1890IMG_0435_s.jpg[/IMG]
to get the same effect, check out the chopper rims on this bad boy
[IMG]http://bigbikeriders.com/photopost/data/3466/1890IMG_0435_s.jpg[/IMG]
| VR4Impreza | 02-08-2007 08:58 PM |
It's amazing how from a simple question like "Would You Be Interested in Buying These Types of Wheels?" Turns into an engineering debate. Since the question wasn't "Are these wheels possible?" I'll answer with a YES. They look cool. As for rally-X use, obviously not, but you wouldn't use just any rim for that. I also think an alloy/glass composite type wheel would look cool. Maybe not clear the whole way but with sections that are clear, this would enhance brake cooling and strength, plus decrease weight. You could easily create a rim to support the weight and in a few empty spaces use the glass, it would draw attention - maybe even add a hue to the glass to match the car...... let the pros decide [I]if[/I] it's possible, your job is to find out if it will sell.
| TreyS | 02-08-2007 09:01 PM |
All the ghetto balla's will buy them.
As for the hubless wheels on the chopper, THAT is pimp!
As for the hubless wheels on the chopper, THAT is pimp!
| elYk7kYle | 02-08-2007 09:51 PM |
nice chopper, any idea who makes thoes wheels?
| nich0lai | 02-09-2007 12:20 AM |
[QUOTE=VR4Impreza;16985454]It's amazing how from a simple question like "Would You Be Interested in Buying These Types of Wheels?" Turns into an engineering debate.[/QUOTE]
Ok, No I wouldn't buy them. But someone obviously would.
Dude, I'm a pro. It's not going to work out of glass. It's not a debate, it's a fact. Make it out of plastic which obviously works as people are already making them. Soda lime glass as the OP posted is so far from suitable it's not funny. Borosilicate or even pure fused silica is nowhere near strong enough to do something like this. Plus it weighs A TON. I have a 2 inch by 6 inch by 2 ft plate that weighs 44lbs, and thats not even thick enough to do it.
Two inches for a stair case. His three inch stuff aint gonna cut it.
[url]http://www.ifoapplestore.com/stores/glass_staircase.html[/url]
Whatever.
/plus anyone thought about the joy of cleaning your car wheel from the inside so it doesn't look like your driving mud spinners?
Ok, No I wouldn't buy them. But someone obviously would.
Dude, I'm a pro. It's not going to work out of glass. It's not a debate, it's a fact. Make it out of plastic which obviously works as people are already making them. Soda lime glass as the OP posted is so far from suitable it's not funny. Borosilicate or even pure fused silica is nowhere near strong enough to do something like this. Plus it weighs A TON. I have a 2 inch by 6 inch by 2 ft plate that weighs 44lbs, and thats not even thick enough to do it.
Two inches for a stair case. His three inch stuff aint gonna cut it.
[url]http://www.ifoapplestore.com/stores/glass_staircase.html[/url]
Whatever.
/plus anyone thought about the joy of cleaning your car wheel from the inside so it doesn't look like your driving mud spinners?
| clbd39 | 02-09-2007 09:41 AM |
[B]nich0lai [/B] thank you for enlightening us all
however there are obviously other alternatives that this company can do so all opinions and facts are welcome
if it IS possible to do (like it is with certain plastics and other composites) that is also considered
however there are obviously other alternatives that this company can do so all opinions and facts are welcome
if it IS possible to do (like it is with certain plastics and other composites) that is also considered
| BurtonCR | 02-09-2007 10:20 AM |
[QUOTE=clbd39;16989983][B]nich0lai [/B] thank you for enlightening us all
however there are obviously other alternatives that this company can do so all opinions and facts are welcome
if it IS possible to do (like it is with certain plastics and other composites) that is also considered[/QUOTE]
Hmm, I'm gonna go with the guy who works at one of the most reputable glass companies in the world.
however there are obviously other alternatives that this company can do so all opinions and facts are welcome
if it IS possible to do (like it is with certain plastics and other composites) that is also considered[/QUOTE]
Hmm, I'm gonna go with the guy who works at one of the most reputable glass companies in the world.
| wannasupra | 02-09-2007 10:30 AM |
[IMG]http://www.amenmotorcycles.com/reform/hub1024.jpg[/IMG]
hubless wheels ftw
hubless wheels ftw
| clbd39 | 02-09-2007 11:53 AM |
[QUOTE=BurtonCR;16990369]Hmm, I'm gonna go with the guy who works at one of the most reputable glass companies in the world.[/QUOTE]
i wasn't disagreeing
i wasn't disagreeing
| ErasureWRX | 02-09-2007 12:00 PM |
[QUOTE=VR4Impreza;16985454]I also think an alloy/glass composite type wheel would look cool. Maybe not clear the whole way but with sections that are clear, this would enhance brake cooling and strength, plus decrease weight. [/QUOTE]
Clear wheels = better cooling? :huh:
Just because you can't see it, doesn't mean it's not there ;).
Not trying to pick your argument apart, I'm just making sure I get what you're saying.
Clear wheels = better cooling? :huh:
Just because you can't see it, doesn't mean it's not there ;).
Not trying to pick your argument apart, I'm just making sure I get what you're saying.
| atech_rallyrs | 02-09-2007 12:14 PM |
You people have this all wrong. Making wheels out of plastic or glass is an ultimate waste of time. You can accheive the same results, with less weight, more durability, and better material characteristics out of transparent aircraft alumina/um. They are already in the process of producing transparent alumina/um windshields for fightercraft. Check the following links for pictures and details:
[url]http://www.llnl.gov/str/April06/Soules.html[/url]
--- "During the past two decades, additional types of transparent ceramics have been developed for applications such as nose cones for heat-seeking missiles, windows for fighter aircraft, and scintillation counters for computed tomography scanners."
[url]http://aimpoints.hq.af.mil/display.cfm?id=7223[/url]
--- "aluminum, not alumina ceramics"
Yes, there is a difference between transparent alumina and transparent aluminum. I will let you guys figureout how much a wheel is at 15$ a square inch.
[url]http://www.llnl.gov/str/April06/Soules.html[/url]
--- "During the past two decades, additional types of transparent ceramics have been developed for applications such as nose cones for heat-seeking missiles, windows for fighter aircraft, and scintillation counters for computed tomography scanners."
[url]http://aimpoints.hq.af.mil/display.cfm?id=7223[/url]
--- "aluminum, not alumina ceramics"
Yes, there is a difference between transparent alumina and transparent aluminum. I will let you guys figureout how much a wheel is at 15$ a square inch.
| Aaron'z 2.5RS | 02-09-2007 12:27 PM |
[QUOTE=atech_rallyrs;16991745]You people have this all wrong. Making wheels out of plastic or glass is an ultimate waste of time. You can accheive the same results, with less weight, more durability, and better material characteristics out of transparent aircraft alumina/um. They are already in the process of producing transparent alumina/um windshields for fightercraft. Check the following links for pictures and details:
[url]http://www.llnl.gov/str/April06/Soules.html[/url]
--- "During the past two decades, additional types of transparent ceramics have been developed for applications such as nose cones for heat-seeking missiles, windows for fighter aircraft, and scintillation counters for computed tomography scanners."
[url]http://aimpoints.hq.af.mil/display.cfm?id=7223[/url]
--- "aluminum, not alumina ceramics"
Yes, there is a difference between transparent alumina and transparent aluminum. I will let you guys figureout how much a wheel is at 15$ a square inch.[/QUOTE]
Holly molly, those are some interesting articles.... Saved
[url]http://www.llnl.gov/str/April06/Soules.html[/url]
--- "During the past two decades, additional types of transparent ceramics have been developed for applications such as nose cones for heat-seeking missiles, windows for fighter aircraft, and scintillation counters for computed tomography scanners."
[url]http://aimpoints.hq.af.mil/display.cfm?id=7223[/url]
--- "aluminum, not alumina ceramics"
Yes, there is a difference between transparent alumina and transparent aluminum. I will let you guys figureout how much a wheel is at 15$ a square inch.[/QUOTE]
Holly molly, those are some interesting articles.... Saved
| clbd39 | 02-09-2007 01:16 PM |
[QUOTE=atech_rallyrs;16991745]You people have this all wrong. Making wheels out of plastic or glass is an ultimate waste of time. You can accheive the same results, with less weight, more durability, and better material characteristics out of transparent aircraft alumina/um. They are already in the process of producing transparent alumina/um windshields for fightercraft. Check the following links for pictures and details:
[url]http://www.llnl.gov/str/April06/Soules.html[/url]
--- "During the past two decades, additional types of transparent ceramics have been developed for applications such as nose cones for heat-seeking missiles, windows for fighter aircraft, and scintillation counters for computed tomography scanners."
[url]http://aimpoints.hq.af.mil/display.cfm?id=7223[/url]
--- "aluminum, not alumina ceramics"
Yes, there is a difference between transparent alumina and transparent aluminum. I will let you guys figureout how much a wheel is at 15$ a square inch.[/QUOTE]
very interesting! nice find
[url]http://www.llnl.gov/str/April06/Soules.html[/url]
--- "During the past two decades, additional types of transparent ceramics have been developed for applications such as nose cones for heat-seeking missiles, windows for fighter aircraft, and scintillation counters for computed tomography scanners."
[url]http://aimpoints.hq.af.mil/display.cfm?id=7223[/url]
--- "aluminum, not alumina ceramics"
Yes, there is a difference between transparent alumina and transparent aluminum. I will let you guys figureout how much a wheel is at 15$ a square inch.[/QUOTE]
very interesting! nice find
| clbd39 | 02-19-2007 11:55 AM |
bump for more replies
| 06BlackSTIwith550WHP | 02-19-2007 02:44 PM |
I only buy black wheels. Will they be offered in black?
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