| Got Pink? | 05-16-2005 09:45 AM |
Which camber plates to get?
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Hey,
I need camber/caster plates because the coilovers I am getting do not come with them and realize that I need a wide range of adjustment to get a good autox alignment with enough neg camber and pos caster to be competitive.
I am mainly considering the GC and PDE plates because I wanted the adjustments to be indexed for easy small incremental changes to find the ideal settings for the car.
Which is a better choice and why. The GC redesigned top mount ones cost 350 and the PDE are 425 and the cost difference to me is irrellevant in the scheme of things. I just want the ones that are the best for my application. I am tolerant of some noise but would also consider how loud they are in my decision as well as the range of adjustment and of course durability as its also a daily driver and sees roughly 10k miles a year hopefully including long drives to tours and nationals in 06 when it moves to heartland park.
Let me know what you guys think are the best for autox.
Nate
I need camber/caster plates because the coilovers I am getting do not come with them and realize that I need a wide range of adjustment to get a good autox alignment with enough neg camber and pos caster to be competitive.
I am mainly considering the GC and PDE plates because I wanted the adjustments to be indexed for easy small incremental changes to find the ideal settings for the car.
Which is a better choice and why. The GC redesigned top mount ones cost 350 and the PDE are 425 and the cost difference to me is irrellevant in the scheme of things. I just want the ones that are the best for my application. I am tolerant of some noise but would also consider how loud they are in my decision as well as the range of adjustment and of course durability as its also a daily driver and sees roughly 10k miles a year hopefully including long drives to tours and nationals in 06 when it moves to heartland park.
Let me know what you guys think are the best for autox.
Nate
| joey1313 | 05-16-2005 09:51 AM |
I like the PDE plates, but I haven't tried the GC, so I can't give a comparison.
| Got Pink? | 05-16-2005 10:04 AM |
How much noise do they make on the street and what are your autox settings like?
| makofoto | 05-16-2005 01:08 PM |
Most of us find that you don't need fine tuning ... just maximum camber and caster. :-) I'm using modified NOLTECS ... to get more caster/camber on a wagon.
Race cars are noisy ... how fast do you want to be ... stiffer bushings, subframe bolts ...
A lot of us start off with compromises ... and then as we go along ... we just start accepting the trade-offs in the interest of speed.
One way to do it is to set your aggresive AX setting up front ... max camber and caster with say a good 1/8th toe out. Then back off the camber until your toe is zero. Mark that as your street setting. When you get to the track ... jack up your front end ... slam the camber plates to your max. AX setting and race. Afterwards ... just go back to your street setting mark. You will still have a lot of camber ... but it's off-zero toe that eats up tires on the street ... not camber.
In the rear you want at least 1/8th toe out typically. With my inexpensive Whiteline adjustable lateral links ... it's very easy to adjust toe and camber at the track ... just backing up onto ramps. Opinions differ on rear camber ... most use a minimal amount, -1 to -1.3 to facilitate rotation. Others need up to -3 in order to balance their car. It also depends on driving styles/skills. Less neg camber in the rear tends to make the car "suffer" from more snap oversteer. With skill and experience ... you can be very fast with a very loose car. I suspect that with the generous amount of power in a STI, and your mechanical '05 front LSD ... you might benefit from additional rear neg camber ...
To adjust toe ... lean two straight boards (I like to use 2' shelf boards) against your tires ... and measure the distance between the front and rear of the boards with a steel tape measure. I'm fortunate to have a very accurate surveying laser from work to make the measurements quickly.
Race cars are noisy ... how fast do you want to be ... stiffer bushings, subframe bolts ...
A lot of us start off with compromises ... and then as we go along ... we just start accepting the trade-offs in the interest of speed.
One way to do it is to set your aggresive AX setting up front ... max camber and caster with say a good 1/8th toe out. Then back off the camber until your toe is zero. Mark that as your street setting. When you get to the track ... jack up your front end ... slam the camber plates to your max. AX setting and race. Afterwards ... just go back to your street setting mark. You will still have a lot of camber ... but it's off-zero toe that eats up tires on the street ... not camber.
In the rear you want at least 1/8th toe out typically. With my inexpensive Whiteline adjustable lateral links ... it's very easy to adjust toe and camber at the track ... just backing up onto ramps. Opinions differ on rear camber ... most use a minimal amount, -1 to -1.3 to facilitate rotation. Others need up to -3 in order to balance their car. It also depends on driving styles/skills. Less neg camber in the rear tends to make the car "suffer" from more snap oversteer. With skill and experience ... you can be very fast with a very loose car. I suspect that with the generous amount of power in a STI, and your mechanical '05 front LSD ... you might benefit from additional rear neg camber ...
To adjust toe ... lean two straight boards (I like to use 2' shelf boards) against your tires ... and measure the distance between the front and rear of the boards with a steel tape measure. I'm fortunate to have a very accurate surveying laser from work to make the measurements quickly.
| goto_racing | 05-16-2005 01:22 PM |
When we got these from DMS, I immediately liked the design. I thought it was a great solution to the "slotted" style we used to run, which got torn to shreds after just few races season. These seem like they will be far more robust.
[url]http://www.dmsnorthamerica.com/cgi-bin/ec.cgi?opt=2&org=1&pid=234&a=dc[/url]
Chris Lock
[url]http://www.dmsnorthamerica.com/cgi-bin/ec.cgi?opt=2&org=1&pid=234&a=dc[/url]
Chris Lock
| omahasubaru | 05-16-2005 02:36 PM |
Noltec Camber/caster plates (make sure you get the race version not the street ones) so you can get more camber & castor. May want to modify them some like I did mine as well so you can get even more castor/camber.
| funsti | 05-16-2005 03:13 PM |
Here are some [url=http://www.renickmotorsports.com/oscommerce/catalog/product_info.php/cPath/132_138_183/products_id/578]MRT camber/castor plates[/url]. Are these just re-branded Noltecs?
Are there three versions of these (road, sport, race) or are the 'sport' models the ones you meant by saying 'race'?
Do the race (sport?) versions provide for more camber and castor or is it just that they have really hard bushings?
How are you modifying these plates to allow for extra range of movement? Is it difficult to do?
Are there three versions of these (road, sport, race) or are the 'sport' models the ones you meant by saying 'race'?
Do the race (sport?) versions provide for more camber and castor or is it just that they have really hard bushings?
How are you modifying these plates to allow for extra range of movement? Is it difficult to do?
| DougM | 05-16-2005 03:16 PM |
[QUOTE=omahasubaru]Noltec Camber/caster plates (make sure you get the race version not the street ones) so you can get more camber & castor.[/QUOTE]
i thought the only difference between the race and street plates is the rubber bushing to help with noise.
??
i thought the only difference between the race and street plates is the rubber bushing to help with noise.
??
| omahasubaru | 05-16-2005 03:58 PM |
[QUOTE=DougM]i thought the only difference between the race and street plates is the rubber bushing to help with noise.
??[/QUOTE]Nope.
The difference is that the bushing top area is smaller in diameter on the race version verses the street versions and thus you get more adjustment.
[QUOTE=funsti]How are you modifying these plates to allow for extra range of movement? Is it difficult to do?[/QUOTE]I'll take some pics of mine tonight if I have time and post them to compare with the link above which shows the street versions.
Modification is easy if you have the right tools. It's also very straight forward.
Thanks - Jon
??[/QUOTE]Nope.
The difference is that the bushing top area is smaller in diameter on the race version verses the street versions and thus you get more adjustment.
[QUOTE=funsti]How are you modifying these plates to allow for extra range of movement? Is it difficult to do?[/QUOTE]I'll take some pics of mine tonight if I have time and post them to compare with the link above which shows the street versions.
Modification is easy if you have the right tools. It's also very straight forward.
Thanks - Jon
| funsti | 05-16-2005 04:02 PM |
Looks like I answered my own questions:
[url]http://www.noltecsuspension.com/product/adjustable_strut_mount.php[/url]
The MRT's look -exactly- like Noltecs so I'd say it's 99.99999999% likely that they are in fact Noltecs.
The 'clubsport' versions do not have poly-urethane bushings at all.. the pillow ball bearings are in solid steel housings instead (Hell-ooooo noise-vibration-harshness, and no doubt MUCH improved steering feel).
The sport versions are also offset so you get 10mm more range in the negative camber direction (and I assume 10mm LESS in the positive camber direction.. I know, who cares).
I think I'm going to have to get the clubsport Noltecs since they offer both camber and castor adjustment and do not have an overhanging adjustment notch plate like the PDEs because I have Whiteline G4 coilovers which have damper adjustment knobs poking out the tops of the struts.
[url]http://www.noltecsuspension.com/product/adjustable_strut_mount.php[/url]
The MRT's look -exactly- like Noltecs so I'd say it's 99.99999999% likely that they are in fact Noltecs.
The 'clubsport' versions do not have poly-urethane bushings at all.. the pillow ball bearings are in solid steel housings instead (Hell-ooooo noise-vibration-harshness, and no doubt MUCH improved steering feel).
The sport versions are also offset so you get 10mm more range in the negative camber direction (and I assume 10mm LESS in the positive camber direction.. I know, who cares).
I think I'm going to have to get the clubsport Noltecs since they offer both camber and castor adjustment and do not have an overhanging adjustment notch plate like the PDEs because I have Whiteline G4 coilovers which have damper adjustment knobs poking out the tops of the struts.
| DougM | 05-16-2005 04:08 PM |
[QUOTE=funsti]The clubsport versions are also offset so you get 10mm more range in the negative camber direction[/QUOTE]
thanks for the link and clarifying that. very good to know. (thanks also Jon).
d
thanks for the link and clarifying that. very good to know. (thanks also Jon).
d
| makofoto | 05-16-2005 04:22 PM |
Here is a message thread on how I modified my Noltecs:
[url]http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=667681[/url]
[url]http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=667681[/url]
| omahasubaru | 05-16-2005 09:14 PM |
[quote]Hell-ooooo noise-vibration-harshness[/quote]
Nope.. Ride no worse than tein pillow balls and no increased vibration or harness except from my stiffer spring rates
Nope.. Ride no worse than tein pillow balls and no increased vibration or harness except from my stiffer spring rates
| Got Pink? | 05-17-2005 10:26 AM |
Ok so lots of people like the noltecs. I guess they would work but does anyone know what the ranges of adjustment are on the gc and pde plates?
I might get the noltecs if you really just need max neg camber and pos caster but I was also planning on doing the whiteline offset caster bushings and the struts will be slotted for camber adjustability so I was really hoping to get plates that have repeatable adjustments to fine tune the setup rather than run it maxed out all the time.
Mako your idea of running zero toe on the street and 1/8'' toe out with more camber for autox sounds very appealing to me. Thanks for advice everyone and keep the opinions coming.
Nate
I might get the noltecs if you really just need max neg camber and pos caster but I was also planning on doing the whiteline offset caster bushings and the struts will be slotted for camber adjustability so I was really hoping to get plates that have repeatable adjustments to fine tune the setup rather than run it maxed out all the time.
Mako your idea of running zero toe on the street and 1/8'' toe out with more camber for autox sounds very appealing to me. Thanks for advice everyone and keep the opinions coming.
Nate
| Corey | 05-17-2005 10:45 AM |
Nate,
Told you this before, but I'll say it again... don't get your struts slotted. Or if that's how they come, see if you can get un-slotted ones if at all possible.
Corey #89 STS
Told you this before, but I'll say it again... don't get your struts slotted. Or if that's how they come, see if you can get un-slotted ones if at all possible.
Corey #89 STS
| Rodan | 05-17-2005 10:57 AM |
I like to say that having adjustable suspension is not going to make you competitive. At the hobbyist level I think that education and skill is the biggest factor. Sure equipment helps a bit but doesn't matter as much as it does for a Schummi level driver.
It's kinda like the novice golfer who thinks a set of custom made clubs is going to improve his game.
This is not necessarily to "Got Pink?" I am talking in general.
It's kinda like the novice golfer who thinks a set of custom made clubs is going to improve his game.
This is not necessarily to "Got Pink?" I am talking in general.
| Got Pink? | 05-17-2005 11:14 AM |
I know Corey but unfortunately KW shows slotted struts on their site and since they are production part I doubt I can order a set without the slots. If I went with zzyzx motorsports setup I agree that it would be the way to go though.
Rodan: I have run the car on the stock suspension since I bought it in august and have a co driver that is a great driver and we were getting beat with ease by Schreff last weekend with his STi with Cusco Zero2Rs and recent corner weighting and alignment. It was one of the first times we have raced each other in the dry with his nice setup. So I am not a novice and also have a great co driver helping to fine tune the car and compare notes with. Also this thread is about camber plates not about What coilovers are tEh BeST for everything bs. But thank you for pointing out what I already know.
So no comments about the newly redesigned GC plates?
Rodan: I have run the car on the stock suspension since I bought it in august and have a co driver that is a great driver and we were getting beat with ease by Schreff last weekend with his STi with Cusco Zero2Rs and recent corner weighting and alignment. It was one of the first times we have raced each other in the dry with his nice setup. So I am not a novice and also have a great co driver helping to fine tune the car and compare notes with. Also this thread is about camber plates not about What coilovers are tEh BeST for everything bs. But thank you for pointing out what I already know.
So no comments about the newly redesigned GC plates?
| Scoobie Doogie | 05-17-2005 11:50 AM |
Nate-
Who is your co-driver this year?
I'm going to be looking for a Subie to drive in the Subaru Challenge this year. You guys know if anyone who's car is set up really well? Corey, do you have a co-driver for the event in September?
Dave
Who is your co-driver this year?
I'm going to be looking for a Subie to drive in the Subaru Challenge this year. You guys know if anyone who's car is set up really well? Corey, do you have a co-driver for the event in September?
Dave
| omahasubaru | 05-17-2005 12:56 PM |
[QUOTE=Got Pink?]I went with zzyzx motorsports setup I agree that it would be the way to go though. [/QUOTE]
That is what I'm running with Noltec plates. Very nice suspension setup and the redesigned ones due out later in 2005 are even better. Well worth every penny on many aspects.
zzyzx will even order up and prepare & install your choice of plates when you order if you prefer. Which is nice for those who don't want to mess with it themselves or want someone to professionally modify their plate for added camber/castor (like mine - pics hopefully wed.).
That is what I'm running with Noltec plates. Very nice suspension setup and the redesigned ones due out later in 2005 are even better. Well worth every penny on many aspects.
zzyzx will even order up and prepare & install your choice of plates when you order if you prefer. Which is nice for those who don't want to mess with it themselves or want someone to professionally modify their plate for added camber/castor (like mine - pics hopefully wed.).
| Got Pink? | 05-17-2005 02:10 PM |
Dave,
Jon Rush is co-driving my car this year. I thought you bought a 04 WRX wagon to run STX? Also my car is not even setup yet but once it is you can go for a run or two in it if you want to see what its like.
Omahasubaru,
I definently think zzyzx has a nice design but I don't know if I can wait that long to get coilovers since I want to have them before the Devens National Tour for sure. Hopefully they will be available sooner than KW V3 for the 05 STi. At this point whatever of those two is available first I will buy.
Jon Rush is co-driving my car this year. I thought you bought a 04 WRX wagon to run STX? Also my car is not even setup yet but once it is you can go for a run or two in it if you want to see what its like.
Omahasubaru,
I definently think zzyzx has a nice design but I don't know if I can wait that long to get coilovers since I want to have them before the Devens National Tour for sure. Hopefully they will be available sooner than KW V3 for the 05 STi. At this point whatever of those two is available first I will buy.
| omahasubaru | 05-17-2005 02:14 PM |
The first two sets of the redesigned zzyzx are due out next month or so I've heard. My friend with an SM WRX is picking up one of them as he's been waiting for a while. I'm excited for him, should be even better than mine.
Good things come to those who wait. Nationals 2006 isn't that far from 2005 and it will end up on asphalt anyway. :D
Good things come to those who wait. Nationals 2006 isn't that far from 2005 and it will end up on asphalt anyway. :D
| outback2.5HO | 05-17-2005 02:26 PM |
The PDE camber plates are top notch in every aspect. One of the best machined camber and most adjustable plates out there. Also there customer service is excellent.
| fliz | 05-17-2005 02:52 PM |
[QUOTE=Got Pink?]
So no comments about the newly redesigned GC plates?[/QUOTE]
Do you have a link to these?
EDIT: NM...found it.
Looks interesting. I wonder how much they drop the front?
[img]http://www.ground-control-store.com/images/datapage/CCPWRXtop_dp.jpg[/img]
So no comments about the newly redesigned GC plates?[/QUOTE]
Do you have a link to these?
EDIT: NM...found it.
Looks interesting. I wonder how much they drop the front?
[img]http://www.ground-control-store.com/images/datapage/CCPWRXtop_dp.jpg[/img]
| Scoobie Doogie | 05-17-2005 06:54 PM |
[QUOTE=Got Pink?]Dave,
Jon Rush is co-driving my car this year. I thought you bought a 04 WRX wagon to run STX? Also my car is not even setup yet but once it is you can go for a run or two in it if you want to see what its like.
Interesting choice in co-drivers. Dangerous, but interesting. :D I was playing with the 04 wagon a bit but am running the ITR for the season. I have a shot at winning the NE Div and the NE tour in the ITR. I took 1st in PAX at Hershey and I've been averaging 1 second faster than last years competition. :devil: The WRX is my daily driver and I have been adding some mods here and there for fun. I bought a Stone Racing header and up-pipe and sent it to Swain Tech and got it coated. I am having a mid pipe made and will pick up a Helix catted DP and bolt on a dump pipe to exit behind the passenger door. I also have STi wagon springs for now. I think I'm going to see how the 06 or 07 WRX is equipped and maybe pick one of those up if the get the 2.5T. It would REALLY make up for a lot that was lacking in the 2.0 WRX. Well see!
Dave
Jon Rush is co-driving my car this year. I thought you bought a 04 WRX wagon to run STX? Also my car is not even setup yet but once it is you can go for a run or two in it if you want to see what its like.
Interesting choice in co-drivers. Dangerous, but interesting. :D I was playing with the 04 wagon a bit but am running the ITR for the season. I have a shot at winning the NE Div and the NE tour in the ITR. I took 1st in PAX at Hershey and I've been averaging 1 second faster than last years competition. :devil: The WRX is my daily driver and I have been adding some mods here and there for fun. I bought a Stone Racing header and up-pipe and sent it to Swain Tech and got it coated. I am having a mid pipe made and will pick up a Helix catted DP and bolt on a dump pipe to exit behind the passenger door. I also have STi wagon springs for now. I think I'm going to see how the 06 or 07 WRX is equipped and maybe pick one of those up if the get the 2.5T. It would REALLY make up for a lot that was lacking in the 2.0 WRX. Well see!
Dave
| makofoto | 05-17-2005 10:50 PM |
The GC looks adjustment impaired ?
| funsti | 05-17-2005 11:08 PM |
[QUOTE=Scoobie Doogie]I think I'm going to see how the 06 or 07 WRX is equipped and maybe pick one of those up if the get the 2.5T. It would REALLY make up for a lot that was lacking in the 2.0 WRX. Well see![/QUOTE]
I bet the STX drivers will be glad the new 2.5 WRX won't be allowed in their class due to the 2.0l limit on displacement for forced induction engines :P.
I bet the STX drivers will be glad the new 2.5 WRX won't be allowed in their class due to the 2.0l limit on displacement for forced induction engines :P.
| makofoto | 05-18-2005 12:31 AM |
New ? mild Cusco Camber/Caster plate:
[url]http://store.yahoo.com/subarustore/cufrcapl.html[/url]
[url]http://store.yahoo.com/subarustore/cufrcapl.html[/url]
| Scoobie Doogie | 05-18-2005 07:49 AM |
[QUOTE=funsti]I bet the STX drivers will be glad the new 2.5 WRX won't be allowed in their class due to the 2.0l limit on displacement for forced induction engines :P.[/QUOTE]
I bet that will get changed since Subie is such a supporter and money contributing sponsor to the SCCA. The Evo and STi will remain on the excluded list though. I think we'll see the SRT4 get added to STX as well. Nothing official just pure speculation :devil:
Dave
I bet that will get changed since Subie is such a supporter and money contributing sponsor to the SCCA. The Evo and STi will remain on the excluded list though. I think we'll see the SRT4 get added to STX as well. Nothing official just pure speculation :devil:
Dave
| funsti | 05-18-2005 09:31 AM |
[QUOTE=makofoto]New ? mild Cusco Camber/Caster plate:
[url]http://store.yahoo.com/subarustore/cufrcapl.html[/url][/QUOTE]
Huh.. never seen those before either. It doesn't really look like they have adjustment in both planes though.
[url]http://store.yahoo.com/subarustore/cufrcapl.html[/url][/QUOTE]
Huh.. never seen those before either. It doesn't really look like they have adjustment in both planes though.
| D_REX | 05-18-2005 09:34 AM |
[QUOTE=funsti]Huh.. never seen those before either. It doesn't really look like they have adjustment in both planes though.[/QUOTE]
Neither does the PDE ;)
Neither does the PDE ;)
| jcroy66 | 05-18-2005 09:45 AM |
[QUOTE=Scoobie Doogie]I bet that will get changed since Subie is such a supporter and money contributing sponsor to the SCCA. The Evo and STi will remain on the excluded list though. I think we'll see the SRT4 get added to STX as well. Nothing official just pure speculation :devil: [/QUOTE]I disagree. First, I really don't think that classing decisions are made based on "money trails". Remember, the people on the STAC (and other advisory committee boards) are all volunteers. Why would they care how much (or how little) money a manufacturer provides?
Second, the goal of the STAC is rules STABILITY. What makes you think they're suddenly going to throw that in the air and f*** up the class by allowing in a better version of what is already considered "the car to have for the class"?!?
Second, the goal of the STAC is rules STABILITY. What makes you think they're suddenly going to throw that in the air and f*** up the class by allowing in a better version of what is already considered "the car to have for the class"?!?
| bigjon | 05-18-2005 10:09 AM |
[QUOTE=Scoobie Doogie]Interesting choice in co-drivers. Dangerous, but interesting. :D [/QUOTE]Hey!
BigJon
BigJon
| makofoto | 05-18-2005 10:17 AM |
You don't need adjustment in both planes ... you always want more Caster on the track ... these allow you to change your camber for track or street ... while "automatically" getting more caster as you get more aggressive with the camber.
But they don't allow much adjustment ... perhaps one could lengthen the slot towards that back and inside.
But they don't allow much adjustment ... perhaps one could lengthen the slot towards that back and inside.
| funsti | 05-18-2005 11:19 AM |
Aha.. I was just thrown off by the different appearance compared to the Noltecs. I remember reading about how the PDEs you put it together differently so that it alters camber and caster at the same time.
| fliz | 05-18-2005 11:38 AM |
[QUOTE=Corey]Nate,
Told you this before, but I'll say it again... don't get your struts slotted. Or if that's how they come, see if you can get un-slotted ones if at all possible.
Corey #89 STS[/QUOTE]
Are there rules issues to consider when getting slotted struts? I mean, are slotted struts legal for ST? SP? SM?
The Cusco plates look very nice.
How much max caster/camber do they allow?
Told you this before, but I'll say it again... don't get your struts slotted. Or if that's how they come, see if you can get un-slotted ones if at all possible.
Corey #89 STS[/QUOTE]
Are there rules issues to consider when getting slotted struts? I mean, are slotted struts legal for ST? SP? SM?
The Cusco plates look very nice.
How much max caster/camber do they allow?
| D_REX | 05-18-2005 12:26 PM |
Any of the camber only plates can be mounted so that they adjust caster with camber. I consider the PDE a camber only plate although they do offer alternate mounting positions that should allow for greater caster gain at a given camber setting versus a cusco.
My statements about the PDE plates are based on pictures from the web, I have never fondled them. They are certainly the easiest plate to get repeatable adjustments, if that's not one of your priorities then my personal suggestion is to explore other options first.
My statements about the PDE plates are based on pictures from the web, I have never fondled them. They are certainly the easiest plate to get repeatable adjustments, if that's not one of your priorities then my personal suggestion is to explore other options first.
| Dussander | 05-18-2005 05:34 PM |
Just FYI, I have some Noltec/MRT castor/camber (sport) plates I can unload (collecting dust in the garage...somewhere). PM me if you are interested.
Ack, these are the solid plates with NO poly bushing.
Ack, these are the solid plates with NO poly bushing.
| ChrisW | 05-18-2005 07:34 PM |
[QUOTE=funsti]Here are some [url="http://www.renickmotorsports.com/oscommerce/catalog/product_info.php/cPath/132_138_183/products_id/578"]MRT camber/castor plates[/url]. Are these just re-branded Noltecs?
Are there three versions of these (road, sport, race) or are the 'sport' models the ones you meant by saying 'race'?
Do the race (sport?) versions provide for more camber and castor or is it just that they have really hard bushings?
How are you modifying these plates to allow for extra range of movement? Is it difficult to do?[/QUOTE]
yes, MRT = noltec.
The race version does not use a bushing, where the sport model has a poly bushing holding the spherical bearing. with the sport plates your limited on how high you can go in the spring rates (350lbs I think) while the race plates can go much higher.
I would recommend the Noltec. Please don't buy from MRT :furious: <- from my own past experiance dealing with them.
Are there three versions of these (road, sport, race) or are the 'sport' models the ones you meant by saying 'race'?
Do the race (sport?) versions provide for more camber and castor or is it just that they have really hard bushings?
How are you modifying these plates to allow for extra range of movement? Is it difficult to do?[/QUOTE]
yes, MRT = noltec.
The race version does not use a bushing, where the sport model has a poly bushing holding the spherical bearing. with the sport plates your limited on how high you can go in the spring rates (350lbs I think) while the race plates can go much higher.
I would recommend the Noltec. Please don't buy from MRT :furious: <- from my own past experiance dealing with them.
| Scoobie Doogie | 05-18-2005 09:00 PM |
[QUOTE=jcroy66]I disagree. First, I really don't think that classing decisions are made based on "money trails". Remember, the people on the STAC (and other advisory committee boards) are all volunteers. Why would they care how much (or how little) money a manufacturer provides?
Second, the goal of the STAC is rules STABILITY. What makes you think they're suddenly going to throw that in the air and f*** up the class by allowing in a better version of what is already considered "the car to have for the class"?!?[/QUOTE]
I said it was just pure speculation, don't get so defensive man. :huh: I guess I wanted to stir the pot and stir the pot I did. :devil: :devil: :devil:
Dave
Second, the goal of the STAC is rules STABILITY. What makes you think they're suddenly going to throw that in the air and f*** up the class by allowing in a better version of what is already considered "the car to have for the class"?!?[/QUOTE]
I said it was just pure speculation, don't get so defensive man. :huh: I guess I wanted to stir the pot and stir the pot I did. :devil: :devil: :devil:
Dave
| Corey | 05-18-2005 09:40 PM |
[QUOTE=fliz]Are there rules issues to consider when getting slotted struts? I mean, are slotted struts legal for ST? SP? SM?
The Cusco plates look very nice.
How much max caster/camber do they allow?[/QUOTE]
No rules issues that I know of in the classes you mentioned... I just don't like that method of adjustment.
Corey #89 STS
The Cusco plates look very nice.
How much max caster/camber do they allow?[/QUOTE]
No rules issues that I know of in the classes you mentioned... I just don't like that method of adjustment.
Corey #89 STS
| abaxter34 | 05-18-2005 10:17 PM |
pde alighnment numbers- [url]http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=658406[/url]
i like my pde's but if had known that i would end up setting them and leaving them like i have, i wouldve gotten the noltecs. theyre cheaper and provide more caster. however, the pde's ar built like a brick ****house. its no wonder theyre so expensive when you see them in person. plus, mine havent made a peep in 1 year/18-20k worth of driving.
i like my pde's but if had known that i would end up setting them and leaving them like i have, i wouldve gotten the noltecs. theyre cheaper and provide more caster. however, the pde's ar built like a brick ****house. its no wonder theyre so expensive when you see them in person. plus, mine havent made a peep in 1 year/18-20k worth of driving.
| jcroy66 | 05-19-2005 08:06 AM |
[QUOTE=Scoobie Doogie]I said it was just pure speculation, don't get so defensive man. :huh: I guess I wanted to stir the pot and stir the pot I did. :devil: :devil: :devil: [/QUOTE]Not defensive. I was just pointing out that you were using flawed logic. :p And that I would be very surprised if the STAC made an exception for the 2.5L WRX (or upped the displacement limit) for the class.
I'm also thinking maybe I need a different screenname. Then again, this screenname leads to a source of amusement for KC, Biggly, Tom, and others who know me when other posters make assumptions about me. :)
I'm also thinking maybe I need a different screenname. Then again, this screenname leads to a source of amusement for KC, Biggly, Tom, and others who know me when other posters make assumptions about me. :)
| DrBiggly | 05-19-2005 10:43 AM |
I'm amused. :D
-Biggly
-Biggly
| Corey | 05-19-2005 10:47 AM |
Ditto.
Corey #89 STS
Corey #89 STS
| Scoobie Doogie | 05-19-2005 03:05 PM |
[QUOTE=jcroy66]Not defensive. I was just pointing out that you were using flawed logic. :p And that I would be very surprised if the STAC made an exception for the 2.5L WRX (or upped the displacement limit) for the class.
I'm also thinking maybe I need a different screenname. Then again, this screenname leads to a source of amusement for KC, Biggly, Tom, and others who know me when other posters make assumptions about me. :)[/QUOTE]
There was no logic involved. :D I just thought it would be interesting since it would now allow teh fAsTaR SRt4 in the class as well. :devil:
Dave
I'm also thinking maybe I need a different screenname. Then again, this screenname leads to a source of amusement for KC, Biggly, Tom, and others who know me when other posters make assumptions about me. :)[/QUOTE]
There was no logic involved. :D I just thought it would be interesting since it would now allow teh fAsTaR SRt4 in the class as well. :devil:
Dave
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