| BlazingEngine | 12-25-2004 02:58 AM |
cornering,no slide
�
�
can any1 recommend the best way to stay in a tight corner without sliding out with an assload of G's going thru u.
i go at a good speed into a rough corner,but try to get the most boost out of it,i end up sliding, or going wide
i go at a good speed into a rough corner,but try to get the most boost out of it,i end up sliding, or going wide
| GarySheehan | 12-25-2004 12:47 PM |
Slow down. :huh:
Gary
Sheehan Motor Racing
[url]www.teamSMR.com[/url]
Gary
Sheehan Motor Racing
[url]www.teamSMR.com[/url]
| jawbrkr | 12-25-2004 12:54 PM |
if you can, you want to take the corner wide and hit the apex going as straight as possible. going wide slows down your entrance speed, but its exit speed you're worrying about. I take any corner as wide as possible, hit the apex, and floor it.
in the precaution that youre coming into hot, or the corner is too tight and you start to plow (understeer), tap on your brakes and then put pressure on the gas, tapping the brakes will help rotate the rear end of the car.
again if you are rotating too much, (oversteering) counter and partial throttle on the gas. if you let off the gas, your car will snap into the direction its facing which is not good, while putting partial throttle will help you counter.
again, you dont need to lay down on the gas to go fast, partial throttle through a turn is good. I noticed myself in autocross courses, when I take it smooth and maintain a constant speed, i run better times than when i try to enter and exit too hard.
I hope this helps, and drive responsibly.
in the precaution that youre coming into hot, or the corner is too tight and you start to plow (understeer), tap on your brakes and then put pressure on the gas, tapping the brakes will help rotate the rear end of the car.
again if you are rotating too much, (oversteering) counter and partial throttle on the gas. if you let off the gas, your car will snap into the direction its facing which is not good, while putting partial throttle will help you counter.
again, you dont need to lay down on the gas to go fast, partial throttle through a turn is good. I noticed myself in autocross courses, when I take it smooth and maintain a constant speed, i run better times than when i try to enter and exit too hard.
I hope this helps, and drive responsibly.
| BlazingEngine | 12-25-2004 01:54 PM |
[QUOTE=jawbrkr]if you can, you want to take the corner wide and hit the apex going as straight as possible. going wide slows down your entrance speed, but its exit speed you're worrying about. I take any corner as wide as possible, hit the apex, and floor it.
in the precaution that youre coming into hot, or the corner is too tight and you start to plow (understeer), tap on your brakes and then put pressure on the gas, tapping the brakes will help rotate the rear end of the car.
again if you are rotating too much, (oversteering) counter and partial throttle on the gas. if you let off the gas, your car will snap into the direction its facing which is not good, while putting partial throttle will help you counter.
again, you dont need to lay down on the gas to go fast, partial throttle through a turn is good. I noticed myself in autocross courses, when I take it smooth and maintain a constant speed, i run better times than when i try to enter and exit too hard.
I hope this helps, and drive responsibly.[/QUOTE]
Thanx, yea its a big help, knowing my rola can do it is also something nice,lol.
well, i dont have any autoX courses near me, so imma try on a street,lol,without going nuts.
thanx lots
in the precaution that youre coming into hot, or the corner is too tight and you start to plow (understeer), tap on your brakes and then put pressure on the gas, tapping the brakes will help rotate the rear end of the car.
again if you are rotating too much, (oversteering) counter and partial throttle on the gas. if you let off the gas, your car will snap into the direction its facing which is not good, while putting partial throttle will help you counter.
again, you dont need to lay down on the gas to go fast, partial throttle through a turn is good. I noticed myself in autocross courses, when I take it smooth and maintain a constant speed, i run better times than when i try to enter and exit too hard.
I hope this helps, and drive responsibly.[/QUOTE]
Thanx, yea its a big help, knowing my rola can do it is also something nice,lol.
well, i dont have any autoX courses near me, so imma try on a street,lol,without going nuts.
thanx lots
| psyber_0ptix | 12-25-2004 04:46 PM |
[QUOTE=jawbrkr]
in the precaution that youre coming into hot, or the corner is too tight and you start to plow (understeer), tap on your brakes and then put pressure on the gas, tapping the brakes will help rotate the rear end of the car. [/QUOTE]
depending on how fast you are going and what kind of corner, you can just let off the gas. but stay in gear, this deceleration will throw weight forward also making it easier to rotate.
nice fluid driving, no herky jerky :P
another good point of taking corners wide is that you are less likely to understeer as oppsed to making quick steering inputs that your tires wont like. therfor potentially reducing your wide exits
also i'm almost certain there are autocrosses in your area.
hit up the scca website and look for yoru region
in the precaution that youre coming into hot, or the corner is too tight and you start to plow (understeer), tap on your brakes and then put pressure on the gas, tapping the brakes will help rotate the rear end of the car. [/QUOTE]
depending on how fast you are going and what kind of corner, you can just let off the gas. but stay in gear, this deceleration will throw weight forward also making it easier to rotate.
nice fluid driving, no herky jerky :P
another good point of taking corners wide is that you are less likely to understeer as oppsed to making quick steering inputs that your tires wont like. therfor potentially reducing your wide exits
also i'm almost certain there are autocrosses in your area.
hit up the scca website and look for yoru region
| ProRallyEric | 12-25-2004 06:30 PM |
spend a bunch of $$$ on your car.
| gjhsu | 12-25-2004 08:56 PM |
slow in fast out
| cooleyjb | 12-25-2004 09:38 PM |
[QUOTE=gjhsu]slow in fast out[/QUOTE]
^ gets beat by fast in fast out. :D
^ gets beat by fast in fast out. :D
| skuttledude | 12-26-2004 10:17 AM |
[QUOTE=gjhsu]slow in fast out[/QUOTE]
Yep what he said.
Very simple statement yet extremely revelent. It took me all year to AutoX the Sti where I could find that balance of slow in fast out. You won't be able to find this balance overnight (unless you are Gary S. or Pat R. :cool: ), so lots of practice helps.
I was able to beat many M3's at Mid-Ohio since using this slow-in-fast-out theory.
Yep what he said.
Very simple statement yet extremely revelent. It took me all year to AutoX the Sti where I could find that balance of slow in fast out. You won't be able to find this balance overnight (unless you are Gary S. or Pat R. :cool: ), so lots of practice helps.
I was able to beat many M3's at Mid-Ohio since using this slow-in-fast-out theory.
| cooleyjb | 12-26-2004 10:32 AM |
[QUOTE=gjhsu]slow in fast out[/QUOTE]
'slow' is relative term here. When people make this statement they are essentially saying get the car slowed down to the speed at which you are going to take the corner before you really start turning. It will [I]seem[/I] slow but you will be gaining time on accelerating out of the corner because the car is under control. When you go into a corner too fast you spend all of your turn sliding and slowing down more while getting the car under control. If you do that all in a strait line before the turn you should be quicker.
'slow' is relative term here. When people make this statement they are essentially saying get the car slowed down to the speed at which you are going to take the corner before you really start turning. It will [I]seem[/I] slow but you will be gaining time on accelerating out of the corner because the car is under control. When you go into a corner too fast you spend all of your turn sliding and slowing down more while getting the car under control. If you do that all in a strait line before the turn you should be quicker.
| Section 8 | 12-26-2004 12:02 PM |
[QUOTE]so imma try on a street,lol,without going nuts.[/QUOTE]
edited link out
edited link out
| cooleyjb | 12-26-2004 01:46 PM |
[QUOTE=Section 8]Link Removed[/QUOTE]
^^^ Virus warning :eek:
nothing against Section 8 My virus window popped up when I opened it though
^^^ Virus warning :eek:
nothing against Section 8 My virus window popped up when I opened it though
| import111 | 12-26-2004 01:50 PM |
[QUOTE=BlazingEngine]can any1 recommend the best way to stay in a tight corner without sliding out with an assload of G's going thru u.
i go at a good speed into a rough corner,but try to get the most boost out of it,i end up sliding, or going wide[/QUOTE]
Lots of practice. Find a twisty road that is smooth and safe and not busy and practice. U will learn the limits of your car better and learn how and when to turn in and exit the turns better.
Ryan
i go at a good speed into a rough corner,but try to get the most boost out of it,i end up sliding, or going wide[/QUOTE]
Lots of practice. Find a twisty road that is smooth and safe and not busy and practice. U will learn the limits of your car better and learn how and when to turn in and exit the turns better.
Ryan
| Fogrider | 12-26-2004 06:37 PM |
Go to a performance driving school, either sealed surface or loose surface or BOTH. Have a professional instructor work with you in your car where you don't have to worry about breaking the law on the streets/roads. I predict you will learn more in less time, also not develope bad habits if instruction is good.
Good luck,
Rik
Good luck,
Rik
| Storm | 12-26-2004 06:49 PM |
I smell a RIP thread looming soon.....
Jay Storm
Jay Storm
| solo-x | 12-26-2004 10:15 PM |
hello, darwin? yeah, found you another one...
you should never intentionally be near the limits of what your car can do while driving on open, public roads. the track is where you should be doing this. please stop before you kill someone.
so you say the track is too far away? its REALLY far away when you're spending time in jail for vehicular manslaughter.
nate
you should never intentionally be near the limits of what your car can do while driving on open, public roads. the track is where you should be doing this. please stop before you kill someone.
so you say the track is too far away? its REALLY far away when you're spending time in jail for vehicular manslaughter.
nate
| FLEMON | 12-26-2004 10:15 PM |
Section 8. Dude that link fuked up my computer!
| turbokonejo | 12-26-2004 10:33 PM |
That ***** was :eek: :eek: :eek: I am a idiot for clicking on that link. :furious: I didnt get down enough on the page to see it was a virus.
I got O :o owned
I got O :o owned
| NskGenakuDuckie | 12-27-2004 01:53 AM |
I think since you drive a corolla you're not going to get enough grip no matter what you do if you try to attempt to corner at high speeds. The front will slide outward (understeer). However there is a way to correct that, you would need to do very aggressive weight transfer to the front by braking hard in a straightline while approaching a corner; shifting as much weight to the front as you can, and at this point the rear will be light, and as you smoothly yet quickly steer into the corner you gently/gradually/kinda quickly let off the brake. If you do this correctly your car will sort of do a turning dive and you will feel the front of the car being shoved forward throughout the whole turn. I would not recommend that you do this, especially not on the street. I was dumb when I was 16 and did that with my dad's car along with the scandenavian flick, I just got lucky I didn't crash into anything or anyone. My advice for you is, if you don't have a track to drive on, just drive normally like the way you should with a corolla, thank you and drive safe.
| BlazingEngine | 12-27-2004 03:24 AM |
yea,drive safe is what iv always done.
Im gonna find a perfomance drivign school,cuz im really interested in it.
thx anyhow
Im gonna find a perfomance drivign school,cuz im really interested in it.
thx anyhow
| gjhsu | 12-27-2004 09:53 AM |
ooooh, here's another one: brake in a straight line.
That'll also help from sliding.
That'll also help from sliding.
| javid | 12-27-2004 03:05 PM |
Actually I was going to suggest trail breaking. It will take some OFF ROAD practice, but will pay off.
Considering your drivetrain, you may not want to use a late apex. Certainly not as late as when in a 200+ hp AWD.
"spend a bunch of $$$ on your car."
or
"Slow down. :huh: "
aint bad advice
Considering your drivetrain, you may not want to use a late apex. Certainly not as late as when in a 200+ hp AWD.
"spend a bunch of $$$ on your car."
or
"Slow down. :huh: "
aint bad advice
| BlazingEngine | 12-27-2004 05:52 PM |
lol, all good advice,i have a feeling i wont b able 2 do much with my rola, unless i upgrade everything,which i dun have money for.
Am i right?
Am i right?
| akuhner | 12-28-2004 09:57 AM |
[QUOTE=BlazingEngine]LOL, all good advice! I have a feeling I won't be able to do much with my car, unless I upgrade everything, which I don't have money for.
Am I right?[/QUOTE]
^
Fixed! ;)
Any car can be driven 10/10ths, it's just that the edge of that car's handling is lower than others. It's better to learn in a low performance car, then step up to a faster car when you have developed your skills. A lot of the good rally drivers started in underpowered 2WD machines and learned to manage momentum properly before stepping up to faster cars. The guys who start ralling in turbo AWD rockets tend to get less performance out of the car, and they are considered to be more dangerous (so the rules are being revised to force beginners to start in 2WD under powered cars).
Where do you live that there are no Auto-xs? If you really care about improving be ready to drive for a few hours to get to one, and if you aren't willing to do that forget about performance driving. Does "cali, russianville,SF" mean you live in San Fran? I know there are events around there because a friend of mine moved out to go to Berkley and started auto-xing his 240SX again.
Alex
PS - Is there anyway you can try and use proper English when posting here? You'll get more respect and better advice that way. What you have been saying seems reasonable, but the way you say it paints an unflattering picture...
Am I right?[/QUOTE]
^
Fixed! ;)
Any car can be driven 10/10ths, it's just that the edge of that car's handling is lower than others. It's better to learn in a low performance car, then step up to a faster car when you have developed your skills. A lot of the good rally drivers started in underpowered 2WD machines and learned to manage momentum properly before stepping up to faster cars. The guys who start ralling in turbo AWD rockets tend to get less performance out of the car, and they are considered to be more dangerous (so the rules are being revised to force beginners to start in 2WD under powered cars).
Where do you live that there are no Auto-xs? If you really care about improving be ready to drive for a few hours to get to one, and if you aren't willing to do that forget about performance driving. Does "cali, russianville,SF" mean you live in San Fran? I know there are events around there because a friend of mine moved out to go to Berkley and started auto-xing his 240SX again.
Alex
PS - Is there anyway you can try and use proper English when posting here? You'll get more respect and better advice that way. What you have been saying seems reasonable, but the way you say it paints an unflattering picture...
| ITWRX4ME | 12-28-2004 12:53 PM |
[QUOTE=Car #187]PS - Is there anyway you can try and use proper English when posting here? You'll get more respect and better advice that way. What you have been saying seems reasonable, but the way you say it paints an unflattering picture...[/QUOTE]
I admire your restraint and diplomacy.
I admire your restraint and diplomacy.
| PKer | 12-28-2004 06:27 PM |
This can't be real. I think it's something for teh OT. :devil:
| wrxited | 12-28-2004 06:34 PM |
[QUOTE=turbokonejo]That ***** was :eek: :eek: :eek: I am a idiot for clicking on that link. :furious: I didnt get down enough on the page to see it was a virus.
I got O :o owned[/QUOTE]
:lol: :lol: :lol: sorry but it is funny.
I got O :o owned[/QUOTE]
:lol: :lol: :lol: sorry but it is funny.
| BlazingEngine | 12-29-2004 03:18 AM |
alright, i will use proper english.
Yes, the russianville stands for san francisco, ill look into the autoX locations,never really new of any before though.
PS:where did you not see proper english,might i ask you???
Yes, the russianville stands for san francisco, ill look into the autoX locations,never really new of any before though.
PS:where did you not see proper english,might i ask you???
| BlazingEngine | 12-29-2004 03:19 AM |
scratch the ps, i saw
| akuhner | 12-29-2004 09:44 AM |
:D
After a quick search, here is the San Fran SCCA site on auto-x:
[url]http://www.sfrscca.org/solo2/[/url]
You might be better off asking in your regional forum, they'll know where all the good stuff is.
I visted San Fran for the first time back in April, and I fell in love with the roads! Particularly the roads to the north of the city on the Marin penninsula, here's the map I pulled for the friend of mine who moved there:
[IMG]http://csl.forcefed4.com/Alex/Stinson%20Beach.jpg[/IMG]
If you haven't already, go try these roads out, they are great even at normal speeds. Rather than trying to attack the corners or worry about speed, concentrate on smoothness and your lines (while staying in your lane of course!). When you get it right you'll see how a late apex works even without the speed. If you are going down hill, try to use the brakes as sparingly as possible (I smelled many overheated SUV brakes at the bottom!), and brake before the corner to be at the right speed and off the brakes when you are actually in the corner. You'll see the cars in front of you get to the corner, realize they want to reduce speed in the corner and brake then, which only upsets the car more. On these roads you can also practice shuffle steering, and get used to having your hands closer to 10 and 2 through the turn.
Alex
After a quick search, here is the San Fran SCCA site on auto-x:
[url]http://www.sfrscca.org/solo2/[/url]
You might be better off asking in your regional forum, they'll know where all the good stuff is.
I visted San Fran for the first time back in April, and I fell in love with the roads! Particularly the roads to the north of the city on the Marin penninsula, here's the map I pulled for the friend of mine who moved there:
[IMG]http://csl.forcefed4.com/Alex/Stinson%20Beach.jpg[/IMG]
If you haven't already, go try these roads out, they are great even at normal speeds. Rather than trying to attack the corners or worry about speed, concentrate on smoothness and your lines (while staying in your lane of course!). When you get it right you'll see how a late apex works even without the speed. If you are going down hill, try to use the brakes as sparingly as possible (I smelled many overheated SUV brakes at the bottom!), and brake before the corner to be at the right speed and off the brakes when you are actually in the corner. You'll see the cars in front of you get to the corner, realize they want to reduce speed in the corner and brake then, which only upsets the car more. On these roads you can also practice shuffle steering, and get used to having your hands closer to 10 and 2 through the turn.
Alex
| BlazingEngine | 12-29-2004 01:46 PM |
thx thx, yea iv been to all these places,just never really concidered them as beeing good practice.
ill look into it for sure,
sposibo(russian for thanks)
ill look into it for sure,
sposibo(russian for thanks)
| datageek | 12-30-2004 11:40 AM |
[QUOTE=BlazingEngine]alright, i will use proper english.
Yes, the russianville stands for san francisco, ill look into the autoX locations,never really new of any before though.
[/QUOTE]
SF area has a lot of autox's. If you're willing to do a little driving, it's possible to have an event just about every weekend.
I'm told that the new season for the SF Region SCCA will probably start on Superbowl Sunday at the Oakland Coliseum. Check the event calendar off of [URL=http://www.sfrscca.org/solo2/]here[/URL] after the new year for dates and places. (Do wait until Jan 1 to check, since the calendar sometimes has trouble showing dates into the next year.)
Yes, the russianville stands for san francisco, ill look into the autoX locations,never really new of any before though.
[/QUOTE]
SF area has a lot of autox's. If you're willing to do a little driving, it's possible to have an event just about every weekend.
I'm told that the new season for the SF Region SCCA will probably start on Superbowl Sunday at the Oakland Coliseum. Check the event calendar off of [URL=http://www.sfrscca.org/solo2/]here[/URL] after the new year for dates and places. (Do wait until Jan 1 to check, since the calendar sometimes has trouble showing dates into the next year.)
| Mushashi | 12-30-2004 12:44 PM |
Good question.
| jmott | 12-30-2004 05:55 PM |
coasting is always bad
you always should be on the gas or on the brakes
[QUOTE=psyber_0ptix]depending on how fast you are going and what kind of corner, you can just let off the gas. but stay in gear, this deceleration will throw weight forward also making it easier to rotate.
nice fluid driving, no herky jerky :P
another good point of taking corners wide is that you are less likely to understeer as oppsed to making quick steering inputs that your tires wont like. therfor potentially reducing your wide exits
also i'm almost certain there are autocrosses in your area.
hit up the scca website and look for yoru region[/QUOTE]
you always should be on the gas or on the brakes
[QUOTE=psyber_0ptix]depending on how fast you are going and what kind of corner, you can just let off the gas. but stay in gear, this deceleration will throw weight forward also making it easier to rotate.
nice fluid driving, no herky jerky :P
another good point of taking corners wide is that you are less likely to understeer as oppsed to making quick steering inputs that your tires wont like. therfor potentially reducing your wide exits
also i'm almost certain there are autocrosses in your area.
hit up the scca website and look for yoru region[/QUOTE]
| akuhner | 12-31-2004 10:34 AM |
[QUOTE=jmott]coasting is always bad
you always should be on the gas or on the brakes[/QUOTE]
That's a mighty general statement if I've ever heard one! How on earth is "coasting ALWAYS bad?" What about when you are going down hill?! I coast a lot in regular driving, either in gear or out of gear, and there's nothing wrong with it. This whole thread is about how this guy can safely practice his cornering lines on public roads (and how he should really auto-x!), so if he's always on the brake or the gas I'd say he's going a little fast.
you always should be on the gas or on the brakes[/QUOTE]
That's a mighty general statement if I've ever heard one! How on earth is "coasting ALWAYS bad?" What about when you are going down hill?! I coast a lot in regular driving, either in gear or out of gear, and there's nothing wrong with it. This whole thread is about how this guy can safely practice his cornering lines on public roads (and how he should really auto-x!), so if he's always on the brake or the gas I'd say he's going a little fast.
| NskGenakuDuckie | 12-31-2004 01:16 PM |
jmott must drive like my mom...... she accelerates.....brakes....accelerates....brakes....accelerate.....brakes..... all while in a long big straight road. I get sea sick when I sit in her car =P
| BlazingEngine | 12-31-2004 06:13 PM |
lol, love the sarcasm duckie
| Spectre186 | 01-27-2005 05:06 PM |
slow in fast out :D
| NskGenakuDuckie | 01-27-2005 08:21 PM |
I drive like the way I fwak..... :banana:
Fast in Fast out :devil:
Fast in Fast out :devil:
| Calamity Jesus | 01-28-2005 10:18 AM |
Hoosiers and Driving lessons. That's all you need.
| CBRDSpeedfactory | 01-28-2005 11:02 AM |
well...
�
�
what they teach u at a driver's school is...
slow in fast out....
what u learn at the race track is...fast in fast out....
i like gary's response lol, its spot on really....
but u can always find more grip with a street car....when ur done, uve basically turned it into a race car lol
its maintaining momentum....you will find that car's have a lot more ability to carry entry speed than u think...u just have to find the limit of what the car can do on its own to scrub speed off for you.... their should almost always be a point in the corner with minimal brake and acceleration where u are just carrying a ton of rolling momentum.....
WRC is obviously different because of the tight tight radius of their corners and everything is point and squirt...also, the car's are designed to be whipped around by their suspension geometry and travel.....but they have raised and lower suspension mounting points etc.... to allow for different suspension travel...
anyway
my thoughts...
chad b
slow in fast out....
what u learn at the race track is...fast in fast out....
i like gary's response lol, its spot on really....
but u can always find more grip with a street car....when ur done, uve basically turned it into a race car lol
its maintaining momentum....you will find that car's have a lot more ability to carry entry speed than u think...u just have to find the limit of what the car can do on its own to scrub speed off for you.... their should almost always be a point in the corner with minimal brake and acceleration where u are just carrying a ton of rolling momentum.....
WRC is obviously different because of the tight tight radius of their corners and everything is point and squirt...also, the car's are designed to be whipped around by their suspension geometry and travel.....but they have raised and lower suspension mounting points etc.... to allow for different suspension travel...
anyway
my thoughts...
chad b
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