| makofoto | 03-19-2005 02:46 AM |
"First" Falken 615 opinion ...
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From Rex Tener ... 3rd in STU @ the San Diego Tour, driving a '96 M3 w/ 255/40/17 Falken 615's:
>>>I really like the Falken RT-615. I got them minutes before I left on
Thursday for San Diego for the National Tour. After a few practice runs to
scrub them on Friday, I thought they were great on Saturday and Sunday. To me they feel just like the RT-215, very responsive with good turn-in. They seem to be much more heat resistant, but that is hard to tell with the mild temperatures we had at the Tour. I am hoping they will hold up to the
summer heat at Atwater, where my RT-215's would turn to butter 2/3's of the way through a run.<<<
btw. Mark Coleman won with a '04 STI/Azenis. 2nd was Richard Jung in a '04 Evo/Kuhmo ... followed by six M3's. ;)
>>>I really like the Falken RT-615. I got them minutes before I left on
Thursday for San Diego for the National Tour. After a few practice runs to
scrub them on Friday, I thought they were great on Saturday and Sunday. To me they feel just like the RT-215, very responsive with good turn-in. They seem to be much more heat resistant, but that is hard to tell with the mild temperatures we had at the Tour. I am hoping they will hold up to the
summer heat at Atwater, where my RT-215's would turn to butter 2/3's of the way through a run.<<<
btw. Mark Coleman won with a '04 STI/Azenis. 2nd was Richard Jung in a '04 Evo/Kuhmo ... followed by six M3's. ;)
| itsawagon | 03-20-2005 12:24 AM |
I looked in to buying these tires as I've chewed up my current set of MXs, but they haven't released my size yet (225/50-16) so I stuck with MXs. If the new 615s turn out good though, I may be going with those.
PS Anyone here run at the National event in Toledo? I'll probably be there this year (to watch).
PS Anyone here run at the National event in Toledo? I'll probably be there this year (to watch).
| Storm | 03-20-2005 01:04 AM |
We'll be there for both the Pro and the 'tour. 98RS in DSP. Feel free to stop by and say hi.
Jay Storm
Jay Storm
| itsawagon | 03-20-2005 02:31 AM |
Good deal. I may run after all, this may be too hard to pass up...:D
Any Subaru owners in line for a set of 615s yet?
Any Subaru owners in line for a set of 615s yet?
| jcroy66 | 03-20-2005 07:53 AM |
Phil and I will also be there for the Pro and Tour in Toledo. Probably most/all the regional events at the airport too. 03 blue WRX - 77 STX/77 L2.
| silver04rs | 03-20-2005 03:23 PM |
Thanks for the post.... I was just about to put up a thread to ask if anybody had tried them..
TRAVIS- THE GRAVEL CREW
[url]WWW.GCRALLYX.COM[/url]
TRAVIS- THE GRAVEL CREW
[url]WWW.GCRALLYX.COM[/url]
| rex n effect | 03-20-2005 09:46 PM |
I tried them today. I took first in STX at the WDCR SCCA autocross, just barely beating the fellow who was driving KCs old (well prepped) WRX wagon. Luckily for me, he picked up a cone on his last run, where his raw time was .05 faster than mine. I'm sorry, I can't do a direct comparo to the old azenis because I never tried those. I've happily been on 245/40 MXs for the past two years. The 615s are much more responsive than the MXs, requiring less steering input to initiate turn-in. They are just as grippy, but I think they like to slide a *little* bit to provide maximum grip. They are very predictable at and past the limit, making it easy to recover if you get a little sideways. Their advantage compared to the MXs is probably not all-out grip, but responsiveness, which I think goes a LONG way in autocross. Judging by other people running the same size (225/45 17) old Azenis and their tire pressures, these sidewalls are just as stiff. I ran 38/38 and didn't let any air out between runs, so they probably got up to 40psi or so. Sidewalls didn't roll outside the tread range, which is a first for me. Since it was cool today, they never got hot, so I cannot yet comment on their ability to handle some warmth.
| D_REX | 03-21-2005 09:06 AM |
What are you guys refferring to as "cool"?
I've run the Azenis in ~60 degree weather on asphault and still had to spray them between runs to keep them cool.
Are you still doing some spraying?
How long are the runs?
How much time between runs?
Thanks,
Dustin
I've run the Azenis in ~60 degree weather on asphault and still had to spray them between runs to keep them cool.
Are you still doing some spraying?
How long are the runs?
How much time between runs?
Thanks,
Dustin
| subieworx | 03-21-2005 09:22 AM |
[QUOTE=itsawagon]I looked in to buying these tires as I've chewed up my current set of MXs, but they haven't released my size yet (225/50-16) so I stuck with MXs. If the new 615s turn out good though, I may be going with those.
PS Anyone here run at the National event in Toledo? I'll probably be there this year (to watch).[/QUOTE]
When are those events this year? I would like to go to at least one.
PS Anyone here run at the National event in Toledo? I'll probably be there this year (to watch).[/QUOTE]
When are those events this year? I would like to go to at least one.
| rex n effect | 03-21-2005 10:12 AM |
Temps didn't get over 60 and cloudy. The ground was even cooler due to very recent rain. We got a big break in between our first and second runs due to some fluid on course and the next three runs had about 5-7 minutes in between.
| driggity | 03-21-2005 02:15 PM |
There were some impressions on these tires on an STi posted a week ago.
[url]http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=727619[/url]
rex n effect, did you feel like you were giving up because of the Azeni's being narrower than the MXs you used to run? Also any idea how much narrower the 225/45 17 Azenis actually are when compared to the 245/40 17 MXs?
Thanks.
[url]http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=727619[/url]
rex n effect, did you feel like you were giving up because of the Azeni's being narrower than the MXs you used to run? Also any idea how much narrower the 225/45 17 Azenis actually are when compared to the 245/40 17 MXs?
Thanks.
| makofoto | 03-21-2005 03:08 PM |
At a SD local Championship event ... Leslie Cohen's STS Honda with 615's was about a second faster then Ken Motohishi's MX shod STS Honda. Ken usually beats Leslie by a few hundredths!
| BriDrive | 03-21-2005 04:40 PM |
Its premature...sorry...but I will have some definitive info in perhaps two weeks.
Myself and wrx2.0 555 have been competing head to head for over year.
I have rt615's mounted and ready to scrub in....225/45/17
He (and I...codriven so far) a set of Kuhmo MX 225/45/17 2 events this year.
He has beaten me by approximately 5 tenths in most cases last year, against my car on RT215's...........
We will go head to head next week....( STX as usual )
We are a team, we set up our cars together and we have useful data on
RT215,Kuhmo MX and soon RT615....
Will give our insight soon............
BriDrive
Myself and wrx2.0 555 have been competing head to head for over year.
I have rt615's mounted and ready to scrub in....225/45/17
He (and I...codriven so far) a set of Kuhmo MX 225/45/17 2 events this year.
He has beaten me by approximately 5 tenths in most cases last year, against my car on RT215's...........
We will go head to head next week....( STX as usual )
We are a team, we set up our cars together and we have useful data on
RT215,Kuhmo MX and soon RT615....
Will give our insight soon............
BriDrive
| CirrusWRX | 03-21-2005 05:30 PM |
Anxious to hear more - thanks for the updates everybody
| Jsortor | 03-21-2005 10:03 PM |
[QUOTE=makofoto]At a SD local Championship event ... Leslie Cohen's STS Honda with 615's was about a second faster then Ken Motohishi's MX shod STS Honda. Ken usually beats Leslie by a few hundredths![/QUOTE]
Mako,
Did you get to talk to Ken? Did he get a good run in and still get beat? That could determine some things.... Everyone has a bad day... ;)
Mako,
Did you get to talk to Ken? Did he get a good run in and still get beat? That could determine some things.... Everyone has a bad day... ;)
| itsawagon | 03-21-2005 11:45 PM |
National event in Toledo, OH is June 10-11.
It seems that the 615s are doing big things, making me angry that they didn't have my size...
It seems that the 615s are doing big things, making me angry that they didn't have my size...
| makofoto | 03-22-2005 04:51 AM |
Josh ... [URL=http://www.sdr-scca.com/solo2/results/final_03-20-05.htm]HERE[/URL] are the results from Sunday ... compare Ken's Kuhmo MX STS times with Leslie's and James G. X run times using 615's (same car). Their LAST X run times are not valid because water was running across one of the corners (sprinklers came on). I believe Leslie was using 215's during her STS runs and then changed to the 615's for the X runs.
I will check with Leslie and cc to you.
Ken and Jason Rhodes were doing some suspension testing .. which they thought improved Ken's car ... but not enough.
I will check with Leslie and cc to you.
Ken and Jason Rhodes were doing some suspension testing .. which they thought improved Ken's car ... but not enough.
| jcroy66 | 03-22-2005 09:18 AM |
[QUOTE=itsawagon]National event in Toledo, OH is June 10-11.[/QUOTE]
Toledo National Tour is June 11-12. Toledo ProSolo is August 6-7. There are several regional NWOR events at the airport as well.
Toledo National Tour is June 11-12. Toledo ProSolo is August 6-7. There are several regional NWOR events at the airport as well.
| makofoto | 03-22-2005 11:19 AM |
Leslie was using Kuhmo MX's for her STS runs ... then switched to the 615's for the X runs. James G. was almost a second faster then Ken M on his last X run with Leslie's car/615's even though he had to go through water braking for on corner ... and then through is again on corner exit! Ken said he was driving as well as usual in his STS runs.
Leslie said the 615's were much more forgiving then the MX's ...
It was probably in the 70's when they ran the 615's. We need hot weather feedback.
2nd place (local SD Championship race) Chris Teague ran 255/40/17 615's on his STU M3 ... and was over a second behind Mark Coleman's 1st place STI STU. Chris is use to using Victoracers on a VERY lightly prepped SM M3. He says the street tires don't allow him to brake deep into the corners like he could with his Victoracers.
Leslie said the 615's were much more forgiving then the MX's ...
It was probably in the 70's when they ran the 615's. We need hot weather feedback.
2nd place (local SD Championship race) Chris Teague ran 255/40/17 615's on his STU M3 ... and was over a second behind Mark Coleman's 1st place STI STU. Chris is use to using Victoracers on a VERY lightly prepped SM M3. He says the street tires don't allow him to brake deep into the corners like he could with his Victoracers.
| ExitVisa | 03-22-2005 12:35 PM |
One of the WRX drivers at the first KCRSCCA event this past Sunday told me that the 615s are better than 215s at temperature, but not nearly as good as the 215s -before- they get up to temperature.
Hot weather feedback will be no problem here, its gets into the mid/upper 90s in the summer.
Hot weather feedback will be no problem here, its gets into the mid/upper 90s in the summer.
| MattGC8 | 03-22-2005 05:21 PM |
I don't want to hijack so I'll make my disclaimer now. I wanted to get the new 615's this year but I can't justify the price. $142 for 225/45/17 opposed to $110 for the Ventus R-S2 Z212's I'm looking at. Another comparison being the 615's at $142 and 215's at $111. I keep hearing good things about Hankook's latest, but I'm not convinced yet. I guess some more testimonials are needed for both(615, Z212). I guess I'm trying to get what most are aiming for, the best bang for the buck. Input? 615 vs. Z212
| D_REX | 03-22-2005 05:28 PM |
[QUOTE=MattGC8]I don't want to hijack so I'll make my disclaimer now. I wanted to get the new 615's this year but I can't justify the price. $142 for 225/45/17 opposed to $110 for the Ventus R-S2 Z212's I'm looking at. Another comparison being the 615's at $142 and 215's at $111. I keep hearing good things about Hankook's latest, but I'm not convinced yet. I guess some more testimonials are needed for both(615, Z212). I guess I'm trying to get what most are aiming for, the best bang for the buck. Input? 615 vs. Z212[/QUOTE]
Are you autocrossing, daily driving, open tracking? If so at what level? What are these tires for??
Are you autocrossing, daily driving, open tracking? If so at what level? What are these tires for??
| PKer | 03-22-2005 05:35 PM |
[QUOTE=makofoto]At a SD local Championship event ... Leslie Cohen's STS Honda with 615's was about a second faster then Ken Motohishi's MX shod STS Honda. Ken usually beats Leslie by a few hundredths![/QUOTE]
I got a chance to talk to Leslie at the start while we were waiting out the sprinkler fiasco. She said they like heat, I think she's a pretty good authority on the subject.
After 4 almost consecutive runs they decided to spray them (the car had three drivers that day) she said they probably didn't need it though. I don't think anyone at the event in SD was able to get them hot enough to go greasy.
They sound very promising.
I got a chance to talk to Leslie at the start while we were waiting out the sprinkler fiasco. She said they like heat, I think she's a pretty good authority on the subject.
After 4 almost consecutive runs they decided to spray them (the car had three drivers that day) she said they probably didn't need it though. I don't think anyone at the event in SD was able to get them hot enough to go greasy.
They sound very promising.
| ratt_finkel | 03-22-2005 05:45 PM |
[QUOTE=MattGC8]I don't want to hijack so I'll make my disclaimer now. I wanted to get the new 615's this year but I can't justify the price. $142 for 225/45/17 opposed to $110 for the Ventus R-S2 Z212's I'm looking at. Another comparison being the 615's at $142 and 215's at $111. I keep hearing good things about Hankook's latest, but I'm not convinced yet. I guess some more testimonials are needed for both(615, Z212). I guess I'm trying to get what most are aiming for, the best bang for the buck. Input? 615 vs. Z212[/QUOTE]
Why not make a pick, and then you can add more insight to the pile?
Why not make a pick, and then you can add more insight to the pile?
| MattGC8 | 03-22-2005 06:11 PM |
I should have been more specific. Tires, whatever I decide on, will be used for seasonal daily driving(low mileage), auto-x(2 per month avg.) and at least 1 track day at Limerock Park. Last season I ran Kumho 712's for my novice season of auto-x and managed to do well on the track with them. I've had no experience with a tire of Falken's caliber. I guess I would consider the 712 a good learning tire even though UncleScotty would say otherwise :p . Lastly, I'm not quite ready to put new tires on yet, here in CT we have the threat of some sleet/freezing rain tonight into tomorrow. Just a little bit longer I guess....
| AlpineFD | 03-22-2005 07:16 PM |
speaking of the new hankook z212, has anyone tried them yet? The price is very attractive.
[url]http://www.discounttiredirect.com/direct/findTireDetail.do?cs=245&pc=11868&rd=17&ar=45[/url]
[url]http://www.discounttiredirect.com/direct/findTireDetail.do?cs=245&pc=11868&rd=17&ar=45[/url]
| bolio | 03-22-2005 08:01 PM |
The Hankook looks like a copy of the Yokohama Neova which is supposed to be awesome.I'm waiting for 17x8.5 rims for my 04 sti and I cant decide between the rs-2, mx, or rt-615. The rs-2 is the cheapest but has the least feedback and I've heard Hankook street tires are crap.
| RogersWRX | 03-23-2005 12:16 AM |
Check out this thread for some feedback....[url]http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=730154&page=2&pp=25[/url]
| makofoto | 03-23-2005 07:26 AM |
... more on Chris Teague using the 615's in STU. At the National Tour event in SD ... Chris on 215's (M3) was almost 2 seconds a lap slower then Mark Coleman on 215's/STI on an approx. 58 second course.
On new 615's Chris was only a bit more then a second slower then Mark ... on a 68 second course. The 615's helped Chris (who has has something like 20+ years of racing experience, and was the local SD and LA SM Champ in '03) gain a second on Mark Coleman.
On new 615's Chris was only a bit more then a second slower then Mark ... on a 68 second course. The 615's helped Chris (who has has something like 20+ years of racing experience, and was the local SD and LA SM Champ in '03) gain a second on Mark Coleman.
| Paisan | 03-23-2005 12:24 PM |
I run he old Azenis in 215-45-16 for HPDE and Daily driving here in the northeast. I love em, tried a set of MXs at HPDE but they overheated too easily. Was going to try the new tires but seem a bit expensive, at that point you might be able to get Toyo Proxie RA1s for slightly more cash and way more grip.
For HPDE though I think that they don't heat up as much as auto-x cause you aren't scrubbing them as much. I always used R-compounds for A-X but in HPDE now good summer tires are more than adequet when i'm not doing an Enduro or Sprint race.
-mike
For HPDE though I think that they don't heat up as much as auto-x cause you aren't scrubbing them as much. I always used R-compounds for A-X but in HPDE now good summer tires are more than adequet when i'm not doing an Enduro or Sprint race.
-mike
| crtillmanspeed | 03-23-2005 01:40 PM |
so am i going to need an 8 inch wide rim to mount on the stock size tire?
225/45/17
i have an 04... i believe they are 7.5" or will these work.. just tighter...
and whats the advantage of an 8inch wide rota wheel besides less weight?
225/45/17
i have an 04... i believe they are 7.5" or will these work.. just tighter...
and whats the advantage of an 8inch wide rota wheel besides less weight?
| DrBiggly | 03-23-2005 02:26 PM |
The Rota 8" wide wheel is not lighter than anything that I know of other than maybe some chromed out 20s or something. :confused: The lightest Rota 8" wide wheel for a Subaru is 19lbs. Your stock wheels should be notably lighter than that.
A 225/45/17 will fit on a 7.5" rim with ease. The 245/45/17s will fit on the 7.5" rim with a little persuasion. The tire mounter might complain a little, but it will go and be just fine. :)
A 225/45/17 will fit on a 7.5" rim with ease. The 245/45/17s will fit on the 7.5" rim with a little persuasion. The tire mounter might complain a little, but it will go and be just fine. :)
| crtillmanspeed | 03-23-2005 03:58 PM |
[QUOTE=DrBiggly]The Rota 8" wide wheel is not lighter than anything that I know of other than maybe some chromed out 20s or something. :confused: The lightest Rota 8" wide wheel for a Subaru is 19lbs. Your stock wheels should be notably lighter than that.
A 225/45/17 will fit on a 7.5" rim with ease. The 245/45/17s will fit on the 7.5" rim with a little persuasion. The tire mounter might complain a little, but it will go and be just fine. :)[/QUOTE]
and the advantage of the wider tire is just more surface area?
A 225/45/17 will fit on a 7.5" rim with ease. The 245/45/17s will fit on the 7.5" rim with a little persuasion. The tire mounter might complain a little, but it will go and be just fine. :)[/QUOTE]
and the advantage of the wider tire is just more surface area?
| D_REX | 03-23-2005 04:03 PM |
[QUOTE=DrBiggly]A 225/45/17 will fit on a 7.5" rim with ease. The 245/45/17s will fit on the 7.5" rim with a little persuasion. The tire mounter might complain a little, but it will go and be just fine. :)[/QUOTE]
At some point a wide tire mounted on a narrow wheel will be slower than a narrower tire mounted on the same wheel. I'm not sure where that line is though.
At some point a wide tire mounted on a narrow wheel will be slower than a narrower tire mounted on the same wheel. I'm not sure where that line is though.
| makofoto | 03-23-2005 04:12 PM |
For AX ... seems like wider rubber is more important then "proper" width wheels. Just walk through any AX paddock. :-)
Hoosier (not sure about Kuhmo) of course make special extra wide "cantilevered" tires designed to go on relatively narrow class regulated wheel widths. You see these on some Miata's, etc. But they aren't available in any size of interest to us.
Typically rim width should equal tire width ... but even the Hoosier FAQ says there is a lot of leeway. Typically for every 0.5" increase in wheel width, you gain 0.1" tread width ... to a point.
I'm happy that my ROTA sponsor has 8.5" wheels! :D
Hoosier (not sure about Kuhmo) of course make special extra wide "cantilevered" tires designed to go on relatively narrow class regulated wheel widths. You see these on some Miata's, etc. But they aren't available in any size of interest to us.
Typically rim width should equal tire width ... but even the Hoosier FAQ says there is a lot of leeway. Typically for every 0.5" increase in wheel width, you gain 0.1" tread width ... to a point.
I'm happy that my ROTA sponsor has 8.5" wheels! :D
| PKer | 03-23-2005 08:10 PM |
I am under the impression that a tire "stretched" to fit a wider rim produces a stiffer sidewall, making it more responsive and less prone to sidewall rollover.
| Got Pink? | 03-23-2005 09:42 PM |
[QUOTE=PKer]I am under the impression that a tire "stretched" to fit a wider rim produces a stiffer sidewall, making it more responsive and less prone to sidewall rollover.[/QUOTE]
Yep that has been my experience with 205/40/17 MX's on 17x7.5 rims on my miata. The turn in was crisp and I did not experience any of the soft feeling sidewall compared to azenis that many miata owners comparing them in 205/50/15 sizes did. Also the 205 MX's stretched were wider than many other 225 summer tires and fit nicely with the really short sidewalls.
Ideally for STU i should run 17x9s with 245/40/17 MXs to benefit from better gearing and shorter stretched sidewalls for less flex and less weight than the 615s. But if the 615s are really that much better I may just run them on my stock 8'' rims and see what happens since the azenis sidewall is stiffer it shouldn't benefit as much from a wider rim. Too bad they don't make the 615 in 245/40/17.
Nate
Yep that has been my experience with 205/40/17 MX's on 17x7.5 rims on my miata. The turn in was crisp and I did not experience any of the soft feeling sidewall compared to azenis that many miata owners comparing them in 205/50/15 sizes did. Also the 205 MX's stretched were wider than many other 225 summer tires and fit nicely with the really short sidewalls.
Ideally for STU i should run 17x9s with 245/40/17 MXs to benefit from better gearing and shorter stretched sidewalls for less flex and less weight than the 615s. But if the 615s are really that much better I may just run them on my stock 8'' rims and see what happens since the azenis sidewall is stiffer it shouldn't benefit as much from a wider rim. Too bad they don't make the 615 in 245/40/17.
Nate
| DrBiggly | 03-23-2005 10:03 PM |
[QUOTE=D_REX]At some point a wide tire mounted on a narrow wheel will be slower than a narrower tire mounted on the same wheel. I'm not sure where that line is though.[/QUOTE]
Indeed. I think there is a slight difference on a 225 tire between a 7.5" wheel and 8" wheel; I thought I remembered trhoppe commenting to me at one point about the difference of it stretching out to fit an 8" wheel. Can't remember the tread width difference though. :)
I can't go above an 8" rim in an ST class though; so that's really my limit. Also 245 section width. :)
Indeed. I think there is a slight difference on a 225 tire between a 7.5" wheel and 8" wheel; I thought I remembered trhoppe commenting to me at one point about the difference of it stretching out to fit an 8" wheel. Can't remember the tread width difference though. :)
I can't go above an 8" rim in an ST class though; so that's really my limit. Also 245 section width. :)
| makofoto | 03-24-2005 05:25 AM |
Wheel width is unlimited in STU now ... although 245 is the tire limit for AWD cars. The BMW's can't seem to fit anything wider then a 255 ... even though they can go to 275. RX8's can fit 275's I guess ...
Nate ... you don't think a 245/40/17 is too short, or unnecessarily short for an STI? Mark Coleman has been doing very well out here in STU using 245/45/17 Azenis's on our typically fast AX courses. He still has to go into third ... and was even hitting fourth at one San Diego event. He was hitting 85 through the finish!
Nate ... you don't think a 245/40/17 is too short, or unnecessarily short for an STI? Mark Coleman has been doing very well out here in STU using 245/45/17 Azenis's on our typically fast AX courses. He still has to go into third ... and was even hitting fourth at one San Diego event. He was hitting 85 through the finish!
| jcroy66 | 03-24-2005 07:00 AM |
[QUOTE=makofoto]Mark Coleman has been doing very well out here in STU using 245/45/17 Azenis's on our typically fast AX courses. He still has to go into third ... and was even hitting fourth at one San Diego event. He was hitting 85 through the finish![/QUOTE]
*Covering up eyes and ears* "LA LA LA LA LA...I can't hear you..."
FYI, IMO that definitely sounds like a course that should have been modified and/or disallowed for safety reasons. The Safety Belt newsletter that came in the mail this week indicates that the SSC (Solo Safety Committee) is starting to crack down on regions that are hosting events that are faster than the rulebook allows.
[QUOTE][font=Univers][size=1][color=#231f20]Speeds on straight stretches should not normally exceed the low 60�s (mph) for the fastest Stock and Street Prepared category cars.[/color][/size][/font] [/QUOTE]
*Covering up eyes and ears* "LA LA LA LA LA...I can't hear you..."
FYI, IMO that definitely sounds like a course that should have been modified and/or disallowed for safety reasons. The Safety Belt newsletter that came in the mail this week indicates that the SSC (Solo Safety Committee) is starting to crack down on regions that are hosting events that are faster than the rulebook allows.
[QUOTE][font=Univers][size=1][color=#231f20]Speeds on straight stretches should not normally exceed the low 60�s (mph) for the fastest Stock and Street Prepared category cars.[/color][/size][/font] [/QUOTE]
| afpdl | 03-24-2005 07:08 AM |
[QUOTE=makofoto]
Nate ... you don't think a 245/40/17 is too short, or unnecessarily short for an STI? Mark Coleman has been doing very well out here in STU using 245/45/17 Azenis's on our typically fast AX courses. He still has to go into third ... and was even hitting fourth at one San Diego event. He was hitting 85 through the finish![/QUOTE]
If you are going to shift anyway how is having a taller tire going to help anything? Ive found they help a little on a couple of courses that top out right at 7000rpms in 2nd but for any course I have to go to 3rd in I would rather have the 245/40s. I also cant have my rideheight quite where I want it because the tires are too tall.
Nate ... you don't think a 245/40/17 is too short, or unnecessarily short for an STI? Mark Coleman has been doing very well out here in STU using 245/45/17 Azenis's on our typically fast AX courses. He still has to go into third ... and was even hitting fourth at one San Diego event. He was hitting 85 through the finish![/QUOTE]
If you are going to shift anyway how is having a taller tire going to help anything? Ive found they help a little on a couple of courses that top out right at 7000rpms in 2nd but for any course I have to go to 3rd in I would rather have the 245/40s. I also cant have my rideheight quite where I want it because the tires are too tall.
| DrBiggly | 03-24-2005 10:26 AM |
[QUOTE=makofoto]Wheel width is unlimited in STU now ... although 245 is the tire limit for AWD cars. The BMW's can't seem to fit anything wider then a 255 ... even though they can go to 275. RX8's can fit 275's I guess ...
[/QUOTE]
Oops! Made a mistake. Thanks Mako. :)
[/QUOTE]
Oops! Made a mistake. Thanks Mako. :)
| felonious | 03-24-2005 11:10 AM |
Back on topic... I just got my 615s installed on my 04 STi in 225/45/17. I'll report back after they're scrubbed in. So far all I can report is that they're a lot quieter than the 070s, which is good for a daily driver.
-Ollie
-Ollie
| SoloImpreza | 03-24-2005 11:26 AM |
well nephew matthew,
for the amount of drive we do i wouldnt go with the new azenis. granted they are more heat resistant and dont get "greasy" like the previous azenis, i dont believe it will last more than a season if you auto-x, track day and daily drive on them. i am going with the hankook. mainly because of price. i went through a set of azenis in one season. thats 300 bux. hankook should last longer, and although the new azenis is more succeptable to heat, i cannot imagine them lasting all that much longer then their predecessor.
as for the kuhmo 712's in the sleet and snow, your brave. azenis or 712's in the snow or snow like material, i choose neither.
for the amount of drive we do i wouldnt go with the new azenis. granted they are more heat resistant and dont get "greasy" like the previous azenis, i dont believe it will last more than a season if you auto-x, track day and daily drive on them. i am going with the hankook. mainly because of price. i went through a set of azenis in one season. thats 300 bux. hankook should last longer, and although the new azenis is more succeptable to heat, i cannot imagine them lasting all that much longer then their predecessor.
as for the kuhmo 712's in the sleet and snow, your brave. azenis or 712's in the snow or snow like material, i choose neither.
| makofoto | 03-24-2005 01:42 PM |
afpdl ... do you/anybody ... feel that using the shorter 245/40/17 MX would be at least equal to using a 245/45/17 615 tire? Would the shorter gearing and slight lowering of a STI make it the way to go? Especially because the STU STI that I'm going to co-drive soon doesn't have coilovers ... only jdm Pinks ... so it rides a bit higher then oem (w/45 series tires) ... and leans a fair amount.
[IMG]http://images9.fotki.com/v164/photos/4/43793/1992934/MarkWide-vi.jpg[/IMG]
The one real unknown so far with the 615 ... is how well will it perform under really hot Southern CA track conditions ... while we know the MX likes the heat.
[IMG]http://images9.fotki.com/v164/photos/4/43793/1992934/MarkWide-vi.jpg[/IMG]
The one real unknown so far with the 615 ... is how well will it perform under really hot Southern CA track conditions ... while we know the MX likes the heat.
| afpdl | 03-24-2005 01:52 PM |
[SIZE=1]Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/4.0 (MobilePhone SCP-7300/US/1.0) NetFront/3.0 MMP/2.0)[/SIZE]
Ive only used 245 215s so i cant say. kds would prob b better than the mxs though.
Ive only used 245 215s so i cant say. kds would prob b better than the mxs though.
| Snakebot | 03-24-2005 11:36 PM |
[QUOTE=makofoto]afpdl ... do you/anybody ... feel that using the shorter 245/40/17 MX would be at least equal to using a 245/45/17 615 tire? Would the shorter gearing and slight lowering of a STI make it the way to go?[/QUOTE]
I used the 245/40-17 MX for 2-3 events and Nationals last year and I'm currently using the 245/45-17 old Azeinis Sports.
Personally, I like the MX's better. While the sidewall wasn't as stiff which caused the turn in to be not as sharp as the Azeins. The shorter height and gearing that the MX offered was worth the trade-off.
With the taller Azeins, the car feels a little sluggish comming out of slower corners because the revs take a bit longer to come back up. The MX on the same type of corner allows the revs to come up faster.
On the courses we have here in Dallas, running out of gear and needing to shift is not that big of an issue. Even at Nationals I didn't feel like I was in a situation where I had to shift into third instead of bumping the rev limiter for extended periods of time.
I'll need a new set of tires around mid season. Unless I see difinitive proof that the new RT-615 or the Hankook RS-2 are significantly faster, I'm going back to the 245/40-17 MX.
I used the 245/40-17 MX for 2-3 events and Nationals last year and I'm currently using the 245/45-17 old Azeinis Sports.
Personally, I like the MX's better. While the sidewall wasn't as stiff which caused the turn in to be not as sharp as the Azeins. The shorter height and gearing that the MX offered was worth the trade-off.
With the taller Azeins, the car feels a little sluggish comming out of slower corners because the revs take a bit longer to come back up. The MX on the same type of corner allows the revs to come up faster.
On the courses we have here in Dallas, running out of gear and needing to shift is not that big of an issue. Even at Nationals I didn't feel like I was in a situation where I had to shift into third instead of bumping the rev limiter for extended periods of time.
I'll need a new set of tires around mid season. Unless I see difinitive proof that the new RT-615 or the Hankook RS-2 are significantly faster, I'm going back to the 245/40-17 MX.
| WRXIN | 03-25-2005 12:41 PM |
[QUOTE=Snakebot]
With the taller Azeins, the car feels a little sluggish comming out of slower corners because the revs take a bit longer to come back up. The MX on the same type of corner allows the revs to come up faster.
On the courses we have here in Dallas, running out of gear and needing to shift is not that big of an issue. Even at Nationals I didn't feel like I was in a situation where I had to shift into third instead of bumping the rev limiter for extended periods of time.
[/QUOTE]
Hehe, at the nationals in San Diego a few weeks ago, on day 2, Sunday, I took my first two laps bumping of the rev limiter in 2nd all over the place, then decided to take large parts of the course in 3rd on my final run, and I knocked a full second off my time... and came in first in STU.
Thanks for the great input Snakebot. I'm Mark, the guy Mako has been talking about. He's worried about co-driving my car because he's used to an SM-modded WRX that's practically welded to the frame.
But at the San Diego nationals... in my mildly suspension modded STi, I finished ahead of STS and STX (in raw times at least...) as an STU car should. Its just unusual as you all know. STS seems to spank the other classes more than it should!
Like Mako said, I'm running with JDM Pink STi springs, camber plates and sway bars and the 245 old style Azenis. I'm not nearly as worried about body roll as Mako is, I'm actually ok with it. And the car IS actually lower than stock, even with the tall tires, because of the springs.
But here's the obvious ongoing dilemma, there's contigency money with the Kumho MXs, enough of it to easily cover the cost of the tires. And with the National Tour and the Prosolo Nationals happening in northern CA in a few weeks, we have been debating about either getting 615s, which seem to be a sure bet and at least as good as the old Azenis, or do we go for contigency money with the Kumho MXs...
I think we're just going to have to test the MXs in the coming weeks and see if they are at least equal to the old Azenis.
Personally, I think the aspect ratio is a non-issue with an STi. I have more power than I need right now with 45 series tires. For me, its about grip.
I'd really appreciate any other experiences with MXs vs. Azenis.
-Mark
With the taller Azeins, the car feels a little sluggish comming out of slower corners because the revs take a bit longer to come back up. The MX on the same type of corner allows the revs to come up faster.
On the courses we have here in Dallas, running out of gear and needing to shift is not that big of an issue. Even at Nationals I didn't feel like I was in a situation where I had to shift into third instead of bumping the rev limiter for extended periods of time.
[/QUOTE]
Hehe, at the nationals in San Diego a few weeks ago, on day 2, Sunday, I took my first two laps bumping of the rev limiter in 2nd all over the place, then decided to take large parts of the course in 3rd on my final run, and I knocked a full second off my time... and came in first in STU.
Thanks for the great input Snakebot. I'm Mark, the guy Mako has been talking about. He's worried about co-driving my car because he's used to an SM-modded WRX that's practically welded to the frame.
But at the San Diego nationals... in my mildly suspension modded STi, I finished ahead of STS and STX (in raw times at least...) as an STU car should. Its just unusual as you all know. STS seems to spank the other classes more than it should!
Like Mako said, I'm running with JDM Pink STi springs, camber plates and sway bars and the 245 old style Azenis. I'm not nearly as worried about body roll as Mako is, I'm actually ok with it. And the car IS actually lower than stock, even with the tall tires, because of the springs.
But here's the obvious ongoing dilemma, there's contigency money with the Kumho MXs, enough of it to easily cover the cost of the tires. And with the National Tour and the Prosolo Nationals happening in northern CA in a few weeks, we have been debating about either getting 615s, which seem to be a sure bet and at least as good as the old Azenis, or do we go for contigency money with the Kumho MXs...
I think we're just going to have to test the MXs in the coming weeks and see if they are at least equal to the old Azenis.
Personally, I think the aspect ratio is a non-issue with an STi. I have more power than I need right now with 45 series tires. For me, its about grip.
I'd really appreciate any other experiences with MXs vs. Azenis.
-Mark
| Snakebot | 03-27-2005 04:58 PM |
Grip wise the MX is very close to the original Azenis. But you really have to shave the MX to ~4/32nds to get the most out of them. Full tread MXs are too squirmy.
| makofoto | 03-27-2005 08:33 PM |
Mark's lucky ... the only tire shaver in Southern CA, Trackside Performance, Yoko racing tire importer, is only a couple of miles away from him. Ken M. said to just do 5/32nds ...
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