| trojan9x | 09-19-2002 04:58 PM |
Harness question
I have a racing harness in mind and would like your opinions on if it is worth it or not.
any experience with the product
is it even legal to use for racing (solo2)
here is the link
[url]http://www.crowenterprizes.com/Crow%20Enterprizes/html/products_rotary.html[/url]
it's part numbers
11133 or 11125 that i'm interested in.
thanks for any help
any experience with the product
is it even legal to use for racing (solo2)
here is the link
[url]http://www.crowenterprizes.com/Crow%20Enterprizes/html/products_rotary.html[/url]
it's part numbers
11133 or 11125 that i'm interested in.
thanks for any help
| IXLR8 | 09-19-2002 05:18 PM |
There is considerable debate (try a search) on the safety of using a 5 or 6 point harness w/o a roll bar or cage...
I'm one of the guys who think it's not a very good idea, but then I was instructing at Summit Point the day the guy in the attached photo did this (with a fellow instructor on board)...
Both were OK (instructor with a relatively minor cut to his knee), but undoubtedly wouldn't have been if they'd been in a harness.
If you really think you need one take a look at the Schroth's (2 inch)... they are the only ones with a DOT approval, as they don't use a sub strap and instead incorporate a little module (forget what they call it) to sort of torque you into the seat under load.
They are expensive, but probably worth it.
[url]http://www.roadraceengineering.com/eclsafety.htm[/url]
(Don't know anything about this vendor but the belt descritpion is pretty good)
I'm one of the guys who think it's not a very good idea, but then I was instructing at Summit Point the day the guy in the attached photo did this (with a fellow instructor on board)...
Both were OK (instructor with a relatively minor cut to his knee), but undoubtedly wouldn't have been if they'd been in a harness.
If you really think you need one take a look at the Schroth's (2 inch)... they are the only ones with a DOT approval, as they don't use a sub strap and instead incorporate a little module (forget what they call it) to sort of torque you into the seat under load.
They are expensive, but probably worth it.
[url]http://www.roadraceengineering.com/eclsafety.htm[/url]
(Don't know anything about this vendor but the belt descritpion is pretty good)
| shinylugnuts | 09-19-2002 05:56 PM |
With a hacksaw that could be a nice convertible.
| Corey | 09-19-2002 07:12 PM |
Tom,
Yes, they are legal for solo2.
And I would only get the Schroth if I were planning to use it on the street. Just like the one that Dan just got. It has the anti-submarine strap built in.
Corey #89 SM
Yes, they are legal for solo2.
And I would only get the Schroth if I were planning to use it on the street. Just like the one that Dan just got. It has the anti-submarine strap built in.
Corey #89 SM
| Kostamojen | 09-20-2002 02:20 AM |
Hmm... Which one of those Schroth harnesses would be good for a GC8?
I've been thinking about what to do about my seat situation for awhile (my cloth is bad and torn up in a couple locations in my L) whether to get racing seats or not, but its just too expensive cause of all the 5-point harnasses... So ill probably just keep these seats (they have enough side support, just the belt doesnt hold me down well enough for how well my car turns)
Oh, and I autocross but want something good for everyday use... (ive seen how 5-points are rediculously hard to get in and out of in person)
I've been thinking about what to do about my seat situation for awhile (my cloth is bad and torn up in a couple locations in my L) whether to get racing seats or not, but its just too expensive cause of all the 5-point harnasses... So ill probably just keep these seats (they have enough side support, just the belt doesnt hold me down well enough for how well my car turns)
Oh, and I autocross but want something good for everyday use... (ive seen how 5-points are rediculously hard to get in and out of in person)
| NoZen | 09-20-2002 12:09 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Kostamojen [/i]
[B]Hmm... Which one of those Schroth harnesses would be good for a GC8?
[...]Oh, and I autocross but want something good for everyday use... (ive seen how
5-points are rediculously hard to get in and out of in person) [/B][/QUOTE]
The only Schroth I would recommend for street use is the "asm autocontrol II"
(listed on the above-mentioned site as "Auto Control"). This incorporates a
lockable inertia reel between the seat and the rear mount point so your harness
straps don't have to be tight. Without this, you will *not* be able to adjust
your stereo, turn around in your seat to look back while reversing, etc.
Your whole torso will be stapled quite firmly to the seat.
Aside from that one, you should likely use the Rallye 3 (mounted to the
C pillar at the rear shoulder harness mount) if you don't have a harness
bar or roll bar, and the Rallye Cross or Profi II or III if you do have a bar.
You likely should NOT use the Rallye 4 or any other belt designed to mount
to the rear seatbelt mounting points because the harness straps will be angled
down and in the event of a crash your spine will be badly compressed.
Note, however, my use of the word "likely" up there - I am speculating.
Schroth Automotive USA can be reached at (978) 532-1145; I have
called them several times with questions about various applications
and they have always been very helpful. Anyone mounting a Schroth
harness in a car that's not listed on their application sheets (which
can be downloaded from [url]www.schroth.com[/url]) should give them a call.
They list their email address as "[email protected]" on
their web site - you might also try emailing them.
Do keep in mind that what happened to the BMW above is very common
in street accidents as well; if you're not getting a roll bar I wouldn't use
any of the Schroth harness on the street. Even with the Autocontrol,
in a crash you will be held completely upright and if the roof gets
squished you will be too - no ducking or getting pushed to one side
as can happen with the stock 3-point harness.
-Robert.-
[B]Hmm... Which one of those Schroth harnesses would be good for a GC8?
[...]Oh, and I autocross but want something good for everyday use... (ive seen how
5-points are rediculously hard to get in and out of in person) [/B][/QUOTE]
The only Schroth I would recommend for street use is the "asm autocontrol II"
(listed on the above-mentioned site as "Auto Control"). This incorporates a
lockable inertia reel between the seat and the rear mount point so your harness
straps don't have to be tight. Without this, you will *not* be able to adjust
your stereo, turn around in your seat to look back while reversing, etc.
Your whole torso will be stapled quite firmly to the seat.
Aside from that one, you should likely use the Rallye 3 (mounted to the
C pillar at the rear shoulder harness mount) if you don't have a harness
bar or roll bar, and the Rallye Cross or Profi II or III if you do have a bar.
You likely should NOT use the Rallye 4 or any other belt designed to mount
to the rear seatbelt mounting points because the harness straps will be angled
down and in the event of a crash your spine will be badly compressed.
Note, however, my use of the word "likely" up there - I am speculating.
Schroth Automotive USA can be reached at (978) 532-1145; I have
called them several times with questions about various applications
and they have always been very helpful. Anyone mounting a Schroth
harness in a car that's not listed on their application sheets (which
can be downloaded from [url]www.schroth.com[/url]) should give them a call.
They list their email address as "[email protected]" on
their web site - you might also try emailing them.
Do keep in mind that what happened to the BMW above is very common
in street accidents as well; if you're not getting a roll bar I wouldn't use
any of the Schroth harness on the street. Even with the Autocontrol,
in a crash you will be held completely upright and if the roof gets
squished you will be too - no ducking or getting pushed to one side
as can happen with the stock 3-point harness.
-Robert.-
| trojan9x | 09-20-2002 12:10 PM |
i dont' know which of the schroth ones to get. rally 3 or 4
| Kostamojen | 09-21-2002 02:42 AM |
I guess this means that no matter what direction you go for harnasses, you loose back seat capability? (With a cross bar, theres no way anyone can get back there with a 2-door Impreza)
| trojan9x | 09-21-2002 10:19 AM |
with the schroth harnesses, there is a clip in the back that you can hit that will let back passengers in and out easily
| Kostamojen | 09-22-2002 01:23 AM |
Really? Hmm...
| ScoobyShak | 09-22-2002 07:55 PM |
Yep, There is a locking splice that separates the front to mounting points from the rear mounting points so you can have people in the backseat.
You sould go with the ralley 4 and that the ralley cross unless you really don't want a useable back seat.
Dan
You sould go with the ralley 4 and that the ralley cross unless you really don't want a useable back seat.
Dan
| Kostamojen | 09-23-2002 01:39 AM |
Doh, so you cant use the harness and still have passangers in the back, unless you have a harness bar in a 4-door :p SUCKS! Time to trade in the coupe... :lol:
| trojan9x | 09-23-2002 02:06 PM |
i ordered the rally 4 harness. if you like, i will try to take some pictures of the install so you can see how it works
| Kostamojen | 09-24-2002 02:12 AM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by trojan9x [/i]
[B]i ordered the rally 4 harness. if you like, i will try to take some pictures of the install so you can see how it works [/B][/QUOTE]
Oh for sure i want to see pics of it when you get it ;) Ill hold my breath until then...
[B]i ordered the rally 4 harness. if you like, i will try to take some pictures of the install so you can see how it works [/B][/QUOTE]
Oh for sure i want to see pics of it when you get it ;) Ill hold my breath until then...
| Jack | 09-24-2002 08:58 AM |
I'm also a convert to the camp who believes in no shoulder harness without a roll bar. I have not yet looked at the Schroth that you're talking about. For now, I'm using the stock seat belt with a 3" Simpson competition belt added for the lap only. Even with the shoulder harness, it should not be really tight. The lap belt holds you in and the shoulder harness is there for emergencies.
jack
jack
| Sea Dragon Rex | 09-24-2002 12:16 PM |
This is an interesting debate. I race Porsches and have worked on the track safety crew in the past. IXLR8 has a point that the individuals in that rollover would have been seriously hurt or possibly killed if they had 5-point harnesses. What I find interesting is that the club doesn't require a rollbar in high speed driving events.
Our local Porsche Club requires a roll bar on all convertibles (this doesn't include Targas) and cars that are in classes higher than Improved (these cars can run r-compound dot legal tires and very minor suspension upgrades but otherwise stock). A majority of incidents on the track do not involve rollovers and the 5-point are almost always a benefit (kind of like in the old days when people used to say they didn't wear their safety belt because they might get into an accident where using the belt could cause more injury (trapped under water, getting thrown from the car might save you if it caught on fire?, etc.). For most instances, this is the exception.
In the accident IXLR8 showed, the occupants were both lucky. I'm not sure how fast the driver was going or if they rolled more than once but they could have easily been ejected from the car and crushed. While working on a safety crew, I've had to respond to two incidents where the cars rolled over and in one case a car rolled on the rod. In all cases, the cars landed upside-down and the structure of the car held up (all were 914's, maybe I should find another race car:( ). In two of the cars where the drivers were wearing 5-point belts, the occupants walked away with minor injuries (bruised knees). In the last car, the occupants were wearing 3-point (regular) belts and one of the occupants is now quadrapalegic (the belts didn't hold the occupant in place and her head hit the roof).
One last issue I want to bring up. I find it interesting that people are willing to put their cars on the track but don't want to put the safety gear in because it is a street car or it costs too much (I've done the same thing). I talk to guys who complain they have to drill holes in their cars to put the belts in or the car doesn't look good with the bar on it or "I only drive it on the track once in a while so why should I put a bar/5-point/etc. in the car?". My question is, how much is it going to cost you if you have an incident and need that equipment?
Our local Porsche Club requires a roll bar on all convertibles (this doesn't include Targas) and cars that are in classes higher than Improved (these cars can run r-compound dot legal tires and very minor suspension upgrades but otherwise stock). A majority of incidents on the track do not involve rollovers and the 5-point are almost always a benefit (kind of like in the old days when people used to say they didn't wear their safety belt because they might get into an accident where using the belt could cause more injury (trapped under water, getting thrown from the car might save you if it caught on fire?, etc.). For most instances, this is the exception.
In the accident IXLR8 showed, the occupants were both lucky. I'm not sure how fast the driver was going or if they rolled more than once but they could have easily been ejected from the car and crushed. While working on a safety crew, I've had to respond to two incidents where the cars rolled over and in one case a car rolled on the rod. In all cases, the cars landed upside-down and the structure of the car held up (all were 914's, maybe I should find another race car:( ). In two of the cars where the drivers were wearing 5-point belts, the occupants walked away with minor injuries (bruised knees). In the last car, the occupants were wearing 3-point (regular) belts and one of the occupants is now quadrapalegic (the belts didn't hold the occupant in place and her head hit the roof).
One last issue I want to bring up. I find it interesting that people are willing to put their cars on the track but don't want to put the safety gear in because it is a street car or it costs too much (I've done the same thing). I talk to guys who complain they have to drill holes in their cars to put the belts in or the car doesn't look good with the bar on it or "I only drive it on the track once in a while so why should I put a bar/5-point/etc. in the car?". My question is, how much is it going to cost you if you have an incident and need that equipment?
| Kostamojen | 09-25-2002 02:42 AM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Sea Dragon Rex [/i]
[B]My question is, how much is it going to cost you if you have an incident and need that equipment? [/B][/QUOTE]
I cant even afford a track day event, let alone that equipment :lol:
I just want something to replace my worn out old seatbelts and work for autocrosses :p
[B]My question is, how much is it going to cost you if you have an incident and need that equipment? [/B][/QUOTE]
I cant even afford a track day event, let alone that equipment :lol:
I just want something to replace my worn out old seatbelts and work for autocrosses :p
| Tim K. | 09-25-2002 07:58 AM |
I've used a Schroth Rallye 4 in my RS and WRX. I was not happy with the mounting points of the belt and felt they were a compromise at best. As such I would not use the harness except for autocrossing. Without a suitable harness bar in the back, the angle the shoulder straps would run to their mounting points is simply too steep.
The purpose they served in autocrossing was to keep me from sliding around in the seat more then anything else. I did feel confident in their ability to prevent serious injury from speeds encountered during autocrossing. However, I didn't feel the same way on the road where the potential for head-on impacts was prevelant.
Currently I have a Miata and I am installing a ProSolo I legal roll bar which does require some cutting and drilling of the car. I also intend to go with a 6 point harness with a minimum of 3" wide harness straps. If you are using a harness it is imperative you have anti-submarining straps (The Schroth is an exception, but I wouldn't want to test their claims) and that all straps be secured tightly.
Good luck!
The purpose they served in autocrossing was to keep me from sliding around in the seat more then anything else. I did feel confident in their ability to prevent serious injury from speeds encountered during autocrossing. However, I didn't feel the same way on the road where the potential for head-on impacts was prevelant.
Currently I have a Miata and I am installing a ProSolo I legal roll bar which does require some cutting and drilling of the car. I also intend to go with a 6 point harness with a minimum of 3" wide harness straps. If you are using a harness it is imperative you have anti-submarining straps (The Schroth is an exception, but I wouldn't want to test their claims) and that all straps be secured tightly.
Good luck!
| trojan9x | 09-25-2002 01:56 PM |
[url]http://www.soloracer.com/imprezarallye4.html[/url]
here you go...pics and instructions courtesy of soloracer.com
here you go...pics and instructions courtesy of soloracer.com
| Tim K. | 09-25-2002 02:07 PM |
The photographs accompanying the installation of the Schroth Harness aptly illustrates my concerns with the system. One of the first things you can see is the angle from the shoulders to the shoulder straps rear mounting points. It is rather steep and promotes compression of the spine. The second deals with the bending of the harness tabs in order to facilitate the install.
It really bothered me how easily the tabs bent. In addition, if involved in a collision the stresses placed at the mounting points would act upon the mounting tabs at the bends. It seemed possible there could be enough force and movement to cause shearing at the bend points. Not a comfortable feeling.
Again, I felt fine using the harness for autocrossing, but not for daily driving nor for track events.
It really bothered me how easily the tabs bent. In addition, if involved in a collision the stresses placed at the mounting points would act upon the mounting tabs at the bends. It seemed possible there could be enough force and movement to cause shearing at the bend points. Not a comfortable feeling.
Again, I felt fine using the harness for autocrossing, but not for daily driving nor for track events.
| Sea Dragon Rex | 09-25-2002 04:33 PM |
I agree with Tim K. concerning the spine compression issue. I believe that the belts shown in trojan9x's picture could cause injury. What I've seen in 911's is that instead of bolting the shoulder belts to the floor, they are instead bolted to the rear deck above and behind the rear seats (what little rear seats there are). This, of course, means that the rear seats are useless while utilizing the harnesses. However, how much time does it take to unbolt them and bolt them back in if you use your street car for the track?
I think the roof construction of the WRX is strong enough to support the rest of the car even without a roll bar or roll cage. If mounted correctly, I think I would rather take my chances with a 5-point instead of the regular 3-point. Again, if you are planning on doing a lot of track events, you should consider at least getting a bolt-in roll bar. They only cost a couple hundred bucks and are easy to install.
Again, how much is your head, body or life worth? Speaking of that, I need to buy a new set of harnesses. Mine are over 10 years old and the club I'm in requires newer harnesses.
I think the roof construction of the WRX is strong enough to support the rest of the car even without a roll bar or roll cage. If mounted correctly, I think I would rather take my chances with a 5-point instead of the regular 3-point. Again, if you are planning on doing a lot of track events, you should consider at least getting a bolt-in roll bar. They only cost a couple hundred bucks and are easy to install.
Again, how much is your head, body or life worth? Speaking of that, I need to buy a new set of harnesses. Mine are over 10 years old and the club I'm in requires newer harnesses.
| IXLR8 | 09-25-2002 05:47 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Sea Dragon Rex [/i]
[B]I agree with Tim K. concerning the spine compression issue. I believe that the belts shown in trojan9x's picture could cause injury. [/B][/QUOTE]
I'm NOT promoting Schroth (I don't use them myself) but... FYI Schroth certifies what seats are OK for use with their system (and how the belts must be routed) for exactly the reason you note... compression.
[B]I agree with Tim K. concerning the spine compression issue. I believe that the belts shown in trojan9x's picture could cause injury. [/B][/QUOTE]
I'm NOT promoting Schroth (I don't use them myself) but... FYI Schroth certifies what seats are OK for use with their system (and how the belts must be routed) for exactly the reason you note... compression.
| Tim K. | 09-25-2002 05:58 PM |
I know, and the last time I looked the RS nor the WRX were on the approved list. Its a good system when used in the right situation. With the RS and the WRX I felt there were too many compromises in the installation to ensure the belts operated properly in the event of an accident.
| ConeMasher | 09-25-2002 07:05 PM |
Schroth does certify the 87+ Justy, 86+ Sedan, and 86-90 XT.... all for the Rallye 3 ONLY (to anchor point C... the rear seat shoulder belt). The Rallye 4 is specified as NO INSTALL.
Perhaps it's not 100% correct to extrapolate this decision to the newer subies, but perhaps the reasoning is due to the spine compression issue mentioned earlier? As such, it might be prudent to only run the rallye 3 in the Subies.
Of course, "similar" cars 4-door cars like the A-4 are certified for the rallye 4 (at the D & E mounting points (rear passenger seat belt))... and their rear seats are no higher, therefore their shoulder to mounting-point angle remains identical (so Schroth dismisses the spine compression fear on these cars?)
*hmm*
-- Gary
Perhaps it's not 100% correct to extrapolate this decision to the newer subies, but perhaps the reasoning is due to the spine compression issue mentioned earlier? As such, it might be prudent to only run the rallye 3 in the Subies.
Of course, "similar" cars 4-door cars like the A-4 are certified for the rallye 4 (at the D & E mounting points (rear passenger seat belt))... and their rear seats are no higher, therefore their shoulder to mounting-point angle remains identical (so Schroth dismisses the spine compression fear on these cars?)
*hmm*
-- Gary
| trojan9x | 09-26-2002 08:26 AM |
i would say it depends on how high the seat goes above your shoulders. and they need to update there list with cars that were made after 1990.
i think most of the pressure would be on the top of the seat, not your shoulders. we'll see when i get it in. will have to take a pic to see what it looks like in use.
i think most of the pressure would be on the top of the seat, not your shoulders. we'll see when i get it in. will have to take a pic to see what it looks like in use.
| Tim K. | 09-26-2002 11:15 AM |
With my harness system I did feel a lot of compression pressure on my shoulders and back. However, I am fairly short and this might have had an additive effect in combination with the harness mounting points.
| trojan9x | 09-26-2002 11:33 AM |
what harness did you have? same one?
also, you should only be held down by the lap belt and held against the back of the seat by the shoulder belts, correct? You shouldn't feel pressure coming down on your shoulders. i've never used a harness before, but is that how it is supposed to feel?
also, you should only be held down by the lap belt and held against the back of the seat by the shoulder belts, correct? You shouldn't feel pressure coming down on your shoulders. i've never used a harness before, but is that how it is supposed to feel?
| ChrisDP | 09-26-2002 04:27 PM |
FYI, the BMW in the picture was not a convertible. It was a hardtop. You'd be pretty hard-pressed to keep any harness properly tightened, since I know at least I cannot reach the radio/AC/glovebox or anything once I'm belted into my car. I use a Schroth 3 for autocross, with the tailstrap mounted to the upper rear seatbelt mount to keep the strap parallel to the ground. I would not/do not use any harness on the street.
| Tim K. | 09-26-2002 05:52 PM |
I used the Schroth Rallye 4 system for autocrossing only. If the shoulder straps mounting points were mounted perpendicular to the shoulder then I doubt there would have been any downward pressure on the back. However, as the straps are mounted to the rear seat belt mounting points the tension angle is such that downward pressure would be exerted on my back if the shoulder straps were sufficiently tightened to prevent unwanted movement.
In order for any harness system to function properly they must be tightened very snugly. Remember, their function is to control your deceleration in the event of an accident. If you have any slack in the belts this will allow the body to continue to accelerate away from the seat during impact. When you factor this in with the belts stretch (and stretch they will!) you could wind up with serious injuries. This has been documented. Also, unsnug belts can allow for submarining. So please, even if it hurts, tighten up those crotch straps (the Schroth system uses a different technology)! The thigh area absorbs a tremendous amount of energy during a sudden deceleration (thankfully its well suited to this because of the large muscle and thigh bone).
In order for any harness system to function properly they must be tightened very snugly. Remember, their function is to control your deceleration in the event of an accident. If you have any slack in the belts this will allow the body to continue to accelerate away from the seat during impact. When you factor this in with the belts stretch (and stretch they will!) you could wind up with serious injuries. This has been documented. Also, unsnug belts can allow for submarining. So please, even if it hurts, tighten up those crotch straps (the Schroth system uses a different technology)! The thigh area absorbs a tremendous amount of energy during a sudden deceleration (thankfully its well suited to this because of the large muscle and thigh bone).
| Brett555 | 09-26-2002 06:02 PM |
Rallye 4's in my 2.5RS, which I autocross a lot...
[url]http://www.soloracer.com/imprezarallye4.html[/url]
[IMG]http://store3.yimg.com/I/soloracerdotcom_1705_1057081[/IMG]
[url]http://www.soloracer.com/imprezarallye4.html[/url]
[IMG]http://store3.yimg.com/I/soloracerdotcom_1705_1057081[/IMG]
| trojan9x | 10-05-2002 11:21 AM |
one more thing to add.
the child seat anchors should be as strong as the seat belt bolts, correct?
[color=blue]what if you bolted the harness to them so that it's not putting the stress down on your shoulders[/color]
btw, i got the harness, it's in, and my first race with it will be tomorrow. i'm anxious to try it out.
the child seat anchors should be as strong as the seat belt bolts, correct?
[color=blue]what if you bolted the harness to them so that it's not putting the stress down on your shoulders[/color]
btw, i got the harness, it's in, and my first race with it will be tomorrow. i'm anxious to try it out.
| Corey | 10-05-2002 06:53 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by trojan9x [/i]
[B]one more thing to add.
the child seat anchors should be as strong as the seat belt bolts, correct?
[/B][/QUOTE]
No, they aren't nearly as strong. Did you ever take your rear deck apart? The rear deck is made out of very thin gauge steel compared to the reinforced seatbelt attachment points. They are obviously not meant to handle the weight of a 200lb person pulling on them in a wreck.
Corey #89 SM
[B]one more thing to add.
the child seat anchors should be as strong as the seat belt bolts, correct?
[/B][/QUOTE]
No, they aren't nearly as strong. Did you ever take your rear deck apart? The rear deck is made out of very thin gauge steel compared to the reinforced seatbelt attachment points. They are obviously not meant to handle the weight of a 200lb person pulling on them in a wreck.
Corey #89 SM
| Tim K. | 10-05-2002 07:52 PM |
Corey is right. Definately do not use the child seat mounting points for your harness.
| trojan9x | 10-05-2002 08:08 PM |
it's all i needed to know. that's why i asked
| aspera | 10-27-2002 02:26 AM |
shedding off the pounds
Can I take them out then?:)
| aspera | 05-14-2003 03:36 AM |
I'm in the process of trying to install some Willans harnesses. They're 2" strap, twin tail, push button, clip-in ones.
Why the hell couldn't Subaru make the child anchors hella strong? They have to be pretty stong already, right? What would it have cost them, like a dollar per car? This thread would not exist if there were solid anchor points in place for people wanting to do exactly what we're trying to do.
So Subaru listen up. Make the next Impreza more harness ready. I want to see every seat and seat belt bolt be able to take a 7/16 by 20 fine thread eyebolt. That includes the one on the transmission tunnel. It should not interfere with the seat slider. I do like how the carpet is "hole ready" for an eyebolt at the base of the B-pillar. I don't like how that bolt is spaced to make room for the brake lines. Run the brake/fuel (?) lines on the tranny tunnel. That will eliminate the problem for both RHD and LHD drivers. The lines will also be better protected from impact.
The rear parcel shelf should have ADULT anchor points instead of child anchor points.
I don't know if the next Impreza will have these features, but my next car will.:)
Why the hell couldn't Subaru make the child anchors hella strong? They have to be pretty stong already, right? What would it have cost them, like a dollar per car? This thread would not exist if there were solid anchor points in place for people wanting to do exactly what we're trying to do.
So Subaru listen up. Make the next Impreza more harness ready. I want to see every seat and seat belt bolt be able to take a 7/16 by 20 fine thread eyebolt. That includes the one on the transmission tunnel. It should not interfere with the seat slider. I do like how the carpet is "hole ready" for an eyebolt at the base of the B-pillar. I don't like how that bolt is spaced to make room for the brake lines. Run the brake/fuel (?) lines on the tranny tunnel. That will eliminate the problem for both RHD and LHD drivers. The lines will also be better protected from impact.
The rear parcel shelf should have ADULT anchor points instead of child anchor points.
I don't know if the next Impreza will have these features, but my next car will.:)
| trojan9x | 05-15-2003 09:45 AM |
I don't see why it isn't that strong either. I mean, would you feel safe having your baby strapped into that? there has to be some sort of test done to see the strenght of the baby seat harness.
| fengshui-fu | 05-15-2003 10:17 AM |
check these out, they are relatively inexpensive and will allow all your harnessing desires:
[url]http://www.upgrademotoring.com/safety/autopower.htm[/url]
chris
[url]http://www.upgrademotoring.com/safety/autopower.htm[/url]
chris
| gqzboy | 05-21-2003 12:22 AM |
hum
what about the TAKATA racing harness??
| MSG | 05-21-2003 05:01 PM |
I have installed the [URL=http://www.speedwaremotorsports.com/safety/hbars.asp]SpeedWare Motorsports[/URL] Harness bar, which is real sweet, with Sparco 5 point belts. They make a tremendous improvement at track events, making me feel much more stable and secure. However that BMW picture at the top of the thread is pretty chilling.
One point to make-With a harness bar in the back seat, I have converted my WRX into a 2 passenger car. It is incredibly unsafe to have passengers back there. One hard stop and they will do a forehead pant into 1 1/2" stainless tubing. It is a removable bar, but I likely won't remove it before the fall when track events end for the year. Unless I need to take the car in for some serious warranty work.....
MSG
One point to make-With a harness bar in the back seat, I have converted my WRX into a 2 passenger car. It is incredibly unsafe to have passengers back there. One hard stop and they will do a forehead pant into 1 1/2" stainless tubing. It is a removable bar, but I likely won't remove it before the fall when track events end for the year. Unless I need to take the car in for some serious warranty work.....
MSG
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