| Tuner1 | 07-10-2005 01:51 PM |
Mesh screen for TMIC - any good ideas?
�
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I would like to have a mesh screen to protect my STi TMIC from bugs and stones. Has anyone found a simple and effective way or installing a screen into the hood scoop opening or even directly on top of the TMIC?
Thanks :)
Thanks :)
| WRXRgr | 07-10-2005 02:13 PM |
You can get something called "gutter guard" at Lowes or Home Depot...it's a galvanized mesh, 36" for about four bucks. The stuff I found will lay in the IC tray, and if you cut it short enough to leave a 1/2" space at either end, the rubber skirt will seal as usual. You don't even need to try to change the "arch" in it...it works fine. I vinyl dipped mine, it could be spray painted or just left as-is.
A fellow I know that claims direct communications with Prodrive told me that using a screen "reduces the IC efficiency by 17%"...I really don't know. ;-)
Edit: it's easy to cut with tin snips...possibly even with heavy-duty scissors.
A fellow I know that claims direct communications with Prodrive told me that using a screen "reduces the IC efficiency by 17%"...I really don't know. ;-)
Edit: it's easy to cut with tin snips...possibly even with heavy-duty scissors.
| I LOVE SIU MAIS | 07-10-2005 03:51 PM |
scooby mods has a DIY mesh cover for the STI TMIC...
| Damon | 07-10-2005 04:32 PM |
gutter guard would not really do much of a job protecting the intercooler, as the holes are huge compared to small stones and bugs.
| Subie Gal | 07-10-2005 04:36 PM |
[QUOTE=Damon]gutter guard would not really do much of a job protecting the intercooler, as the holes are huge compared to small stones and bugs.[/QUOTE]
works great on my race car
double it up if you cant find some of a 'smaller' size
Jamie
works great on my race car
double it up if you cant find some of a 'smaller' size
Jamie
| WRXRgr | 07-10-2005 04:51 PM |
[QUOTE=Damon]gutter guard would not really do much of a job protecting the intercooler, as the holes are huge compared to small stones and bugs.[/QUOTE]
I wouldn't try getting "small" enough to block bugs and small stones---at that point, I think you'd definitely be impeding much airflow. My objective was just to deflect/slow down anything large and heavy enough to mash fins...I used the same stuff to fab a grille for protecting the lower front opening (AC evaporator/condenser, never can remember which it is :D ).
I wouldn't try getting "small" enough to block bugs and small stones---at that point, I think you'd definitely be impeding much airflow. My objective was just to deflect/slow down anything large and heavy enough to mash fins...I used the same stuff to fab a grille for protecting the lower front opening (AC evaporator/condenser, never can remember which it is :D ).
| WRXRgr | 07-10-2005 04:53 PM |
[QUOTE=I LOVE SIU MAIS]scooby mods has a DIY mesh cover for the STI TMIC...[/QUOTE]
If it's the same one I remember, he's got it going across the entire top surface of the IC...which keeps the rubber skirting on the splitter from inserting down into the recess, where the IC fins live.
If it's the same one I remember, he's got it going across the entire top surface of the IC...which keeps the rubber skirting on the splitter from inserting down into the recess, where the IC fins live.
| joeyb7 | 07-10-2005 06:55 PM |
why not just use screen mesh that cost almost nothing??
| WRXRgr | 07-10-2005 07:08 PM |
Assuming you mean regular "window screen", it has no strength to protect the IC fins, and IMHO, it's too darn fine a mesh for good airflow...but whatever floats yer boat ;-) !!
| Tuner1 | 07-11-2005 10:52 PM |
[QUOTE=WRXRgr]
A fellow I know that claims direct communications with Prodrive told me that using a screen "reduces the IC efficiency by 17%"...I really don't know. ;-)
[/QUOTE]
I am sure this data is accurate which is one of the things holding me back from covering my TMIC with mesh. I have other industry data showing the same or worse cooling reduction when placing a type of mesh screen in front of a radiator. Maybe my TMIC will have to lead a rough and dented life :D
A fellow I know that claims direct communications with Prodrive told me that using a screen "reduces the IC efficiency by 17%"...I really don't know. ;-)
[/QUOTE]
I am sure this data is accurate which is one of the things holding me back from covering my TMIC with mesh. I have other industry data showing the same or worse cooling reduction when placing a type of mesh screen in front of a radiator. Maybe my TMIC will have to lead a rough and dented life :D
| Vew | 07-11-2005 11:24 PM |
The reason behind that is that the fine mesh in combo with the high speed, the air just moves right over the mesh, not thru it. But i usually hear about that with radiators, not IC's. They have a tendency to overheat the car on intererstate driving.
| andrew12 | 07-12-2005 09:29 AM |
dude that number is bs... 17 percent is quite a lot and seemingly quite a myth.
with that mesh stuff from home depot, gutter guard or whatever, i highly doubt there are any side effects seeing it as how the holes are large enough to allow air flow but also will deflect any objects that hits it which = happy IC... just do the gutter guard stuff.
chile
with that mesh stuff from home depot, gutter guard or whatever, i highly doubt there are any side effects seeing it as how the holes are large enough to allow air flow but also will deflect any objects that hits it which = happy IC... just do the gutter guard stuff.
chile
| WRXRgr | 07-12-2005 10:13 AM |
I posted that info, somewhat in hopes of receiving some independent corroboration or dismissal ;-) The source owns a *very* well worked STi (and the discretionary funding to make it so), but some of his advice ("Put cold air on that thing!" <my WRX>) has disagreed with everything else I've seen. Too bad we can't get Myth Busters to check it out! :-P
| Turbo4Life | 07-12-2005 10:33 AM |
Intercooler Screen Mod: (Copied from Scoobymods.com)
Here are the instructions on how to make your very own intercooler
screen. This is a very worthwhile mod especially if you live in a high bug
area or your roads are full of those damn little rocks that always tend to
chip your mirrors, bumper etc. Total cost on this mod is about 1 hour of
your time and $10.00 or your milk money.
TOOLS:
Pliers, whichever you feel comfy with
Newspapers
Wire cutters or sharp scissors.
Ruler
MATERIALS:
Both items were found at Home Depot
(1) Roll of Mesh Wire Sheet
(1) Can of Pink Paint (optional)
(1) Can of Black Paint (opitonal)
MEASUREMENTS:
19 inches wide
7 inches high
Basically this is a wire mesh screen that covers your intercooler and
prevents the fins from getting hit/bent by rocks and debris.
You could buy the Prodive one for $100.00 I believe. Cut out two identical sized sheets from your roll of wire screen. I used pliers to
bend the ends of one of the sheets over the other making one sheet. Make sheet 2 slightly off center of sheet 1 to get a finer mesh. I also printed out an STI logo and made a stencil. I Painted the screen black and then used the pink paint for the logo.
Once the paint is all nice and dry (if you did this step) just lay the
screen over the intercooler and fold the ends over the intercooler. No need to use any extra fasteners or twist-ties, the bending alone is very secure.
There you are a $10 part that will save you a lot of money for a new intercooler.
[IMG]http://www.scoobymods.com/mods/wrx/images/icguard.jpg[/IMG]
Here are the instructions on how to make your very own intercooler
screen. This is a very worthwhile mod especially if you live in a high bug
area or your roads are full of those damn little rocks that always tend to
chip your mirrors, bumper etc. Total cost on this mod is about 1 hour of
your time and $10.00 or your milk money.
TOOLS:
Pliers, whichever you feel comfy with
Newspapers
Wire cutters or sharp scissors.
Ruler
MATERIALS:
Both items were found at Home Depot
(1) Roll of Mesh Wire Sheet
(1) Can of Pink Paint (optional)
(1) Can of Black Paint (opitonal)
MEASUREMENTS:
19 inches wide
7 inches high
Basically this is a wire mesh screen that covers your intercooler and
prevents the fins from getting hit/bent by rocks and debris.
You could buy the Prodive one for $100.00 I believe. Cut out two identical sized sheets from your roll of wire screen. I used pliers to
bend the ends of one of the sheets over the other making one sheet. Make sheet 2 slightly off center of sheet 1 to get a finer mesh. I also printed out an STI logo and made a stencil. I Painted the screen black and then used the pink paint for the logo.
Once the paint is all nice and dry (if you did this step) just lay the
screen over the intercooler and fold the ends over the intercooler. No need to use any extra fasteners or twist-ties, the bending alone is very secure.
There you are a $10 part that will save you a lot of money for a new intercooler.
[IMG]http://www.scoobymods.com/mods/wrx/images/icguard.jpg[/IMG]
| Pain++ | 07-12-2005 10:46 AM |
Good find! That's a really cost-efficent and nice looking mod.
| WRXRgr | 07-12-2005 10:53 AM |
Yup, that's the one I was thinking of...bad, see how it goes flush across the entire IC frame?
What's happened to the rubber sealing skirt from your splitter, that would normally *insert* down into the recess right above the IC fins (about 1/2-3/4" past where that screen is laying)? That rubber skirt expands out under air flow pressure at speed, and helps direct the airflow thru the IC. That particular screen method totally nullifies the skirt's functionality.
Slip your fingers in the scoop with the hood closed, and feel how the skirt lies inside the recess of the IC.
What's happened to the rubber sealing skirt from your splitter, that would normally *insert* down into the recess right above the IC fins (about 1/2-3/4" past where that screen is laying)? That rubber skirt expands out under air flow pressure at speed, and helps direct the airflow thru the IC. That particular screen method totally nullifies the skirt's functionality.
Slip your fingers in the scoop with the hood closed, and feel how the skirt lies inside the recess of the IC.
| drees | 07-12-2005 01:01 PM |
Yep, the mesh screen above will prevent proper sealing of the scoop/seal.
I believe the claims of 17% reduction in airflow. Would you stick gutter guard into your intake pipe?
That said, I would propbably do the install which attaches the guard to the back of the supports of the scoop instead of onto the IC iteslf.
I believe the claims of 17% reduction in airflow. Would you stick gutter guard into your intake pipe?
That said, I would propbably do the install which attaches the guard to the back of the supports of the scoop instead of onto the IC iteslf.
| tasq | 07-12-2005 01:27 PM |
Gutter mesh :)
[IMG]http://endepth.com/dave/ic/1.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://endepth.com/dave/ic/2.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://endepth.com/dave/ic/3.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://endepth.com/dave/ic/4.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://endepth.com/dave/ic/5.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://endepth.com/dave/ic/1.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://endepth.com/dave/ic/2.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://endepth.com/dave/ic/3.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://endepth.com/dave/ic/4.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://endepth.com/dave/ic/5.jpg[/IMG]
| crashtest sonny | 07-12-2005 01:40 PM |
^^ by laying it right on top, how is that gonna prevent rocks and bugs? you probably can clean out the bugs, but with it laying RIGHT ON top, you cant stop rocks from bending your fins..you'll need like half an in space in between the IC and grill for the grill to catch everything.
| tasq | 07-12-2005 01:43 PM |
[QUOTE=crashtest sonny]^^ by laying it right on top, how is that gonna prevent rocks and bugs? you probably can clean out the bugs, but with it laying RIGHT ON top, you cant stop rocks from bending your fins..you'll need like half an in space in between the IC and grill for the grill to catch everything.[/QUOTE]
Actually, I have noticed a 90% decrease in bent fins. :rolleyes:
Actually, I have noticed a 90% decrease in bent fins. :rolleyes:
| Smurfy | 07-12-2005 02:49 PM |
I 57% belielve you..
| tasq | 07-12-2005 02:55 PM |
[QUOTE=Smurfy]I 57% belielve you..[/QUOTE]
:lol: 90% is a rough number, but IC temps have stayed same as stock and I have alot less bent fins.
:lol: 90% is a rough number, but IC temps have stayed same as stock and I have alot less bent fins.
| WRXRgr | 07-12-2005 06:49 PM |
[QUOTE=crashtest sonny]^^ by laying it right on top, how is that gonna prevent rocks and bugs? you probably can clean out the bugs, but with it laying RIGHT ON top, you cant stop rocks from bending your fins..you'll need like half an in space in between the IC and grill for the grill to catch everything.[/QUOTE]
Bugs break up on mine...looks like he flattened his piece out. As it comes, it has a natural arch to it, that would have it raised up in the middle (left-to-right middle, of the IC) about 5/8" off the fins. It's strong enough that I can pretty much drop socket wrenches, etc in with no concern of bending fins...heck, that might be the best benefit for it :lol:
Bugs break up on mine...looks like he flattened his piece out. As it comes, it has a natural arch to it, that would have it raised up in the middle (left-to-right middle, of the IC) about 5/8" off the fins. It's strong enough that I can pretty much drop socket wrenches, etc in with no concern of bending fins...heck, that might be the best benefit for it :lol:
| joeyb7 | 07-12-2005 06:56 PM |
maybe I'm not understanding this... but if everyone is trying to make the screen's have finer holes by using two sheets, offsetting them, etc., why isn't the screen that you would screen in a porch, etc. with the right thing to use here?
| rishoboy6 | 07-12-2005 07:04 PM |
[QUOTE=joeyb7]maybe I'm not understanding this... but if everyone is trying to make the screen's have finer holes by using two sheets, offsetting them, etc., why isn't the screen that you would screen in a porch, etc. with the right thing to use here?[/QUOTE]
that type of screen is too flimsy to do the job. . .i followed the one on scooby mods, and it works well for blocking bugs and rocks. as far as IC efficiency, my WRX seems fine. . .at least to the butt dyno.
that type of screen is too flimsy to do the job. . .i followed the one on scooby mods, and it works well for blocking bugs and rocks. as far as IC efficiency, my WRX seems fine. . .at least to the butt dyno.
| down_for_the_scooby | 07-15-2005 11:16 PM |
To all who think one would lose horsepower because the splitter is not flush against the intercololer, it makes no difference. There is no suction being generated.
| WRXRgr | 07-15-2005 11:53 PM |
[QUOTE=down_for_the_scooby]To all who think one would lose horsepower because the splitter is not flush against the intercololer, it makes no difference. There is no suction being generated.[/QUOTE]
No, silly! No suction...the opposite, higher pressure!
As in, higher pressure is developed by the scoop, scooping out a hunk of air flowing over the hood.
The air fills the schoopah, creating higher pressure inside...now, where does it go?!?!
Why, just like electricity and lazy people, it will follow the path of least resistance!
Is the path of least resistance, thru that IC core, with all those little spiney things that are hard for the air to squeeze past?? Or is it out to the sides, where that rubber skirt [B]used[/B] to block airflow?!?
No, silly! No suction...the opposite, higher pressure!
As in, higher pressure is developed by the scoop, scooping out a hunk of air flowing over the hood.
The air fills the schoopah, creating higher pressure inside...now, where does it go?!?!
Why, just like electricity and lazy people, it will follow the path of least resistance!
Is the path of least resistance, thru that IC core, with all those little spiney things that are hard for the air to squeeze past?? Or is it out to the sides, where that rubber skirt [B]used[/B] to block airflow?!?
| ittybitty_STI | 07-16-2005 02:11 PM |
I like that idea as well thats another mod ill be doing soon as well.
| markadopolus | 07-16-2005 09:04 PM |
[QUOTE=tasq]Actually, I have noticed a 90% decrease in bent fins. :rolleyes:[/QUOTE]
I have not gotten a single bent fin since I layed a screen on my IC. That was over 1000 miles ago. Sometimes bugs get stuck, but no matter what, screen or no screen, bugs will stick in the intercooler. Now its just easier to clean them off.
tasq...is that gutter mesh made out of metal, or something like PVC?
I have not gotten a single bent fin since I layed a screen on my IC. That was over 1000 miles ago. Sometimes bugs get stuck, but no matter what, screen or no screen, bugs will stick in the intercooler. Now its just easier to clean them off.
tasq...is that gutter mesh made out of metal, or something like PVC?
| WRXRgr | 07-16-2005 09:13 PM |
The gutter guard from Lowes is galvanized steel. I've got it in lower radiator opening also, and have noted no rusting...just to see how it would hold up, I put a cut scrap in the grass next to my garage door. It's been exposed to the elements for over a year, with no paint, and still shows no sign of rust.
| tasq | 07-17-2005 01:42 AM |
[QUOTE=markadopolus]I have not gotten a single bent fin since I layed a screen on my IC. That was over 1000 miles ago. Sometimes bugs get stuck, but no matter what, screen or no screen, bugs will stick in the intercooler. Now its just easier to clean them off.
tasq...is that gutter mesh made out of metal, or something like PVC?[/QUOTE]
yea it is metal :)
tasq...is that gutter mesh made out of metal, or something like PVC?[/QUOTE]
yea it is metal :)
| Bundyboyz | 07-17-2005 02:57 PM |
That 17% from prodrive is B.S. Sure it may cover 17% of your intercooler, but it's not going to effect the capability to cool it that much.
Certainly not in the rain.
I wonder if that false statement is because they sell a screen for 100.00
In addition you guys talking about door screen... well that will obstruct air flow quiet a bit. Stick with the mesh, it will stop/slow down a rock and that's going to cause the most damage.
Unless you swallow a bird :D
Certainly not in the rain.
I wonder if that false statement is because they sell a screen for 100.00
In addition you guys talking about door screen... well that will obstruct air flow quiet a bit. Stick with the mesh, it will stop/slow down a rock and that's going to cause the most damage.
Unless you swallow a bird :D
| WRXjp93 | 08-24-2005 11:41 AM |
shoot me down if im wrong, but i saw another thread on these forums about puting a screen (for looks) at the entrance to the scoop. so if you doubled-up your mesh, offset the two pieces and installed it at the scoop entrance; would that not solve the pebble, bug, and gasket problem?
| drees | 08-24-2005 01:55 PM |
[QUOTE=WRXjp93]shoot me down if im wrong, but i saw another thread on these forums about puting a screen (for looks) at the entrance to the scoop. so if you doubled-up your mesh, offset the two pieces and installed it at the scoop entrance; would that not solve the pebble, bug, and gasket problem?[/QUOTE]Yes, I would recommend a screen at the scoop entrance over a screen that sits on the IC.
| WRXjp93 | 08-24-2005 08:36 PM |
[URL=http://www.scoobymods.com/forums/showthread.php?t=235]Scoop Screen Mod[/URL]
Go to this link to get an idea of what i was talking about. This guy did a great job. i gotta give hive major credit for this.
Go to this link to get an idea of what i was talking about. This guy did a great job. i gotta give hive major credit for this.
| BIGSKYWRX | 08-24-2005 11:55 PM |
I've never seen or heard of Prodrive IC screen- somone care to post up this mythical beast :)
You certainly DO want the rubber seal to fit into your IC- a good seal is critical. A screen as shown above (that lies flush w/ the fins) that allows this good seal I can't see hurting efficiency at all (and should help protect the fins)
You certainly DO want the rubber seal to fit into your IC- a good seal is critical. A screen as shown above (that lies flush w/ the fins) that allows this good seal I can't see hurting efficiency at all (and should help protect the fins)
| Alizarin | 08-25-2005 11:40 PM |
[QUOTE=joeyb7]maybe I'm not understanding this... but if everyone is trying to make the screen's have finer holes by using two sheets, offsetting them, etc., why isn't the screen that you would screen in a porch, etc. with the right thing to use here?[/QUOTE]
A good analogy from a Floridian. The first thing on a house to fail is usually a screen porch or screen pool enclosure. And those can fail even in strong tropical storm force winds (>60mph). They just tear apart since they can't flow the volume of air required.
A good analogy from a Floridian. The first thing on a house to fail is usually a screen porch or screen pool enclosure. And those can fail even in strong tropical storm force winds (>60mph). They just tear apart since they can't flow the volume of air required.
| TurboRoo | 08-26-2005 10:27 AM |
I have the gilcraft grill on my 03. I got it used and it works great. I�ve had it for over a year now. It catches a lot a bugs, mainly bumble bees. :lol: Some very tiny rocks get past it but that�s about it. It did stop a bird from going in the hood scoop about a month ago. I�d recommend it. I�m not sure if they have one for the 04+ models yet or not though.
| WRXjp93 | 08-26-2005 10:43 AM |
i was looking around today and i saw that grillcraft scoop grill too. that would be the best and easiest way to go, but if they dont make it for your model id just go with the DIY.
| thatwrxman | 09-02-2005 09:33 PM |
ha ha ha
�
�
You really think that the rubber "BLOCKED" airflow? Go look at the Japan tuned cars they run with out them. I think they are going for mass air. Maybe it is easier for the air to go through the fins straight down from the scoop. Does it seem that it's easier for the air to have to change directions and go down the sides of the intercooler and rest of the engine bay? ;)
[QUOTE=WRXRgr]No, silly! No suction...the opposite, higher pressure!
As in, higher pressure is developed by the scoop, scooping out a hunk of air flowing over the hood.
The air fills the schoopah, creating higher pressure inside...now, where does it go?!?!
Why, just like electricity and lazy people, it will follow the path of least resistance!
Is the path of least resistance, thru that IC core, with all those little spiney things that are hard for the air to squeeze past?? Or is it out to the sides, where that rubber skirt [B]used[/B] to block airflow?!?[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=WRXRgr]No, silly! No suction...the opposite, higher pressure!
As in, higher pressure is developed by the scoop, scooping out a hunk of air flowing over the hood.
The air fills the schoopah, creating higher pressure inside...now, where does it go?!?!
Why, just like electricity and lazy people, it will follow the path of least resistance!
Is the path of least resistance, thru that IC core, with all those little spiney things that are hard for the air to squeeze past?? Or is it out to the sides, where that rubber skirt [B]used[/B] to block airflow?!?[/QUOTE]
| WRXRgr | 09-02-2005 09:51 PM |
Blocks, directs, seals...whatever term you like ;-)
Next time you have your IC off, take a close look at it...no, a CLOSE look! Get your eyeball down there and look *past* the ends of the fins...what does it look like down in there? Think that offers more resistance to airflow--you betcha! Will some air spill out the sides, as the flow thru the IC fin-core offers resistance--if the rubber skirt is missing, or doesn't properly seal against the IC rim? Can there be any doubt?
Here's one for ya: what percentage of WRXs come from the factory, with an improperly fitted IC scoop skirt?
Next time you have your IC off, take a close look at it...no, a CLOSE look! Get your eyeball down there and look *past* the ends of the fins...what does it look like down in there? Think that offers more resistance to airflow--you betcha! Will some air spill out the sides, as the flow thru the IC fin-core offers resistance--if the rubber skirt is missing, or doesn't properly seal against the IC rim? Can there be any doubt?
Here's one for ya: what percentage of WRXs come from the factory, with an improperly fitted IC scoop skirt?
| thatwrxman | 09-02-2005 10:39 PM |
oh oh pic me......87% ?????????
| scrmblr2 | 09-02-2005 11:27 PM |
I just got some chicken wire mesh and bent it around. Works real well for keepin rocks and big bugs out:)
| djerickd | 09-02-2005 11:29 PM |
is window screen too small of a mesh for this application?
| thatwrxman | 09-03-2005 01:43 AM |
yeah man....just doesn't hold up well
| djerickd | 09-03-2005 01:57 AM |
I'm talking about airflow wise...
| thatwrxman | 09-03-2005 02:00 AM |
yeah....think of the sound of wind blowing through that type of mesh or go get a fan and do it. feel the difference between in front of the mesh which is how it would be without it and behind it . you can actually feel the restriction and hear it too if you listen you can hear that kind of whistling sound
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