| Mr. Jones | 02-15-2001 09:05 PM |
OT: Poll - buying a second car as a Track/AutoX/Drag/Rally car - what would you buy?
See what the Scooby folks have to say! I drive a '98 A4 as a daily driver, but have always had a thing for Subarus - almost bought an RS myself...
But for this, I'm talking a car that you could really build up, learn on, and not worry about breaking kind. Here are some options I came up with - what would YOU do? (thinking ~$15K or so pricecap, for the sake of argument, that brings the Z and RX-7 in range...)
- '90-6 300ZX TT
- 3gen RX-7
- '90-94 DSM (Eclipse, Talon etc)
- Supra Twin Turbo
- Some older porsche flavor
98.5 A4 1.8T? hehe just kidding.
- older Impreza L or somepin?
myself, I think I'm might try a '93-94 GSX or something so I can try to get some real HP out of it, and maybe learn to rally or drive well on snow/ice. I'm sure I'm speaking to a pretty dedicated AWD crowd!
you?
Jake
Fort Collins, CO
'98.5 A4 1.8TQMS
But for this, I'm talking a car that you could really build up, learn on, and not worry about breaking kind. Here are some options I came up with - what would YOU do? (thinking ~$15K or so pricecap, for the sake of argument, that brings the Z and RX-7 in range...)
- '90-6 300ZX TT
- 3gen RX-7
- '90-94 DSM (Eclipse, Talon etc)
- Supra Twin Turbo
- Some older porsche flavor
98.5 A4 1.8T? hehe just kidding.
- older Impreza L or somepin?
myself, I think I'm might try a '93-94 GSX or something so I can try to get some real HP out of it, and maybe learn to rally or drive well on snow/ice. I'm sure I'm speaking to a pretty dedicated AWD crowd!
you?
Jake
Fort Collins, CO
'98.5 A4 1.8TQMS
| Hucker | 02-15-2001 09:09 PM |
Mazda 323GTX, cheap, and with $1000 worth of mods, they fly...
| Kostamojen | 02-16-2001 12:19 AM |
Theres a sweet late 80's Red 911 Carrera with the big spoiler and big ole' fender flares for sale at a Used car lot... I'd love to supe that up for the track!
| Habu | 02-16-2001 12:33 AM |
Older Porsche would be an excellent choice. That's what I'd have. Or even and older Impreza and just do some work on it. But yeah I'd go with a late 70's/early 80's Porsche 911S, or SC.
Gotta fly!
Skippy
Gotta fly!
Skippy
| inzomniac | 02-16-2001 04:10 AM |
Audi Quattro from the late 80's, something like a 4000, or a coupe if I could find it.
Right now I"m working on getting a mini ready for 2003, all I have is the chasis and I'm working from there. [img]http://www.i-club.com/ubb-files/smilies/biggrin.gif[/img]
Right now I"m working on getting a mini ready for 2003, all I have is the chasis and I'm working from there. [img]http://www.i-club.com/ubb-files/smilies/biggrin.gif[/img]
| hacman | 02-16-2001 04:19 AM |
I'd go with either a 91-93 Toyota MR2 Turbo (you won't find a 94-95 under 15K), or the 90-93 Eclipse GSX. Or even a 70's Porshce 914. [img]http://www.i-club.com/ubb-files/smilies/smile.gif[/img]
| JayP | 02-16-2001 05:07 AM |
Mk II VW GTi: Light, fast and plenty of parts available.
'87 Porsche 924: Lightweight, good balance and has the 944 engine.
If you want to drive, forget the high-hp cars. With all that power, you'll never learn to drive properly.
'87 Porsche 924: Lightweight, good balance and has the 944 engine.
If you want to drive, forget the high-hp cars. With all that power, you'll never learn to drive properly.
| scoobiejosh | 02-16-2001 05:24 AM |
3rd gen 7. You can leave it stock to learn how to drive, if you have little/no experience like me. And then go crazy with it later. It is in my opinion one of the best track cars to come off of a production car line. And as long as you dont get stupid with upgrades and make sure the car is maintained, and all the weak links taken care of, it will be a reliable car. My too sence, but then again im a rotary nut.
Josh[img]http://www.i-club.com/ubb-files/smilies/monkey.gif[/img]
Josh[img]http://www.i-club.com/ubb-files/smilies/monkey.gif[/img]
| litespeed | 02-16-2001 05:45 AM |
Some other members have mentioned Porsches as a great car for setting up for the track and autocross. I love the brand and I have a older brother that used to do that very thing with a 1973 911T. Great car and tons of fun to drive and a sound like no other (especially with the twin pipe Euro-rally exhaust). Man, but what a money pit! That it had a contributing factor in his divorce was a general family opinion. Any engine mods are very expensive, dry sump oil changes take 10 quarts, platinum plugs are pricey, suspension parts will kill you and if you break anything be prepared to pay top dollar for parts and labor. They are not easy cars to work on in the garage and take some specialized tools I understand. I personally would love to have an older 911 tweaked to an RS level, but I could only do that if I won the Lottery or had a trust fund. Sorry to seem such a downer, but German "performance" cars are in a whole different category of complexity and cost, compared to the Japanese cars. I have a '98 RS that I bought used and I think with mods it would be a great weekend track and fun car with a lower cost.
The only Porsche that you might consider (and most consider it less of a "real" Porsche) would be a 2.0 litre 914. Mid-engine, some VW parts compatibility, cheap, fast enough to scare you and they make neat sounds. I remember my brother's autocross buddies used to run them and had a blast without the cost. Not a pretty car, but fun nontheless. Good luck on your search.
The only Porsche that you might consider (and most consider it less of a "real" Porsche) would be a 2.0 litre 914. Mid-engine, some VW parts compatibility, cheap, fast enough to scare you and they make neat sounds. I remember my brother's autocross buddies used to run them and had a blast without the cost. Not a pretty car, but fun nontheless. Good luck on your search.
| smacksube | 02-16-2001 05:53 AM |
I'd build my own car from the everything up, if I had a 15k price cap, which is pretty freakin alot, I'd take a 5th gen hatchback civic, tack on all the suspension stuff, then drop in a vvt-i engine, or a vtec engine, or a heavily modded non-vtec, doh, you can't have my decide on one decision, 15k is alotttta money for a car to screw around and learn on, but I'd definitely go something hybrid
| slidewaysmike | 02-16-2001 07:49 AM |
I would go for the MkII VW GTI myself also.
Oh wait... Thats exactly what I did. I have an 85 GTI that I am building to go Rally with. I like it because the car was cheap, parts are very abundant, and the thing will still be competetive in G2. Heck, this last years SCCA G2 champion drove a VW GTI.
Mike
Oh wait... Thats exactly what I did. I have an 85 GTI that I am building to go Rally with. I like it because the car was cheap, parts are very abundant, and the thing will still be competetive in G2. Heck, this last years SCCA G2 champion drove a VW GTI.
Mike
| Jason | 02-16-2001 09:31 AM |
I would get a Suzuki Swift GT(i). Low cost, easy to work on, cheap replacement parts and ultra light weight, 1700lbs.It has fewer performance parts selection though.
| JZ oo7 | 02-16-2001 01:38 PM |
a 1985-87 corolla gts (AE86) twin-cam. heard it was a great car to drive. it's way under 15g, and you can use the rest of the money to get parts. like the japanese race engine for it that is a 5 valuer, and it revs to like 11k i think. if you gonna do all this stuff, i'm guessing you want a car that is low on maintence and a car that you can stomp on, kick on when you get pissed, don't do it to a supra, or a FD, or a 300zx. people that loves those cars might get pissed off (me [img]http://www.i-club.com/ubb-files/smilies/biggrin.gif[/img] )
| jeffg | 02-16-2001 02:07 PM |
I hate to say it, but unless you are flexible about the price cap, and/or love to be a mechanic, I would stay away from the 3rd gen RX7. They are great cars, but they are kind of fragile in stock form. Subframe connectors ($500), seals, trannies, rearends, all have a lot of weakness in stock form, epecially once you start making more power. If you replace all those parts with the "Race" kit, then you are good to go, but last time I looked the race kit was like $5k. Efini or nothing as far as RX7's go
| FstrMnky | 02-16-2001 03:23 PM |
F125 shifter kart (http://skusaonline.com/)
On your budget you could go for a prime setup and still most of your budget left over to spend on driving schools and a nice trailer setup.
nothing else will give you the same performance for your buck and few cars can exceed the lateral g's generated by these little racers.
plus you can also autox them and the only class faster will be A mod.
On your budget you could go for a prime setup and still most of your budget left over to spend on driving schools and a nice trailer setup.
nothing else will give you the same performance for your buck and few cars can exceed the lateral g's generated by these little racers.
plus you can also autox them and the only class faster will be A mod.
| Gambit | 02-17-2001 12:41 AM |
Get a Wabbit! hehehe...those things goes on 3 wheels all the time! Altenately you can go buy a go kart and beat everyone without even trying. hahahaha
| DaveK | 02-17-2001 12:51 AM |
The eclipses are fun, but beware of reliability problems. I had a 90 GSX and the timing belt snapped about 20K prematurely, and I was stuck with a $1500 repair bill. I just sold the car, and less than 10K miles passed between when I replaced the timing belt, and it snapped again. They feel quick, but they are rather heavy. If I were going to build up a racer, I'd buy a 2.2L impreza and upgrade as my racing skills improved.
| Rallyrcr | 02-17-2001 12:57 AM |
track racing is way too expensive go rally!!!
and i have the perfect car an open class turbo 4wd subaru ready to race!! and for 1/2 what your going to spend you could get a tow rig trailer and a race car!!
see the FS 85 subaru RX posts in this and the classifieds section
or e-mail me
[email protected]
and i have the perfect car an open class turbo 4wd subaru ready to race!! and for 1/2 what your going to spend you could get a tow rig trailer and a race car!!
see the FS 85 subaru RX posts in this and the classifieds section
or e-mail me
[email protected]
| Mr. Jones | 02-17-2001 11:15 AM |
That definitely sounds like one of the options to consider. How far back do the 2.2L AWD cars go, anyway?
| Dirt Man | 02-17-2001 04:53 PM |
You've got alot of choices if your covering all of your bases(drag, auto-x, track) a 92-96 Supra will cover the bases, if your buying new look into an Integra Type R, then again if you can find an old Porsche 914, or an 80's era BMW M3 you can have a ton of fun. As for a Subaru, you can find a used 99 RS for 14,500-16,000, with upgraded tires, rear sway bar, springs & struts, you could have a real contender!
| AutoXr | 02-17-2001 05:20 PM |
Given that all of the activities that you mentioned are not necesarily compatible with each other, there will obviously be trade-offs in one or more of the activities.
The 3rd gen RX-7 is almost more work that it's worth. It's an awsome car, but maybe just a bit too fragile for everything you mentioned you wanted to do with it.
An Audi Quattro Sport with a series 200 engine swap (turbo 5 vs n/a 5) would really haul. There's lots of available parts too so the whole thing should come in less than $12k.
1st gen RX-7 GSL-SE. This has the 13B engine instead of the 12A. Tons of available parts and fairly light. A single turbo upgrade is easily completed and not too expensive. Even without a turbo, tuned engines are able to pump out up to 220hp.
There's always the DSM route. Probably cheaper than the Audi and more aftermarket parts available; 300hp is very easily attainable.
Older porsche's are OK, but often a handfull in the handling dept. because of their layout. Aftermarket parts are very expensive too. If this is the route you take, go for an '87 or newer since they have a much better gearbox.
Did I say that I wish this were my project [img]http://www.i-club.com/ubb-files/smilies/biggrin.gif[/img]
The 3rd gen RX-7 is almost more work that it's worth. It's an awsome car, but maybe just a bit too fragile for everything you mentioned you wanted to do with it.
An Audi Quattro Sport with a series 200 engine swap (turbo 5 vs n/a 5) would really haul. There's lots of available parts too so the whole thing should come in less than $12k.
1st gen RX-7 GSL-SE. This has the 13B engine instead of the 12A. Tons of available parts and fairly light. A single turbo upgrade is easily completed and not too expensive. Even without a turbo, tuned engines are able to pump out up to 220hp.
There's always the DSM route. Probably cheaper than the Audi and more aftermarket parts available; 300hp is very easily attainable.
Older porsche's are OK, but often a handfull in the handling dept. because of their layout. Aftermarket parts are very expensive too. If this is the route you take, go for an '87 or newer since they have a much better gearbox.
Did I say that I wish this were my project [img]http://www.i-club.com/ubb-files/smilies/biggrin.gif[/img]
| 98mpreziveRS | 02-17-2001 08:29 PM |
personally i would get either a 2nd gen RX7 with the 13B turbo, or the 323 GTX
either one suits your purposes and the gtx is AWD [img]http://www.i-club.com/ubb-files/smilies/biggrin.gif[/img]
either one suits your purposes and the gtx is AWD [img]http://www.i-club.com/ubb-files/smilies/biggrin.gif[/img]
| Mr. Jones | 02-17-2001 10:35 PM |
Man...you folks are amazing. Thanks a lot for all the responses. I think I might check out the Audi route.
the $15K pricecap was just for discussion, in reality, for the car itself, we're probably around half that, which takes a lot of those cars out of the running. I like the idea of a DSM, since I know those motors are absolutely bulletproof. The Audi Quattro idea is a good one, if it could be found. And, there's always the ~95ish Impreza L and turbo it, but that'd be more expensive than a DSM setup, I think.
the $15K pricecap was just for discussion, in reality, for the car itself, we're probably around half that, which takes a lot of those cars out of the running. I like the idea of a DSM, since I know those motors are absolutely bulletproof. The Audi Quattro idea is a good one, if it could be found. And, there's always the ~95ish Impreza L and turbo it, but that'd be more expensive than a DSM setup, I think.
| JayP | 02-17-2001 10:37 PM |
I still say buying a turbo and/or awd as a learning car is a mistake.
AWD gets drivers out of so much trouble, its not a good learning tool. Front and rear drive cars will force you to learn the 'lines' of a track.
Big turbos lead to chasing better lap times with $$$$. They break too...
My credentials are that I had an A4 1.8T quattro. I could do no wrong on the track with AWD. Combine AWD with the turbo power and I looked like a 911/M3 slayer.
Buy a used GTi or Gen1 RX7. Take the money you saved from not buying a $15k car and put it into some stocks.
AWD gets drivers out of so much trouble, its not a good learning tool. Front and rear drive cars will force you to learn the 'lines' of a track.
Big turbos lead to chasing better lap times with $$$$. They break too...
My credentials are that I had an A4 1.8T quattro. I could do no wrong on the track with AWD. Combine AWD with the turbo power and I looked like a 911/M3 slayer.
Buy a used GTi or Gen1 RX7. Take the money you saved from not buying a $15k car and put it into some stocks.
| 98mpreziveRS | 02-17-2001 11:11 PM |
yes but what most don't realize is that a GTX when driven at 25% of the cars ability is docile, but at 10/10s is amazing, but anywhere in between and the car will jump up an bite you in the arse harder than you can say ***? [img]http://www.i-club.com/ubb-files/smilies/biggrin.gif[/img] lol.. the driver needs to pay attention when pushing that particular car, due to light weight chasis, and the lockable diff- loads of fun when driven properly, but loads of trouble when relied on to save yours.
I would get teh RX7. they are killer cars, the one you will want to do is take car of the wheel hop problem that the rx7 faces. you can do this eitehr one of 3 ways, 1 is traction bars, 2 is retune the rear suspension, the last and BEST is to rebuild the rear end using a mazdamatrix setup which goes for around 900 IIRC and has new springs as well as a mini-traction bar setup.
That and check the apex seals on the rotary very well..the older 12a and 13a are prone to blowing the seals at around 80K. Just a little FYI. and if you get a 13B turbo motor, make sure you let it cool like youshould, but also check and upgrade the apex seals if you do a LOT of hard driving [img]http://www.i-club.com/ubb-files/smilies/smile.gif[/img]
my .02
I would get teh RX7. they are killer cars, the one you will want to do is take car of the wheel hop problem that the rx7 faces. you can do this eitehr one of 3 ways, 1 is traction bars, 2 is retune the rear suspension, the last and BEST is to rebuild the rear end using a mazdamatrix setup which goes for around 900 IIRC and has new springs as well as a mini-traction bar setup.
That and check the apex seals on the rotary very well..the older 12a and 13a are prone to blowing the seals at around 80K. Just a little FYI. and if you get a 13B turbo motor, make sure you let it cool like youshould, but also check and upgrade the apex seals if you do a LOT of hard driving [img]http://www.i-club.com/ubb-files/smilies/smile.gif[/img]
my .02
| TCRA2 | 02-18-2001 09:10 PM |
Hi Mr. Jones, If you need a track car, check out my ad in the for sale on this site, or if these cars don't suit you check out [url="http://www.touringcarclub.com"]www.touringcarclub.com[/url] under the classified section. I have a bunch of race cars for sale. I just want to sell off 2 cars out of this bunch whatever they are. Good luck in your search. TCRA2/Emil
| snowmants | 08-25-2010 09:17 AM |
This is an old thread, but a good one, so i thought I would bring it back to life and share a little of my experience.
I think the ideal dedicated track car is the nissan 240sx.
here's why:
-cars are Cheap
-parts are cheap when you wreck it
-easy to work on yourself
-with basic sr20 swap it makes 230whp and only weighs 2850lbs.
-Rear wheel drive so it is great for Roadracing, AutoXing, Drag racing, and Drifting. This car can do it all simply by changing wheels/tires.
-The one thing I would complain abouut is that the chasis could be stiffer, but that can be improved with a cage as it is a track car.
Just my 2 cents. If you are lookin for a second car to have as a dedicated track car with some minimal street driving atleast take a look at the 240sx. It has worked out great for me.
[IMG]http://zhktfw.bay.livefilestore.com/y1phGA9h8gyLAuKs2U5AzL-LUv0BSPkMjQ2WGZDtoOapzeCPDAHJmkKg-NXtbXkEUXDfegT5GzeaTsC_daMe2yArtns2LoHNl-G/Screen%20capture-20100618-075102.jpg?psid=1[/IMG]
I think the ideal dedicated track car is the nissan 240sx.
here's why:
-cars are Cheap
-parts are cheap when you wreck it
-easy to work on yourself
-with basic sr20 swap it makes 230whp and only weighs 2850lbs.
-Rear wheel drive so it is great for Roadracing, AutoXing, Drag racing, and Drifting. This car can do it all simply by changing wheels/tires.
-The one thing I would complain abouut is that the chasis could be stiffer, but that can be improved with a cage as it is a track car.
Just my 2 cents. If you are lookin for a second car to have as a dedicated track car with some minimal street driving atleast take a look at the 240sx. It has worked out great for me.
[IMG]http://zhktfw.bay.livefilestore.com/y1phGA9h8gyLAuKs2U5AzL-LUv0BSPkMjQ2WGZDtoOapzeCPDAHJmkKg-NXtbXkEUXDfegT5GzeaTsC_daMe2yArtns2LoHNl-G/Screen%20capture-20100618-075102.jpg?psid=1[/IMG]
| nhat | 08-25-2010 01:18 PM |
[quote=snowmants;31697607]This is an old thread[/quote]
understatement of the year!
understatement of the year!
| Krang | 08-26-2010 04:43 AM |
[quote=nhat;31699822]understatement of the year![/quote]
Understatement of the last 9 years to be exact!
Understatement of the last 9 years to be exact!
| RB5 Clone | 08-26-2010 10:22 AM |
good used rally cars can be cheap. running rallies (and/or keeping the car going after you stuff it 31x) is not, however ;)
[url]http://www.specialstage.com/classifieds/showproduct.php/product/1993/cat/13[/url]
[url]http://www.specialstage.com/classifieds/showproduct.php/product/1993/cat/13[/url]
| newclutch | 08-27-2010 10:58 AM |
You are driving a 11.5 year old daily driver and you want to get an inexpensive newer fast car to enjoy some motorsports activites? You got it backwards. Convert the Audi which is paid for by now and play and fix up it into a track toy and get yourself a newer daily driver. plan on you new car also fulfilling this conversion 5-6 years down the road.
| Robbie_B | 08-27-2010 11:13 AM |
You two probably should've looked that this was a 2001 post dug up by the person in post #27 so he could masturbate all over himself about how awesome his sr20 powered 240 is
| REX8 | 08-27-2010 12:44 PM |
E36 M3
| ptclaus98 | 08-27-2010 03:26 PM |
Formula Ford or Formula Vee.
| o-townFLA | 08-27-2010 03:35 PM |
Mazda Miata..... period...!
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