| reallyslow | 11-12-2006 11:48 PM |
rollcage help!
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I have been thinking about getting a roll cage, or harness bar... Autopoer makes a nice cage, its called the "race roll bar" I would like to know how much it weighs and if you have any imput on the cage. Also if there are any harness bars out there besides the sparco one. If you have any other ideas of a roll cage (half cage preferably) then please inform me. thank you
| Hyper | 11-12-2006 11:51 PM |
safedrives is a cool place to look up this stuff
and if you want just the harness bar, I might have one for sale soon :)
and if you want just the harness bar, I might have one for sale soon :)
| reallyslow | 11-12-2006 11:55 PM |
[QUOTE=Hyper;15965637]safedrives is a cool place to look up this stuff
and if you want just the harness bar, I might have one for sale soon :)[/QUOTE]
im guessing its the sparco one?
and if you want just the harness bar, I might have one for sale soon :)[/QUOTE]
im guessing its the sparco one?
| Hyper | 11-13-2006 12:04 AM |
yeah, I think it is
it's for the long version of belts, goes on the rear shelf
it's for the long version of belts, goes on the rear shelf
| reallyslow | 11-13-2006 01:06 AM |
nobody else?
| reallyslow | 11-13-2006 01:17 AM |
nobody else?
| BluScopion | 11-13-2006 01:53 AM |
unless you are tracking your car, i wouldn't put a cage in it. that is unless you plan to drive with a helmet everyday. banging your head against a steel cage is pretty painful.
| Win0427 | 11-13-2006 02:58 AM |
If you're gonna get a cage...
Get the Cusco one...
The black one...
Not the blue
Get the Cusco one...
The black one...
Not the blue
| Eriksport | 11-13-2006 07:51 AM |
[url]http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1005822[/url]
Thread with pics, and props to SafeDrives. Great deals, and depending on where in WA you are, you can save on shipping and just pick it up.
Erik
Thread with pics, and props to SafeDrives. Great deals, and depending on where in WA you are, you can save on shipping and just pick it up.
Erik
| blue blurr | 11-13-2006 10:35 AM |
Actually, Autopower is in southern Cali so you would have to ship it, Safe Drives just does the order and Autopower makes it and ships it from the warehouse. With the Autopower roll bars, you don�t have to worry about hitting your head it's so far behind the seat that it is just about impossible. The only thing I would say about the roll bar is that it may get a bit annoying for a street car. The back seats become useless, you will have to run a harness (5 or 6 point) which means you will need a racing seat that allows a crotch belt.
| Eriksport | 11-13-2006 10:44 AM |
[QUOTE=blue blurr;15968928]Actually, Autopower is in southern Cali so you would have to ship it, Safe Drives just does the order and Autopower makes it and ships it from the warehouse. With the Autopower roll bars, you don�t have to worry about hitting your head it's so far behind the seat that it is just about impossible. The only thing I would say about the roll bar is that it may get a bit annoying for a street car. The back seats become useless, you will have to run a harness (5 or 6 point) which means you will need a racing seat that allows a crotch belt.[/QUOTE]
I meant no shipping in that SafeDrives gets these bars in bulk, which cuts the shipping waaaay down. Picking them up directly from them is easy since they're less than an hour of Portland, and Charles is easy to deal with (at all the local rally events).
Erik
I meant no shipping in that SafeDrives gets these bars in bulk, which cuts the shipping waaaay down. Picking them up directly from them is easy since they're less than an hour of Portland, and Charles is easy to deal with (at all the local rally events).
Erik
| reallyslow | 11-13-2006 09:18 PM |
[QUOTE=blue blurr;15968928]Actually, Autopower is in southern Cali so you would have to ship it, Safe Drives just does the order and Autopower makes it and ships it from the warehouse. With the Autopower roll bars, you don�t have to worry about hitting your head it's so far behind the seat that it is just about impossible. The only thing I would say about the roll bar is that it may get a bit annoying for a street car. The back seats become useless, you will have to run a harness (5 or 6 point) which means you will need a racing seat that allows a crotch belt.[/QUOTE]
wouldnt have to run racing seats and harnesses, (even though i am going to) it dosnt take out ur seats or seatbelts... also you could use a 4 point harness
[QUOTE=BluScopion;15966597]unless you are tracking your car, i wouldn't put a cage in it. that is unless you plan to drive with a helmet everyday. banging your head against a steel cage is pretty painful.[/QUOTE]
i said i would like a roll bar or half cage. meaning there is no bar in front to bang ur head on, the bars are behind the seat
wouldnt have to run racing seats and harnesses, (even though i am going to) it dosnt take out ur seats or seatbelts... also you could use a 4 point harness
[QUOTE=BluScopion;15966597]unless you are tracking your car, i wouldn't put a cage in it. that is unless you plan to drive with a helmet everyday. banging your head against a steel cage is pretty painful.[/QUOTE]
i said i would like a roll bar or half cage. meaning there is no bar in front to bang ur head on, the bars are behind the seat
| PARANOID56 | 11-13-2006 09:27 PM |
i would go find your local fabriactor and have them build you a custom one that will fit your car perfect. and have them WELD it in, not bolt in.
Shane
Shane
| Call_me_Tom | 11-13-2006 09:32 PM |
Here is my take.
I got a custom one that was made locally in my area for a fraction of the cost of a Sparco Harness Bar.
I removed it after a month or so because I couldn't slide the seat back or lean back. I had to sit up right in the "racing position" all of the time.
Below are a couple of pics
[IMG]http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b63/krazyk1371/060129004.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b63/krazyk1371/060129003.jpg[/IMG]
I got a custom one that was made locally in my area for a fraction of the cost of a Sparco Harness Bar.
I removed it after a month or so because I couldn't slide the seat back or lean back. I had to sit up right in the "racing position" all of the time.
Below are a couple of pics
[IMG]http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b63/krazyk1371/060129004.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b63/krazyk1371/060129003.jpg[/IMG]
| mykrrrr | 11-13-2006 09:34 PM |
[QUOTE=Win0427;15966881]If you're gonna get a cage...
Get the Cusco one...
The black one...
Not the blue[/QUOTE]
How about this...
1) Don't get either black or blue Cusco "cage"
2) Cages aren't safe for road going cars. Don't give me any BS about how it's more safe or that it stiffens up the car. The negatives far outweigh the positives.
3) What do you really need a cage for? Bling factor? Spend it on overpriced open ended lugnuts or the latest "go fast" or "handle better" race bit.
4) ???
5) Thank us "sensible" folk later.
Get the Cusco one...
The black one...
Not the blue[/QUOTE]
How about this...
1) Don't get either black or blue Cusco "cage"
2) Cages aren't safe for road going cars. Don't give me any BS about how it's more safe or that it stiffens up the car. The negatives far outweigh the positives.
3) What do you really need a cage for? Bling factor? Spend it on overpriced open ended lugnuts or the latest "go fast" or "handle better" race bit.
4) ???
5) Thank us "sensible" folk later.
| tekgnosis | 11-13-2006 10:03 PM |
i'm curious...why are cages so unsafe for road cars?
i can understand smashing your head against the bars in an accident and having brain damage/dying. But other than that, what are the downsides, if any?
i can understand smashing your head against the bars in an accident and having brain damage/dying. But other than that, what are the downsides, if any?
| Call_me_Tom | 11-13-2006 10:08 PM |
[QUOTE=tekgnosis;15978085]i'm curious...why are cages so unsafe for road cars?
i can understand smashing your head against the bars in an accident and having brain damage/dying. But other than that, what are the downsides, if any?[/QUOTE]
The car won't crumble as intended to.
Modern cars are designed to crumble around the occupants. The body will take the damage instead of the people inside. If your not wearing protective gear (helmet) and get into an accident your body will slam around inside of it as the body will not give.
I once saw a car that got into a light fender bender. It had strut bars installed so when it go hit on the left side the strut bar sent the force to the right side also screwing the whole car up instead of just messing up that one side.
i can understand smashing your head against the bars in an accident and having brain damage/dying. But other than that, what are the downsides, if any?[/QUOTE]
The car won't crumble as intended to.
Modern cars are designed to crumble around the occupants. The body will take the damage instead of the people inside. If your not wearing protective gear (helmet) and get into an accident your body will slam around inside of it as the body will not give.
I once saw a car that got into a light fender bender. It had strut bars installed so when it go hit on the left side the strut bar sent the force to the right side also screwing the whole car up instead of just messing up that one side.
| iheartmysuby | 11-13-2006 10:38 PM |
check out becks beams bars and bumpers.
| AruisDante | 11-13-2006 10:47 PM |
[QUOTE=krazyK1371;15978159]The car won't crumble as intended to.
Modern cars are designed to crumble around the occupants. The body will take the damage instead of the people inside. If your not wearing protective gear (helmet) and get into an accident your body will slam around inside of it as the body will not give.
I once saw a car that got into a light fender bender. It had strut bars installed so when it go hit on the left side the strut bar sent the force to the right side also screwing the whole car up instead of just messing up that one side.[/QUOTE]
Only in a side impact. The frontal and rear crumple zones won't be affected, at least by any cage you'll probably be putting in on a street car.
And if you're wearing harnesses and are in a good racing seat, you shouldn't slam around very much at all. I'd only be scared of a roll cage in a car with normal seats and no harness.
A helmet, without a HANS device, does very little to protect you from the kind of things that happen when you're in a crash with a cage (such as whiplash). It does stop you from killing yourself when your head smashes into something though, should you not be properly restrained or should part of the roll cage bend enough to get in the path of your head.
Modern cars are designed to crumble around the occupants. The body will take the damage instead of the people inside. If your not wearing protective gear (helmet) and get into an accident your body will slam around inside of it as the body will not give.
I once saw a car that got into a light fender bender. It had strut bars installed so when it go hit on the left side the strut bar sent the force to the right side also screwing the whole car up instead of just messing up that one side.[/QUOTE]
Only in a side impact. The frontal and rear crumple zones won't be affected, at least by any cage you'll probably be putting in on a street car.
And if you're wearing harnesses and are in a good racing seat, you shouldn't slam around very much at all. I'd only be scared of a roll cage in a car with normal seats and no harness.
A helmet, without a HANS device, does very little to protect you from the kind of things that happen when you're in a crash with a cage (such as whiplash). It does stop you from killing yourself when your head smashes into something though, should you not be properly restrained or should part of the roll cage bend enough to get in the path of your head.
| tekgnosis | 11-13-2006 11:17 PM |
Well, I can understand the point of view that you can wreck the entire car, as the forces arent applied as designed. that makes sense.
but i'm more concerned with the personal safety aspect. If I'm in an accident and my car doesn't crumple, but gets destroyed in the process instead...and i'm safe, I'm ok with that. But if I die because the roll cage is installed, then I'll be concerned.
I have a harness (schroth) and never wear it during daily driving. just for autocross/track use. I can't see myself wearing it on a daily basis, should I have a cage. I can see how people get injured that way (slamming their heads into the cage)....but again, what other forms of personally injury could one sustain?
I'm quite interested...I was thinking of doing this to a street car that doubles as a track car, but I'm leaning towards 'no' due to the safety risks.
but i'm more concerned with the personal safety aspect. If I'm in an accident and my car doesn't crumple, but gets destroyed in the process instead...and i'm safe, I'm ok with that. But if I die because the roll cage is installed, then I'll be concerned.
I have a harness (schroth) and never wear it during daily driving. just for autocross/track use. I can't see myself wearing it on a daily basis, should I have a cage. I can see how people get injured that way (slamming their heads into the cage)....but again, what other forms of personally injury could one sustain?
I'm quite interested...I was thinking of doing this to a street car that doubles as a track car, but I'm leaning towards 'no' due to the safety risks.
| sc00by4life | 11-14-2006 02:38 AM |
[QUOTE=reallyslow;15977535]wouldnt have to run racing seats and harnesses, (even though i am going to) it dosnt take out ur seats or seatbelts... also you could use a 4 point harness
i said i would like a roll bar or half cage. meaning there is no bar in front to bang ur head on, the bars are behind the seat[/QUOTE]
if you are seriously concerned about safety, you either 1.) do a rollbar ONLY. roll cages are only effective if you use them in conjunction with other safety devices. that means a helmet, a harness, and a race shell. its somewhat OK to rock a roll bar on the street, which wont cause TOO much damage if you do get into a wreck. do a WELD IN cage only. while you may think a cusco or autopower bar is a good idea, there is a good chance that the feet will punch through the floor in an accident. ive seen it happen. numerous times. ive seen autopower and cusco cages do this. also - the autopower cages to not come CLOSE to fitting correctly. there is too much gap between the b pillars/roof on the main hoop. custom cages are the best route to go, while they may be more expensive, they are SAFER. only trust your local fabrication shop or race shop to do so. they know how to properly triangulate the bars and how fitment is supposed to be (not just look like). lastly do NOT, i mean DO NOT use a 4 point harness. they are worthless. although they might hold you in a bit better than the stock seatbelt, they can end up being more dangerous than you could imagine. you know what happens if you get into a good wreck with a 4 point? you submarine under the camlock, and the camlock gets jammed into your stomach and causes internal bleeding (read: MORE damage). 5 or 6 point only if you are serious on safety. if you dont mind a few internal injuries, by all means, go for it.
[URL="http://www.speedwaremotorsports.com"]Speedware Motorsports[/URL] is the west coast distributor for Recaro and Sparco. they usually have the best deals around, and have things that other dealers cannot get. They are also a distributor and dealer for Alpinestars. They are also Oakleys sole distributor for all of their race products. They also manufacture the flat brackets for Sparco, as well as their alluminum side mounts and harness bars.
give me a call tomorrow if you want to chat some more.
<----jon.
i said i would like a roll bar or half cage. meaning there is no bar in front to bang ur head on, the bars are behind the seat[/QUOTE]
if you are seriously concerned about safety, you either 1.) do a rollbar ONLY. roll cages are only effective if you use them in conjunction with other safety devices. that means a helmet, a harness, and a race shell. its somewhat OK to rock a roll bar on the street, which wont cause TOO much damage if you do get into a wreck. do a WELD IN cage only. while you may think a cusco or autopower bar is a good idea, there is a good chance that the feet will punch through the floor in an accident. ive seen it happen. numerous times. ive seen autopower and cusco cages do this. also - the autopower cages to not come CLOSE to fitting correctly. there is too much gap between the b pillars/roof on the main hoop. custom cages are the best route to go, while they may be more expensive, they are SAFER. only trust your local fabrication shop or race shop to do so. they know how to properly triangulate the bars and how fitment is supposed to be (not just look like). lastly do NOT, i mean DO NOT use a 4 point harness. they are worthless. although they might hold you in a bit better than the stock seatbelt, they can end up being more dangerous than you could imagine. you know what happens if you get into a good wreck with a 4 point? you submarine under the camlock, and the camlock gets jammed into your stomach and causes internal bleeding (read: MORE damage). 5 or 6 point only if you are serious on safety. if you dont mind a few internal injuries, by all means, go for it.
[URL="http://www.speedwaremotorsports.com"]Speedware Motorsports[/URL] is the west coast distributor for Recaro and Sparco. they usually have the best deals around, and have things that other dealers cannot get. They are also a distributor and dealer for Alpinestars. They are also Oakleys sole distributor for all of their race products. They also manufacture the flat brackets for Sparco, as well as their alluminum side mounts and harness bars.
give me a call tomorrow if you want to chat some more.
<----jon.
| AruisDante | 11-14-2006 12:49 PM |
[QUOTE=sc00by4life;15980580]if you are seriously concerned about safety, you either 1.) do a rollbar ONLY. roll cages are only effective if you use them in conjunction with other safety devices. that means a helmet, a harness, and a race shell. its somewhat OK to rock a roll bar on the street, which wont cause TOO much damage if you do get into a wreck. do a WELD IN cage only. while you may think a cusco or autopower bar is a good idea, there is a good chance that the feet will punch through the floor in an accident. ive seen it happen. numerous times. ive seen autopower and cusco cages do this. also - the autopower cages to not come CLOSE to fitting correctly. there is too much gap between the b pillars/roof on the main hoop. custom cages are the best route to go, while they may be more expensive, they are SAFER. only trust your local fabrication shop or race shop to do so. they know how to properly triangulate the bars and how fitment is supposed to be (not just look like). lastly do NOT, i mean DO NOT use a 4 point harness. they are worthless. although they might hold you in a bit better than the stock seatbelt, they can end up being more dangerous than you could imagine. you know what happens if you get into a good wreck with a 4 point? you submarine under the camlock, and the camlock gets jammed into your stomach and causes internal bleeding (read: MORE damage). 5 or 6 point only if you are serious on safety. if you dont mind a few internal injuries, by all means, go for it.
[URL="http://www.speedwaremotorsports.com"]Speedware Motorsports[/URL] is the west coast distributor for Recaro and Sparco. they usually have the best deals around, and have things that other dealers cannot get. They are also a distributor and dealer for Alpinestars. They are also Oakleys sole distributor for all of their race products. They also manufacture the flat brackets for Sparco, as well as their alluminum side mounts and harness bars.
give me a call tomorrow if you want to chat some more.
<----jon.[/QUOTE]
Not sure if I agree with your comment about a four pointer, at least for street use (again, assuming you're in a racing bucket that actually fits you). Heck, Team O'Neal only has four pointers in their cars, and that's at a rally school. If you're going fast enough on a public road to submarine if you wreck, you're going way, way to fast. In most common street accidents, assuming you properly adjust the 4-pointer and you're in a good bucket, it will be equal to or better then a normal seatbelt. Definitely for track use you should get a 5 pointer though.
But I definitely agree with everything else you state there.
[URL="http://www.speedwaremotorsports.com"]Speedware Motorsports[/URL] is the west coast distributor for Recaro and Sparco. they usually have the best deals around, and have things that other dealers cannot get. They are also a distributor and dealer for Alpinestars. They are also Oakleys sole distributor for all of their race products. They also manufacture the flat brackets for Sparco, as well as their alluminum side mounts and harness bars.
give me a call tomorrow if you want to chat some more.
<----jon.[/QUOTE]
Not sure if I agree with your comment about a four pointer, at least for street use (again, assuming you're in a racing bucket that actually fits you). Heck, Team O'Neal only has four pointers in their cars, and that's at a rally school. If you're going fast enough on a public road to submarine if you wreck, you're going way, way to fast. In most common street accidents, assuming you properly adjust the 4-pointer and you're in a good bucket, it will be equal to or better then a normal seatbelt. Definitely for track use you should get a 5 pointer though.
But I definitely agree with everything else you state there.
| tekgnosis | 11-14-2006 01:52 PM |
For the submarining: Schroth has an anti-submarine system on their belts.
in the event of a crash, the strap unfastens partially to keep you in your seat. I'm not 100% sure of how it works, but it's better than nothing I imagine.
Thanks for this info...it's quite helpful.
in the event of a crash, the strap unfastens partially to keep you in your seat. I'm not 100% sure of how it works, but it's better than nothing I imagine.
Thanks for this info...it's quite helpful.
| sc00by4life | 11-14-2006 02:02 PM |
[QUOTE=tekgnosis;15985598]For the submarining: Schroth has an anti-submarine system on their belts.
in the event of a crash, the strap unfastens partially to keep you in your seat. I'm not 100% sure of how it works, but it's better than nothing I imagine.
Thanks for this info...it's quite helpful.[/QUOTE]
if it unfastens how does it keep you in your seat?
in the event of a crash, the strap unfastens partially to keep you in your seat. I'm not 100% sure of how it works, but it's better than nothing I imagine.
Thanks for this info...it's quite helpful.[/QUOTE]
if it unfastens how does it keep you in your seat?
| AruisDante | 11-14-2006 02:18 PM |
[QUOTE=sc00by4life;15985730]if it unfastens how does it keep you in your seat?[/QUOTE]
were I to guess, it has some kind of stress sensitive release in the shoulder straps which loosens them slightly if there is enough force on them, allowing your shoulders to go forwards a little bit, and the preventing your body from submarining, to a degree.
Just my best guess as an Mechanical Engineering student though.
were I to guess, it has some kind of stress sensitive release in the shoulder straps which loosens them slightly if there is enough force on them, allowing your shoulders to go forwards a little bit, and the preventing your body from submarining, to a degree.
Just my best guess as an Mechanical Engineering student though.
| sc00by4life | 11-14-2006 02:46 PM |
[QUOTE=AruisDante;15986013]were I to guess, it has some kind of stress sensitive release in the shoulder straps which loosens them slightly if there is enough force on them, allowing your shoulders to go forwards a little bit, and the preventing your body from submarining, to a degree.
Just my best guess as an Mechanical Engineering student though.[/QUOTE]
but wouldnt you think that if it loosens, there would be a greater risk of sliding under during the peak of the crash?
Just my best guess as an Mechanical Engineering student though.[/QUOTE]
but wouldnt you think that if it loosens, there would be a greater risk of sliding under during the peak of the crash?
| swappedGF | 11-14-2006 02:48 PM |
very good info guys. does anyone have any pictures to contribute of mishaps? (cages poking through floor, poor fitment [of premade/bolt in] vs proper [custom weld in], etc?)
I think that would definitely reinforce all that has been mentioned here
I think that would definitely reinforce all that has been mentioned here
| DocWyte | 11-14-2006 02:50 PM |
The schroth belts have an extra bit of webbing sewed in. When you have an impact, the stiches open, releasing this little extra bit of length, keeping you from submarining.
If you have a rollbar, a 5 or preferably 6 point harness is preferred. However, you *have* to use a seat meant for a 5 or 6 point belt, otherwise you're doing more harm than good.
Basically if you're just auto-x ing and doing a few DE's here or there, the Schroth 4 point quick fit harnesses are fine. If you're doing more time trials or are really carrying alot of speed on the track, but still drive the car on the street, pick up a rollbar, seats meant for a sub strap and a 5-6 point harness.
If you have a rollbar, a 5 or preferably 6 point harness is preferred. However, you *have* to use a seat meant for a 5 or 6 point belt, otherwise you're doing more harm than good.
Basically if you're just auto-x ing and doing a few DE's here or there, the Schroth 4 point quick fit harnesses are fine. If you're doing more time trials or are really carrying alot of speed on the track, but still drive the car on the street, pick up a rollbar, seats meant for a sub strap and a 5-6 point harness.
| t3hWIT | 11-14-2006 03:57 PM |
Where would one get a Cusco cage from?
| swappedGF | 11-14-2006 04:13 PM |
Probably anyone who's a cusco retailer. I'm sure not many keep them in stock so you have to email and special order them.
I think i remember seeing a thread in the FS forum of a vender that actually had a couple.
I think i remember seeing a thread in the FS forum of a vender that actually had a couple.
| AruisDante | 11-14-2006 04:22 PM |
[QUOTE=sc00by4life;15986521]but wouldnt you think that if it loosens, there would be a greater risk of sliding under during the peak of the crash?[/QUOTE]
not if it's in the shoulder straps. You submarine because the energy stored in your body can't go forwards (lap belt) or upwards (shoulders), so it finds the easiest way out, which is to start moving downwards under the lap belt. If the shoulder straps lengthen slightly, your momentum will start to move upwards, as to move downwards it still has to fight friction in the seat and the lap belt to a degree, so moving with the shoulder strap is easier, and then once they stop lengthening, you'll have absorbed enough energy and have gotten your momentum shifted enough that you won't submarine. There is a limit to how much impact this system can resist though... if you've got enough energy, you'll still wind up submarining after the shoulder belts stop lengthening.
Again, just my really quick analysis as an ME student.
not if it's in the shoulder straps. You submarine because the energy stored in your body can't go forwards (lap belt) or upwards (shoulders), so it finds the easiest way out, which is to start moving downwards under the lap belt. If the shoulder straps lengthen slightly, your momentum will start to move upwards, as to move downwards it still has to fight friction in the seat and the lap belt to a degree, so moving with the shoulder strap is easier, and then once they stop lengthening, you'll have absorbed enough energy and have gotten your momentum shifted enough that you won't submarine. There is a limit to how much impact this system can resist though... if you've got enough energy, you'll still wind up submarining after the shoulder belts stop lengthening.
Again, just my really quick analysis as an ME student.
| swappedGF | 11-14-2006 04:31 PM |
found the cusco cage -
[url]http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1050372&highlight=cusco+cage[/url]
[url]http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1050372&highlight=cusco+cage[/url]
| sc00by4life | 11-14-2006 07:35 PM |
[QUOTE=swappedGF;15986560]very good info guys. does anyone have any pictures to contribute of mishaps? (cages poking through floor, poor fitment [of premade/bolt in] vs proper [custom weld in], etc?)
I think that would definitely reinforce all that has been mentioned here[/QUOTE]
for improper fitment and build (safety wise), basically look at any pictures of autopower, cusco, or any other pre-fabbed roll bar/cage. cusco definatly has better fitment than the rest though, however, they do not have proper support on that bar to make it worthwile (once again...if you are serious on safety).
for properfitment - [url]http://speedwaremotorsports.com/gallery/nissan.asp[/url]
check the thumbnails for the xanavi themed 350z.
also - [url]http://speedwaremotorsports.com/project/68cam.asp[/url] full FIA spec 12 point cage.
I think that would definitely reinforce all that has been mentioned here[/QUOTE]
for improper fitment and build (safety wise), basically look at any pictures of autopower, cusco, or any other pre-fabbed roll bar/cage. cusco definatly has better fitment than the rest though, however, they do not have proper support on that bar to make it worthwile (once again...if you are serious on safety).
for properfitment - [url]http://speedwaremotorsports.com/gallery/nissan.asp[/url]
check the thumbnails for the xanavi themed 350z.
also - [url]http://speedwaremotorsports.com/project/68cam.asp[/url] full FIA spec 12 point cage.
| DocWyte | 11-14-2006 07:44 PM |
Nothing wrong with the Autopower bar. Is it as good as a custom welded, gussetted bar? Nope, but then again, you haven't done anything permenant to the car, you can still remove it. You can always use larger backing plates...
The Cusco rollcage has got to be the biggest POS I've ever seen. A total blinger car show peice...
The Cusco rollcage has got to be the biggest POS I've ever seen. A total blinger car show peice...
| sc00by4life | 11-14-2006 08:23 PM |
[QUOTE=DocWyte;15990546]Nothing wrong with the Autopower bar. Is it as good as a custom welded, gussetted bar? Nope, but then again, you haven't done anything permenant to the car, you can still remove it. You can always use larger backing plates...
The Cusco rollcage has got to be the biggest POS I've ever seen. A total blinger car show peice...[/QUOTE]
autopower has poor fitment, and very large gaps around the b-pillar area.
from my experience, autopower is just tyring to cash in on people who dont know better.
The Cusco rollcage has got to be the biggest POS I've ever seen. A total blinger car show peice...[/QUOTE]
autopower has poor fitment, and very large gaps around the b-pillar area.
from my experience, autopower is just tyring to cash in on people who dont know better.
| Psydotek | 11-14-2006 08:42 PM |
Hmmm, i'd recommend going with just a Schroth harness belt for now.
[url]http://www.soloracer.com/harnessbelts.html[/url]
The Rallye 3/4/cross belts are all DOT approved because of the Anti-SubMarining (ASM) device built in. I recommend trying that out first to see if you like using a harness and if it's enough for what you want. It's the least expensive option that does not compromise safety. I use my Schroth Rallye 3 nearly everyday whenever i drive.
But if you're fully intent on a cage, save up and get a custom built cage that's welded in and everything else that goes with it (including a proper seat and a proper harness). Don't forget the cage padding either.
[url]http://www.soloracer.com/harnessbelts.html[/url]
The Rallye 3/4/cross belts are all DOT approved because of the Anti-SubMarining (ASM) device built in. I recommend trying that out first to see if you like using a harness and if it's enough for what you want. It's the least expensive option that does not compromise safety. I use my Schroth Rallye 3 nearly everyday whenever i drive.
But if you're fully intent on a cage, save up and get a custom built cage that's welded in and everything else that goes with it (including a proper seat and a proper harness). Don't forget the cage padding either.
| DocWyte | 11-14-2006 08:51 PM |
My friend has an Autopower bar in his STI, but I didn't really look at it closely. I had Autopower rollbars in my '91 GTI and '88 944 and they fit quite well.
| sc00by4life | 11-14-2006 10:20 PM |
[QUOTE=DocWyte;15991369]My friend has an Autopower bar in his STI, but I didn't really look at it closely. I had Autopower rollbars in my '91 GTI and '88 944 and they fit quite well.[/QUOTE]
correct fitment is much more than "it fits in there". take a look at how close a true cage is supposed to fit, you cant make a bolt in fit and perform nearly as well.
correct fitment is much more than "it fits in there". take a look at how close a true cage is supposed to fit, you cant make a bolt in fit and perform nearly as well.
| reallyslow | 11-14-2006 11:51 PM |
thank you all very much for this great and uselfull information. I have decided that I will not be getting a roll bar. However i would still like to get 1 piece seats and 4 point harnesses, would you still recomend I stick with a normal seatbelts and a recliables? Once again thank you for all your help, it was greatly appreciated
AND, the cusco role cage is preety much for show for those that are asking. It has unnecesary bends wich would not hold up in the event of an accident. It is a bling peice. ;)
AND, the cusco role cage is preety much for show for those that are asking. It has unnecesary bends wich would not hold up in the event of an accident. It is a bling peice. ;)
| DocWyte | 11-15-2006 12:51 AM |
Normal seat belts and reclinable seats are all you need.
I never said the Autopower just "fit in there". In both the cars I had an autopower bar in, it fit quite well. It's not a custom cage and I never made that claim.
I never said the Autopower just "fit in there". In both the cars I had an autopower bar in, it fit quite well. It's not a custom cage and I never made that claim.
| reallyslow | 11-15-2006 01:05 AM |
[QUOTE=DocWyte;15994011]Normal seat belts and reclinable seats are all you need.
I never said the Autopower just "fit in there". In both the cars I had an autopower bar in, it fit quite well. It's not a custom cage and I never made that claim.[/QUOTE]
thnx, kinda bumed now... maybe ill just get some recaro or bride recliables and be a gangster
I never said the Autopower just "fit in there". In both the cars I had an autopower bar in, it fit quite well. It's not a custom cage and I never made that claim.[/QUOTE]
thnx, kinda bumed now... maybe ill just get some recaro or bride recliables and be a gangster
| AruisDante | 11-15-2006 01:12 AM |
[QUOTE=reallyslow;15993461]thank you all very much for this great and uselfull information. I have decided that I will not be getting a roll bar. However i would still like to get 1 piece seats and 4 point harnesses, would you still recomend I stick with a normal seatbelts and a recliables? Once again thank you for all your help, it was greatly appreciated
AND, the cusco role cage is preety much for show for those that are asking. It has unnecesary bends wich would not hold up in the event of an accident. It is a bling peice. ;)[/QUOTE]
My personal recommendation is go sit in some seats and see what you like. If you find a racing bucket that you like sitting in better then your stock seats, go for it, since there's nothing wrong or less safe about a bucket seat, assuming it's installed properly. I personally hated the stock STi seats, so I went and found seats that I liked, Bride Zeta III L's. I'm 6'6" and 200lbs, so they fit me like a glove, but I like my seats that way. Is it going to be uncomfortable on long rides? Sure. But so were the stock seats, at least for me, so I'll take the much better support and short term comfort of the Zeta's. For me, it's worth the trade off of long term comfort and the ability to recline, which I think I used once in my 2 years of owning my STi. As for harnesses, without a harness bar if they're mounted properly they're going to make your back seat useless, so that one is up to you.
AND, the cusco role cage is preety much for show for those that are asking. It has unnecesary bends wich would not hold up in the event of an accident. It is a bling peice. ;)[/QUOTE]
My personal recommendation is go sit in some seats and see what you like. If you find a racing bucket that you like sitting in better then your stock seats, go for it, since there's nothing wrong or less safe about a bucket seat, assuming it's installed properly. I personally hated the stock STi seats, so I went and found seats that I liked, Bride Zeta III L's. I'm 6'6" and 200lbs, so they fit me like a glove, but I like my seats that way. Is it going to be uncomfortable on long rides? Sure. But so were the stock seats, at least for me, so I'll take the much better support and short term comfort of the Zeta's. For me, it's worth the trade off of long term comfort and the ability to recline, which I think I used once in my 2 years of owning my STi. As for harnesses, without a harness bar if they're mounted properly they're going to make your back seat useless, so that one is up to you.
| reallyslow | 11-15-2006 01:21 AM |
[QUOTE=AruisDante;15994187]My personal recommendation is go sit in some seats and see what you like. If you find a racing bucket that you like sitting in better then your stock seats, go for it, since there's nothing wrong or less safe about a bucket seat, assuming it's installed properly. I personally hated the stock STi seats, so I went and found seats that I liked, Bride Zeta III L's. I'm 6'6" and 200lbs, so they fit me like a glove, but I like my seats that way. Is it going to be uncomfortable on long rides? Sure. But so were the stock seats, at least for me, so I'll take the much better support and short term comfort of the Zeta's. For me, it's worth the trade off of long term comfort and the ability to recline, which I think I used once in my 2 years of owning my STi. As for harnesses, without a harness bar if they're mounted properly they're going to make your back seat useless, so that one is up to you.[/QUOTE]
thats niec to know, I am very interested in teh Bride VIOS (low max). Do you know if they are similar in size becasue i would love to be able to give someone a bit larger a ride, i would hate to have to tell my friend he is to fat for my seat :lol:
[IMG]http://i15.tinypic.com/42um88y.jpg[/IMG]
thats niec to know, I am very interested in teh Bride VIOS (low max). Do you know if they are similar in size becasue i would love to be able to give someone a bit larger a ride, i would hate to have to tell my friend he is to fat for my seat :lol:
[IMG]http://i15.tinypic.com/42um88y.jpg[/IMG]
| AruisDante | 11-15-2006 11:44 AM |
If you go to bride's website, the have a sizing chart.
[URL="http://tees-usa.com/size_bucket2.html"]http://tees-usa.com/size_bucket2.html[/URL]
Sizes are in mm.
Looks like the VIOS is actually a good bit smaller then the Zeta-III's, even the non L versions. The Zeta-III L is the biggest seat Bride makes, IIRC.
[URL="http://tees-usa.com/size_bucket2.html"]http://tees-usa.com/size_bucket2.html[/URL]
Sizes are in mm.
Looks like the VIOS is actually a good bit smaller then the Zeta-III's, even the non L versions. The Zeta-III L is the biggest seat Bride makes, IIRC.
| c'dalerider | 11-15-2006 12:07 PM |
if you get a prper seat and are in proper driving position (in any seat) for agresive driving, chances of submerging are GREATLY reduced. A 4-6 pt belt will help. My concern was in case of a rollover, you may not be able to 'bend' or move around as needed if the roof crushes alittle, thus causing neck/spine injury...bad. I have an autopower 4 pt rollbar. i like it alot. fittment looks very good, but as mentioned , n the corners where top goes down there may be alittle to much room , but it does extend pretty darn close the whole way across the top. I modified my roll bar to a 5 pt by adding a kick bar on the drivers side, and added plates so it can not realy 'poke' thru the floor in case of roll over. She whould have to be droped pretty darn hard or ROLL many times to poke through anyway, and not just a mild rollover. Im very happy with it and DO have alot of padding all over, and want to add more! I also need a better seat!
IMO
IMO
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