| JamesWilson | 11-05-2006 01:27 AM |
STS/X 2.5RS weight?
�
�
Just curious (don't read too much into this) on what a typical STS/STX-prepped GC8 2.5RS weighs in full class preparation...I ran into a guy I autocross with in San Diego, claimed his '00 coupe weighs "nearly/at" 3000lbs, in what I would consider a good Local level STS setup and stock 16" wheels. What do the seats weigh? Stock exhaust system weight?
FWIW, my H-Stock car is listed at 2690lbs with steel wheels and a tank of fuel. I haven't had the chance to weigh it yet with the ligher wheels, less fuel, Whiteline 22mm FSB, and exhaust (future) and race magnets ;)
-JW
'98 Impreza L Sedan (no sunroof, no wing, drum brakes....plenty fast):D
FWIW, my H-Stock car is listed at 2690lbs with steel wheels and a tank of fuel. I haven't had the chance to weigh it yet with the ligher wheels, less fuel, Whiteline 22mm FSB, and exhaust (future) and race magnets ;)
-JW
'98 Impreza L Sedan (no sunroof, no wing, drum brakes....plenty fast):D
| mofugga | 11-05-2006 02:05 AM |
i thought they weighed 2830 or so w/out driver???
| flyboymike | 11-05-2006 02:07 AM |
Yeah, my stock WRX wagon with the spare still in it weighs about 3,070 lb... that old school GC8 must be lighter... right?
| Fred | 11-05-2006 08:49 AM |
I remember hearing that Corey Ridgick's was around 2700.
| recnelis | 11-05-2006 09:22 AM |
The curb weight of a stock manual GC is listed at 2800 and 2795 for the GM. Maybe the "nearly/at" 3000 comes from upgraded suspension bits without any sort of weight reduction? That or he's including himself in the weight.
| Warp3 | 11-05-2006 10:16 AM |
He's probably including the driver in that weight. The curb weight of the 99 2.5RS was listed at 2825 lbs (where did you see 2795/2800, recnelis :confused: ) and that's with a full load of gas which you rarely run at autocross. I've heard of several drivers running low 2700s and even high 2600s but I'm not sure what all mods they did to pull that off in Street Touring (nor can I remember any specific weights offhand...you may be able to find something in a search here or on RS25.com's forums).
The obvious sources of weight reduction in Street Touring (that I can think of at the moment):
- Lighter seats (though the stock seats aren't really all *that* heavy, unlike the airbag-laden seats in the newer models)
- Coilovers (many coilovers are notably lighter than the stock suspension parts)
- Wheels (something like a 15x7 Kosei K1 only weighs 13.5 lbs, plus a 15-inch tire will weigh a good bit less than the 16-inch or 17-inch equivalents as they are smaller rolling diameters)
- Run as little fuel as you can without fuel starving (which unfortunately isn't as low as you'd hope in some cars)
- Lightweight battery (this will save you about 10 lbs or so by itself)
- Exhaust (many exhausts are lighter than stock, despite having larger diameter piping)
On the other hand parts like larger anti-roll bars will actually weigh more than stock as there is simply more material there (a hollow bar might help this some, but I don't recall any hollow ARBs for the GC/GM N/A cars).
The obvious sources of weight reduction in Street Touring (that I can think of at the moment):
- Lighter seats (though the stock seats aren't really all *that* heavy, unlike the airbag-laden seats in the newer models)
- Coilovers (many coilovers are notably lighter than the stock suspension parts)
- Wheels (something like a 15x7 Kosei K1 only weighs 13.5 lbs, plus a 15-inch tire will weigh a good bit less than the 16-inch or 17-inch equivalents as they are smaller rolling diameters)
- Run as little fuel as you can without fuel starving (which unfortunately isn't as low as you'd hope in some cars)
- Lightweight battery (this will save you about 10 lbs or so by itself)
- Exhaust (many exhausts are lighter than stock, despite having larger diameter piping)
On the other hand parts like larger anti-roll bars will actually weigh more than stock as there is simply more material there (a hollow bar might help this some, but I don't recall any hollow ARBs for the GC/GM N/A cars).
| Draken | 11-05-2006 12:21 PM |
Corey's car was right at 2,650, if i remember correctly.
The white '99 RS we ran in STX in 2003 was 2,705, with stock seats, stock battery, and the AC intact. We were also on fairly light wheels and Toyo T1-S. We could have easily been 2,640-50 range with seats/battery/ac mods.
Hope this helps,
Chris H.
The white '99 RS we ran in STX in 2003 was 2,705, with stock seats, stock battery, and the AC intact. We were also on fairly light wheels and Toyo T1-S. We could have easily been 2,640-50 range with seats/battery/ac mods.
Hope this helps,
Chris H.
| bbimpreza | 11-05-2006 02:15 PM |
My car is at 2870 lbs. Corey's is at 2650 as Draken says.
| Warp3 | 11-05-2006 03:01 PM |
Oh yeah...forgot about the AC. :)
| JamesWilson | 11-05-2006 04:05 PM |
Nice. So where is that 110lbs of difference between the base Imprezas and the 2.5RS? Mine does not have a sunroof or wing, drum brake rears, and the interiors appear close (other than color and much greater quality/feel of the RS interiors...mine is cheap!), mine has A/C as well.
Just curious to see what the weight can come down to. If Corey's car is 2650 (starting at 2800/2825), could it be reasonable that a base model Impreza could be 2550?
Just curious to see what the weight can come down to. If Corey's car is 2650 (starting at 2800/2825), could it be reasonable that a base model Impreza could be 2550?
| adhowe70 | 11-05-2006 04:43 PM |
The weight is in the sunroof (25 pounds right there), brakes, wheels, etc.
My SM car is a '96 and before swapping weighed about 2525 with half a tank of fuel. After swap, the car weighs in the low 2600's (same fluids). Not all of that is engine - the rear disc brake conversion added quite a few pounds. So did moving up to autocross-worthy wheels and tires and adding a rear sway bar.
My SM car is a '96 and before swapping weighed about 2525 with half a tank of fuel. After swap, the car weighs in the low 2600's (same fluids). Not all of that is engine - the rear disc brake conversion added quite a few pounds. So did moving up to autocross-worthy wheels and tires and adding a rear sway bar.
| recnelis | 11-05-2006 06:49 PM |
[QUOTE=Warp3;15874051]He's probably including the driver in that weight. The curb weight of the 99 2.5RS was listed at 2825 lbs (where did you see 2795/2800, recnelis :confused: ) and that's with a full load of gas which you rarely run at autocross. I've heard of several drivers running low 2700s and even high 2600s but I'm not sure what all mods they did to pull that off in Street Touring (nor can I remember any specific weights offhand...you may be able to find something in a search here or on RS25.com's forums).
[/QUOTE]
I've never thrown mine on scales, so I can't tell you from experience. I grabbed the 2795/2800 from MSN Autos for the 2000 models, so take that however you feel like it. :)
[/QUOTE]
I've never thrown mine on scales, so I can't tell you from experience. I grabbed the 2795/2800 from MSN Autos for the 2000 models, so take that however you feel like it. :)
| Whiteghost 2.5 | 11-05-2006 07:31 PM |
my dsp prepped RS weighs a little over 2800 without driver
| adhowe70 | 11-05-2006 08:23 PM |
2795 and 2800 are correct except that number does not inlcude 25 pounds for the sunroof... which was standard. Who knows why they published that number. Subaru didn't.
| recnelis | 11-05-2006 09:36 PM |
Ah, the sunroof. Strange that they don't include it in the curb weight, oh well.
| ratt_finkel | 11-06-2006 11:17 AM |
The lowest my GS RS has seen is 2850. I believe that 2790's is about as low as you could get in a stock class legal RS.
| zzyzx | 11-06-2006 11:48 AM |
15.9 gallons X 6.25 lbs. per gallon = 99.4 lbs. total.
I think commenting on total weight w/o a close estimate of how much gas is in your tank can be a little bit misleading.
I think commenting on total weight w/o a close estimate of how much gas is in your tank can be a little bit misleading.
| Draken | 11-06-2006 11:52 AM |
Then I'll clarify my earlier posts:
1,705lbs. for a STX class 2.5RS with stock seats, stock battery, and stock AC system, 5/8 tank of gas.
Of the half a dozen RSs I've driven, they have all had fuel pick-up issues on long right handers with anything less than 1/2 a tank.
Chris H.
PS: my specs show the pre-2002 Impreza as having 13.2 gallon tank.
1,705lbs. for a STX class 2.5RS with stock seats, stock battery, and stock AC system, 5/8 tank of gas.
Of the half a dozen RSs I've driven, they have all had fuel pick-up issues on long right handers with anything less than 1/2 a tank.
Chris H.
PS: my specs show the pre-2002 Impreza as having 13.2 gallon tank.
| Kostamojen | 11-06-2006 12:26 PM |
The Imprezas had 15 gallon tanks starting in either 97 or 98. And the fuel cut issue is usually closer to 1/3rd or 1/4th of a tank.
(I presume thats 2705 lbs right?)
(I presume thats 2705 lbs right?)
| Master2192 | 11-06-2006 12:35 PM |
My 98 would fuel starve at anything less than 1/2 tank. But at 1/2 tank it weighs 2700 lbs without driver (alluminum hood, a/c removed, lightweight bumper beams).
| Scooby South | 11-06-2006 12:43 PM |
The 'Avg' Rs weighs about 2800...so to be at 3000 must include the driver...
My Swapped RS weighed at 2750 at a Divisional...with about 1/4 tank of gas...
it would be pretty easy to get it down in the weeds to 26xx with some easy mods...(Seats, Wheels, Battery, and some general lightning....)....
Bill
My Swapped RS weighed at 2750 at a Divisional...with about 1/4 tank of gas...
it would be pretty easy to get it down in the weeds to 26xx with some easy mods...(Seats, Wheels, Battery, and some general lightning....)....
Bill
| Draken | 11-06-2006 12:51 PM |
[QUOTE=Kostamojen;15884809]The Imprezas had 15 gallon tanks starting in either 97 or 98. And the fuel cut issue is usually closer to 1/3rd or 1/4th of a tank.
(I presume thats 2705 lbs right?)[/QUOTE]
No...as stated, the weight was with 5/8 tank. We were always dilligent about fuel levels.
In my obviously limited experience with RSs, my G-Stock '99 Coupe would wash at anything near 1/2 tank, especially on concrete. The STX classed '99 Coupe we ran in 2003 needed 1/2 a tank as well, even on the Toyo T1-S and Fontana Asphalt. Sean's DSP '99 washes out at 5/8 tank.
Chris H.
(I presume thats 2705 lbs right?)[/QUOTE]
No...as stated, the weight was with 5/8 tank. We were always dilligent about fuel levels.
In my obviously limited experience with RSs, my G-Stock '99 Coupe would wash at anything near 1/2 tank, especially on concrete. The STX classed '99 Coupe we ran in 2003 needed 1/2 a tank as well, even on the Toyo T1-S and Fontana Asphalt. Sean's DSP '99 washes out at 5/8 tank.
Chris H.
| Chin | 11-06-2006 01:37 PM |
My '00 RS in DSP trim came in at 2700# with about 1/3tank...there is more to do (pass seat comes to mind). As for fuel cut, mine does well if there is >1/3 tank.
Christian
Christian
| adhowe70 | 11-06-2006 03:25 PM |
I'll add another vote for 5/8 tank - Chris H. is right. My '00RS would wash out on long right handers with less than this. I washed out at my very first autocross with 3/8 tank... on RE92's and a crappy asphalt lot. Also, the '00RS came with the 15.9 gallon tank. I believe all of the RS's did.
My RS typically weighed 2790 on the scales in GS trim.
My RS typically weighed 2790 on the scales in GS trim.
| Scooby921 | 11-06-2006 04:06 PM |
Billy's '00 2.5RS also fuel starves at just over 1/2 tank of gas. Know that one from experience...not fun. Not sure if the 2870lbs he mentioned was with the 3/4 tank the car is usually run on.
| Warp3 | 11-06-2006 05:36 PM |
My 99RS used to work great in STS for not fuel starving (I'd even run it with the low fuel light on before :lol: ), but as soon as I moved to DSP and slapped on the R-comps, I had to use a LOT more fuel to not get starvation. Anything less than about 1/3rd of a tank would fuel starve with R-comps.
Sucks that you guys have to run so much more than that. :-/
Sucks that you guys have to run so much more than that. :-/
| Corey | 11-06-2006 06:19 PM |
Just to clarify... I think the lightest I've seen my car weigh in at was around 2670. That's with about 3/4 tank of gas. There was some more weight to be had... but not much. Maybe cut the exhaust off a little shorter, and take off the front lip and rear spats, a duct tape wing maybe? Other than that, every other weight reduction measure was taken.
Corey #89 STS
Corey #89 STS
| JamesWilson | 02-26-2007 03:59 AM |
Dredging this one up again, would ~100lbs of weight loss (2550 STS Impreza L vs 2670 STS 2.5RS) in an STS car make up for the deficit of no rear LSD and down a bit of horsepower (2.2L vs 2.5L)? The Suzuki Swift GT we ran a few years ago was 1730-1800lbs and dyno'd 82hp at the wheels (DOHC 1.3L), but was always ahead of the STS Civics to 60' and beyond despite being 30+hp down and "only" 150lbs lighter, and worse gearing.
Thoughts are always a-brewin', not that I woud like to leave H-Stock after doing well initially....got too busy to go down and weight the car this weekend like I had planned, and this thread came to mind. I guess I need to see where I sit as far as weight goes, and go from there.
Man I had fun in STS and STS2 though......I think there is an STS2 MR-2 in the cards maybe next season? Or buy back my '81 Porsche 924 Turbo GTS conversion :)
Thoughts are always a-brewin', not that I woud like to leave H-Stock after doing well initially....got too busy to go down and weight the car this weekend like I had planned, and this thread came to mind. I guess I need to see where I sit as far as weight goes, and go from there.
Man I had fun in STS and STS2 though......I think there is an STS2 MR-2 in the cards maybe next season? Or buy back my '81 Porsche 924 Turbo GTS conversion :)
| Corey | 02-26-2007 08:16 AM |
Having driven a 2.2L Subaru before... I'd say if you could get it down to 2470# it still wouldn't compete with the 2.5L at 2670# in STS. That's my opinion... I'd stick to HS. Sorry.
Corey #89 STU
Corey #89 STU
| speedyHAM | 02-26-2007 08:31 AM |
[QUOTE=Corey;17179947]Having driven a 2.2L Subaru before... I'd say if you could get it down to 2470# it still wouldn't compete with the 2.5L at 2670# in STS. That's my opinion... I'd stick to HS. Sorry.
Corey #89 STU[/QUOTE]
I ran my '96 L in STS for a few years and I'd have to agree with this. The 2.5 and the LSD are just too much of an advantage for the minimal weight savings to overcome. Maybe if it was possible to get it around 2200#...
Corey #89 STU[/QUOTE]
I ran my '96 L in STS for a few years and I'd have to agree with this. The 2.5 and the LSD are just too much of an advantage for the minimal weight savings to overcome. Maybe if it was possible to get it around 2200#...
| DrBiggly | 02-26-2007 10:16 AM |
James,
Given your current success, I should say that HS is probably your best bet for now. I'd love to see you give the Minis a serious run for their money in a car that costs about what their shocks do. :D
-Biggly
Given your current success, I should say that HS is probably your best bet for now. I'd love to see you give the Minis a serious run for their money in a car that costs about what their shocks do. :D
-Biggly
| ratt_finkel | 02-26-2007 08:21 PM |
I had to run around 10 gallons of gas or 3/4 of a tank to prevent fuel slosh as well. Stick it out in HS!
| Patrick L | 02-26-2007 11:54 PM |
[QUOTE=Whiteghost 2.5;15877711]my dsp prepped RS weighs a little over 2800 without driver[/QUOTE]
Ouch!!
Mine is around 2725-2750 in DSP last year. I am looking to shave more off. Heavy wheels didn't help.
I did how ever have it down to 2705 back in 2003 when I ran my RS in STX.
I hope to get it back down below 2700 this year as I have a small passager front seat and braket to install. Got rid of my 21lbs wheels this year for something about 16-17lbs. Plus some other things. I'll know better how things come out as soon as I reinstall my coilovers.
I normally have to run 3/4 tank of fuel and even at that. I have fuel starvation back in 2003 on the south course at Nats.
I am still looking to fit a tempory fuel cell to save more weight.
Ouch!!
Mine is around 2725-2750 in DSP last year. I am looking to shave more off. Heavy wheels didn't help.
I did how ever have it down to 2705 back in 2003 when I ran my RS in STX.
I hope to get it back down below 2700 this year as I have a small passager front seat and braket to install. Got rid of my 21lbs wheels this year for something about 16-17lbs. Plus some other things. I'll know better how things come out as soon as I reinstall my coilovers.
I normally have to run 3/4 tank of fuel and even at that. I have fuel starvation back in 2003 on the south course at Nats.
I am still looking to fit a tempory fuel cell to save more weight.
| wagonman | 02-27-2007 07:54 PM |
I have always had to run at least a 1/3 of a tank to avoid fuel starving, which really sucks.
I havent been bitten by the weight bug yet, but its only a matter of time. Locally, I am very competitive in STS, and was pretty competitive in STX last year...so there hasn't been a need to cut weight just yet.
I havent been bitten by the weight bug yet, but its only a matter of time. Locally, I am very competitive in STS, and was pretty competitive in STX last year...so there hasn't been a need to cut weight just yet.
| JamesWilson | 04-05-2007 03:03 AM |
Just to update, the H-Stock car was 2671 at the San Diego NT with 1/2 tank fuel and 15" wheels, rear drum brakes. Not sure how much lighter it could get :)
-JW
-JW
| Spectre23 | 04-05-2007 04:34 PM |
At the 2000 Colorado Springs national tour, my '98 RS weighed 2830. Noah's '00 RS weighed 2750, but he had a carbon hood which was deemed illegal at the race. I had headers which were protested but legal.
| swede978 | 01-19-2009 09:15 AM |
[QUOTE=wagonman;17201800]
I havent been bitten by the weight bug yet, but its only a matter of time. Locally, I am very competitive in STS, and was pretty competitive in STX last year...so there hasn't been a need to cut weight just yet.[/QUOTE]
You and Dave have been neck and neck, but if you can loose a pound or two in the car, you could take him.
I havent been bitten by the weight bug yet, but its only a matter of time. Locally, I am very competitive in STS, and was pretty competitive in STX last year...so there hasn't been a need to cut weight just yet.[/QUOTE]
You and Dave have been neck and neck, but if you can loose a pound or two in the car, you could take him.
| wagonman | 01-19-2009 12:38 PM |
[QUOTE=swede978;25243504]You and Dave have been neck and neck, but if you can loose a pound or two in the car, you could take him.[/QUOTE]
If Dave would ever choose the right tires ( read Dunlop ) he would beat me quite often. I need to do bushings and even the playing field a little :devil:
If Dave would ever choose the right tires ( read Dunlop ) he would beat me quite often. I need to do bushings and even the playing field a little :devil:
| Chiketkd | 01-19-2009 04:15 PM |
While on the topic of weight, what kind of whp and wtq numbers can an ST 2.5RS make with a good tune?
| darkonion | 01-23-2009 07:03 PM |
I skipped through most of the thread, but for your reference... my "illegal" '97 L weighs in at 2763 lbs with a CF hood and 1/3 tank of gas and a 4EAT.
No driver, no spare, no other junk in the car, but had all of the interior in there.
No driver, no spare, no other junk in the car, but had all of the interior in there.
| Chiketkd | 01-23-2009 08:27 PM |
[QUOTE=darkonion;25306235]my "illegal" '97 L weighs in at 2763 lbs with a CF hood and 1/3 tank of gas and [b]a 4EAT.[/b][/QUOTE]
Ever swapped out a subaru trans? I've done at least 3 to date. The 4eat weighs at least 75-100lbs more than the 5spd. They're hefty!!! :eek:
Ever swapped out a subaru trans? I've done at least 3 to date. The 4eat weighs at least 75-100lbs more than the 5spd. They're hefty!!! :eek:
| wagonman | 01-23-2009 09:16 PM |
[QUOTE=Chiketkd;25248224]While on the topic of weight, what kind of whp and wtq numbers can an ST 2.5RS make with a good tune?[/QUOTE]
For what it's worth, mine made ~125whp and ~135wtq on the I-speed computer early last year, but I have done a huge tune-up and plan to possibly ditch the a/c :devil:
For what it's worth, mine made ~125whp and ~135wtq on the I-speed computer early last year, but I have done a huge tune-up and plan to possibly ditch the a/c :devil:
Không có nhận xét nào:
Đăng nhận xét