| RebelINS | 02-09-2004 06:10 PM |
Why did the SCCA change my membership cost by $40?
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I received my membership renewal for in the mail today, and to my surprise, my membership cost has risen by $40! Last year was my first year as an SCCA member (or autocrossing for that matter), I since I was 20 I qualified for their Speed Freakz membership which was for people under 25. I had heard that they were going to change it to First Gear, and change some of the things about it. Well they did. Now it is for people who are under 21. Me turning 21 last October means that I have to pay $70 for my membership now. I am not very happy about this because I am a full time college student, who has no source of income, except in the summer. To some $70 may not sound like alot of money, but when you have no money coming in, it is. It is almost not worth me paying for it, because I think I only ran 6 or 7 SCCA autocrosses last year, which is the only thing I use my membership for. If I don't get amembership, and just pay the non-member price at my events this summer, I think it might just save me money. Can someone shed some light on why they changed it? I had originally heard that they were going to change it to people 23 and younger.
-Wes
-Wes
| Patrick Olsen | 02-09-2004 06:55 PM |
I dunno, but I'm with you on not being a member and just paying a bit extra at events. I would have to attend 9 auto-x events to make that $70 actually pay off, and since I'm on a sub that goes to sea it and causes me to miss events (dammit! :( ) it just isnt' worth becoming a member.
Now if SCCA had deals worked out with Tire Rack or Summit Racing or Jegs or NAPA or whatever for members to get discounts I'd be all over it.
Pat Olsen
'97 Legacy 2.5GT sedan
Now if SCCA had deals worked out with Tire Rack or Summit Racing or Jegs or NAPA or whatever for members to get discounts I'd be all over it.
Pat Olsen
'97 Legacy 2.5GT sedan
| mywrx2002 | 02-09-2004 08:17 PM |
Features and Benefits
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I'm just going to briefly address the concerns here, and to qualify myself I'm the incoming regional executive of the Kentucky Region of the SCCA.
The SCCA is way more than just autocross to alot of people. I have just returned for the SCCA convention in Kansas City, Mo. where my region sent me all expences paid for me to gain knowledge. I was like you two at one time and thought" darn thats alot of money to put out" , but when we start examining everything that the SCCA does you stand back and think ....wow I don't realise they did that.
I'm going to bullet point a few things in a second and maybe you did or maybe you didn't know this so if I'm giving you information you know then forgive me.
** solo **
Pro solos
soloI
SoloII
Foumula Karting ( children 7-15)
Adult Shifter Karting
**Rally**
Rally cross
Club Rally
Pro Rally
Hill Climbs
**Track Racing**
Club Racing
and other types of wheel to wheel competition including enduro Karts
** Stewards and Flaggers**
Were Responcible for those people in the little white suits who get no thanks for working the dangerous corners and waving the flags and communication track conditions for the drivers to help keep them safe
** Emergency Services **
Kind of self explanatory and mainly used in rally and track situations
** SCCA University**
Educational programs for SCCA members on regional, divisional, and national levels
** SCCA Foundation**
Helps communities, and gives colleges funding for such things as experimental vehicles, Formula S A E and the like
Now with this said maybe this isn't for you, or maybe it is. I'm just trying to tell you there is a bigger picture than even I have told you about here and this is the future of motorsports in America so maybe this sounds like a sales pitch but I hope not I'm just kinda trying to validate where your money goes.
Last but not least remember that the SCCA is there for , if you need them I have known that people have called them on a late sunday and gotten a call back in a very short time for insurance or other "emergency" matters.
I thank you for listening/reading and do hope you stay members as it does have rewards that may not be exactly evident at the moment .
Jamey McDaniel
Kentucky Regional Executive #17
Central Division
P.S. I thank you for your dedicated effort in the Naval Submarine Corps.
The SCCA is way more than just autocross to alot of people. I have just returned for the SCCA convention in Kansas City, Mo. where my region sent me all expences paid for me to gain knowledge. I was like you two at one time and thought" darn thats alot of money to put out" , but when we start examining everything that the SCCA does you stand back and think ....wow I don't realise they did that.
I'm going to bullet point a few things in a second and maybe you did or maybe you didn't know this so if I'm giving you information you know then forgive me.
** solo **
Pro solos
soloI
SoloII
Foumula Karting ( children 7-15)
Adult Shifter Karting
**Rally**
Rally cross
Club Rally
Pro Rally
Hill Climbs
**Track Racing**
Club Racing
and other types of wheel to wheel competition including enduro Karts
** Stewards and Flaggers**
Were Responcible for those people in the little white suits who get no thanks for working the dangerous corners and waving the flags and communication track conditions for the drivers to help keep them safe
** Emergency Services **
Kind of self explanatory and mainly used in rally and track situations
** SCCA University**
Educational programs for SCCA members on regional, divisional, and national levels
** SCCA Foundation**
Helps communities, and gives colleges funding for such things as experimental vehicles, Formula S A E and the like
Now with this said maybe this isn't for you, or maybe it is. I'm just trying to tell you there is a bigger picture than even I have told you about here and this is the future of motorsports in America so maybe this sounds like a sales pitch but I hope not I'm just kinda trying to validate where your money goes.
Last but not least remember that the SCCA is there for , if you need them I have known that people have called them on a late sunday and gotten a call back in a very short time for insurance or other "emergency" matters.
I thank you for listening/reading and do hope you stay members as it does have rewards that may not be exactly evident at the moment .
Jamey McDaniel
Kentucky Regional Executive #17
Central Division
P.S. I thank you for your dedicated effort in the Naval Submarine Corps.
| NotAnRS | 02-10-2004 07:00 AM |
Well Jamey, at the risk of this turning into an SCCA bashing thread, I'll give you my opinion as someone who decided not to pay the membership fee this year after belonging for probably the last 5-7 years continuously. SCCA is filled with great people and I enjoyed running with them, but I don't feel the 'value' is there for me.
For the casual member (like our auto-x friends above) it simply is not a good value. In fact, my local region's auto-x series does not give any discount if you belong to SCCA or not. So, no advantage there.
The magazine has been heavily criticized as being expensive and ultimately not very entertaining. The vast bulk of it could be put on a members only area of the web site (race results, Fastrack).
The recent debacles/knuckling under to the insurers in regards to ClubRally and 2 year seatbelt rules have personally offended me.
The lower cost of using competitors like NASA has given me an alternative, and has thus far been nothing but a good experience.
The high cost of licenses (getting a road racing license is very expensive).
The rules minutiae, car classifications and all the other political nonsense that seem to bog down the organization remain a constant.
Ultimately, if you are a road racer and [I]need[/I] SCCA membership to compete in your series of choice, then you have no alternative but to pay their fees.
If racing is a serious business in your life, then SCCA can be the venue for you. If it's going to simply be a hobby, then I feel there are less costly alternatives (NASA, Vintage organizations, EMRA, etc). They are (thankfully) no longer the only game in town. Choices are good. If SCCA fits your needs, fine. Personally, I've found better value for my $ elsewhere.
For the casual member (like our auto-x friends above) it simply is not a good value. In fact, my local region's auto-x series does not give any discount if you belong to SCCA or not. So, no advantage there.
The magazine has been heavily criticized as being expensive and ultimately not very entertaining. The vast bulk of it could be put on a members only area of the web site (race results, Fastrack).
The recent debacles/knuckling under to the insurers in regards to ClubRally and 2 year seatbelt rules have personally offended me.
The lower cost of using competitors like NASA has given me an alternative, and has thus far been nothing but a good experience.
The high cost of licenses (getting a road racing license is very expensive).
The rules minutiae, car classifications and all the other political nonsense that seem to bog down the organization remain a constant.
Ultimately, if you are a road racer and [I]need[/I] SCCA membership to compete in your series of choice, then you have no alternative but to pay their fees.
If racing is a serious business in your life, then SCCA can be the venue for you. If it's going to simply be a hobby, then I feel there are less costly alternatives (NASA, Vintage organizations, EMRA, etc). They are (thankfully) no longer the only game in town. Choices are good. If SCCA fits your needs, fine. Personally, I've found better value for my $ elsewhere.
| TimStevens | 02-10-2004 07:55 AM |
Jamey, I appreciate you posting, but you have to realize that a lot of SCCA members just want to autocross, and while they appreciate supporting the US grassroots motorsports scene, they're only going to join if it makes financial sense for them.
I think it would be a good move for the SCCA to institute a few levels of SCCA membership, particularly a "cheap" membership that just entitles one to go autocrossing and rallycrossing and that's it, then a few levels above depending on your level of competition, basically the same as Speed Freakz was, but without the age limitations.
I signed up when I got my WRX, resubscribed as it was cheap enough being a Speed Freekz member, but this year I won't be able to do that, and while I love winning trophies at autocrosses, it's just not worth the cost.
Anyway, I'm with NotAnRS.
I think it would be a good move for the SCCA to institute a few levels of SCCA membership, particularly a "cheap" membership that just entitles one to go autocrossing and rallycrossing and that's it, then a few levels above depending on your level of competition, basically the same as Speed Freakz was, but without the age limitations.
I signed up when I got my WRX, resubscribed as it was cheap enough being a Speed Freekz member, but this year I won't be able to do that, and while I love winning trophies at autocrosses, it's just not worth the cost.
Anyway, I'm with NotAnRS.
| mywrx2002 | 02-10-2004 09:02 AM |
Well guys as I said I like opinions and I do validate what you guys say. It might be a good idea to have different levels of membership for people, maybe thats something that needs to be explored.
Also I do come from a region that Solo II is basicly the only thing we do( this is just so ya know) so keep posting the opinions because thats what makes us great our free speech and I don't take anything said as bad, just constructive critisizm :)
laters
Also I do come from a region that Solo II is basicly the only thing we do( this is just so ya know) so keep posting the opinions because thats what makes us great our free speech and I don't take anything said as bad, just constructive critisizm :)
laters
| Patrick L | 02-10-2004 12:33 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by NotAnRS [/i]
[B]Well Jamey, at the risk of this turning into an SCCA bashing thread, I'll give you my opinion as someone who decided not to pay the membership fee this year after belonging for probably the last 5-7 years continuously. SCCA is filled with great people and I enjoyed running with them, but I don't feel the 'value' is there for me.
For the casual member (like our auto-x friends above) it simply is not a good value. In fact, my local region's auto-x series does not give any discount if you belong to SCCA or not. So, no advantage there.
The magazine has been heavily criticized as being expensive and ultimately not very entertaining. The vast bulk of it could be put on a members only area of the web site (race results, Fastrack).
The recent debacles/knuckling under to the insurers in regards to ClubRally and 2 year seatbelt rules have personally offended me.
The lower cost of using competitors like NASA has given me an alternative, and has thus far been nothing but a good experience.
The high cost of licenses (getting a road racing license is very expensive).
The rules minutiae, car classifications and all the other political nonsense that seem to bog down the organization remain a constant.
Ultimately, if you are a road racer and [I]need[/I] SCCA membership to compete in your series of choice, then you have no alternative but to pay their fees.
If racing is a serious business in your life, then SCCA can be the venue for you. If it's going to simply be a hobby, then I feel there are less costly alternatives (NASA, Vintage organizations, EMRA, etc). They are (thankfully) no longer the only game in town. Choices are good. If SCCA fits your needs, fine. Personally, I've found better value for my $ elsewhere. [/B][/QUOTE]
Sounds like you need to bring it up too you local region at their next membership meeting and ask why they do not discount members at soloIIs. Here it's $20 for nonmembers and $15 for members.
Heck I got to pay $70 for my membership and $60 for my ProSolo licence.
[B]Well Jamey, at the risk of this turning into an SCCA bashing thread, I'll give you my opinion as someone who decided not to pay the membership fee this year after belonging for probably the last 5-7 years continuously. SCCA is filled with great people and I enjoyed running with them, but I don't feel the 'value' is there for me.
For the casual member (like our auto-x friends above) it simply is not a good value. In fact, my local region's auto-x series does not give any discount if you belong to SCCA or not. So, no advantage there.
The magazine has been heavily criticized as being expensive and ultimately not very entertaining. The vast bulk of it could be put on a members only area of the web site (race results, Fastrack).
The recent debacles/knuckling under to the insurers in regards to ClubRally and 2 year seatbelt rules have personally offended me.
The lower cost of using competitors like NASA has given me an alternative, and has thus far been nothing but a good experience.
The high cost of licenses (getting a road racing license is very expensive).
The rules minutiae, car classifications and all the other political nonsense that seem to bog down the organization remain a constant.
Ultimately, if you are a road racer and [I]need[/I] SCCA membership to compete in your series of choice, then you have no alternative but to pay their fees.
If racing is a serious business in your life, then SCCA can be the venue for you. If it's going to simply be a hobby, then I feel there are less costly alternatives (NASA, Vintage organizations, EMRA, etc). They are (thankfully) no longer the only game in town. Choices are good. If SCCA fits your needs, fine. Personally, I've found better value for my $ elsewhere. [/B][/QUOTE]
Sounds like you need to bring it up too you local region at their next membership meeting and ask why they do not discount members at soloIIs. Here it's $20 for nonmembers and $15 for members.
Heck I got to pay $70 for my membership and $60 for my ProSolo licence.
| 10th Warrior | 02-10-2004 01:43 PM |
The great thing about the SCCA is that not only do you meet great people, not only do they allow you to participate in so many forms of motorsport at so many levels, but they allow you to make it [i]your[/i] club if [i]you[/i] are willing to do the work. complaining on the internet as so many are want to do (and i'm not directing this at anybody here) gets you nowhere. if you think things should be done differently, talk to your Region's Board, or better yet, run for a Board position, make a proposal, and instead of saying "i think you guys should do x", be willing to do the work to implement your idea. that's how St. Louis got a rally-x program. now, in my club, i can auto-x, ProSolo, crew at the road races, rally-x, marshall a rally, and coming soon, compete in a rally :) all this, in a highly competitive yet friendly enviornment. i guess if you only auto-x occasionally, and your region doesn't give a member discount (stl is $10), then it doesn't make alot of sense. but that is just the tip of the iceberg of what the SCCA has to offer.
| TimStevens | 02-10-2004 01:52 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by 10th Warrior[/i]
[B] The great thing about the SCCA is that not only do you meet great people, not only do they allow you to participate in so many forms of motorsport at so many levels, but they allow you to make it [i]your[/i] club if [i]you[/i] are willing to do the work.
[/B][/QUOTE]
Another great thing is that you can socialize with all those great people and participate at many levels without being a member, and SCCA is giving little incentive for us casual racers to become members, which is what we're discussing here :)
[QUOTE][B]
complaining on the internet as so many are want to do (and i'm not directing this at anybody here) gets you nowhere. if you think things should be done differently, talk to your Region's Board[/B][/QUOTE]
I'd say we're doing pretty good here, since we're complaining to a Kentucky region executive :)
[B] The great thing about the SCCA is that not only do you meet great people, not only do they allow you to participate in so many forms of motorsport at so many levels, but they allow you to make it [i]your[/i] club if [i]you[/i] are willing to do the work.
[/B][/QUOTE]
Another great thing is that you can socialize with all those great people and participate at many levels without being a member, and SCCA is giving little incentive for us casual racers to become members, which is what we're discussing here :)
[QUOTE][B]
complaining on the internet as so many are want to do (and i'm not directing this at anybody here) gets you nowhere. if you think things should be done differently, talk to your Region's Board[/B][/QUOTE]
I'd say we're doing pretty good here, since we're complaining to a Kentucky region executive :)
| dknv | 02-10-2004 03:16 PM |
One of the value-adds for me is the additional insurance coverage as a member participating in an scca event or activity. Even though I hope I never need it, it's comforting to know its there.
| DILLIGAF Racing | 02-10-2004 04:03 PM |
I would do what everyone is already saying. If you are only running 5 maybe 6 autox's and don't care about your standings (I think in Pgh, you don't get points if you are not a member), don't get the membership. Especially if they don't offer breaks for members, which is odd, because thats their ploy to get more people to join isn't it? Anyways, being a crew chief for one car, and crew member on another, I have to have the Membership to be in Hot Areas, so $70 is a needed expense for me.
| cfvwtuner | 02-10-2004 06:02 PM |
We also wont join SCCA. We did a few years back, and learned our lesson fast.
You get a mag with alot of results that arnt that imporant, and no real quality articles.
We saved $5 at that one rally :rolleyes:
The one autocross we did run, my wife won her class FSPL,
But what did they do? Throw all the women into a single class and use that crap PAX factor on them.
Of course mens classes with a single driver still got trophies, and werent pax'd.
Then their run schedule sucks, wait all day for your heat, do your 3 runs, and done.
Just hope you arnt working in a heat with alot of cars, you'll be working a disproptionate amount of time, if your heat has fewer cars...And hope you dont have to run first heat and sit all damn day and work the last one.
So for us, cost :rolleyes: event structure :rolleyes: giving someone a trip expnses paid for a confrenence :huh:
That's why it's $70.
We're going to stay with local clubs, and stay away from the SCCA whenever possible
You get a mag with alot of results that arnt that imporant, and no real quality articles.
We saved $5 at that one rally :rolleyes:
The one autocross we did run, my wife won her class FSPL,
But what did they do? Throw all the women into a single class and use that crap PAX factor on them.
Of course mens classes with a single driver still got trophies, and werent pax'd.
Then their run schedule sucks, wait all day for your heat, do your 3 runs, and done.
Just hope you arnt working in a heat with alot of cars, you'll be working a disproptionate amount of time, if your heat has fewer cars...And hope you dont have to run first heat and sit all damn day and work the last one.
So for us, cost :rolleyes: event structure :rolleyes: giving someone a trip expnses paid for a confrenence :huh:
That's why it's $70.
We're going to stay with local clubs, and stay away from the SCCA whenever possible
| jerseybrandon | 02-11-2004 12:28 AM |
I wont get into any specifics because there are SCCA members and brass on this board, but let me say this... try out NASA and you wont look back.
Brandon
Brandon
| RebelINS | 02-11-2004 02:24 AM |
I don't think NASA is really an option for me. I haven't heard of a single NASA event in my area, ever.
-Wes
-Wes
| ellisnc | 02-11-2004 06:30 AM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by 10th Warrior [/i]
[B] all this, in a highly competitive yet friendly enviornment. [/B][/QUOTE]
I guess you don't know what happened in SSC this year at the Runoffs... :rolleyes:
[B] all this, in a highly competitive yet friendly enviornment. [/B][/QUOTE]
I guess you don't know what happened in SSC this year at the Runoffs... :rolleyes:
| ellisnc | 02-11-2004 06:34 AM |
I was a member for a couple years in SpeedFreekz or however you spell it. When I got my renewal for $70 last year it didn't take me long to figure out that $5 discount at each autocross didn't add up to a benefit for me. I'm not into doing the Divisional Events or Nationals. While I like to be competitive and win my class at the end of the day I'm driving around a parking lot so more or less I try to keep autocross as more a social activity than anything else.
| kfoote | 02-11-2004 10:26 AM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by ellisnc [/i]
[B]I guess you don't know what happened in SSC this year at the Runoffs... :rolleyes: [/B][/QUOTE]
...or worse, SSB. :rolleyes:
There are two reasons why I have an SCCA National Competition license and run with them (in my SSB Miata). First, I would like to go to the Runoffs at some point (won't be '04 because of a scheduling conflict), and an it's a lot easier to get other licenses or race with other clubs with an SCCA National license. For someone running the occasional Auto-X, I agree that it makes little sense to get an SCCA membership.
[B]I guess you don't know what happened in SSC this year at the Runoffs... :rolleyes: [/B][/QUOTE]
...or worse, SSB. :rolleyes:
There are two reasons why I have an SCCA National Competition license and run with them (in my SSB Miata). First, I would like to go to the Runoffs at some point (won't be '04 because of a scheduling conflict), and an it's a lot easier to get other licenses or race with other clubs with an SCCA National license. For someone running the occasional Auto-X, I agree that it makes little sense to get an SCCA membership.
| 10th Warrior | 02-11-2004 02:13 PM |
heheh, yeah, i know what happened at the runoffs :) i didn't say there were no politics :p besides, that just shows how important the championship is to the people involved, which is a good sign.
cfvwtuner-you should have worked with the solo/regional board to try and improve the events. like i said, in my experience the SCCA is very open about your suggestions as long as you are willing to do the work to see them through.
cfvwtuner-you should have worked with the solo/regional board to try and improve the events. like i said, in my experience the SCCA is very open about your suggestions as long as you are willing to do the work to see them through.
| GuidoThePenguin | 02-11-2004 05:16 PM |
Locally, its $20 for non-members and only $10 for SCCA members to run.
We have 10 events during the season. That'd be $100 saved on events. Actually its $105 saved since the last event is a 2 day affair (counts as 2 events) and its only $15 for members for both days.
Only SCCA members are eligible for the different points class championships.
So for our region (Gulf Coast Region 12), its actually beneficial to be an SCCA members. And we've tried like heck to keep it that way.
We have 10 events during the season. That'd be $100 saved on events. Actually its $105 saved since the last event is a 2 day affair (counts as 2 events) and its only $15 for members for both days.
Only SCCA members are eligible for the different points class championships.
So for our region (Gulf Coast Region 12), its actually beneficial to be an SCCA members. And we've tried like heck to keep it that way.
| TimStevens | 02-11-2004 05:18 PM |
Our region had a $5 discount on autocrossing, and unfortunately had a single event last year. The next region a few hours from here has a whopping $2 discount, and though they had 8 events, that's still nowhere near making up for the full price for SCCA admission.
| NotAnRS | 02-11-2004 05:32 PM |
I think it's important to remember that, [I]in spite of[/I] the large numbers of Solo II participants in SCCA, the organization is still set up to cater to the road racers first.
Yes, a club often is only as good as what you put into it. If events in your area suck, get involved and help make them better. That's easy and effective advice. Unfortunately, a lot of people are not leaders either by choice or just how they are put together. Nothing wrong with that.
In my region (which isn't where I actually compete), there are certain prima donnas who run certain series. Questioning how these people do things will get you a real earful at the minimum.
As for NASA, they have their flaws also. I got one of my good friends to join so he could do an HPDE, and he had a horrible time getting a problem corrected because one regional director wasn't interested in helping my friend with something he needed to transfer from another region. It was ridiculous. Generally, however, I do find them more receptive to competitor concerns. They are a new organization, and not everywhere yet. Give them time. Lots of folks appreciate having an alternative to SCCA.
SCCA and/or NASA are not for everyone; that is why competition is good. :)
Yes, a club often is only as good as what you put into it. If events in your area suck, get involved and help make them better. That's easy and effective advice. Unfortunately, a lot of people are not leaders either by choice or just how they are put together. Nothing wrong with that.
In my region (which isn't where I actually compete), there are certain prima donnas who run certain series. Questioning how these people do things will get you a real earful at the minimum.
As for NASA, they have their flaws also. I got one of my good friends to join so he could do an HPDE, and he had a horrible time getting a problem corrected because one regional director wasn't interested in helping my friend with something he needed to transfer from another region. It was ridiculous. Generally, however, I do find them more receptive to competitor concerns. They are a new organization, and not everywhere yet. Give them time. Lots of folks appreciate having an alternative to SCCA.
SCCA and/or NASA are not for everyone; that is why competition is good. :)
| ellisnc | 02-11-2004 06:07 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by kfoote [/i]
[B]...or worse, SSB. :rolleyes:
There are two reasons why I have an SCCA National Competition license and run with them (in my SSB Miata). First, I would like to go to the Runoffs at some point (won't be '04 because of a scheduling conflict), and an it's a lot easier to get other licenses or race with other clubs with an SCCA National license. For someone running the occasional Auto-X, I agree that it makes little sense to get an SCCA membership. [/B][/QUOTE]
My bad, I meant SSB... there are a couple guys in my region with Z4's that were going to run them.
[B]...or worse, SSB. :rolleyes:
There are two reasons why I have an SCCA National Competition license and run with them (in my SSB Miata). First, I would like to go to the Runoffs at some point (won't be '04 because of a scheduling conflict), and an it's a lot easier to get other licenses or race with other clubs with an SCCA National license. For someone running the occasional Auto-X, I agree that it makes little sense to get an SCCA membership. [/B][/QUOTE]
My bad, I meant SSB... there are a couple guys in my region with Z4's that were going to run them.
| kfoote | 02-12-2004 10:24 AM |
There were a couple of issues with SSC as well, I beleve the car that finished 2nd on track was DQed in tech. That's what I thought you were referring to. The Z4 fiasco was (and still is) a total disaster, though.
| boileralum00 | 02-12-2004 02:10 PM |
Reading all of this, I feel sorry for you guys. Here in the Kentucky Region, we average over 140 drivers per autocross, with worker changes on the fly, and usually get 6 runs/ event and are still done by 4:30pm. Like Jamey said, we don't do much other than Solo II, but there are 4 of us leaving tomorrow morning to go try our hands in the rain at the ProSolo event in Atlanta this weekend. It'ss all what you are willing to put into it. We have a young and quick-growing local scene, so I think that helps make my experience so enjoyable.
| 10th Warrior | 02-12-2004 04:01 PM |
[quote]It'ss all what you are willing to put into it[/quote]
bingo.
bingo.
| ellisnc | 02-12-2004 08:17 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by kfoote [/i]
[B]There were a couple of issues with SSC as well, I beleve the car that finished 2nd on track was DQed in tech. That's what I thought you were referring to. The Z4 fiasco was (and still is) a total disaster, though. [/B][/QUOTE]
Just like the punting of the Integra... at least that Miata dude got DQ'd. I wanted to punch that guy when he was interviewed at the end of the Speed coverage. Clearly spun the Acura around and then said he raced clean in the interview while you could tell he didn't even believe he did himself. There are going to be lots more Z4's next year from what I hear through the grapevine. I hope they rip up the Miatas.
[B]There were a couple of issues with SSC as well, I beleve the car that finished 2nd on track was DQed in tech. That's what I thought you were referring to. The Z4 fiasco was (and still is) a total disaster, though. [/B][/QUOTE]
Just like the punting of the Integra... at least that Miata dude got DQ'd. I wanted to punch that guy when he was interviewed at the end of the Speed coverage. Clearly spun the Acura around and then said he raced clean in the interview while you could tell he didn't even believe he did himself. There are going to be lots more Z4's next year from what I hear through the grapevine. I hope they rip up the Miatas.
| wrx2.0 555 | 02-13-2004 11:09 AM |
Not sure if this is really "on topic", but the people reading this thread will more likely be able to enlighten me.
At my region non members are $25 and members are $20.
The site we use 90% of the time is FREE.....
Now my question: What could our region possibly be doing with all of our entry fee money?
Scott
At my region non members are $25 and members are $20.
The site we use 90% of the time is FREE.....
Now my question: What could our region possibly be doing with all of our entry fee money?
Scott
| mywrx2002 | 02-13-2004 11:48 AM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by wrx2.0 555 [/i]
[B]Not sure if this is really "on topic", but the people reading this thread will more likely be able to enlighten me.
At my region non members are $25 and members are $20.
The site we use 90% of the time is FREE.....
Now my question: What could our region possibly be doing with all of our entry fee money?
Scott [/B][/QUOTE]
I'll try to hit on just a few key points where our money goes
3.50 per car for insurance
XXX.00 for portable lavatories
xxx.00 for trophies
xxx.00 to replace the cones that we damage
xx.oo for flour to line the course
XX.oo for refreshments ( water on hot days/ doughnuts for course set up )
XX.oo for fuels ( generator / tow vehicle )
and a certain percentile held back in appreciation of the site liasons, year end banquet, and other unforseen things
this isn't all it was a quick 30 second answer to a question, the best answer is to attend your regions monthly meeting and ask and be shown where your money goes .
thanks :)
[B]Not sure if this is really "on topic", but the people reading this thread will more likely be able to enlighten me.
At my region non members are $25 and members are $20.
The site we use 90% of the time is FREE.....
Now my question: What could our region possibly be doing with all of our entry fee money?
Scott [/B][/QUOTE]
I'll try to hit on just a few key points where our money goes
3.50 per car for insurance
XXX.00 for portable lavatories
xxx.00 for trophies
xxx.00 to replace the cones that we damage
xx.oo for flour to line the course
XX.oo for refreshments ( water on hot days/ doughnuts for course set up )
XX.oo for fuels ( generator / tow vehicle )
and a certain percentile held back in appreciation of the site liasons, year end banquet, and other unforseen things
this isn't all it was a quick 30 second answer to a question, the best answer is to attend your regions monthly meeting and ask and be shown where your money goes .
thanks :)
| wrx2.0 555 | 02-13-2004 12:40 PM |
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by mywrx2002 [/i]
[B]I'll try to hit on just a few key points where our money goes
3.50 per car for insurance
XXX.00 for portable lavatories
xxx.00 for trophies
xxx.00 to replace the cones that we damage
xx.oo for flour to line the course
XX.oo for refreshments ( water on hot days/ doughnuts for course set up )
XX.oo for fuels ( generator / tow vehicle )
and a certain percentile held back in appreciation of the site liasons, year end banquet, and other unforseen things
this isn't all it was a quick 30 second answer to a question, the best answer is to attend your regions monthly meeting and ask and be shown where your money goes .
thanks :) [/B][/QUOTE]
Thanks for those points. I should have been smart enought to see those myself.:o
BTW, I have seen floured courses, but we never do that.
I can think of a few times when that certainly would have come in handy. ;)
[B]I'll try to hit on just a few key points where our money goes
3.50 per car for insurance
XXX.00 for portable lavatories
xxx.00 for trophies
xxx.00 to replace the cones that we damage
xx.oo for flour to line the course
XX.oo for refreshments ( water on hot days/ doughnuts for course set up )
XX.oo for fuels ( generator / tow vehicle )
and a certain percentile held back in appreciation of the site liasons, year end banquet, and other unforseen things
this isn't all it was a quick 30 second answer to a question, the best answer is to attend your regions monthly meeting and ask and be shown where your money goes .
thanks :) [/B][/QUOTE]
Thanks for those points. I should have been smart enought to see those myself.:o
BTW, I have seen floured courses, but we never do that.
I can think of a few times when that certainly would have come in handy. ;)
| 10th Warrior | 02-13-2004 02:35 PM |
[QUOTE]Thanks for those points. I should have been smart enought to see those myself[/QUOTE]
you should be able to request budgets and region financial status from the BoD. i know we publish it every month for the general membership meetings.
you should be able to request budgets and region financial status from the BoD. i know we publish it every month for the general membership meetings.
| [email�protected] | 02-13-2004 02:49 PM |
I have one additional thing for those that dont want to pay for memberships to think about.
The fact that you are an SCCA member actually keeps the SCCA around. If everyone decided to only sit back and pay an extra $5 at events, then there might come a time when there wont be any events for you to actually attend.
The SCCA does so much more than just putting on a couple of autocrosses a year. There are all kinds of events that they sponsor, they have drivers schools, they offer up the ability to go road racing, rally racing, work with the racing scene as corner workers, flaggers, tech inspectors, and any number of other things.
If you only run one or two autocrosses a year, then it might not be the best thing for you, but for those that do run the majority of the events, even if it would save you a few bucks to not join, I would encourage that you join and try to help the club to put on better events and more events. Be a part of the club and try to improve it.
There are other options, NASA and others are valid alternatives. But to just complain that spending $70 on membership doesnt pay back in the end is not right. Take advantage of the benefits and get your money's worth out of it.
I dont even race. I am a photographer that shoots events and sells to drivers and teams. I am a member because I like the fact that they offer the extra insurance should the unthinkable happen while I'm out shooting. I like the people and corner workers that I meet while out shooting. I like the bottles of Gatorade that they bring out to the workers and the ocassional photogrpher on a hot day. I like the fact that they are just out there and that I have the opportunity that I would not have if the SCCA did not exist.
Think about it, its more than the $5 savings at an autocross.
The fact that you are an SCCA member actually keeps the SCCA around. If everyone decided to only sit back and pay an extra $5 at events, then there might come a time when there wont be any events for you to actually attend.
The SCCA does so much more than just putting on a couple of autocrosses a year. There are all kinds of events that they sponsor, they have drivers schools, they offer up the ability to go road racing, rally racing, work with the racing scene as corner workers, flaggers, tech inspectors, and any number of other things.
If you only run one or two autocrosses a year, then it might not be the best thing for you, but for those that do run the majority of the events, even if it would save you a few bucks to not join, I would encourage that you join and try to help the club to put on better events and more events. Be a part of the club and try to improve it.
There are other options, NASA and others are valid alternatives. But to just complain that spending $70 on membership doesnt pay back in the end is not right. Take advantage of the benefits and get your money's worth out of it.
I dont even race. I am a photographer that shoots events and sells to drivers and teams. I am a member because I like the fact that they offer the extra insurance should the unthinkable happen while I'm out shooting. I like the people and corner workers that I meet while out shooting. I like the bottles of Gatorade that they bring out to the workers and the ocassional photogrpher on a hot day. I like the fact that they are just out there and that I have the opportunity that I would not have if the SCCA did not exist.
Think about it, its more than the $5 savings at an autocross.
| RebelINS | 02-13-2004 04:38 PM |
[QUOTE]There are other options, NASA and others are valid alternatives. But to just complain that spending $70 on membership doesnt pay back in the end is not right. Take advantage of the benefits and get your money's worth out of it.[/QUOTE]
What you said is great in theory, but just isn't true in the real world. I am well aware that they offer road racing, rally, etc., and I would love to rally, in fact it is my dream, but I can't afford anything other then autocrossing at the moment. It isn't because I don't want to do any other motorsports, or that I don't know about them, it all comes down to money. If I could afford to do a ton of forms of racing, then I doubt that I would be complaining about just having to pay $70 ;) .
-Wes
What you said is great in theory, but just isn't true in the real world. I am well aware that they offer road racing, rally, etc., and I would love to rally, in fact it is my dream, but I can't afford anything other then autocrossing at the moment. It isn't because I don't want to do any other motorsports, or that I don't know about them, it all comes down to money. If I could afford to do a ton of forms of racing, then I doubt that I would be complaining about just having to pay $70 ;) .
-Wes
| [email�protected] | 02-13-2004 06:30 PM |
If you dont have the money to rally, then get involved on the worker level. Get involved on the crew level. There are other things that you can do to fill your racing needs even if you are unable to get behind the wheel.
The point is these other options are open to people because of the SCCA and if you want to take advantage of what they offer they are there and waiting.:)
The point is these other options are open to people because of the SCCA and if you want to take advantage of what they offer they are there and waiting.:)
| NotAnRS | 02-14-2004 06:41 AM |
I see the point that sending SCCA $70 helps support motorsports overall. Sorta like paying school taxes and not having any kids. :rolleyes:
But, I can't see spending this kind of money without getting any tangible value from it.
1) I don't need SCCA to autocross
2) I don't need SCCA to attend or work a ProRally
3) I don't need SCCA to do HPDE's (heck, they don't even offer them outside the west coast from what I've seen)
I've elected to 'support' NASA for $35 instead. I [I]do[/I] need the membership to do HPDE's, but I also see it as a 'vote' as a consumer for an alternative to a lot of the negatives I listed in my first post. Keep in mind I was an SCCA member who did more than autocross, I ran the local hill climb series (Solo 1) which is much more expensive, serious and risky. On top of the $70 membership I additionally had to fork over $35 for a 'license' (which is a joke...fill out an application). Then pay a doctor for a medical (I'm ok with that), then buy hundreds of $ worth of safety gear (again, not really a dispute) before I ever get the 'opportunity' to pay $150 for six runs up a mountain. I can't imagine what it would cost me to actually go road racing, which is why I haven't made that leap.
For me, NASA's HPDE series satisfies my need for speed at a much cheaper level (and something the SCCA hasn't seen fit to offer, which amazes me). I still believe they are focused as a road race organization first, which is fine. But the resistance to the cost talked about here is vastly coming from autocrossers, who frankly don't get much for their $ and ultimately don't [I]need[/I] to be members to participate in events.
I agree, a stepped membership sounds like an excellent idea. Maybe they'd get more track workers if they only charged them $25 to belong instead of $70. :confused: Racers will pay whatever it takes to get on the track, such is the addiction of speed. :lol:
Bottom line: I think there is something wrong with SCCA's cost of membership and they need to do something about it. I'm choosing not to spend my money there until they do take it under consideration.
But, I can't see spending this kind of money without getting any tangible value from it.
1) I don't need SCCA to autocross
2) I don't need SCCA to attend or work a ProRally
3) I don't need SCCA to do HPDE's (heck, they don't even offer them outside the west coast from what I've seen)
I've elected to 'support' NASA for $35 instead. I [I]do[/I] need the membership to do HPDE's, but I also see it as a 'vote' as a consumer for an alternative to a lot of the negatives I listed in my first post. Keep in mind I was an SCCA member who did more than autocross, I ran the local hill climb series (Solo 1) which is much more expensive, serious and risky. On top of the $70 membership I additionally had to fork over $35 for a 'license' (which is a joke...fill out an application). Then pay a doctor for a medical (I'm ok with that), then buy hundreds of $ worth of safety gear (again, not really a dispute) before I ever get the 'opportunity' to pay $150 for six runs up a mountain. I can't imagine what it would cost me to actually go road racing, which is why I haven't made that leap.
For me, NASA's HPDE series satisfies my need for speed at a much cheaper level (and something the SCCA hasn't seen fit to offer, which amazes me). I still believe they are focused as a road race organization first, which is fine. But the resistance to the cost talked about here is vastly coming from autocrossers, who frankly don't get much for their $ and ultimately don't [I]need[/I] to be members to participate in events.
I agree, a stepped membership sounds like an excellent idea. Maybe they'd get more track workers if they only charged them $25 to belong instead of $70. :confused: Racers will pay whatever it takes to get on the track, such is the addiction of speed. :lol:
Bottom line: I think there is something wrong with SCCA's cost of membership and they need to do something about it. I'm choosing not to spend my money there until they do take it under consideration.
| dknv | 02-14-2004 11:04 PM |
Just for people to keep in mind, the $70 cost is not universal, some regions are at $65, some are at $80. National scca dues are $55, and the balance is the region's dues.
While you may not have the $70 now, if you have it this summer and you are autocrossing alot, you might still get value from a membership then (assuming your region does provide discounted entry fees).
Our region has an incentive program which credits a membership fee for the difference in the non-member fee, for up to 2 immediate events backwards. For example, if you were paying $70 for your membership and you ran in SoloII with us the prior event weekend of 2 days, we will discount $20 from that $70. It might be worth your while to ask your region if they would do the same.
Reno region had 20 points events last year as well as our first NorPac divisional event (which you needed to be a member of to run). Since I was one of about 15 people here who had perfect attendence, I 'saved' $200.:lol:
With all that said, I'm in agreement the membership fee may be steep if you're only going to get a limited value from it, i.e. small discount, small # of events, and I'm sure there are a Ton more people out there besides the ones posting on this with the same thought. The 'tiered' price structure idea sounds good, but someone should raise it up to SCCA as a question.
btw: I belong to scca as well as nasa, and find them both enjoyable to be a member of.
While you may not have the $70 now, if you have it this summer and you are autocrossing alot, you might still get value from a membership then (assuming your region does provide discounted entry fees).
Our region has an incentive program which credits a membership fee for the difference in the non-member fee, for up to 2 immediate events backwards. For example, if you were paying $70 for your membership and you ran in SoloII with us the prior event weekend of 2 days, we will discount $20 from that $70. It might be worth your while to ask your region if they would do the same.
Reno region had 20 points events last year as well as our first NorPac divisional event (which you needed to be a member of to run). Since I was one of about 15 people here who had perfect attendence, I 'saved' $200.:lol:
With all that said, I'm in agreement the membership fee may be steep if you're only going to get a limited value from it, i.e. small discount, small # of events, and I'm sure there are a Ton more people out there besides the ones posting on this with the same thought. The 'tiered' price structure idea sounds good, but someone should raise it up to SCCA as a question.
btw: I belong to scca as well as nasa, and find them both enjoyable to be a member of.
| bcblues | 02-15-2004 10:30 AM |
Jamey, Thanks for chiming in. In other words, the dues that I pay as an autocrosser help subsidize the other elements of the sport? That does not make much sense, since each and every competitor should be paying an equally equitable portion of their particular sport�s costs. IOW, there should not be a huge shift in monies from one area to another. Sure each area should kick in to help the overall organizational needs (like the nice new facility), but than the daily, weekly, annual operation should be largely self-funded. Again, IMHO.
Having said all that, I still opt to support the SCCA through my annual renewal. I do this not to gain some sort of financial stake, but because I want my sport supported, and more importantly, I want my sparsely populated region represented.
As always, my 2 cents worth.
Having said all that, I still opt to support the SCCA through my annual renewal. I do this not to gain some sort of financial stake, but because I want my sport supported, and more importantly, I want my sparsely populated region represented.
As always, my 2 cents worth.
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